Legendary/Athena's Progression Dead-end and Possible Solutions

  • Ahoy pirates!
    Sea of Thieves is one of the best games that I have ever played. I have made lots of friends and had many incredible adventures. However, I feel that the legendary progression system needs some serious work if Rare wants to keep legends from jumping ship (pun intended) after they max out their levels. I want to voice my opinions on some aspects of post-legendary gameplay that I feel could use some improvements.

    The following is my opinions and that of others that I play with. I'm sure not everyone will agree with me and that’s fine. These are just some ideas that I've been thinking about and wanted to share in hopes that Rare might consider some of them.

    First of all, I strongly feel that you should be able to continue to level up past 50 for the 3 trading companies (you would still be a legend when you get everything over 50). Not being able to see your rep increasing almost completely annihilates any incentive to do normal voyages (which dramatically changes the character of the game). This means that there is very little that remains in common between legends and those striving to be legends (as far as motivation). Hence why I hear a lot of people saying that "the game is over once you hit legend" because the primary motivator that kept you playing for 50 levels instantly evaporates. Most people need to feel like they have something to work towards and that they are making some form of measurable progress on. Seeing the rep animations pop up every time I sell something that just show "50" with no progress being added is a huge downer.

    A solution to this could be to allow people to continue to level up with no limit to it. Why put a hard stop on something that annihilates peoples motivation for playing? If there was always progress to be made then legends wouldn't mind doing normal voyages to help others level up. As it stands now, there is very little that motivates legends to play with other players (as far as doing voyages goes) unless they have empty spots on an Athena's voyage. Even then there is a clear difference in drive since legends don't care as much about loot because they don’t need the rep and usually already have lots of money. So it can sometimes be annoying playing with non-legends since they want to stop at every single shipwreck and refuse to ever leave loot behind (this makes doing Athena's with non-legends especially time consuming). So why not just allow legends to keep the love for loot by allowing them to keep progressing?

    On top of being able to keep progressing past 50, maybe have special equipment and costumes for each trading company (similar to the Athena's ghost outfit) that could be unlocked piece by piece with each additional level increase (50: sails, 51:hull, 52: boots, 53: gloves, 54: pants…). After 10 levels (60) start over again but with different color equipment and clothes. This would practically make the game infinitely playable. Also, I understand that it would take longer to develop the clothes, but maybe Rare could at least add the feature to track our progress and level up past 50 soon in one of the weekly updates so that they don't lose more legendary players in the meantime (I know many people that have lost interest in the game since there's very little left to work towards).

    Now for the Athena's voyages, I became a pirate legend a few weeks ago and am currently at level 8.8 for Athena's. I want to continue playing in the future, but am concerned that I will lose interest once I get to level 10 for Athena's (as has happened to others that I know who have reached level 10). A similar approach could be taken as discussed above, after level 10 the progression could start over again, but with a different color ghost suit (1-9 green, 10-19 blue, 20-29 red, 30-39 purple). Also, it would be nice if you could get an achievement for reaching level 10 Athena's and get a commendation for it. My friend said that it was kind of disappointing to get to level 10 and not get anything other than the hat. Why doesn't Athena's have the trackable commendations like all the other trading companies?

    I really enjoy SOT and am hoping that Rare will consider some of my suggestions to make the game even better.

    Happy sailing!

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  • These are very good ideas and you make a good point. I too think there should be a little more to Legends.

  • @dawson-dev The game needs more than that but it's a good starting point.

  • What most annoy about Athena's voyages is the merchant quests...
    If it fails and somebody compromise our voyage we have no way to go around it...
    The deliveries date are too long for us to wait it to timeout... And we can't cancel single quests nor pick the items again from the merchant..

    If we still want to make the legendary we need to wait for about 2 or 3 hours to it time out. Or we have to cancel the entire quest.

  • @nunoazuldimeter Being able to buy crates/coops/baskets would solve this issue.

  • @nunoazuldimeter cycle 5 or 6 merchant voyages through and collect all the cages before you lay down the Athena's. That way you'll have lots of extra cages on board which has numerous benefits. The main one is that if you're sunk, you can sail back to where you sank and collect enough cages from the water to finish the voyage. In my experience, the people that sink you will often take any animals that you have in cages, but don't bother with empty cages or if they do will only grab some of them (that's why you should have lots of extras). You should usually be able to make it back to the spot that you sunk before the cages sink. Even if they do sink you can still get them off the bottom (as long as it's not very deep). This helps in 90% of the scenarios that you'll lose cages. Sometimes people want to ruin your voyage so they'll take the cages, but that's not very common.

