What is the point in having alliances if those people you ally up with can just turn around and kill you at the end of a battle?! You shouldn’t be able to friendly fire in an alliance it’s ridiculous! Yesterday we defeated a bunch of skeleton ships in our gally with the help of a brig. They then snuck some gunpowder onto our ship while we looted the skelly ship and sunk us, then left the alliance. How am I supposed to trust other players online when the game supports this sort of play? Please allow alliances to be created with friends!
What is the point in alliances?
i feel like the people doing this still haven't caught on that it literally hurts nothing, except a big ego, to stay in an alliance. they wanna sink comrades and sell it themselves for max profit? fine. but don't leave the alliance. they're just a _____ if they do that (insert your preferred word).
I've been fortunate to form alliances with people likeminded. i hope it turns around for you too.
The alliance system was out in place to reward players for what they were doing outside of an official system. Yes you can betray other people if you wish which sucks if you are the one being betrayed but that's how things were before. be on guard of other pirates at all times.
Now because of this system I agree friends should be able to join your server now in an alliance. That way you can play with at least on other crew you know you can trust.
Unless your on of my friends then you would be joining my server to be hunted down at least a few times before we started cooperating.
You kill each other for the 100% value of the loot. The loosing crew gets 50%. It's that simple. But never disband an appliance after doing such a thing. Never. It's the ultimate d**k move and rewards you nothing. The only time we split the loot for equal share is if it's an organized alliance via Discord and such.
Before the alliance system we had to go off instinct and trust players whom we may have needed to aid us in an event and we had no reward in place for helping. It was a period rife with betrayals, anxiety, staged griefing scenarios, area camping for the sake of PvP, having to manually decide on loot splits, and more. More often than not, betrayals were at the heart of these encounters because there was no value behind a loot split.
So they added a carrot to join with others and split the loot gained by doing so. The split still requires some moderation and assurance that not all of the best loot ends up on one ship versus another without merit. But, it's improved, and for many like myself who don't really care about money and have no use for rep even that's lessened in virtue. Simply knowing I'll get 'something' gives me enough reason to comply.
But, no, they did not remove the ability and freedom to choose to betray an alliance or to create the situations described above where others might break the alliance for self serving whims. It's a valid action that remains valid in it's course so long as it satisfies the whims of the antagonist.
is it stupid and inane? Sure, most would likely agree with you. But even for me, sometimes NOT being an ally is just as valuable to my play experience - though maybe not wallet - than being allied.
For one example, we had a 2 ship alliance and knew of other alliances on the server after a cursed sails run. We spotted a Skull fort. One of our ships sailed to it straight away as the other conducted some wrap up on a couple of missions or some such. When our first ship arrived so to had a Galleon and a fight broke out over the fort. It was thrilling to fight over the fort claim. We both knew that simply going into an alliance would allow us a fair split of the goods... but neither wanted that sort of experience. Without saying a word to one another we knew instantly we both wanted a fight for the sake of the fight and the fun it creates... the skull fort was merely a jewel over which to brawl.
Mid fight... an allied sloop appeared from out of the storm, friends with the Galleon, and started to fight us in our Brigantine. We sank the sloop straight away, good for us, but the Galleon was giving us trouble thanks in no small part to the storm we were in, the island cannons, and so on. Until, that is, our fellow allied brigantine appeared. At this point though we lost the 2nd brig in the fight thanks to the storm messing up their focus and their crashing right into the island... overall the Galleon lost to my ship after that.
Left to our own devices neither the Galleon nor the Sloop reappeared. I would have been happy if they had. It was a thrill, two allied groups quarrel ling over a skull fort neither really cared to have... it was epic.
Now, if my partner brigantine were to have waited till near turn in and betrayed my crew? I'd have laughed and fought to the bitter end to reclaim our glory. But I wouldn't have been amazed, nor butthurt. And that's the point.
Alliance systems haven't been implemented to remove any of the chaos that grouping entails from the game. The freedom to be as thou art remains strong. There's very valid merit in counting coins and profits are higher when one remains in an alliance. Heck, by all logical capital demands no player on the server should be without a full server alliance, period.
