Let's Talk about the Season Pass

The plunder pass cosmetics that you get from the pass are from the Emporium. If you don't unlock them during the season, you can buy them from the Emporium. All the pass does is allow you to get selected cosmetics for a much cheaper price, and you don't really have the option to select what you get as it's a preselected set for that season.

The smart thing to do will be to play through the season and then as it gets close to the end decide whether buying the pass is worth what you would unlock or not. Maybe you didn't progress very far that season, or you already bought most of the cosmetics previously, or you just don't like them; you can save your money that season.

They've also never said anything about locking quests or features behind the pass. That stuff is available to everyone for free.

@d3adst1ck I am sorry but why would a person buy something again when they paid for it prior? It's is nothing more than a money grab at that point.

If a person paid for a season pass, they should be able to unlock those cosmetics whenever possible. The cosmetics are already in the game and I am sure rare can do the quests in way where it can be done long after the season pass is over.

@mad-jim-rogers That's how most season passes work. You get to claim what you've unlocked, and when the season ends the rest of the stuff disappears.

When you buy the pass you aren't paying for the items directly, which is why the pass is priced cheaper than buying all of the items themselves. You're paying for access to the premium unlock tier. If you play enough, you get more value than you've paid. If you don't, then you wasted money. That's why I said to wait until near the end of the season to determine if you get your money's worth or not.

I don't necessarily agree with passes and how they are set up, but that's how they work.

@d3adst1ck said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers That's how most season passes work. You get to claim what you've unlocked, and when the season ends the rest of the stuff disappears.

When you buy the pass you aren't paying for the items directly, which is why the pass is priced cheaper than buying all of the items themselves. You're paying for access to the premium unlock tier. If you play enough, you get more value than you've paid. If you don't, then you wasted money.

I don't necessarily agree with passes and how they are set up, but that's how they work.

But does it have to work that way? No it does not. I am not sure why you are advocating for it to work that way or even defending it.

I am saying, lets change how season passes work all together. It is only some software changes. It is not written anywhere in stone that season passes must be a certain way.

What I am suggesting is something better for the consumer, the person that paid Rare the money. If a person bought something, it shouldn't disappear.

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

But does it have to work that way? No it does not. I am not sure why you are advocating for it to work that way or even defending it.

I'm doing neither of those things.

@d3adst1ck said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

But does it have to work that way? No it does not. I am not sure why you are advocating for it to work that way or even defending it.

I'm doing neither of those things.

Good, then you see the light of reason that It can be changed. The current system is anti-consumer.

So instead of saying this is how the system works, lets try to change it together for the better?

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

So instead of saying this is how the system works, lets try to change it together for the better?

I was doing that because you seemed confused on how it worked in the first post.

@d3adst1ck said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

So instead of saying this is how the system works, lets try to change it together for the better?

I was doing that because you seemed confused on how it worked in the first post.

I was merely suggesting that the way season passes work now is anti-consumer. Hopefully you see this as well and want change? It does not have to be with this way :) Let's change it.

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

If a person paid for a season pass, they should be able to unlock those cosmetics whenever possible. The cosmetics are already in the game and I am sure rare can do the quests in way where it can be done long after the season pass is over.

This wouldnt really make sense how it works now. Where its like, if you have/are going to play a lot during the season, you can get the items cheaper. But they're still going to be in the emporium anyway after. If it didnt go away, they're basically just lowering the items on all emporium items eventually.

That being said, I do think theres space for something like you what you want as well. Or maybe even that it would fit SoT better. If its like a pay for the pass and get some basic items at the outset, but then as you unlock higher tiers they all become more cursed/magical and you unlock crazier looking stuff. If it worked like that, those items could only be for that pass. And always available

@dekeita I am talking about how things should change for the better. The current system of season passes are bad business behavior driven by greed and is very anti-consumer. I have no problem giving Rare money for new additions to the game, I do however have a problem when i give a company money only for them to remove the stuff i paid for. If I bought a pass, I should be able to unlock it at throughout the life of the game.

Let's see the world as it should be and not as it currently is. It is a very easy to change as it is just software. Rare can easily add new content/passes that can be bought every 3 months without it ever leaving.