  • @dawson-dev
    It was our second legendary voyage. This is pretty new to us.
    we figured that out after we lost it. We tried to find someone to help us get it from merchant quests. But the server was empty like most of the time..

    So my friends gave up and quit the session after we run all the map trying to find someone. And I waited 2 hours AFK on an outpost for it to timeout ahaha.

  • @dawson-dev If you would like to see some of my ideas on made a post about Pirate Legends and it's uniqueness a while ago detailing some issues and possible improvements. Check the link if interested and feel free to comment and upvote if you like it. https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/topic/60029/pirate-legends-it-s-uniqueness

  • If you are concerned about losing the crates, a good way to insure the voyage is to start and cancel a few merchant quests to get extra crates. Once you start the Athena voyage, DO NOT collect the crates and only collect them if you lose your extras. (from any outpost)

  • Yup, I'm at Athena level 5.8 and I'm just not having fun anymore. Raise the skill cap from 50 to 100 and make it take months to acquire. They could have at least bumped it up to 60 for hungering deep so there was a little more to do.

  • @horizonlegendo yeah raising the level cap to 100 would be a lot better.

  • I think they should remove the level cap all-together and let people gain exp and levels infinitely, leaving the requirements for pirate legend as they are. I do have to say though, if you're playing a game solely to increment a number and not because you enjoy the action, you should stop playing. If the game ceases to be fun for you because the number can no longer grow any larger, you should search elsewhere for meaning in your actions. The game doesn't need more levels to raise. The game needs more enjoyable things to do.

  • @ttargetpractice I definitely agree.

  • I completely disagree with the OP. I've been legend for some time now and I am still just as motivated to run voyages as I was before I hit legend. I see no reason why the levels need to continue past 50. All that would happen is people would complain that there are no benefits after 50, such as an increased/guaranteed legendary chest on every.

    The motivation for completing voyages are the commendations and due to the recent rng tweaks, I'm now forced to run low level voyages with new players as that is the only way I am likely to get my castaway/foul commendations finished.

    I don't think Rare need to increase the cap at all. I personally think it is a good thing if the kind of people who server hop or speed run just to reach the arbitrary levels of 50/50/50/10 as quick as possible get bored and leave the game.

  • @warmedxmints thank you for sharing your thoughts on the matter. I appreciate your opinion. I'd like to address some of your points:

    I see no reason why the levels need to continue past 50. All that would happen is people would complain that there are no benefits after 50, such as an increased/guaranteed legendary chest on every.

    As long as they drastically slowed down the growth rate of required rep per level past 50, they wouldn't have to really change the voyages from the level 50 ones. What would make it worth it is if at each level past 50 you unlocked a new piece of the trading companies legendary outfit (as I mentioned in the post) just like the Athena voyages.

    The motivation for completing voyages are the commendations and due to the recent rng tweaks, I'm now forced to run low level voyages with new players as that is the only way I am likely to get my castaway/foul commendations finished.

    The commendations are, from my experience with other players, not a sufficient motivator to keep playing for most people. They are too much of a long-term investment that have a small future value. Maybe if you could use the commendation as soon as you get to level 2 or 3, but it would say "Hunter of Fort Skulls III" or "Hunter of Cursed Captains IV." Then I think it would have a higher future value for players.

    I don't think Rare need to increase the cap at all. I personally think it is a good thing if the kind of people who server hop or speed run just to reach the arbitrary levels of 50/50/50/10 as quick as possible get bored and leave the game.

    The goal was never to "reach the arbitrary levels of 50/50/50/10 as quick as possible." The goals were incremental and rewarding (i.e., unlocking new equipment and clothes, being able to open the hideout, completing the ghost suit). There's nothing arbitrary about it. Once all of those goals have been reached there's nothing else to play for that comes anywhere close to being has rewarding. Hence why so many people are leaving the game shortly after they hit legend.

    Also, I never server hopped, but I definitely speed run Athena voyages. You do the Athena voyages for rep, not treasure. Athena voyages are terrible for making money even if you stop for all the chest (compared to spending the same amount of time doing MA or GH). So why would you spend 3+ hours doing an Athena voyage when you can speed run it in less than an hour and a half? Speed running is a natural optimization of the process. I've even done Athena voyages in less than an hour a few times because we recruited a sloop to go do all the riddles and maps with one of our crew members while we did the skulls and caught animals. The sloops get to keep all the treasure from the islands and we get to finish the voyages faster. From my experience, legends are less likely to sail around looking for PVP or skull forts than lower level players since they're just trying to finish their Athena voyage in peace. So why is it good if people like me leave the game?

  • @dcr-lt-kanada great post!

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