But that's not the game.
The game is all about never knowing what to expect, creating your own stories, and having a good time playing for yourself. There are few if any rules governing what players might do in game, because it's meant to cater to chaos.
Obviously Rare wants to reward us for working together but if the reward is so high that players becoe mere server farming bots... no fun will be there to be had.
Better it remains as it is with "I personally feel one exception" I'd like a means to tell other alliance members apart be it a color code to their name or even a dot next to it. Anything better than the pure white sea of names I read which overlap, offer no depth perception or text segregation when overlapped, and frankly blur alot when at 30fps or even at 60FPS which is my usual home.
Just remember, like all stories drama is at the heart of value. And frankly, silliness such as upsetting betrayals and so on... help create drama in an otherwise quiet sea. Sure, it sucks to be on the losing end. But it's not insurmountable to sinply find friends to play the game with who have a like mind. If it is... that's on you.. all the tools are there. I went from maybe 30 friends to over 200 thanks to this game alone. And among them... yup.. I promise I know who I can trust.
But how to get friends in an alliance let alone the same server?
Not impossible. Find a ship that's getting ready to log out and put a friend in their crew before they do... ta-da! You now have 2 ships on the same server, just add more friends and repeat as needed.
@celestron90 May be a d**k move but it’s smart. In alliances you can see each other’s ships so there’s a chance they try to chase you down, severing ties essentially takes you off the radar.
The fact is that the alliance system duplicates gold for every additional crew and is a heavy handed attempt to push this game even further towards being “Sea of Friends”. I wish Rare would really stop trying to give out participation trophies and would just put a bigger emphasis on building friendships among our own crews, and gave us more legitimate reasons for both allying with other crews or actively working against them.
More in depth and skill knowledge and work based merchanting would allow a lot of co op and trading/trade route type gameplay if they did that right, instead of flagging for pve like other games that make you invulnerable, you could flag yourself as a merchant at a specific outpost that would be your trading hub, and each outpost would want different goods regardless of voyage. Add basic harvesting and creation of crates of tea leaves, spices, sugar, silks, and more, based on knowledge of islands and weather patterns according to the day of the month or time of day, etc.
Then you could have repercussions for sinking merchant ships, and they would lose merchant status for firing first, and bounties could be introduced for ships that attack merchants, with “navy rep” or something being gained with exclusive cosmetic that if you see you know as a merchant you can trust them, because they literally can’t just go around sinking people or they would lose those cosmetics until they did the grind (only killed ships with bounties enough times to earn that status) again.
Rambling but having a system that justifies outrage for losing based on that fact that someone didn’t let you get free gold based on a system that duplicates it in the first place is all kinds of stupid.
I have had a 50/50 when it comes to alliances. Just last night me, my wife and daughter we on a brig doing the skeleton ships and had an alliance with another brig. We all fought fine, sunk and killed the ships and the Captain. We were next to said Captain ship that sunk and only took half the loot(had plenty of time to take it all) but left them half as well. We head to the nearest outpost and they start heading to one farther away. I knew then they were gonna ditch but I said screw it, lets see. So we turn all ours in and they get credit. As soon as they show up to the other outpost, they leave the alliance.
I mean I knew it was coming, And could have left knowing in my gut, but that is just the way the game is. They only did it to be a donkey no other reason not to let us get credit as well, and this after leaving them half the loot. Other times we have been attacked, other times we have had everyone turn in and go about voyages and it works out. Had a blast the other night with a group of people we met and that is whats fun, the not knowing what to expect.
@dumbdrunkpirate said in What is the point in alliances?:
I mean I knew it was coming, And could have left knowing in my gut, but that is just the way the game is. They only did it to be a donkey no other reason not to let us get credit as well, and this after leaving them half the loot.
Or they didn't know better. Don't jump to conclusions.
They did know:
@dumbdrunkpirate said in What is the point in alliances?:We head to the nearest outpost and they start heading to one farther away. So we turn all ours in and they get credit. As soon as they show up to the other outpost, they leave the alliance.
