Rolling up ladders for solos

Safer seas or group up. Solo sloop is hard mode

Rolling up one ladder for solos would be good given boarding meta made easier with grapplin gun cheez - or make traps impervious to cannon fire.

incredibly hard to defend yourself against as a solo slooper

Hard mode if you play alone, But you have better position on the ship. Everything within arms reach, and there are things called "Traps" so you can set them up.

Why not let us roll up our ladders and make bigger crews actually put in effort?

Takes little effort to ram and cannon shot over.
But im curious...what if you fall off your ship and, the ladder is right there. But since it rolled up, you are unable to get back on board yourself.
What then?

Besides: All ships are basically equal when it comes to function. So if Sloops have a feature, the other ships should as well.

@burnbacon
"Hard mode if you play alone, But you have better position on the ship. Everything within arms reach, and there are things called "Traps" so you can set them up."
Could you give a specific example? I don't know exactly what you mean with having everything in arms reach and how it would help. Like sure I can have storage crate with Blunderbombs, I have an ammo box and can switch weapons. All very nice things. I'm still only one guy who unfortunately can't grow a blunder out of his butt and deter the person climbing behind me while I deal with his friend. Assuming all are of roughly equal skill level. Correct me if I have missed your point please.
"Takes little effort to ram and cannon shot over."
You have to immobilize my sloop first or put enough pressure on me so I can't deal with your boat coming at me. Otherwise I'll just chain you and move away while you're busy pulling your masts.
"But im curious...what if you fall off your ship and, the ladder is right there. But since it rolled up, you are unable to get back on board yourself."
That is an excellent point that I did not consider at all. Thank you. I mean I could probably still get a mermaid but it'd take time. Hm. Only rolling up one ladder might solve this. I'd still have to potentially deal with 2 guys climbing the same ladder but that's less awful than 2 pirates boarding both I'd say.
"All ships are basically equal when it comes to function. So if Sloops have a feature, the other ships should as well."
That's a statement for sure. 1. I'm talking about solo sloop specifically. 2. Why? Solo sloop has been heavily nerfed with the introduction of harpoon guns and the removal of dummy sailing. Since Rare apparently doesn't want to bring those mechanics back (I'm still hoping) why not add an additional function to solo sloops for balance reasons? I disagree that all ships need to have the same function. Thank you for your comment, sincerely. You put a lot more thought into it as the first guy and pointed out a very obvious flaw.

edit: I forgot to answer the part about traps. I did adress it in my main post but let me qualify it a bit more. If I know there are traps on the ladder or there's at least a high probability (because I got blunder trapped and sniped then killed before) then I'll just throw a blunder bomb at the top of your ladder from the water. Trap gone, prolly did damage to the solo on the ship. Or I'll blow dart the top of you ladder. Depending on where the solo stands that could be even worse because not only does the solo receive trap damage but is potentially on fire.

@lazy-eye-ed said in Rolling up ladders for solos:

Solo sloop has been heavily nerfed with the introduction of harpoon guns and the removal of dummy sailing.

Dummy sailing was removed for all player ships at the same time the sloop received a speed buff, and the brig copped a speed nerf. Harpoon guns can only score a hit in a small number of locations on the sloop, compared to Brigs/Gallys. So calling out nerf isn't correct. Sloop play IMO has had a considerable number of buffs over the years.

I don't think allowing a solo player to roll up their ladder, whilst others have to leave them down is fair. I suggest that any changes made to the game have to be looked at from the PvP-sweat-hunting-you-down angle. How are they going to make advantage of this? If the sweat is already going to have an advantage against others in skill and strategy, any potential changes to the game shouldn't be aimed at widening the gap.

