Add a system to stop ladder re-grab spam.

  • MaxMikester
    Sailor
    Founder

    I have a simple request: Make it so that if you take weapon/non damage over time (DoT) hits while on a ladder (sword, gun, blunderbomb, cannonball, etc) you cannot grab the ladder again for a few seconds.

    Why do I ask this? Ladder re-grabbing spam. Normally if you take non DoT damage while climbing a ship's ladder you would let go and take knockback. However, because by default the key to grab and let go of the ladder are DIFFERENT (As an Xbox player for example, X let's you grab the ladder while B lets go of it) players can just spam the ladder grab key rapidly to avoid falling off and actually keep climbing upward regardless of taking damage, allowing them to get on the ship to do whatever for PvP, making countering it next to impossible save for if the hit kills the climber in question due to low health.

    This defeats the entire point of ladder guarding when enemy players try to board. Before you tell me to use the blunderbomb and/or blunderbomb trap, no that sadly does not work despite the fact that's what it can be used for and I have tried. Not even the knockback created by a blunderbomb's explosion can stop a climber from spamming the key and keep going up to board you if they spam the key enough. I do not need to explain how this is completely unfair from a gameplay balance perspective. I can shoot or slash someone on the ladder and they can just bypass the knockback and get on my ship anyway to do whatever they want. While the Horn of Fair Winds and the Ashen Winds Skull could potentially counter this problem, these items aren't always available due to the specific requirements to obtain them. (Both are generally only obtained via World Events/Raid Voyages)

    I normally don't seek out to engage in PvP nor am I some pro at it, but I have lost PvP clashes many times in large part because of people spamming/rapid tapping a button to bypass a counter tactic to the point it has gotten really annoying and frustrating to play. It should not be considered a 'skill issue' on my part when rapidly pressing a button like a quick time event in some other game can nullify trying to counter boarders so easily. I get it, it's a pirate game and people will PvP on the high seas and fight dirty. However this falls more along the lines of abusing/exploiting game mechanics to gain an unfair advantage.

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  • WolfManbush
    Champion

    I get the frustration, very much so.

    It's not gonna make a difference though

    a decent crew is gonna get on eventually, even a not so coordinated crew might.

    The deck is stacked in the favor of bigger crew spam boarding and now they have an OP harpoon gun.

    It's all about win conditions now. Fight with strategy to "get something done" or fight just to fight. This ain't the game for balanced pvp. It's the game for random adventure pvp.

  • Europa4033
    Commander
    Insider

    I mean, even if they remove what you ask, there's still the option of the grapple gun. I've had a few players try to get on my ladder this way, but a pistol and blunderbomb usually fix it. Then they grapple again, and I repeat as well. With me holding 5 pistol bullets, 5 blunderbombs, and the fact they get 5 grapple hooks, they won't be successful.

  • MaxMikester
    Sailor
    Founder

    @europa4033 Yes the Grapple Gun exists, but that is more balanced because of the fact you still have to aim and has a significant reload time like the damaging guns, as well as sacrificing having second damaging weapon. Grappling the ship doesn't guarantee you can reach the ladder especially when the ship is on the move, nor does grappling the ladder instantly put you on it.

    By comparison, mashing a button to re-grab the ladder feels like straight up cheating, and the only reliable way to counter it requires items that are rare and not easy to obtain compared to something like a blunderbomb. This has been a thing before the Grapple Gun was added to the game and more and more people are doing it because it is straight up busted as a result, more so than the Grapple Gun itself.

  • WolfManbush
    Champion

    @maxmikester said in Add a system to stop ladder re-grab spam.:

    @europa4033 Yes the Grapple Gun exists, but that is more balanced because of the fact you still have to aim and has a significant reload time like the damaging guns, as well as sacrificing having second damaging weapon. Grappling the ship doesn't guarantee you can reach the ladder especially when the ship is on the move, nor does grappling the ladder instantly put you on it.

    By comparison, mashing a button to re-grab the ladder feels like straight up cheating, and the only reliable way to counter it requires items that are rare and not easy to obtain compared to something like a blunderbomb. This has been a thing before the Grapple Gun was added to the game and more and more people are doing it because it is straight up busted as a result, more so than the Grapple Gun itself.

