You can get someone who runs away from you the entire time just to get you to back out. Definitely should be a time limit, based on cannons hit or some sort of ticker to choose the winner also reducing the time you can be in one single battle. One ship fight should never last over 3-4 hours or force you to give up/back out.
Hourglass- Time Limit
I think they should have a 10 minute no damage timer
after 10 minutes of no damage/kills either party can cancel the fight and everyone moves on
even give both sides loss rep and not the loss on the record
Solos should not have progression and the content experience held hostage in a scenario where it's consent based combat that is built on having many fights.
They could have modelled the mode off their own Arena rules (Arena 1.0): 24-minute timer, which equates to an in-game day. Five points for killing an enemy, 40 points for landing a cannon hit, 1000 points for sinking a ship, but you lose 1000 points if your ship sinks.
Quicker matches would mean quicker matchmaking (I’m on Oceanic), and more points for cannonball hits would favour naval combat over boarding (which would still be viable). The timed nature would encourage a flurry of cannon shots, rather than the tedious circling many matches end up becoming.
The long-play of chases for hours for those who seek it belongs in open regular play, where it’s always been.
@shelbydimon I agree. Maybe the fighting circle could start shrinking after a certain amount of time.
@d1zzy-mouse said in Hourglass- Time Limit:
@shelbydimon I agree. Maybe the fighting circle could start shrinking after a certain amount of time.
This is what other games have done. Works great.
Runners run to annoy you.
They're not gonna stop once you implement a timer. Their whole purpose is to get you mad so you quit and they get the win. It works, you're here.
Just fish, that'll drive them crazy
There's no need for a timer. There's a need to incentivize players not to cheese this mode (make it more fun and rewarding, people will play it)
Please no timer or shrinking circle or a forced draw with cheesable numbers of cannon shots or kills.
An option after some time (10 - 15 minutes or so) where both crews can choose to call it a draw (and it only becomes a draw when both choose so within a certain time period) with the same allegiance value as losing and not losing the number of wins you had in a row.
@lem0n-curry said in Hourglass- Time Limit:
Please no timer or shrinking circle or a forced draw with cheesable numbers of cannon shots or kills.
An option after some time (10 - 15 minutes or so) where both crews can choose to call it a draw (and it only becomes a draw when both choose so within a certain time period) with the same allegiance value as losing and not losing the number of wins you had in a row.
this doesn't address the malicious intent of a solo running entirely to run, no engagement
a solo doesn't have the resources to address that in a substantive way.
a border exists because the intent and spirit of the content is to engage in consenting combat
in any competitive environment outside of SoT there would be a system in place to address no engagement. This is competitive content. It's fine for a person to play defensively, to play cautiously, to turn out and repair and reset, it's unacceptable in competitive content to reward no engagement at a direct sacrifice to the experience of another. Everyone involved signed up for combat and engagement.
This is no different than when people were camping people and taking them to the red sea for no rep. It's outside of the spirit of the content and is malicious when done as it directly negatively impacts the content and participants, specifically solo players.
If a person changes their mind and no longer wants what they signed up for that's fine they can take the L as soon as they want out. They will even get rep for it.
Enabling that sort of behavior only leads to more hostility, the frustrations of running/chasing is very much known for leading to toxicity. The design of this content is to bring down toxicity within combat, which it largely has, other than when people were camping others for no rep and other than people intentionally run just to try to force someone into conceding.
@wolfmanbush said in Hourglass- Time Limit:
@lem0n-curry said in Hourglass- Time Limit:
Please no timer or shrinking circle or a forced draw with cheesable numbers of cannon shots or kills.
An option after some time (10 - 15 minutes or so) where both crews can choose to call it a draw (and it only becomes a draw when both choose so within a certain time period) with the same allegiance value as losing and not losing the number of wins you had in a row.
this doesn't address the malicious intent of a solo running entirely to run, no engagement
Malicious ? Trying your patience is malicious now ? Is there a rule that you have to shoot cannons ?
I doubt that many of these runners can keep pulling it off, if there are many of them at all. Long fights can be fun as well, would hate that not being possible because people might not fight for 15 minutes.
a solo doesn't have the resources to address that in a substantive way.