@smuntface
"Harpoon guns can only score a hit in a small number of locations on the sloop, compared to Brigs/Gallys."
It can attach to the entire side of the sloop both left and right. That in my opinion is not a small target. I'd say the same about the brig. I agree with the gally part, you can grapple onto way more compared to sloop/brig.
"So calling out nerf isn't correct."
I disagree because its removal affects solo sloops considerably more compared to a fully manned brig or gally. You are helm, cannonier, repair guy and mast catcher all at the same time whereas a gally or brig usually has a dedicated helm responsible for wheel and sails, a dedicated cannoneer and so on. It helps a solo compensate for his/her missing crew member and taking it away without giving anything substantial in return has changed the way solo gameplay works fundamentally. Not to our benefit. The result is reduced damage output, less time to repair and (with addition of the harpoon gun) more time we need to spend ladder guarding because 5 attempts per person trying to board. It did not affect all crew sizes/ships in the same way equally.
"Sloop play IMO has had a considerable number of buffs over the years."
Agreed. Faster respawn times come to mind for example. If you'd like to give some specific examples on how those buffs counteract the nerfs or even the plain field for solos I'm listening.
"I don't think allowing a solo player to roll up their ladder, whilst others have to leave them down is fair."
A duo sloop, galleon or brig against a solo sloop is an unfair scenario by default if we assume equal skill levels. I can see your point with the galleon because you can use the HG to circumvent the ladder guard. But in a gally vs sloop scenario forcing the solo to use the HP would nerf him/her even more because he's missing his additional weapon. Brig and Gally players can compensate for that due to their crew size.
"I suggest that any changes made to the game have to be looked at from the PvP-sweat-hunting-you-down angle." Can you explain why? I honestly don't see the benefit in it. If we go with the equal skill level approach we have a more or less defined goal both sides have to meet to achieve the desired outcome. The one who fails to meet it looses. Of course SoT isn't like that and the variety in skill levels is a factor but at that point you just have to put in the work imo.
I'd welcome a reply and potential counter arguments. I hope I don't come across as know it all or something; I'm hoping for input from people like you to evolve the base idea and see if its viable. Thank you for your input.

It can attach to the entire side of the sloop both left and right. That in my opinion is not a small target.

Yeah, and most cases nobody can properly jump on a ship while its moving when they Hit the sides. Takes proper care, timing and placement. Not many players are good at that.

You are helm, cannonier, repair guy and mast catcher all at the same time whereas a gally or brig usually has a dedicated helm responsible for wheel and sails, a dedicated cannoneer and so on.

When was the last time you been a Brig/Galleon and people were dedicated anything? Someone isnt pulling there weight, someone isnt watching something and one it fails, ship fails. Meanwhile, "You as a Solo" are master of your ship, you control and pick what to manage.

A duo sloop, galleon or brig against a solo sloop is an unfair scenario by default

Yeah, i feel bad for the Duo who are sunk by solo players more often, or even Galleon players. So unfair, a Solo can simply do whatever they want without worry.
Solo dont have to argue with crewmates, worry what someone else is doing, or if by chance they arent doing something unprotective.

People keep throwing the word "Skill" around like it even means anything in a game like this. Simple well prepared solo can do a lot of damage against full galleon crews.
With the Mimic dart, as a solo you can do a lot of trickery and blame another crewmate.

@burnbacon
"Yeah, and most cases nobody can properly jump on a ship while its moving when they Hit the sides. Takes proper care, timing and placement. Not many players are good at that."
Jump? It just has to attach so you slide down the side and then you sit in the water for a couple of seconds til the movement of the boat gets you close to the ladder. You just have to dial in once with cannons and then shoot out. Harpoon Gun solves the rest. That is not difficult even for new players. Which is why the HG was introduced in the first place.
"When was the last time you been a Brig/Galleon and people were dedicated anything? Someone isnt pulling there weight, someone isnt watching something and one it fails, ship fails."
The base assumption is that both crews know what they are doing. Yes, I acknowledge there is a skill gap and not all crews are equal. That just means that they have something to work on.
"Meanwhile, "You as a Solo" are master of your ship, you control and pick what to manage."
While having to put in twice the effort. That in my eyes is a perfectly fair trade off and does not grant me the huge advantage you seem to think it does.
"Yeah, i feel bad for the Duo who are sunk by solo players more often, or even Galleon players. So unfair, a Solo can simply do whatever they want without worry."
That is not the case. You may see your favourite streamer who has 10k hours in the game do it but those people are the exception not the rule. Not all solos are BoxyFresh, Miffoo or iDBz.
"a Solo can simply do whatever they want without worry."
Right. You don't play solo very often do you?
"People keep throwing the word "Skill" around like it even means anything in a game like this."
You don't think there skill progression in this game?
"Simple well prepared solo can do a lot of damage against full galleon crews."
Sure I don't disagree. If he has, you know. Skill.
"With the Mimic dart, as a solo you can do a lot of trickery and blame another crewmate."
That works on people who are stup - don't know the game very well. But sure lets say an experienced crew lets you up the ladder and they all are currently looking at their phone. Mid fight. Scrolling TikTok maybe. They don't hear the boarding noise. The one you shoot doesn't realize hes taking damage from your Mimic dart (10% I believe). You manage to drop the anchor. We agree that this at least gets their attention yeah? How long do you think it takes them to figure out that there are A) 4 people on the ship (lets assume a brig, why not) and B that the guy who dropped the anchor and is currently shooting explosive darts in their direction might be the enemy? And how often do you think you can manage to pull this off again?
No offense but I think I'm gonna pass on further discussion with you. Agree to disagree.

