[New feature idea] Bounty Hunter Guild "trading company" + The player database...

  • Hello pie rats!
    Another day at work spent by thinking of new SoT features is behind me and once again it born it's fruit!
    So what is it this time you ask?

    Well... you read the title, so you already know. Yes, a bounty hunting "trading company".
    Currently we have 2 main ways to make money in SoT.
    One is all about going to different islands and digging up chests, the other about going to islands and killing some NPCs. I believe the next step is to make PVP profitable.
    So how would the bounty hunting work?

    • The system
      Each player in the world of SoT would have a bounty on him. The amount would differ however.
      Each player would start with a basic bounty of for example 50 gold.
      For each player they kill (enemy) the bounty on their head would grow (possibly with a limit) until the player dies to another player in a pvp situation.
      -With each player kill (on an enemy, not a crew member of your own), the bounty on your head grows by 50.
      -With each ship you and your crew manage to sink, the bounty grows by a 100 or 150.
      -With each chest, stolen from an enemy and sold for your own profit, the bounty on your head will grow for the amount of gold the chest was worth. This would give players who's treasures were stolen a comeback chance.
      -Players themselves would be able to put additional bounties to any player using the other new feature I came up with. More lower down...
      -Bounty would also rise with the amount of current crew members of the target.
      -If you manage to kill a player with bounty on their head, you will need a token as a proof for the "trading company". This idea came from Its S****.'s post where he talks of scrolls dropping from the dead enemies to sell to actual trading companies. I'd however think that the proof token could even be like a finger or an ear (which I believe what actual bounty hunters used) but even if it was a scroll, it would only be possible to sell to the Bounty Hunter Guild.
      -Last thing is that if you don't get a contract for the bounty, you get no token drop and no money. You'd need to go and take down the one actual person and vote for it, just like you'd vote for any other voyage with your team members.

    This brings me to the next bit.

    • Who, where, how?
      Now in my humble opinion, bounty hunters aren't like the other companies.
      They shouldn't have a shiny stall showing off their trade. The exact opposite actually.
    1. Who
      I was thinking about this a lot and came to thinking that the person, should be covered by mystery. A long leather coat, face hidden in shade of the hood he's got on. The little of his face that you can see would be rough looking and well scarred and above that, in a complete darkness, his eyes would slightly glow with a yellow tint. All the clothes roughed out by countless battles and all in a dark, blood red style, the main colour of the BHG. Imagine a mix of Geralt, Star Lord and Ezio :D
    1. Where
      Another important aspect of the b****s way of the bounty hunter is being loners.
      They're exiles at the edge of society. Hated by many, even tho helping those in need.
      Prohibited by law, yet completely necessary. And always as cool as their own heart.
      You can't just go to the beach and look for a big sign that shouts "Murder business", not even in the pirate world. Or maybe especially not there...
      If you really need this sort of thing done, you have to know where to look.
      And that would be the dirtiest godforsaken and remote place on the high sees. The place so close that you can go there at any time, yet you will never do so anyway because it's simply too far from the most important source. Not to mention nobody honourable (if that's what the pirate laws can be called) would ever even touch such place.
      Yes, it is The table at the darkest corner of the outpost tavern. Sitting alone, with only his trusty hit list (or a note book in this case) by the side.
    1. How
      Now to the most important bit. How would it all work out.
      The bounty voyages would be created for every enemy player on the same server as you and your crew. At first you could only go get the low level bounties (max 150 gold?) and as you would progress and get higher levels with the Bounty Hunter Guild, you could see also players with higher bounties on them. So the basics are similar as with the others.
      You walk in, push the action button while aiming at him, he pops up a window with names of all the enemy players on your server + the information of how much you gonna get paid and the amount of current crew members of the target. This "price" would once again would be only an expected one, just like with the chests. The price would get lower in case crew members would DC from the target. However if the target gets killed by another player, the contract would disappear completely (either giving you your input cash back, or maybe not :D).
      Once you would purchase your voyage and won the vote with your crew, you'd get a note similar to the one you get on skeleton hunts. This one however would be written in dark red (unclear if it's blood or just red ink) colour and overall have a bit different design.
      The letter would only say one thing that would not change and never would get any other information added. The hint would be:
      "The target X was last seen near the Y island"
      This information would be true at the time of winning the vote for the voyage. You'd need to act quickly and search more than in other cases.
      The last bit is obvious. You get your crew, find your target, and then... Who is your target? Ofc, from up close, you can see the names but from afar? That's where the next feature comes in...
    • The player database aka "The Hit List"
      Remember the little note book that the "contractee" has on the table next to him?
      Here it finally comes to play. The intended use (apart from curiosity research) is to use it right after you bought your contract from the BHG guy.
      So you click on the book. What next? well... it would somewhat magically open on the table. Without you moving it. It would also open right in the middle and there would be nothing written in. Then... you would type in the name of your target. Or any other for that matter. Whoever you're interested in. Let's say you search for me. You press "R" (as in the first letter of my name) and the first thing it does is that a profile of the first person in the game (any server, not just yours) starting with a letter "R" alphabetically comes up. That would be probably someone called simply R. then you go to "Re" and so it goes until you put in enough of the name to get to the right person. All of it would also appear in a really nice way, just like the little map in Harry Potter movies. Even the colour actually fits :o .