They received credits for the loot that @DumbDrunkPirate and his crew turned in so they had the pop-ups already that everything the alliance turns in will be split towards other crews.
We were doing the skeleton ships, for the majority of the time solo. We had Alliance Heart flag up just in-case lat joiners come. Meanwhile, a sloop kept just out of range and waited. Not close enough to help nor join alliance. Wave after wave we sink, while the sloop just stays out of range. Finally, we sink the Capt. first and to ensure we don't lose track of the loot we park near the sink sight. As if on cue, sloop roles up and parks right next to us waving and acting all friendly. They join alliance passively. No words were said, and no attempt at communication was made. They proceed to load up their sloop with the Capt loot.
Now we didn't like this, in all fairness we earned that loot. We sank them, and left Alliance. They could have loaded it on our ship, or simply said they were just holding it for the time being. I could understand being on a sloop and not wanting to fight the ships if you were new. However at that point offer supplies or the many gunpowder they had in their crows nest. We earned that 100% fraction, not the 50%
Was that their intention the entire time? Maybe, maybe not. Was what we did petty and or scummy? Probably, but Alliances should be made on equal benefits, or at least an agreed upon relationship. We follow the Golden rule of, Play stupid games win stupid prizes. Either negotiate your terms, or be sent to Davy Jones, our HR Department Rep.
@aarghmaargho said in What is the point in alliances?:
They did know:
@dumbdrunkpirate said in What is the point in alliances?:We head to the nearest outpost and they start heading to one farther away. So we turn all ours in and they get credit. As soon as they show up to the other outpost, they leave the alliance.
They received credits for the loot that @DumbDrunkPirate and his crew turned in so they had the pop-ups already that everything the alliance turns in will be split towards other crews.
Yeah they saw they get 50%. Can you imagine they too jumped to conclusions? Besides, it only takes one player to leave the alliance.
In game it doesn't show 50%.
But no matter how you twist it, in @DumbDrunkPirate's situation it was just a complete troll move that they left the alliance after somebody left you loot and let you get a share in what they had.@aarghmaargho said in What is the point in alliances?:
In game it doesn't show 50%.
Should I elaborate more on what "ill informed" means?
But you didn't talk about "ill informed", you said they didn't know better. Which they did because they got the pop up where they received loot from another ones turn in.
So even if they didn't know yet, they learned at that moment that you both get income when your in an alliance. Thus there was no reason for them to leave beside just wanting to get the most out of them themselves whilst letting the other crew in the dark.
@BernardKings1ey Sadly this is part of the game. And as mentioned above, sometimes it is warranted. Either someone shows up and joins the alliance as you are sinking the captain ship, or some other action takes place that makes you have to make a tough choice. But then again, the game and the developers love the "on the edge of your seat" part of the game where you need to have betrayal as something that could happen to you.
When alliances were asked for in the forums, I think the dev's missed a very big reason for them. I could be wrong, but most people I talked to that wanted something like alliances were to allow you to invite a ship to your server, or simply join servers together with other friendly ships. Instead the dev's gave us this form of an alliance system and honestly, I like it. I have made many new friends through the alliances. And yes, I have been betrayed more than a couple of times. But I am more than willing to accept those for the great times I have had with like minded peeps I have met over the past couple of weeks. I really hope you are able to find that and when you do, I hope you see just how the good really does outweigh the bad in this case.
@aarghmaargho said in What is the point in alliances?:
But you didn't talk about "ill informed", you said they didn't know better. Which they did because they got the pop up where they received loot from another ones turn in.
So even if they didn't know yet, they learned at that moment that you both get income when your in an alliance. Thus there was no reason for them to leave beside just wanting to get the most out of them themselves whilst letting the other crew in the dark.
Is it really that hard to grasp?
It's week 2. There is a chance some of them also played last week. That one might have turned in one or two items without being in an alliance and noticed the difference when this time the other crew turned their stuff in. Maybe some other player told him it would be split 50/50 and he believed it.Stick to Hanlon's Razor. Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
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