whats worse is that you and your own crew can set off your own traps, so you cant even reliably put them on your ladder without hurting yourself

Place them before combat or during and...idk "pay attention"
Good crew are fully aware.

@lazy-eye-ed said in Rolling up ladders for solos:

"I suggest that any changes made to the game have to be looked at from the PvP-sweat-hunting-you-down angle." Can you explain why? I honestly don't see the benefit in it. If we go with the equal skill level approach we have a more or less defined goal both sides have to meet to achieve the desired outcome.

The sweat-angle works, because the best players are better able to adapt to mechanics, adopting techniques to exploit them, potentially widening the gap between themselves and other players. Rare has changed quite a few things, like the One-Blunder, to try and bring that skill gap closer.

Let's role play - We roll up ladders for solo players;
You're being hunted by a sweaty Sloop-of-Doom. Both solo. They're deadly on cannons from extreme range, you've no chance in a naval battle, your supplies are exhausted. Harpoon gun is your only option to board, they're likely double gunning. Add to that, they're able to chase directly behind you, as you can't board with a keg, horn of wind etc.
Second role play;
Hourglass. Ever had a Solo Sloop battle go for 30mins+ while the other guy just runs? I have.

Taking away ladders sounds depressing for both.

So you're wanting a solo player to be a little safer on the seas, make them harder to board by rolling up ladders. Understandable.
I just think the more skilled, aggressive, solo sweat chasing another solo player, gets an advantage here as a result.
On the flip-side, once a larger crew realizes you're a solo, they'd equip harpoon guns, and since you mentioned harpoon-board-spam is a problem for you already, will rolling up ladders even change anything for you?