    Well. So you get to my profile. What's there to be seen you ask?
    Well, on the left side of the open book would be my profile (which would be partially generated by statistics and partially made of players own written stuff).
    There you would see my nickname to begin with, number of kills, deaths possibly.
    My own written description of myself. Similar to the ones we wrote here on the forums. Like "Retto Elbaroda, Captain of the Romp Raft, the high priest of the Red Otter Cult. Likes pizza and sushi....." and so on. There would be one or more badges you get for completing challenges (read "achievements"), and most importantly, your character ran through some in game filters so it looks like drawn with an ink pen. Also obviously name of your crew (Red Otter Cult) and whatever info Rare would decide is important or cool. Maybe the most used weapon and a pet? idk... whatever.
    On the right page of the book would then be my (or whoever's you're searching for) ship.
    Again, name at the top (Romp Raft) and the same filter would be used on it so it looks like it was drawn, it would show the most common crew mates that tend to come under your leadership on your... ship. Amount of ships sunk with your ship and times your ship was sunk by others. Maybe even distance it went for and again anything that Rare would like. So by looking into this we could get a direct information about the look of our targets, their ship, crew that we can expect to be with them.

    And that is it for today. What do you think? Will anyone read all of this? I don't even know!

    PS. There was some disinformation happening in the comments. Let me post it here for all so we don't repeat the same questions.

    So some of you were thinking that the book is an unnecessary feature as the looks of your pirate and your ship can be changed, therefore the book would bring no advantage to you.

    However, to be able to recognise your target is only one function of the book. The other, perhaps even more important is to let players look up other players. A feature to allow you to truly become a pirate legend. Be it your favourite streamer, a friend, a random pirate you just met or a completely random person, the book would show you their profile that they could partially customise with their own description, flag, nickname for their crew and so on, creating the character for their own legend. Becoming known would then be done by different "top player" lists inside the book. These would be shown for many different things. Be you one of the best killers, ship sinkers, explorers, treasure hunters, bounty hunters, animal carers or anything the Rare would come up with. This would ensure that no matter what your play style, you could always become great in what you like. The higher up the list, the more people would obviously click on your profile. And that's how a legend is born.

    Another thing people say was why bother doing anything else when you can just sail around killing everyone and sinking ships for money.

    Well. One thing is, you couldn't. As you would only cash out money for the bounty if you actually activated a bounty hunt voyage. Then you'd have to find the right person/ship and then retrieve the token they'd drop to get your money.
    Another thing is, the amount of money was maybe not explained well enough higher up in the post.
    This is not supposed to be a huge trading company that would outdo the other 3. The way I imagine it is that your bounty rises very slowly to the point where it becomes interesting for others. Let's say a decent player would get to 400 gold bounty on his head twice a week. In case no other player would kill them before reaching the maximum (400) bounty. So yes, you could go and only ever do bounty hunter quests, but it would probably be very slow compared to the other ways of getting your gold. It would however allow you, to go and do some PVP bounty hunt worth your time maybe two or three times a day. Obviously, the balance is the key. And I have no information, nor the need to get the exact numbers that would make it perfect. If Rare chose to implement this, they would have ways to get to the final numbers.

