Better cheat detection

  • Europa4033
    Captain
    Insider

    It can be frustrating for players to have to be at the right place at the right time to provide exact video proof of other players using cheats. Tonight, my husband and I were pursued by a reaper brig, where one player made a comment as to what we had on board, despite the fact they never boarded us (how did they know, when our loot was below?). We had no emissary, yet several times, they knew exactly where we were. After we sunk, we respawned at a different island. They came directly towards us. We scuttled, but hid on the island. As they passed by, one of them shot off, came directly towards us and killed us. We respawned on our ship at a different location, and again, they made a beeline straight at us, well over 8 blocks away, out of rendering distance. We just gave up at that point and logged out, letting them have the server to themselves and any other hapless victim they came across. I read how Rare announced that they're releasing an anti-cheat, however I hope it's not just dedicated towards ban-evaders or scare tactics. This is the second time this week around the evening-time that I've encountered players that have unusually uncanny luck such as these players. Two days ago we met players that never missed, despite aiming at a wall, their bullets seemingly knew to come towards us.

    We love Sea of Thieves, and our experience is being ruined by players that are using these cheats and hacks in the game. If I had recorded tonight's episode, it would've been over 4min., and previous experience has taught me that when I submit a report, if it takes long to attach the video, the system asks me to shorten it down, which would've made tonight's video impossible to view for yourself. I just wish there was an easier way of reporting players, and if not, at least have better cheat detection.

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  • ParrotLord6426
    Master
    Insider

    Basically: Yes, i too think Rare is not really dedicated to keeping the seas clean, as there is not even a proper report system in place,
    and there is no visible action taken apart from lip service.

    While its sometimes hard to tell if a cheater or a very good player sunk u, there are certain situations (like the one u described) where its obvious.
    The current "report" system is designed in a way I feel actually hindered in trying to report a player, rather then encouraged, as, like u say, its really difficult to even do so:
    First: U have to keep a video programm running on ur own, u have to keep it open at all times or hastily try to open it when the situation occours.
    And then, once its recorded: U have to actually spend time cutting it down to even make it submitable!
    Third: U have to click/search/write ur way through the homepage to find the report feature, upload the stuff, spend time trying to describe the situation as clearly as possible.
    At this time around i put maybe 30-60 mins into simply trying to report a player, i feel like working for Rare at that point, on something THEY should take care of themselves in the first place.
    Ive done that a few times myself, U know, i like to help i guess.
    At the end i didnt get any notice whatsoever apart from the unspecific yadayada.

    While hacks certainly are not the biggest issue in the game,
    I always felt like Rare simply doesnt care about it - no offense, just my personal honest opinion.

  • BurnBacon
    Vanguard
    Insider

    reaper brig, where one player made a comment as to what we had on board, despite the fact they never boarded us

    What exactly did they even say? "We come for your treasure chests?"?

    We had no emissary, yet several times, they knew exactly where we were

    Maybe they..idk could see you from afar and just sail to the closest ship. That what most Reapers do.

    After we sunk, we respawned at a different island. They came directly towards us.

    Could of simply spawned close by, not uncommon.

    scuttled, but hid on the island. As they passed by, one of them shot off, came directly towards us and killed us.

    Mermaid gave you away. Depending on the island and "where" you "hide" it easy to find players.

  • ParrotLord6426
    Master
    Insider

    @burnbacon honestly whenever people answer to the cheat problem by only trying to divert and distract - I immediatly find u sus. No offense.

    Cheats in SoT are very easy to apply as far as i heard it, and there are a multitude of them, seeing Loot is like the most basic one - just watch some youtube or google it.

    Diverting/Distracting from people bringing this issue up is not helpful in my opinion.

  • a10dr4651
    Commander
    Insider

    It is hard without solid evidence to tell whether someone is cheating. Nothing here screams that they were, I'm not saying they weren't either, it's just so hard to tell sometimes. Some people are extremely good at the game and come across as cheaters because of this. This again though helps hide cheaters. Having the ability to make alt accounts easily on SoT doesn't help this situation. Those who are willing to cheat can do so without repercussions, they don't care about a red beard. I've found myself that there has been an increase in PvP orientated crews of late which has probably increased the amount of cheaters or those who are accused of it but are just skilled. Like I said, its hard to tell. All you can do for now is record play sessions and report those you feel are cheating and let rare deal with it. More reports they get, more likely they are to address it.