It's solo vs solo. Perhaps the opponent can choose a different tactic.
a border exists because the intent and spirit of the content is to engage in consenting combat
Perhaps they need to change the size of the border for solo sloops ?
in any competitive environment outside of SoT there would be a system in place to address no engagement. This is competitive content. It's fine for a person to play defensively, to play cautiously, to turn out and repair and reset, it's unacceptable in competitive content to reward no engagement.
Who is to say that the running player didn't have some difficulty to get his ship in a position he liked to fight ?
This is no different than when people were camping people and taking them to the red sea for no rep. It's outside of the spirit of the content and is malicious when done as it directly negatively impacts the content and participants, specifically solo players.
The red sea without rep was terrible - I'm glad they fixed this.
Just as people starting the fight on the Shores of Gold or having their ship despawned and respawn outside of the circle without getting the loss.I guess no activity at all (except sailing) for a certain period could have some implications, would rather have some red sea effects, decrease in speed &c than a loss.
@jolly-ol-yep "There's no need for a timer. There's a need to incentivize players not to cheese this mode (make it more fun and rewarding, people will play it)"
They can program the game, they cannot change human behavior, so really that is not a solution.
@foambreaker a dit dans Hourglass- Time Limit :
They can program the game, they cannot change human behavior, so really that is not a solution.
You really should study how good game design actually drive player's behaviours, in modern games
@jolly-ol-yep said in Hourglass- Time Limit:
@foambreaker a dit dans Hourglass- Time Limit :
They can program the game, they cannot change human behavior, so really that is not a solution.
You really should study how good game design actually drive player's behaviours, in modern games
I've been a developer for 33 years. How long have you been developing software?
@jolly-ol-yep said in Hourglass- Time Limit:
Runners run to annoy you.
They're not gonna stop once you implement a timer. Their whole purpose is to get you mad so you quit and they get the win. It works, you're here.
Just fish, that'll drive them crazy
There's no need for a timer. There's a need to incentivize players not to cheese this mode (make it more fun and rewarding, people will play it)
Jolly's right on this. I think the current incentive to PvP quite honestly outweighs the grind. I've seen countless posts and people talking on Youtube that they want the curse, but the amount of PvP required is quite steep if they're trying to get it.
Either they need more incentives in the PvP track (spaced FAR closer together, I saw the 200 for the Mysterious Stranger clothes and thought that was astronomical of a grind for this game. I honestly think those should be in the 100 leading up TO the curse) or they need to cut down the grind in general.
Either they're running to annoy people into losing, or they're driving their boat straight into the other one to purposely lose and just accrue experience incredibly slowly. If players are more inclined to spam losses vs. wins, you have a problem with your incentives to win. Rare has a pretty strong design philosophy that you need to design the game to drive player behavior, and if this is a common problem, they need to make PvP more worth people's time. Because as it stands, it feels like you're striving for ... not much, compared to what you can earn in PvE.
I mean, I get it. It's annoying. I had a battle earlier that lasted almost an hour because they just kept trying to spam boards and not engage. I don't think I want anything else like a shrinking border or time limit, however. Those who simply board to sail you OOB will just use the smaller circle to their advantage and if they don't succeed at first they'll run UNTIL the circle is smaller. And I would hate to lose a winning streak because someone opted to quit after 10 minutes of no damage.
I think it's really fine the way it is.
@foambreaker a dit dans Hourglass- Time Limit :
I've been a developer for 33 years. How long have you been developing software?
Oh I see....
Argument from authority... It's just a figure of speech and is generally used to ignite a cognitive bias that you're right.
It doesn't mean you're right. For all I know you could have made stuff like pre-2000's Excel-type software, with their awful design and UI/UX, and never touched a game except Pacman and SoT...
And to answer you, I've been a software developer too, for 5 years now.
Now my turn : I DO make game dev as a hobby. I DO watch hundreds of GDC talks and postmortems and read a lot of essays about game design. I DO attend video game events and conventions and talk with creators in my country. Do you ?
I won't say I know best than SoT CREATORS, as I said I'm just a hobbyist in game dev, I'm just confident you can tweak players' behaviours by pushing some buttons and levers with "game design" (which is just a general term used to refer to an awful lot of stuff)
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