    And lastly. A high bounty on your head would be a negative thing for most players.

    A huge bounty on your head isn't supposed to make you a pirate legend.
    Not only that, it cannot even if you wanted to.
    Even if you choose to be the most evil pirate, your bounty would only grow until reaching some ceiling level. Then it would reset after someone would complete a bounty hunt on you. That would ensure that players wouldn't compete with each other in become the world most bounty hunted legend. There would be thousands of players with the same bounty on their head. And each second many would die just to start over from the base amount.
    The greater part of this is however that it would actually add a sense of karma to the game. You might think twice the next time you see a docked ship with no pirate on it and no reason to take it down. As once you do, your bounty grows higher and the feel of fear from someone coming for you would grow along with it. Of course you may think that it's not a big deal. Even with a huge bounty on your head you die once and then nobody will care about you again anyway. But is that so? One thing is, what is the amount that is good enough for someone to take you down. 200? 300? And another. At any given moment you may be hunted by enemies. You know at some point they will come to get that bounty. But it can be any time. Now or in 3 days. Or in a month. And the longer you keep that bounty and the higher it gets, the worse you will feel carrying an expensive chest on your ship. Especially if you see that silhouette of a galleon at the horizon. So will you sink the poor guys ship or not, Is it worth the trouble? Again... the balance of bounty added on your head is the key.

    Thank you for reading.

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  • i think it would be cool and i like how much thought you put in it but the only way i could see this working is if u hunted a AI adds of someone just leaving the server are huge look at gta bounties

  • @ajm123 Thank you very much! I do also understand that the bounties that other players put on you are too easy to work around but this would be still much more of a game generated bounties on everyone. And then I just thought that if we go this far, players should also be able to contribute to that. Even if their bounties will be easy to get rid of. On the other hand, I didn't really want to let the targets know of their bounties unless they check their own name in the Hit List. Which would therefore make them less likely to run. Either way, thank you for reading this. I very much appreciate it :)

  • Implying that added to the bounties on players heads we could have bounties on the whole ship :O

  • I was about to make a post regarding the same idea!
    Without discussing a different game for too long - I feel like Elite: Dangerous did this well.

    A wanted sign goes up, or a new contract from the Bounty Hunter Guild is available and it details their last known location and their last known bounty amount. As you trail them from outpost to outpost you become closer and their up-to-date bounty updates each time!

    However, I personally believe it'd be best to only display bounties for those over a certain threshold. You don't want to tail someone for an hour to get a 50 gold bounty.
    I also believe you should only gain a bounty once you attack another player. Just my opinion though!

    Love the idea and level of detail!

  • I feel like there should be a way for the TARGET to buy down their bounty. Suppose Captain Salty was able to pay the head hunter a visit and BRIBE down their bounty ? This would certainly make a balance in the loot system.

    Additionally , in regards to the trophy / proof of demise. Though I appreciate a grisly trophy as much as the next gamer why not use their Crest ? I can't get around the thought of Pirates being shady (derp), and ear or finger does not denote ownership.

    If players are going to spend time designing a crest, that should be the proof.

    If you insist on gore .... taking a tattoo off the target would be proof as well.

  • I always assumed if there was going to be a bounty Hunter he would be on the little balcony behind the tavern. Just seemed right for me; a shady character hiding behind a tavern in the shadows, meeting in secret with whoever comes to search for him.

  • Have you thought about how to limit/stop the player abuse of the system?
    Like friends teaming up and using the system to kill each other and level up

  • As an after thought....

    I like your idea of having to act expeditiously to track a newly established bounty, it really adds a sense of urgency.

    I think the map should update when you go to a port, with a delay of course.

    So you get wrecked on your way to your quarry... you head into port to repair and find that your TARGET has moved and was last known to be near "Dante's Peninsula". This would reflect the rumors and information gathering that would be rife with this sort of bounty hunting.

    The BRIBE I mentioned above could increase the delay in the info. So rather than reporting a TARGET's position as of 10 mins ago. It could be increased to 15- 20 mins by the TARGET bribing the Head hunters.

  • I don't see how this brings anything new to the game, other than an extra gold bonus. There's no way to identify players until you get close enough to see their nametags. There's no way to hunt specific high bounties, because the players are all randomly placed into servers and maybe mixed with different crew each time.