  • Unleet1
    Lord
    Insider

    Emissary or not, anyone with experience can track ships around the map and deduce by their island/sailing patterns, what people are doing and what you may have. Because most experienced players have seen the various RNG of the quests, island sequences, etc. through repetition. Nothing really screams "cheat" from the OP but as others mentioned, it's possible.

  • ReneSarjeant
    Ship Mate
    Insider

    Do a Google of Sea of Thieves cheats. There are tons of them. Please do not distract the original purpose of this post which is to encourage Rare to develop an anti-cheat system. No way could the other ship know what treasure they had onboard by "experience." That is a cheat and can easily be found on Google. I'm not using cheats, I have tons of fun playing the game the way it should be, but getting repeatedly killed by the same crew at different spawn points ruins the game. That, aim-bots and the like. It's crazy.

  • CaptainTibbz
    Seafarer

    Been playing since the launch and I've never had any issues with cheaters or hackers, Although I know there are some out there, Other than aim bot, I feel like this game is in ok state as far as cheating detection, could be wrong tho.

  • WolfManbush
    Champion

    Labeling an opponent a cheater without significant evidence or proof is taking away from what another has earned and weakening the improvement that we all work towards. If skill and wins become minimized with accusation then your own improvement will be reduced to the target of poor sportsmanship

    It's difficult for people to find drive to improve when the environment is poisoned with doubt and disbelief.

  • Schwammlgott
    Champion

    @europa4033 they are on it, just read this:

    https://www.seaofthieves.com/de/community/forums/topic/149671/updates-to-security-features

  • ParrotLord6426
    Master
    Insider

    @schwammlgott

    sweet. thanks for sharing

  • Europa4033
    Captain
    Insider

    @burnbacon
    1: What exactly did they say? They specified the fact that we had a few barnacled chests on board. Seeing that we kept them hidden below, how they knew this is beyond me, unless they were using a cheat.

    2: Unless you're able to zoom in to a distance beyond what the game allows you to render, I don't see how they could've seen us when they were near Mermaid's Hideaway (B 16), we were at Shiver Retreat (V 13). Is this possible BurnBacon?

    3: *Could've, not 'could of'. Also to answer your question, we spawned at Shiver Retreat, V 13, while they were near Mermaid's Hideaway (B 16). I guess if you still find nothing suspicious here at all and want to defend them, seeing ships 19 blocks away is perfectly fine and innocent enough I guess, my computer must be old, right?

    4: Our mermaid was on the opposite side of the island to which they were sailing. To put that plainly, my mermaid was on the west side of the island, while they came up along the west side, a member of their crew shot out, came directly towards where we were tucked/hidden (nothing unusual about that, right?) and killed us.

  • Europa4033
    Captain
    Insider

    @unleet1

    The weird thing is, we weren't doing any quests at all. We had no emissary. We were hopping around different islands looking for coral bottles, exploring, taking any/all treasure we could find along the way. Once we sunk, how they knew exactly where we spawned from across the map and came directly toward us (I have it on video) is a mystery. If they were using some kind of cheat to detect where we were, how would I be able to provide proof of this to Rare in the first place? This is why I'm hoping for better cheat detection in this game.

  • Europa4033
    Captain
    Insider

    @renesarjeant

    100% agree. How would I be able to prove that another player is using ESP? This is why I seriously hope they implement better cheat detection. I've read rumors that their current system is a joke, and the recent announcement is only for those who are attempting to use ban evasions. I seriously hope it's not true.

  • Europa4033
    Captain
    Insider

    @renesarjeant

    100% agree. How would I be able to prove that another player is using ESP? This is why I seriously hope they implement better cheat detection. I've read rumors that their current system is a joke, and the recent announcement is only for those who are attempting to use ban evasions. I seriously hope it's not true.

  • Europa4033
    Captain
    Insider

    @wolfmanbush

    This is why I hope better cheat detection is implemented, so every player is genuine. I've read rumors about the current system being a joke, that you have to basically be caught by someone recording you.

  • Eguzky
    Castaway

    @europa4033 said in Better cheat detection:

    @burnbacon
    1: What exactly did they say? They specified the fact that we had a few barnacled chests on board. Seeing that we kept them hidden below, how they knew this is beyond me, unless they were using a cheat.

