Ahoy, not really a complaint here but just a good idea i've heard many people want that I haven't seen mentioned in the forums too often. That idea being the ability to call your mermaid to you whenever you want, that being within the same distance as normal so its not abused or changes the way they are used. Essentially make them not auto-appear but be able to come to you once you are within the right range and want them to. They seem to get in the way when trying to be stealthy and sometimes appear in areas you don't want them to, such as the other side of islands. Let me know what you guys think of this idea?
Call Mermaids When You Need Them
@anarchistang3l
This has been talked about a lot and the general conclusion from players and from Rare themselves is that this is not a stealth game.
Camping would be completely overpowered if you could choose when your mermaid could spawn. Sorry broski. Your idea goes against the game. You forget to realize that the mermaid isn't there to ONLY help players get back to their boat. They are also there as a defense mechanism to players who actually pay attention.
Honestly I still sneak up on players boats without any issue. If you are having problems then you need to get better at the game. If the crew catching you is a good crew well then its to their benefit that they are paying attention.
The game is Sea of Thieves, not Sea of Ninja's or Sea of Stealth Mechanics. This is not a stealth game.
@anarchistang3l
Clearly you didn't look very hard with the search function if you didn't see this topic. This particular idea has been discussed to death, and there are a few reasons why it never went anywhere. First, gameplay: mermaids can be very erratic, but you can learn their patterns (for the most part) and control what they do. Swimming out to sea on the other side of an island can make them swim over to you, not touching the water can make one not spawn when sneaking on an island, etc. As it stands, mermaids around islands are one of the only warnings an alert crew will get to an ambush, be it on a stronghold, an outpost, or any random island. Many crews don't even look at them anyways, and continue ignorantly about their duties. You'd be surprised how many crews will do that. The other reason is the lore: Merfolk cannot hear or speak surface languages, or even understand them should they be conveyed. They appear to lost sailors to prevent those sailors from being afflicted with the Curse of the Drowned, a curse they themselves suffer from and would not wish upon anyone, no matter the deeds committed by the pirate they rescue. Artifacts capable of communicating with them are rare, and giving one to every pirate on the Sea of Thieves would not be possible.
@anarchistang3l as a major stealth enthusiast (multiple guides, videos, and hundreds of successful tucks) the mermaid is a necessary evil. I hate it with a burning passion but it really is needed. I have been found a couple of times due to it showing the enemy crew someone was approaching their island (I often swim 1-2 islands to sneak up on someone) but most people really don't notice it or you can manipulate it to reduce its noticability.
Mermaid Manipulation Tips:
- Swim on the opposite side of the island from where the target is. This spawns it as far from their view as possible.
- Get on a ship/rowboat and stay there until you need to move (side ladders don't count). If ALL pirates on an island are all on one of these to locations then all mermaids go away.
- Use it to draw their attention. While they are looking directly around your mermaid you could be behind a rock and sneaking to their ship.
@xultanis-dragon @UltmateRagnarok wholeheartedly have to disagree with both you gentlemen. Stealth is absolutely a part of being a thief. And being able to summon a merfolk is an easy addition, just give the players a Conch Seashell in there inventory (and a new item for Rare to customize). Blow Conch and merfolk would spawn to whichever deemed spot that Rare would of previously had it spawned at.
Rare has by far and far made this game increasingly more and more easier as the days go by... it doesn’t force players to become better and smarter at gaming (which being better would actually help them in life obstacles and tasks outside of gaming)...
The #1 thing a person should have in video games is “Situational Awareness”. Making a game where this is of utmost importance is a gift to helping gamers get better.
I say take away the forced mermaid spawns and make people have to be more situationally aware. Make them run to turn in locations and check for would be campers the way anyone living in a place full of bandits would do if they had precious cargo to protect. Make people have to be on the look out for people in water about to board... they should be constantly aware of this possibility. Cause right now any half decent crew can defend a ship without the need to pay much attention because the game is holding their hands and easy-mode protecting them from any would be boarders.
I certainly would enjoy having to be more situationally aware of the ship and it’s ladders from would be Thieves.
And if people want to cry about campers being too Overpowered because they cannot beat someone in land combat then I guess having mermaids force spawn at islands would be a compromise to be reached, but still allow mermaids to not be force summoned before conch is blown by a player when out in ocean waters.
@xultanis-dragon said in Call Mermaids When You Need Them:
@anarchistang3l
This has been talked about a lot and the general conclusion from players and from Rare themselves is that this is not a stealth game.
Camping would be completely overpowered if you could choose when your mermaid could spawn. Sorry broski. Your idea goes against the game.