Moreover, new and returning players should be able to buy those content for the life of the game. In the long term, Rare will make more money as new and returning players can purchase previous passes that they missed out on. Everyone wins!

I see no reason why passes should be a limited item thing other than the bad business tactic of eliciting people to buy something out of the fear of missing out.

@captain-coel said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers its not anti consumer at all. You are not buying those cosmetics, you are buying a chance to unlock them earlier and/or at a discount.

They are already said the plunder pass will just be emporium items, which means any other season rewards will be available to everyone atlrast during the season.

You literally just listed things that are anti-consumer :/

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@captain-coel said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers its not anti consumer at all. You are not buying those cosmetics, you are buying a chance to unlock them earlier and/or at a discount.

They are already said the plunder pass will just be emporium items, which means any other season rewards will be available to everyone atlrast during the season.

You literally just listed things that are anti-consumer :/

Ok you dont like the deal, dont buy it then. Other people might like this more. We'll see how it goes.

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

You literally just listed things that are anti-consumer :/

I don't know if it's necessarily anti-consumer. It's certainly not a random loot box. It's more akin to buying a ticket to an event. If you can't go to the event, does that make selling the ticket anti-consumer? I don't think so.

@d3adst1ck said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

You literally just listed things that are anti-consumer :/

I don't know if it's necessarily anti-consumer. It's certainly not a random loot box. It's more akin to buying a ticket to an event. If you can't go to the event, does that make selling the ticket anti-consumer? I don't think so.

analogies are bad reasoning, one does not equate the other. A zebra is like a horse but it is not a horse.

@Captain-Coel How does others purchasing stuff or even what they do with purchased stuff limit your enjoyment? Does it really matter to you that much its limited to you and others cant have something in a game? Don't tell people what to buy or not to buy with their money, I haven't told you what to do with yours.

My only gripe is how season passes work currently now, it is not fair to the consumer. How is it fair to someone who bought an item in a game for it to only stop working? Sure it might not have affected you. But what of the others that it surely will.

Moreover, what happens to the new player or returning player that buys a season pass with only a few days left on it. Explain how you think that is fair to them that the item they paid for disappears within a few days.

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

How is it fair to someone who bought an item in a game for it to only stop working?

You are not buying an item.

@d3adst1ck you are arguing semantics now. The season pass is the item.

I am proposing something that works better than the current season pass that is being proposed. Do you see any negatives in the changes that I am proposing? I only see positives.

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@d3adst1ck you are arguing semantics now. The season pass is the item.

I am proposing something that works better than the current season pass that is being proposed. Do you see any negatives in the changes that I am proposing? I only see positives.

It's impossible to say without Rares data on sales. But probably less money for Rare is the downside. And the only reason they're even trying this now. Is presumably because listening to everyone who said they'd gladly support the game with the current "pro-consumer" model of direct purchases hasn't been successful enough.

@dekeita said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@d3adst1ck you are arguing semantics now. The season pass is the item.

I am proposing something that works better than the current season pass that is being proposed. Do you see any negatives in the changes that I am proposing? I only see positives.

It's impossible to say without Rares data on sales. But probably less money for Rare is the downside. And the only reason they're even trying this now. Is presumably because listening to everyone who said they'd gladly support the game with the current "pro-consumer" model of direct purchases hasn't been successful enough.

These are just hypotheticals. But buying a season pass and being able to unlock stuff from it anytime shouldn't effect the bottom line that much?

Maybe it hasn't been successful enough because of the items being offered aren't compelling enough. Or, people having to visit an outpost or going back to main menu to buy something instead of the shop being on a tab next to quests or reputation. I could suggest a thousand ways to improve monentation.

But, I digress. Are there any negative effects to what I am proposing to the people that actually purchase a season pass and being able to unlock it at anytime they please.

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

you are arguing semantics now. The season pass is the item.

So you agree you're just buying a ticket then (aka a pass)? Tickets are items that grant access to limited time events that expire, which is what this is...

But, I digress. Are there any negative effects to what I am proposing to the people that actually purchase a season pass and being able to unlock it at anytime they please.

The game would need to track and display multiple past seasons, and how much progress you have in each, which will only get more bloated over time as more seasons are added.