    Grapple gun brought down the skill requirement for boarding significantly. Literally any experienced player can spam with it and all anyone has to achieve with it is a distraction. A distraction against a smaller crew/less skilled crew/solo is all anyone needs cause a lot of issues for the one defending.

    The ladder juke stuff is much more skilled based.

    Grapple gun is just sanctioned ladder launching through a feature. Very very op as a boarding tool. Which is why people use it and why people are finding a lot of success with it.

    The "takes a weapon slot" thing is irrelevant in a board. One weapon and the easy board attempts is all it takes in the reality of an adventure fight.

    Don't need to be a 2 weapon sweat when unlimited board attempts are on the table in a cat/mouse situation. Especially against solos/smaller crews. Add in these bonecallers they have now too and it's a real unfun party as the one defending.

  • heslashthem
    Legend
    Insider

    Blunderbuss is pretty effective now at deterring boarders. Let ‘em climb to the top, wait till they’ve finished the animation for coming up over the ladder, then blunder them in the face. Off they go overboard.

  • Th3 Tater
    Marauder

    Horn of Fair Winds can be found randomly on islands. Found more on beaches than shipwrecks or shrines. I stay away from world events.

  • Pleb Sailor
    Marauder
    Insider

    This idea is too double edged.. even though it's aimed mostly at boarders, it's extremely double edged, now take the case that you get knocked out of your own ship, even just a PvE one like a megalodon/skeleton ship, and now they accidentally throw some ladder damage at you and you can't go fix your ship.... now imagine for example a burning blade or a ghost fleet, now take a volcano. . It just has more disadvantages than advantages... The fact that you lose in PvP is not really because others can spam the button and "abuse" the ladder grab, the fact that people from the other ship have the ability to board is that you don't put much pressure on them (Either you don't shoot/missing shots/only shoot one spot/not hitting one balls or getting killed by one balls yourself)

  • Captain Knyt
    Master
    Insider

    It’s not as simple as spamming interact, there is already a slight delay which means you fall down slightly. They need to time it properly, and you need to make sure they don’t. Or do enough damage to where they don’t want to climb

  • HiradC
    Lord
    Insider

    Not sure i agree, someone climbing your ladder with damage is still at a disadvantage as closer to death than you are. On the other side of this it is frustrating that someone swinging a sword non stop can be an effective ladder guard....already a massively one sided interaction

    Ps I suck at close quarters combat and boarding, much better at naval and am defending boards lot more than boarding myself.

  • Sairdontis4317
    Ship Mate
    Insider

    @wolfmanbush said in Add a system to stop ladder re-grab spam.:

    @maxmikester said in Add a system to stop ladder re-grab spam.:

    @europa4033 Yes the Grapple Gun exists, but that is more balanced because of the fact you still have to aim and has a significant reload time like the damaging guns, as well as sacrificing having second damaging weapon. Grappling the ship doesn't guarantee you can reach the ladder especially when the ship is on the move, nor does grappling the ladder instantly put you on it.

    By comparison, mashing a button to re-grab the ladder feels like straight up cheating, and the only reliable way to counter it requires items that are rare and not easy to obtain compared to something like a blunderbomb. This has been a thing before the Grapple Gun was added to the game and more and more people are doing it because it is straight up busted as a result, more so than the Grapple Gun itself.

    Grapple gun brought down the skill requirement for boarding significantly. Literally any experienced player can spam with it and all anyone has to achieve with it is a distraction. A distraction against a smaller crew/less skilled crew/solo is all anyone needs cause a lot of issues for the one defending.

    The ladder juke stuff is much more skilled based.

    Grapple gun is just sanctioned ladder launching through a feature. Very very op as a boarding tool. Which is why people use it and why people are finding a lot of success with it.

    The "takes a weapon slot" thing is irrelevant in a board. One weapon and the easy board attempts is all it takes in the reality of an adventure fight.

    Don't need to be a 2 weapon sweat when unlimited board attempts are on the table in a cat/mouse situation. Especially against solos/smaller crews. Add in these bonecallers they have now too and it's a real unfun party as the one defending.

    Agreed, now bring on added defenses against boarders to balance it out.

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