The game is Sea of Thieves, not Sea of Ninja's or Sea of Stealth Mechanics. This is not a stealth game.
Sea of Thieves Technical Alpha Update
Never forget your roots. If you jump to 2:03 they always considered stealth an option in this game even from the beginning. In more recent times, we got a nametag change a little while ago (I think it was with the Anniversary update but not certain) that shortened the range you could read an enemy pirate's name (not to mention the underwater change to name tags before that) and increased the range you could read an allied pirates name.
They don't want stealth to be the focus of the game because it is a pirate game. However, they want it to be an option with counterplay just like all the other mechanics.
It is nigh-on impossible to find a camper without the mermaid, should it spawn at all. Should it be on the opposite side of the island or have not spawned, the camper has a huge advantage, as they can choose when the crew realises they are there. Situational awareness is what the mermaid is for, you can look for it rather than combing an entire island for one person every time you get to it. You would likely be quite surprised how possible stealth is, and how few crews will heed the warning the mermaid represents even when they dock right next to it. As I said for the conch shell suggestion, the Curse of the Drowned specifically prevents the merfolk from communicating at all with surface dwellers, and as of now no one in the Sea of Thieves has the ability to enchant several million conch shells with the same enchantment, or even get that many conch shells for that matter.
This has been talked about a lot and the general conclusion from players and from Rare themselves is that this is not a stealth game.
Can we still say that after the whole Code of conduct coming out?
Be a good sport. Sea of Thieves is a pirate game, and stealth, stealing and battles are all part of the fun. - Rare, Community Code of Conduct
It wouldn't be the first time they made a change to embrace the more ninja stealth tactics of the game. They disabled names that go under water, as well as disabled mermaid spawns when you stay on another's boat. It wouldn't be out of character to adjust that for staying long term on an island. Something like a timer of 5-15 minutes of extended staying makes the mermaid disinterested if on land for that length of time. Swim out a bit to re-trigger the mermaid.
camping would be completely overpowered if you could choose when your mermaid could spawn.
I don't think it would be. I have put some thought into this topic over the past month, while it does stop outpost camping, outpost camping is the least productive and most inefficient method of getting gold. The only time its profitable is if you have a specific target in mind with a certain niche moment following it. Your essentially sitting on an island potentially hours waiting for a guy to turn in a chest or two. That is hardly worth it. The only time it isn't, is with actually tracking your target and putting in effort to pick the spot. All that can be countered by simple not going to the nearest outpost. Had they changed the game to facilitate that, its not overly difficult to adjust play-style around it.
The only time camping is actually profitable is with either a lucky catch of a whale, or a planned ambush of an already observed target (Athena or Skull Fort). Counter play already exist by simple not turning into the nearest outpost or an escort with a team. Something like not turning in the most expensive item first also helps.
I will echo the response from @Wesley-Sanguin
The #1 thing a person should have in video games is “Situational Awareness”. Making a game where this is of utmost importance is a gift to helping gamers get better.
Its time for those ships afraid of camping to learn how to pay attention and adjust tactics in response to a change of this level.
@anarchistang3l said in Call Mermaids When You Need Them:
Ahoy, not really a complaint here but just a good idea i've heard many people want that I haven't seen mentioned in the forums too often. That idea being the ability to call your mermaid to you whenever you want, that being within the same distance as normal so its not abused or changes the way they are used. Essentially make them not auto-appear but be able to come to you once you are within the right range and want them to. They seem to get in the way when trying to be stealthy and sometimes appear in areas you don't want them to, such as the other side of islands. Let me know what you guys think of this idea?
I love your idea.
Whwnever ive posted an idea about mermaids lots of people get outraged and say the idea is awful etc but i think its good.
Its needed i think.
It will let us stealth properly.@ultmateragnarok so you say people’s situational awareness should be seeing a mermaid at an island to know an enemy player is there and then what?? The enemy player camping still has the same could-be-hiding-anywhere ability accept for that the player at least knows someone is somewhere... the only way a mermaid helps someone is for them to AVOID potential combat by seeing mermaid and running away from said island... and if they are so combat avoiding of a merchant... erm I mean “pirate” then they should just go turn in at the next outpost which is what they would do anyways if they saw an outpost with a mermaid.
There are many tactics to do in a mermaid-on-conch-call only world.
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fire to suspected camper Outpost and check turn-in spots
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turn in your lesser valuable items first to bait any would be attackers
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have escort with you
•Note: all of the above is what most of us experienced crews already do out of gaming habit.
