RE: April 24 Update SoT Enforcement Policy

@gamerglyph

You can roleplay being a pirate without using racist, sexist, or ableist terms.
"I'm roleplaying!" is not an excuse to treat other players like dirt.

"Toxic communication over text/voice chat that isn’t of a discriminatory nature (i.e. doesn’t use racist, homophobic, misogynistic or ableist terms) will – depending on the strength of the offence – earn a player from 1-3 points and a corresponding suspension of 1-3 days for each instance of this behaviour."

This is a direct quote on steam... for the update:

this is what I am referring to: "doesn’t use racist, homophobic, misogynistic or ableist terms"

Under that quote anyone who taunts another player, mean or not - just acts like a pirate would in the real world without being sexist, homophobic, racist, misogynistic or ableist, gets a 3 point suspension.

That is a bit silly.

@lem0n-curry I'm not so sure with the way most players classify Toxicity... a lot of younger people think anything they don't agree with is Toxic, so yes I think this can be abused depending on who is moderating the game at the time.

@gamerglyph said in RE: April 24 Update SoT Enforcement Policy:

"Toxic communication over text/voice chat that isn’t of a discriminatory nature (i.e. doesn’t use racist, homophobic, misogynistic or ableist terms) will – depending on the strength of the offence – earn a player from 1-3 points and a corresponding suspension of 1-3 days for each instance of this behaviour."

This is a direct quote on steam... for the update:

this is what I am referring to: "doesn’t use racist, homophobic, misogynistic or ableist terms"

Under that quote anyone who taunts another player, mean or not - just acts like a pirate would in the real world without being sexist, homophobic, racist, misogynistic or ableist, gets a 3 point suspension.

That is a bit silly.

I mean, you can taunt without using insults.
That's what I assume it means; If you're insulting people, you may get in trouble.

I mean, most my voice communication is either idle chat, or congratulating someone on a good fight regardless if I won or lost.

@guildar9194 Reference: lDicionary.com
That same definition is in every dictionary that would be used by any education institution, so the definition really can't be debated.

You may not be insulting people directly, but you are provoking them which causes the same response in most people: fight or flight.
Either way its a gray area and wording on the 3 point ban needs further clarification and really should be reconsidered by the developers because things like the following will happen:

Player A is fishing off an island
Player B is thinking, hey easy target, lets get him!
Player A notices Player B and flees to avoid conflict.
Player B sends Player C to go to his ship and destroy it or they use cannons.
Player A feels harassed because of the actions of Player B and C
Player B starts yelling: Arg! Gonna sink yer ship matey! Nothin yer going to do will stop us!!
Player A starts getting upset because all they want to do is fish without being disturbed so they report Player B

Player B gets a 3 point suspension... for playing the game.

@gamerglyph said in RE: April 24 Update SoT Enforcement Policy:

@guildar9194 Reference: lDicionary.com
That same definition is in every dictionary that would be used by any education institution, so the definition really can't be debated.

You may not be insulting people directly, but you are provoking them which causes the same response in most people: fight or flight.
Either way its a gray area and wording on the 3 point ban needs further clarification and really should be reconsidered by the developers because things like the following will happen:

Player A is fishing off an island
Player B is thinking, hey easy target, lets get him!
Player A notices Player B and flees to avoid conflict.
Player B sends Player C to go to his ship and destroy it or they use cannons.
Player A feels harassed because of the actions of Player B and C
Player B starts yelling: Arg! Gonna sink yer ship matey! Nothin yer going to do will stop us!!
Player A starts getting upset because all they want to do is fish without being disturbed so they report Player B

Player B gets a 3 point suspension... for playing the game.

Except the reports are reviewed by a human. A human who knows the rules, even.
So no, Player B would not get a suspension.

Plus, reports have to be coupled with video evidence of the voice chat in question.
When ANY mod working for Rare hears that Player B said "Arg! Gonna sink yer ship matey! Nothin yer going to do will stop us!!"; They won't suspend them.