    2: Unless you're able to zoom in to a distance beyond what the game allows you to render, I don't see how they could've seen us when they were near Mermaid's Hideaway (B 16), we were at Shiver Retreat (V 13). Is this possible BurnBacon?

    3: *Could've, not 'could of'. Also to answer your question, we spawned at Shiver Retreat, V 13, while they were near Mermaid's Hideaway (B 16). I guess if you still find nothing suspicious here at all and want to defend them, seeing ships 19 blocks away is perfectly fine and innocent enough I guess, my computer must be old, right?

    4: Our mermaid was on the opposite side of the island to which they were sailing. To put that plainly, my mermaid was on the west side of the island, while they came up along the west side, a member of their crew shot out, came directly towards where we were tucked/hidden (nothing unusual about that, right?) and killed us.

    Ignore the people who always seem to talk down when someone discusses cheating.

    I used too have a friend, back in the Overwatch days:
    When I got killed by a Zarya with 100% laser beam accuracy, following my Junkrat movement 1-to-1 (IE: No hesitation, readjusting aim, or human reaction times), I recorded the kill-cam.

    My friend's reaction to a player having super-human reflexes (no lag time), 100% accuracy, and fluid movement that would require a PC desk the size of a small car (no re-adjusting their mouse)?
    'I'm better than you at this game and I don't think they are cheating, so they're not. You're just bad.'
    Literally everyone else I showed the video too said the Zarya was aimbotting.

    But there's always people who want to take the 'high road' and avoid even admitting cheats exist, even in the face of said cheats.
    It sounds like you ran into cheaters; they should have had no way to beeline for you across the map like that. OR to know what was in your ship*

    *Within reason:
    Sometimes, if you see a ship far enough away, you can see Bounty Skulls or Mermaid/Siren gems glowing before the ship renders. Or even through the ship's walls.
    But this does not work for chests, as far as I am aware.

  • WolfManbush
    Champion

    @europa4033 said in Better cheat detection:

    @wolfmanbush

    This is why I hope better cheat detection is implemented, so every player is genuine. I've read rumors about the current system being a joke, that you have to basically be caught by someone recording you.

    People can tell sometimes when exploits are being done, experienced fighters can tell when macros are being used

    largely people do not know if another is cheating in the form of a program.

    People assume and a big issue is that people think that their skill levels are the standard for what is and isn't cheating. This can be found in streaming/content creation which then becomes narratives that get spread around that are not based on fact.

    "I'm good and I couldn't do that so it's "sus" "

    The sus thing lead to a lot of this. It's when people lightly accuse others of things and leave themselves wiggle room to back out of it when they are questioned over it.

    It's poor sportsmanship and largely not based in fact or accuracy.

  • Europa4033
    Captain
    Insider

    @schwammlgott

    Yes, as I indicated in my original post. What I'm concerned about however, is that what they're referring to in that link is to try and catch those attempting to evade bans from the game, and not those already in the game using cheats. There are so many cheats available for this game, I don't have to tell you. Rumors I've read say that the anti-cheat in this game is a joke, as they rely on their players to record you using it, and if you're using ESP or aimbot, good luck trying to catch cheaters with that (which is why I'm advocating for better cheat detection).

  • Schwammlgott
    Champion

    @europa4033 I'm here since beta, played daily for the first 1,5 years and still play at least once a week, not short sessions and I saw 1 time a crew cheating

    There aren't that many cheaters as you think

  • Europa4033
    Captain
    Insider

    @schwammlgott

    Even if there were, it would be impossible for me to know, on top of being frustrating to gather video proof for Rare (which I have by the way) hence the main point of my post: please implement better cheat detection instead of relying on the players to provide proof.

  • Tenriak
    Marauder
    Insider

    I have never seen a cheater. I think they were just better than you.

    Googling Sea of Thieves cheats doesn't really mean much. I went through most of them and the grand majority are scripts. Still cheating but nothing like ESP.

    You just got followed.

  • Sally Kraken
    Marauder

    Well, the cheating moved from subtle, like esp, into blatant with flying people dropping kegs and players teleporting about.

    I think we are at the point where it's not about winning, it's about being as blatant and unpleasant as possible. It is aggrevated harassment.

  • ParrotLord6426
    Master
    Insider

    @tenriak sagte in Better cheat detection:

    I have never seen a cheater. I think they were just better than you.