@smuntface
"The sweat-angle works, because the best players are better able to adapt to mechanics, adopting techniques to exploit them, potentially widening the gap between themselves and other players."
That is a Rare problem is it not? If I have to be scared of people exploiting stuff, Rare needs to get a grip on the problem and remove said exploits. They did so in the past I believe (I'm thinking about the removal of crud launch for example). Why design a playstyle (or angle as you said) that is made for defense against game breaking mechanics instead of incentivicing a defined skill goal both sides have to meet so that they both have a fighting (and winning) chance in battle? Like dang why even PvP if the outcome is decided by who knows the newest and best exploits.
"Rare has changed quite a few things, like the One-Blunder, to try and bring that skill gap closer."
I dont understand how the removal of One-Blunder tightens the skill gap. It would've been the perfect defense against someone who chooses to harpoon bord spam because I actually have a chance to punish him for it instead of leaf blowing him off the boat so he can try again. Which forces me to spend more time ladder guarding. Plus the amount of times I've seen players who have 5x my hours die to a swabbie One-Blunder makes me doubt this supposed reducing the skill gap even more.
"You're being hunted by a sweaty Sloop-of-Doom. Both solo. They're deadly on cannons from extreme range, you've no chance in a naval battle, your supplies are exhausted. Harpoon gun is your only option to board, they're likely double gunning."
So whats the issue? We have a guy (which is rare enough in adventure no pun intended) that is excellent at the game and has put in the hours to develop his naval and tdm skills. This guy has done the work and beating me is what should happen. Why else aquire skill? And why in the world would I even consider boarding in this scenario. If he is destroying me in naval that is the last thing I'd want to do because as we are both solos I'd have to divert all my attention to simply surviving.
"Hourglass. Ever had a Solo Sloop battle go for 30mins+ while the other guy just runs? I have. Taking away ladders sounds depressing for both."
I agree with this. I can't speak for HG players because the amount of Hourglass battles I have done in my life you can count on both hands. I resent the formulaic, repetitive nature and the mediocre rewards for it but that's on a whole other page. I am speaking solely for adventure big boat vs solo boat scenario and have to defer to the wisdom of my esteemed colleagues regarding anything involving Hourglass and its particular nature. Disabling the ladder roll up for sounds like a fine compromise to me.
"On the flip-side, once a larger crew realizes you're a solo, they'd equip harpoon guns, and since you mentioned harpoon-board-spam is a problem for you already, will rolling up ladders even change anything for you?"
...Yes? Am I missing the point here? Having to defend one ladder or no ladder at all allows me as a solo to invest more time in repairing, sail adjustement, cannoning and thinking in general. The only thing I need to look out for is ram, camp and rodl and deck shots. As I said you can't reliably defend yourself against a decent brig that knows you are solo even if you are of equal or higher skill level. Like what options do I have if there are 2 people climbing both of my ladders and I only have one blunder? Which doesn't even kill? This way I could at least potentially get rid of one while the other drops my anchor probably and then I can deal with him. That's still not ideal but the one guy managing the brig suddenly has a much larger workload and with old respawn times for brigs killing one and killing the second guy after some time might actually give me a chance to recover. But since we don't have old respawn times for brigs and One-Blunder is gone and harpoon gun is a thing why not let me roll up ladders? Solo is a valid playstyle and if Rare doesn't want to balance it that's their perogative but remove it then so I can finally quit the game. As it is right now solo is not a viable playstyle anymore. The only dubs you can get are against bots and new players. Even the 10k hour solos agree and are leaving the sinking ship. It's atrocious to think about what a Miffoo or BoxyFresh could do in the past and compare it to what he can do now. For me it's even worse because I do have my 2k hours played but am still nowhere near their level. Thank you for your input I value it. Sorry if I ranted a bit I can't help myself.
How do I highlight stuff like you do btw I'm not smort enough to figure it out.

Wall of text doesn’t help convince or prove the feature is needed. Keep it to the point.

Remember. If you can something in your ship. Other players can as well. Meaning if someone forces you off your ship, they can roll up the ladderr. Preventing you from getting back the easy way.
Can’t be a feature locked from other crews.

@burnbacon
"No offense but I think I'm gonna pass on further discussion with you. Agree to disagree."

@lazy-eye-ed said in Rolling up ladders for solos:

How do I highlight stuff like you do btw I'm not smort enough to figure it out.

Use "QUOTE" below the post and put your lines inbetween (with an extra line-break) - or use the "greater than" sign at the start of a line/paragraph of the quote and use an extra line-break for your own text.

@lazy-eye-ed

Understandable. Difficult to find a someone to actual have conversation with here. Always "your wrong Im right"

<Use "QUOTE" below the post and put your lines inbetween (with an extra line-break) - or use the "greater than" sign at the start of a line/paragraph of the quote and use an extra line-break for your own text.<
<Working as intended? Test, test.<
My god I'm a cave troll when it comes to technical issues. I'll figure it out eventually. Thank you Lemon.

@lazy-eye-ed said in Rolling up ladders for solos:

<Use "QUOTE" below the post and put your lines inbetween (with an extra line-break) - or use the "greater than" sign at the start of a line/paragraph of the quote and use an extra line-break for your own text.<
<Working as intended? Test, test.<
My god I'm a cave troll when it comes to technical issues. I'll figure it out eventually. Thank you Lemon.

You're using the "less than" sign :), it's the one pointing to the right

@lazy-eye-ed I used to love PVP in this game, but I left years ago due to this. I want to fire cannons during a ship battle, not fight off boarders and fight with weapons in a confined space on a sloop. I recently played again and it looks like they finally added FOV adjustments after all of these years! So that does help a bit with ship fighting. However I still want to fire cannons not camp my ladders.