    So basically, if you're trying to do bounties you'll just attack every ship in sight because you'll get a gold bonus and the odds that the other ship will attack you for the same reason is pretty high.

  • Completely against anything letting players place bunties on other player, period.
    With the mentality of todays gamer that would be the biggest griefing system ever. I can just see butt hurt players gettint together to spam bounties on anyone who dares beat them in pvp. ..even if they are the ones who started the pvp and lost, they would want revenge.
    Screw that.

  • @rgbknights Yes I have actually. One of the possible ways would be to make a cooldown for the voyages. So you could always only do one every 40 minutes or so. But more importantly I think that the balance between a not too high max bounty limit and a lot of effort needed to get it high enough to be worth it would be crucial. Maybe simply by making the base Bounty very low (20 gold), the max bounty fairly low (400) and the kill/ship takedown Bounty additions tiny (10 gold per kill / 25 per ship) and the fact that friends / crew members couldn't be targeted would make it a drag enough to stop the exploitation. It would still be great for random players as someone could be piling up a Bounty on their head for days and once it would reach 200+ people would be naturally interested. But if people still tried and teamed up, it would simply take too much bothersome time to be worth it. The amounts of gold I posted could be even much smaller. Literally 5 gold per ship, but the bounty always only taken away in a bounty voyage, not all player kills like I first intended. So players would not have to feel constantly worried and stressed about someone trying to kill them, but at the same time, once or twice a week, the bounty would simply rise high enough so you'd have to look around and be careful. And the longer your bounty would be on your head and the bigger it would grow, the more scared you'd become and the more people would come after you. I'm not trying to say that it's perfectly thought through to the last detail. It would be Rares job to make the gold/kill ratio perfect so it wouldn't be exploitable, yet still rather often worth it. I think it wouldn't be too hard if they actually were interested in this idea.

  • @d3adst1ck What if the bounty included the ship and Colours they flew? Then you could ID them at least from SPYGLASS distance ?

  • @wtshields I don't see the point in the entire feature. The ship customization options are probably not going to be expansive enough to uniquely identify ships to the point that you could identify a specific ship and crew (and then they could always just change the ship appearance each time they dock at an outpost), and if the bounties are only supplied for other ships on your server (because they can't give bounties for ships not on your server as there is no way to connect to a specific server containing a specific crew) then you don't need to identify them - just blast them all until you get the right one.

    It doesn't seem like a very useful feature to me.

  • @misterdoomed I don't see a problem to be honest. If you were only able to place order on someone on your own server, even if the bounty would transfer to your next server with you, the enemies wouldn't most likely be there anymore. Bullying would be therfore pretty much impossible. But this was an AI Bounty system in the first place anyway, as I said. The player on player bounties were only a side thing. But yea... Doubt it could be used to mess with someone too much. One... You'd have to be rich. Two, you could only do it for as long as the player stays on the server and then once more when they move to another. So... I think this would be alright, no?

  • @d3adst1ck said in [New feature idea] Bounty Hunter Guild "trading company" + The player database...:

    @wtshields I don't see the point in the entire feature. The ship customization options are probably not going to be expansive enough to uniquely identify ships to the point that you could identify a specific ship and crew (and then they could always just change the ship appearance each time they dock at an outpost), and if the bounties are only supplied for other ships on your server (because they can't give bounties for ships not on your server as there is no way to connect to a specific server containing a specific crew) then you don't need to identify them - just blast them all until you get the right one.

    It doesn't seem like a very useful feature to me.

    Maybe as an solution: you can choose 1 crew to attack as a bounty hunter and when you attack another ship it raises your bounty more than usual meaning you HAVE to look out which ship/crew/player whatever you have to kill.
    I know it is probably not a very useful feature....but it is what i would expect in a pirate based game to be honest :D
    Maybe having a cooldown as well to not have people just kill each other would be an idea as well.
    Still there will be people just killing out of fun....but that is always in a game with pvp features...

  • @shikia-caeleaum Yeah but why would I need to pay attention to who I'm attacking? If my bounty goes up, that doesn't affect me at all and I get gold for sinking the other ship no matter what. Just sink all the ships, no need to pay attention to if its correct bounty target or not.