You're acting like the rules as you want to interpret them is the same vague way a mod working for Rare would.
Rare mods have a very comprehensive list of what they can and cannot suspend or ban for.

@guildar9194 "You're acting like the rules as you want to interpret them is the same vague way a mod working for Rare would.
Rare mods have a very comprehensive list of what they can and cannot suspend or ban for."

Agreed.

However I still think Player B would get banned because people are ultra sensitive these days. All it would take really is Player B to continuously follow Player A and sink them repeatedly. I mean it falls within the game rules as ok because that is what the game is really about. However it can also be thought of as harassment.

So perhaps instead of a 3 point ban, just make it so player B has a duration to wait before sinking the same ship over again. Problem solved.

@gamerglyph said in RE: April 24 Update SoT Enforcement Policy:

@guildar9194 "You're acting like the rules as you want to interpret them is the same vague way a mod working for Rare would.
Rare mods have a very comprehensive list of what they can and cannot suspend or ban for."

Agreed.

However I still think Player B would get banned because people are ultra sensitive these days. All it would take really is Player B to continuously follow Player A and sink them repeatedly. I mean it falls within the game rules as ok because that is what the game is really about. However it can also be thought of as harassment.

So perhaps instead of a 3 point ban, just make it so player B has a duration to wait before sinking the same ship over again. Problem solved.

It does not matter how 'ultra sensitive' people are. The rules are the rules.
If Player A gets offended that he got sunk; Rare WILL NOT ban Player B for sinking him.

Player A can yell all they want about how offended they are, and how they consider it toxic; Sinking is not toxic, according to the game's rules.
Therefore, Player B, just saying 'I am going to sink you', or sinking someone, will not be banned.
Because the mods enforce the rules as they are required too. Not based on one player's feelings about PvP.

You're acting like a player just has to say "I'm offended" and they can get someone banned. Which is incredibly incorrect.

Conduct gets easier to navigate when keeping two things in mind. How it could affect others and how it could affect you in the long term.

It's not anything to fear or to fight against. It's a public and shared space. Just avoid harsh language and personal insults.

Most of us already do this in our personal lives. With some friends we might communicate entirely differently than how we do with others. The humor can shift, the severity of the language can shift, etc. People do this all the time privately so it's just extending the same consideration to a public space.

Being considerate of others and of the impact of our conduct is an investment that always pays off in the end, in a lot more ways than one.

Just about everyone that is considerate of how they communicate and conduct themselves ends up wittier and more creative in the end. It will literally help people become better role players, not worse.

@gamerglyph

There’s a certain point when taunting becomes toxic. If it’s playful and doesn’t use any racist, sexist, homophobic, etc. terms then it’s fine to use in conversation.

However, if you start going down the dark path and using swears, racist comments, etc., that’s when things start to be considered toxic.

You’re either overthinking this, or you just really don’t understand how taunts work.

Just need to remember.
Do not use any voice chat in the game in the future, as Rare does not allow us to use voice chat.
Because none of us understand how to determine if the other party is using insulting language?
RARE didn't tell us either. Their way of judging insulting language.
[mod edit]
You can open a translation software, input this Chinese into it, and let the translation software tell you how to pronounce this Chinese.
The pronunciation of this word may sound insulting to those familiar with English.
But in the Chinese language environment, this word is a daily communication language used by people.
[mod removed]

Suppose there is a country called "A" in the world, and their curse words sound like "hello".
This vocabulary is explicitly prohibited in their country.
I met a player in the game and I just wanted to say hello to him. So I said, 'Hello'.
Coincidentally, the person across from me is from country "A". Can he report me?

So I suggest that we all avoid using the game's voice chat.
Unless RARE tells everyone how they define insulting language.
Especially cultural conflicts from different countries.

@gamerglyph

Would you say it to your parents/grandparents.....a cop?