There needs to be a land based weapon fighting mode so players can fight on land and have space to run around. Most people I played with years ago would love this mode!

I think the best approach to ladders would be when the ship is anchored, when the sails are up, or when the mast is down ......the ladders drop. If you knock my mast down or catch me anchored somewhere, come on aboard. All other scenarios the ladders should be up. If you get knocked off while your ship is moving you can always take a mermaid. I would grind hourglass and start playing again if they did this.

@lazy-eye-ed Salty update incoming.

I just tried to fight another sloop, I was solo they had two. My main goal was to just stay on board and block their boards. Nope, I guess I just stink, because their tactic was just to spam board until they eventually got on and then I got camped by a bucket head "Legend of the sea of thieves". Yikes.

No thanks, I am out again. I will check back in a couple of years if this game is still around if they have made any adjustments to ladders so I can just have a boat fight in a pirate game. Sad because I loved this game.

I want to fire cannons during a ship battle, not fight off boarders and fight with weapons in a confined space on a sloop.

Never read or seen some of the movies? This what happens during combat, mix of both land and sea.

However I still want to fire cannons not camp my ladders.

Get a crewmate, Snake baskets, Bear Traps, throw down some crates/treasure chests. So many tools to use.
OR...let them board and use a Horn to blow them away/Blunder them off.

If you get knocked off while your ship is moving you can always take a mermaid.

Not when your ship is still nearby, sailing in a circle and you can grab the ladder with ease.....wait, ladder is up or enemy is watching "your ladders' now.

because their tactic was just to spam board until they eventually got on and then I got camped by a bucket head "Legend of the sea of thieves". Yikes.

So, you as a solo fight a duo sloop. They both left there ship...to board. Meaning..you could of fired at there ship, put some holes and force them to decide. Save your ship or board.
Good tactic, Set your ship on fire. Let them burn as they get on xD

Funny how a simple ladder is the deciding factor to a simple game.
If they add roll up ladders. Players will make sure to knock you off (with ease mind you) and prevent you from getting a mermaid. Leaving you only to try and swim away, or die.
Then...Spawn killing.

@shadowfox327533 "toxic ways to board you"

bruh

I would love to see all ladders up on all ships just to make ship battles less bunny jumping more ship combat

Just ram your ship into them, avoid the ladder.
Harpoon onto deck from the Mast. Cannon shot over.

Remove ladder boarding, and start using the other less "exhausting" part and you will still have the same outcome.

Instead of watching the two..Two ladders, now you got to watch for ships getting close, or flying pirates. (open sky)

One last thing I would add is that as someone with less than perfect hearing, some visual indicators for accessibility would help dramatically. Fortnite does this with footsteps, so the hearing impaired and people who want to play quietly can see when others are approaching. If I had some visual cue as to swimming or ladder grabbing it might not be as bad for me.

This game has been out for years with mostly the same mechanics and people complaining about a lot of the same things. As the player base starts to dwindle why not make some quality of life improvements like this and see what happens? Ah but that is not in the spirit of the game or how it was intended. This game has been out for like 8 years now what's the worst it could do? lol

Why not do something like allow multiple game modes and players choose their experience? See what people actually pick.

Again I will point to Fortnite, despite if you like that game or not, it has multiple game modes to choose from and it didn't kill the player base, its still raking in $$$ and has millions of active players per day. Some options and variety would be nice in SOT.

@burnbacon said in Rolling up ladders for solos:

Funny how a simple ladder is the deciding factor to a simple game.

Exactly

add is that as someone with less than perfect hearing, some visual indicators for accessibility would help dramatically. Fortnite does this with footsteps, so the hearing impaired and people who want to play quietly can see when others are approaching

Send this info to support for additional assistance.

But you have to remember here.
You’re wanting visual aid for when people board or try to be sneaky. Tucking people won’t like this when people turning them on to help catch them sneaking in the water or trying to quietly climb. Next will need other better audio to help see players for the blind.
Penny for thoughts.

And Fortnite vs sea of thieves is poor comparison. That comparing halo and cod, each have there own traits that make them better or worse. Keeps them special and unique, not a copycat.