  • Maybe as an solution: you can choose 1 crew to attack as a bounty hunter and when you attack another ship it raises your bounty more than usual meaning you HAVE to look out which ship/crew/player whatever you have to kill.

    I really like this! Because when you are out on the hunt for your TARGET you need to be careful not to inadvertently up your own bounty by indiscriminately blasting every ship on the horizon.

    That being said I think acting defensively when fired upon should not up your bounty while on a BOUNTY

  • @d3adst1ck Well. Big part of it is to be able to simply look up a player. Check their profile and have a way to show off to others. But with a purpose. SoT is about becoming a pirate legend. This would allow you to make yourself a name and share it with the world. In the end to be an actual legend, you need people to know who you are. This book could have all sorts of top player lists (kills, treasures found, levels with trading companies...) making you a good target for a check. Being able to see the current style of your ship and pirate would not only be to be useful to find out who your target is, even tho it would come in handy then, but more importantly to show yourself off. Along with the description of yourself, your name and crew name and all the other info, this could be a way to truly become a pirate legend that people would get to know. SoT is also supposed to be a big streaming game and this would be a way to check up on your fave "celebrities". It would still have a function as a way to help you distinguish your target, but that would be only half the feature. Also... Idk about you but for me, "taking them all out" sounds like quite a task. Not impossible, but this would make it much easier.

  • Again as an after though .... sorry mods.

    I just imagined a scenario where a TARGET was being engaged and just D/Cs to avoid being sunk. I think in this case the bounty should still be awarded with a "You chased them scallywags out our waters ! It be a long time a'fore we see the likes of them!!! YAR"

  • @d3adst1ck Also you're wrong about that. You don't get gold for sinking the enemy ship or killing a pirate unless you started a voyage with that exact aim. What I said was,
    WITH EVERY SHIP YOU TAKE DOWN OR A PLAYER YOU KILL A BOUNTY ON YOUR HEAD WILL GROW! You don't get any money for that, others will get more money for targeting you using a bounty voyage. Read it again, you didn't understand what I meant.

  • @d3adst1ck there will always be player like you who just attack and shoot... :)
    but there are other players as well....rp players or players who want to really experience the game like pirates: meaning first meeting a ship and try to communicate before shooting it to the ground...ehm sea :P
    it will definetly be a feature that may not benefit you since maybe you just like to sink everything on your way....
    but many players have different kind of play styles...why stopping the option of a bounty mechanic when it may be one of the ways for some players to build a reputation like the game wants us to do :)
    maybe have like a score system to see which player on your server is a good bounty hunter and ask them for a job yourself: like please kill that pirate and i give you a predefined gold amount.
    There was also someone, please excuse me I forgot his game tag, who offered himself as a companion and defender for a chest per voyage :)

    Edit: and what the previous post said....you get nothing without having choosen a bounty to collect and maybe having a time limit or forfeit the quest when the person leaves :P

  • @retto-elbaroda

    In a game were everyone shoots everyone dead onsite, profiting from killing each other would become the primary source of income.

    Nobody would sail around catching chickens and pigs when you could just sink ships and kill people for vastly more profit.

    PvP in this game is the risk factor in running the PvE content. If it's also the primary source of reward, that's all the game will be.

  • @stem589

    ..... and now that I think about it, if engaging in PvP raised your Bounty, this would actually cull some of the needless griefing people may engage in.

    Sink a ship uselessly in port when there's noting on it..... well you just became a more profitable target.

    Alternately, this might also encourage some pirates to only engage in griefing to up their bounty and become the most notorious pirate in the game. (hey look....... I camped this kid for 2hrs, blowing him away over 100 times while he tries to swim to his mermaid)

    Reward for PvP is tricky...... and I've yet to see a game do it well.

  • @stem589 that is a valid point... :/
    maybe having a board with all bounties of the server will help...
    seeing a crew or many players with VERY high bounty suggest them doing pointless killing or griefing (which I hope Rare will do something to stop it, not fully but at least not as bad as it is currently) and you have still the chance of moving to another server where there may be in that way "noble" pirates ;)

  • @retto-elbaroda Why wouldn't I just do the guaranteed treasure map voyages if I wanted gold? Setting up the bounty ones like that means it only pays off if I can find the ship and sink it, which could take hours.