    Googling Sea of Thieves cheats doesn't really mean much. I went through most of them and the grand majority are scripts. Still cheating but nothing like ESP.

    You just got followed.

    Thats simply wrong and i can`t comprehend why u would even state that. literally the first 10 pages for me are aimbots and ESP. And I only googled this once a few days ago when this thread came up and i checked it for a statement here

  • ParrotLord6426
    Master
    Insider

    I honestly cant comprehend why so many people are trying to downplay the cheating issue here.

    I have never experienced this in a forum of a game where cheats like aimbot and ESP are VERY easy to find, more complex ones like TP probably also exist, and since there is no anticheat programm in place one can only speculate about the number of cheaters in the game anyway.

    Like, why would u even do that. Why would u even try to divert from the topic like that, to downplay it like that.

    In the current situation explained by the OP its clearly an ESP cheat. My first 10 google results are aimbots and ESP cheats explaining in detail what they do.
    Like, i simply cant get my head around why people would even try to downplay that. maybe someone can enlighten me.

  • WolfManbush
    Champion

    @parrotlord6426 said in Better cheat detection:

    I honestly cant comprehend why so many people are trying to downplay the cheating issue here.

    I have never experienced this in a forum of a game where cheats like aimbot and ESP are VERY easy to find, more complex ones like TP probably also exist, and since there is no anticheat programm in place one can only speculate about the number of cheaters in the game anyway.

    Like, why would u even do that. Why would u even try to divert from the topic like that, to downplay it like that.

    In the current situation explained by the OP its clearly an ESP cheat. My first 10 google results are aimbots and ESP cheats explaining in detail what they do.
    Like, i simply cant get my head around why people would even try to downplay that. maybe someone can enlighten me.

    Cheats existing isn't proof of it being used
    Links and sites looking to data mine and spread shady coding aren't proof of someone using a cheat

    It's quite simple, people aren't cheating just because people say they are. If there is not significant evidence /proof then it is assumption and speculation turned into accusation and that isn't based in truth, fact, or accuracy

  • Tenriak
    Marauder
    Insider

    @parrotlord6426 said in Better cheat detection:

    @tenriak sagte in Better cheat detection:

    I have never seen a cheater. I think they were just better than you.

    Googling Sea of Thieves cheats doesn't really mean much. I went through most of them and the grand majority are scripts. Still cheating but nothing like ESP.

    You just got followed.

    Thats simply wrong and i can`t comprehend why u would even state that. literally the first 10 pages for me are aimbots and ESP. And I only googled this once a few days ago when this thread came up and i checked it for a statement here

    Read more. Actually click a link and you wont find any of that. Just auto row boat scripts and similar.

  • ParrotLord6426
    Master
    Insider

    @tenriak thats simply wrong. And if u want to see cheats in action, just go to youtube. Why would u even try to paint that picture.

  • Ryzen7606
    Seafarer

    I have encounter a reaper ship today and i think they were using some cheat becouse i was athena emissary lv1 and they also was reaper lv1 and we both were really too far from each: they anticipated my movements when we were really too far to see each other.

    I dont think it was possible without it -_-

    It's really hard and frustrating prove they were using them (cheats).

  • Grog Minto
    Master
    Insider

    I won't say that the players you encountered were not cheating. They could have. Realistically we'll never know. Regardless it's a shame that it ruined your experience and I hope that you will get better ones soon. :)

  • Vic Kestrel
    Marauder
    Insider

    Funny how the guys that are downplaying cheats are all on my block list...

  • ScurvyWoof
    Captain

    @vic-kestrel said in Better cheat detection:

    Funny how the guys that are downplaying cheats are all on my block list...

    I haven't even been paying attention to this thread but that's just downright petty.

  • Jyanin
    Marauder
    Insider
    Founder

    I guess this thread is why it's so hard to report 'cheaters'. If it WAS a single button "REPORT PIRATE", Rare would have no time to do any work :p

  • Halburz
    Captain
    Insider
    Founder

    It's difficult to say when someone is cheating, but other times it is also very much obvious. People doing "impossible" shots is not a reason to call them a cheater, but I have seen people flying, teleporting and also use 1 bucket scoop to clear up all the water in their ship.

    It's never going to be possible to stop all cheaters and be careful of accusing people as well. But there is no denying that there are plenty around.

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