It would also need to remember which seasons you've purchased passes for and which ones you haven't to make sure you are getting the appropriate bonus rewards.

@mad-jim-rogers I mean the specifics of how exactly they'd do it would determine how it could be worse for the player. Because it wouldn't really make any sense, to just literally make the season pass available forever, with how its currently implemented. But generally anyway when we're talking about removing all time limited content, the problem you're getting into is that no one will care to do it in the first place. The limited time seasons both paid and free aspects, help to create a environment that the player is more engaged with. Its not just a thing your purchasing, but its about participating in the ever changing world of SoT.

I mean they tried this for a year, with the free cosmetics, where everything is always available. If it worked better then when there was stuff limited time, I dont think they'd be reintroducing limited time aspects into the game.

That being said, again, I think theres could be a place for emporium purchased things that unlock higher tiers through play, and that are also always available. But its really a seperate question. I'd have both.

@d3adst1ck said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

you are arguing semantics now. The season pass is the item.

So you agree you're just buying a ticket then (aka a pass)? Tickets are items that grant access to limited time events that expire, which is what this is...

But, I digress. Are there any negative effects to what I am proposing to the people that actually purchase a season pass and being able to unlock it at anytime they please.

The game would need to track and display multiple past seasons, and how much progress you have in each, which will only get more bloated over time as more seasons are added.

It would also need to remember which seasons you've purchased passes for and which ones you haven't to make sure you are getting the appropriate bonus rewards.

You are conflating semantics and analogies. Semantics are meanings over words. An analogy is a comparison between two things. Buying a season pass to a game is not akin to buying a ticket to an event one goes to :) Like i said a zebra is like a horse but not a horse.

Tracking of purchases and progress isn't hard to do. It's already being done in the game.

@dekeita said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

@mad-jim-rogers I mean the specifics of how exactly they'd do it would determine how it could be worse for the player. Because it wouldn't really make any sense, to just literally make the season pass available forever, with how its currently implemented. But generally anyway when we're talking about removing all time limited content, the problem you're getting into is that no one will care to do it in the first place. The limited time seasons both paid and free aspects, help to create a environment that the player is more engaged with. Its not just a thing your purchasing, but its about participating in the ever changing world of SoT.

I mean they tried this for a year, with the free cosmetics, where everything is always available. If it worked better then when there was stuff limited time, I dont think they'd be reintroducing limited time aspects into the game.

That being said, again, I think theres could be a place for emporium purchased things that unlock higher tiers through play, and that are also always available. But its really a seperate question. I'd have both.

Again my main gripe is not about the ability to buy the season pass outside of limited time frame (though it would be nice to) but the ability to unlock stuff from the season pass once the time is over. If you bought a season pass, should the ability to unlock stuff from it go away? For example, if a person bought a pass on the last day, should they lose the ability to unlock stuff from it? I argue it shouldn't since they bought the pass.

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

Buying a season pass to a game is not akin to buying a ticket to an event one goes to :)

Yes it is :)

@mad-jim-rogers said in Let's Talk about the Season Pass:

Again my main gripe is not about the ability to buy the season pass outside of limited time frame (though it would be nice to) but the ability to unlock stuff from the season pass once the time is over. If you bought a season pass, should the ability to unlock stuff from it go away? For example, if a person bought a pass on the last day, should they lose the ability to unlock stuff from it? I argue it shouldn't since they bought the pass.

To be honest, my main gripe is your notions of what "should" happen, and terms like "anti-consumer". Put another way, You're saying If a player agrees to pay money and they have till tomorrow to unlock stuff on a pass, should they be held to that agreement?

Uh yes?

I mean if you've played during the season you'll have unlocked free stuff anyway, and on the last day you'll know for sure what you're getting if you pay.

But ok. Lets imagine. If you've payed for the plunder pass during the season, for emporium stuff only, you have extra time to complete it. Would this have a negative impact on the game. I guess not? They could make an extra page that shows all the unearned Plunder Pass Items you have left, and how much renown you need. And just strip out all the extra fluff to keep it simple, and easily maintained.

Feels like kinda a minor thing though. Not sure how many people would even really take advantage of it. I guess its possible you'd even get a few extra purchases this way.