  • @stem589 That's what I was sorta explaining in one of the previous comments. The numbers I used in the original post were meant as an example. In the end the point of bounties should be that once or twice a week it would grow big enough for people to start caring, kill you and take the bounty away to the base value. It wasn't supposed to be the biggest source of income in SoT. Maybe once a day you could then meet a player that would be worth your time and then go for it. Of course the bounties on your head would only grow as much as your own skill and interest in killing other players and sinking their ships.
    PS. I shall add this to the text now, so people don't get confused

  • @d3adst1ck it may not be for the gold...but from a pirate game perspective would be awesome: I can easily see myself with a crew trying to hunt down other pirates without the killing everything I see style...our own adventure of seek destroy and get gold :D
    ...it would even bring some pure PvE players who still want to play this game (yes they exist out there...somewhere :P ) closer to the pvp aspect and the ship fight :)

  • @d3adst1ck That's like asking, why should there be the skeleton voyages, if there is already the treasure digging ones. It's just another way of getting to your gold. This time based of PVP and passively adding sense of karma to the game. The more "evil" stuff you do, the more people will come after you. Do you not think that's all a good thing? I'd love to see many more ways to get money than just digging out treasures, fighting skeletons and collecting animals. And the thing you say about "why would I do it?" is the best thing about this feature. You're unsure for a long time. Until the bounty reaches a certain spot. For someone this will be 200 gold. For others 400. Depending on how much do you actually enjoy fighting pvp rather than doing other voyages. And that's the beauty of it. You never know when could people come and get you. When would it be worth it for them. And the longer you live, the more careful you have to be.

  • @shikia-caeleaum I think its a fine idea... for an MMO.

    It seems like a waste of development time to put into an instanced world with low ship counts. If this was an open world with dozens and dozens of ships per server, then sure it makes sense but I'd rather that Rare focus on creating a rich world to explore (which is terribly lacking at the moment) than to add additional PVP mechanisms when there is no need to - PVP will happen regardless.

  • @d3adst1ck then the game should just be about raiding killing etc without any morals? yes PIRATES/THIEVES and all...but they still had some rules and honor and did NOT kill just about everything :/
    Thats what its like at the moment and it will scare many players away...
    only the purehearted pvp/griefers whatever you call them will stay after the last voyages/content etc. have been completed and that is (hopefully) not the game rare wanted it to be...:(

    I cannot change your mind about it and I agree when there are future plans of MORE content or more sufficient ideas they should pursue those first! :)
    Just thought about what a pirate game would have in my opinion and I am not alone on this since here are more people supporting these ideas ;)

  • @stem589 And also... Thing is, the bounty on your head isn't supposed to be showing how much of a legend you are. For that there is the rest of the book. Bounty on your head is supposed to be a reason for other players take the initiative and go get you. Ultimately, it's something you don't want to have too high at all the times. Exactly like you said.
    Another thing is, there would be a limit to it. 400 gold might be a solid number. So you can't become the "meanest pirate in history" even if you wanted to for some reason. And if you did get to 400, all it would do is to make others come after you. Karma.

  • @shikia-caeleaum said in [New feature idea] Bounty Hunter Guild "trading company" + The player database...:

    @d3adst1ck then the game should just be about raiding killing etc without any morals? yes PIRATES/THIEVES and all...but they still had some rules and honor and did NOT kill just about everything :/

    No, the game should be about exploring and adventures. They should focus on that. Adding a bounty system seems counter to that idea.

  • @d3adst1ck as I said in the end of my comment....when they are working on more content they should and probably will work/focus on those first ;)
    exploring and adventures yeah I agree then why is the game currently only about griefing? I know I know beta and not all content I know....but there WILL be players just doing what I said :/ and that is the thing that would ruin many peoples adventures....just getting killed over and over again just to switch servers and it happening again? what is the adventure of that? It was just an idea...NOONE said it should be implemented at launch or whatever...just an idea that MAY be a base for something more content like -.-

    They should focus on more content but also a solution to this "unmoraly" killing spree with soo many fellows doing it! I dont mind getting killed....but currently you cannot approach 70% of the ships you encounter since they just kill at sight :/ and the spawnkilling is horrible but thats another story ;)

  • @d3adst1ck

    PVP is going to be a large part of the game. Get some reward out of it would be nice...

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