The only reason some people want mermaids at islands is to avoid having ANY danger when turning in their treasure in a game called Sea of Thieves which had originally always stated they wanted a world full of unknown dangers and obstacles on the horizon... mermaids take away that unknown danger... they should only be vessels for returning sailors to their ships and not for taking away danger obstacles from the game.
Ok ok all that said... though I think mermaid-less islands should be the thing, and that checking for campers should be the norm, I believe a compromise would be for mermaids to spawn when players have their boots on land or very near... and that mermaids in ocean alerting crews of enemy boarding parties should NOT be a thing. Players should learn to always watch ladders and not have the game holding their hands to alert them of danger from another player.
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If the mermaids only appeared when you were on land, then they wouldn't take you from the open sea should you fall off of the ship. As for mermaids alerting crews to boarders, a crew knowledgeable and skilled enough to look for mermaids will just look for boarders instead.
@ultmateragnarok all crews should be knowledgeable enough and/or learn to be aware enough to always watch for boarders... and “if” there is any lapse in their awareness (skilled crew or not) then they should not be rewarded by a musical mermaid alerting them to their failed awareness.
As for getting couches in the hands of Sailors just look at it like the peace/friendly offering from the merfolk to the sailors of the sea of thieves... and as for “millions of conches” haha you are mistaken on your parameters of the Sea of Thieves... the merfolk wouldn’t need to enchant “millions” for millions do not exist in the world of sea of thieves at any given moment (Though I really really really wish the game was fast enough to have that many ships all in a gigantic open world at one time)... but alas on the waters of the sea of thieves there can at MAX only exist 24 pirates sailing in 6 ships... and that is MAX, very unfortunately, (I wish it were 12 or more ships).
So 24 “Enchanted Conches” is very doable by any Merfolk standards :-)
As for implementation of Magic Mermaid Calling Conches all we need is Rare to get those designers who brought us the Wizarding World of Sea of Wizards...erm Theives and their magic cannonballs to have a 3D artist make conch models, sound engineer to make Mermaid Call, coder to place it and Boom! Mermaids-on-conch-call for open waters in the Sea of a Thieves.
*Tiphat *
It all comes down to balance and lore.
Balance:
Players should fear a ship on the horizon, not an individual player.
Island Camping:
There is absolutely no way a player or even a crew could successfully clear most of the islands looking for a hidden pirate. Not being able to quickly determin whether an area is safe would ruin the game for a majority of players.
Long Distance Stealth:
Just as ridiculous as being able to hide out on an island for hours on end waiting to ambush someone. Players have enough to worry about as they do their thing without the risk of someone swimming halfway across the map without warning.
Lore:
The game is rich with lore, with more coming every update.
Mermaids are not slaves:
They are here to help players who are marooned or lost at sea. They do this for a couple of reasons, but the primary thing here is they do not do it at your command.
Language Barrier:
The merfold have their own language, which makes them difficult to communicate with. They come to give you assistance whether you feel you need it or not, and they do not know your intensions and will ignore your wish to be left alone.
Stealth is just fine the way it is, and should be difficult. If you manage to get on board another ship, your mermaid will eventually dissapear and your job just got easier. Getting to that point should not be an easy, however.
@anarchistang3l said in Call Mermaids When You Need Them:
Ahoy, not really a complaint here but just a good idea i've heard many people want that I haven't seen mentioned in the forums too often. That idea being the ability to call your mermaid to you whenever you want, that being within the same distance as normal so its not abused or changes the way they are used. Essentially make them not auto-appear but be able to come to you once you are within the right range and want them to. They seem to get in the way when trying to be stealthy and sometimes appear in areas you don't want them to, such as the other side of islands. Let me know what you guys think of this idea?
Rare said NO:
Wow, this post blew up a good bit. I only posted this outta curiosity of how the community felt about the idea, as a bunch of the bigger streamers in the community, when watching their streams recently were not against the idea and thought it would be awesome. Granted they were mainly pvp focused. I see the reasons from each side both for and against the idea that you guys pointed out. I understand it doesn't fit the lore aspect to the tee. Fair point. Camping being overpowered though, I can understand that too a little bit, but honestly it might just be my experience(PL with hundreds of hours in game) I have never really seen people camping in any fashion. I guess i'm more on the for it side due to what @Wesley-Sanguin was talking about with having more situational awareness and making the game a little more interesting. Yeah i don't know if a player is camping at said island or outpost but if you look for the simple signs like nearby ships, or travel in groups to turn in loot, etc, it wouldn't matter if they were anyway. For example: If someone was camping you out at said outpost bc they had good intel on you they shouldn't be punished bc a mermaid is sticking out by said island like: HEY, THERE'S A GUY HERE, GO AWAY.
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