Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?

  • UrihamRayne
    Legend
    Insider
    Founder

    @galactic-geek Yes you named the exact same technique four times acting like it's something different every time, it's a pseudo-technique, just because you pressed foward or backwards doesn't make it a brand new move. Also don't pretend those moves actually stopped numbers and jumping from being odds that influenced fights, this is not a good reasoning why the change is good or bad.

    @sh1znat

    I don't have to "believe" anything, I know it has a penalty, you don't complete the three swing combo if you miss, having to wait a brief moment of recovery to swing again. You can't endlesly swing swords, there is a three swing combo in this game and it's recovery timing is still in the game.

    I don't know why you guys are pretending we got a gigantic change to the swordfighting, when most of your reasoning is baseless.

  • sh1znat
    Ship Mate
    Insider

    @urihamrayne All you have to do is hit an object with your sword to endlessly combo. So yes you can quite endlessly 3-hit combo with these changes all the while having no slowdown or repercussion for doing so.

  • UrihamRayne
    Legend
    Insider
    Founder

    @sh1znat

    All you have to do is hit an object with your sword

    That isn't a miss. Missing is swinging at nothing, which breaks your 3 slash combo. Regardless you still have a recovery delay between every combo, and not having slowdown is the point of the change, what is your point?

  • sh1znat
    Ship Mate
    Insider

    @urihamrayne I've argued for long enough, agree to disagree as we are clearly not on the same page.

  • Liljimothy2306
    Seafarer

    @urihamrayne said in Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?:

    @galactic-geek pseudo-techniques that get removed because a simple movement penalty is taken away probably mean they were redundant to begin with.

    @sh1znat

    No movement slow when swinging.

    That was the point of the change, you added it into the list of why the sword is busted as if it made it more impactful, only made it look like you had nothing to add into the list other than stating that something changed.

    Guns (except blunderbuss) no longer pushback on hit

    It's as if the devs are trying to give you a hint of what gun is better suited for close quarters combat.}

    I agree with the knockback change because of how aids that was getting sniped or pistol'd off your ship especially as a solo.

  • Galactic Geek
    Seafarer
    Founder

    @urihamrayne said in Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?:

    @galactic-geek Yes you named the exact same technique four times acting like it's something different every time, it's a pseudo-technique, just because you pressed foward or backwards doesn't make it a brand new move. Also don't pretend those moves actually stopped numbers and jumping from being odds that influenced fights, this is not a good reasoning why the change is good or bad.

    I don't know why you guys are pretending we got a gigantic change to the swordfighting, when most of your reasoning is baseless.

    It was an intended game mechanic from the very beginning that was meant to elevate sword-play - not some "pseudo-technique" as you call it. And stop saying we're pretending - that's just plain rude. I absolutely wrecked players with that very mechanic prior to the DGE becoming well-known, winning ~80% of my fights, and everyone I taught it too did equally well. The only reason I can think of as to why the Rare devs would even be okay with considering removing it is because 95% of players didn't use it, much less know it existed. Even if that was the case, I would think it would be more important to teach others about it to elevate their game, rather than remove it and only dumb it down to the bare essentials. It literally makes the game less fun by removing this and other balanced mechanics due to fixing something else. While I'm glad Rare is making an attempt to fix their game, I don't think they should've taken it this far. I will continue to bring up this issue until Rare acknowledges my plight and fixes it, or at the very least, gives me an explanation for their decision.

  • Papy Pitch
    Commander
    Insider

    @borges1091
    @borges1091 a dit dans Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely? :

    I think you and a lot of other people here are mixing up "nerfed" with "broken". Not being able to hip fire people from 5-10 meters away would be fine, but 1 meter? Lol. You can see how cheesy and casualized they tried to make it just by shooting it in the sky might as well give everyone teddy bears and remove pvp in that case.

    Shooting 1 meter away ?
    There's another gun for that. Actually there's even two guns for that. You're just asking for a gun that you can use at long-range, mid-range and close-range while remaining a powerful gun in all situations.
    Seems you're the one that wants the game to be casual.

  • ElectricKnights
    Legend
    Insider

    I think the EoR's new hip firing is brilliant and perfectly in-keeping with this game's design. I'd be terribly upset it they just removed the ability to fire it from the hip - that'd just out of place for this game, IMHO.
    Trying to fire a long-barrel flintlock (with a spyglass - or empty rum bottle - tied to it) with a hip fire is a wonky move, and it now is rewarded with a hilariously wonky result.
    I love it.

    And I am a pirate that has been using the EoR and cutlass since the first month of release. It just sort of ended up that way, because I'd be doing skull forts and PvP battles on galleons, and the rest of the crew was using pistols or blunderbusses. I thought someone should be sniping the enemies to protect the boat from the crow's nest and the like. I couldn't count how many times we'd be calling things out and I'd finish someone off at long distance (either from the ship or off of it).
    Then I worked on my hip firing accuracy for using it full time (although, I never fully gave up on the blunder... but usually would forget to switch to it for certain scenarios, hehe).
    Anyway, I just want to explain... my EoR has been my loyal companion for many months (next to my cutlass). And I LOVE these changes.

  • Ticklepantzz
    Marauder
    Insider

    @fractal-pitch To me it seems like he wants the game to make sense the best way to have fixed this issue was the make close range shots do same damage as a pistol, problem solved.

    Making a gun hip firing you at less that 1m go in a 45 degree angles or directly to the ground is absurd.

  • Galactic Geek
    Seafarer
    Founder

    @ticklepantzz said in Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?:

    @fractal-pitch To me it seems like he wants the game to make sense the best way to have fixed this issue was the make close range shots do same damage as a pistol, problem solved.

    Nope, not problem solved - having it do the same amount of damage and accuracy at close-range as the pistol means that the flintlock is marginalized and no longer has a place, which is exactly one of the many reasons the change that was made was, well, made...

  • Ticklepantzz
    Marauder
    Insider

    @galactic-geek

    Yeah okay I see your point. The thing is though the solution proposed now is like playing black jack. You shoot and pray to the stars that your shot wont go 45 degrees away from target hahaha XD

  • UrihamRayne
    Legend
    Insider
    Founder

    @galactic-geek

    It was an intended game mechanic from the very beginning that was meant to elevate sword-play

    Based on who's statement?

    The only reason I can think of as to why the Rare devs would even be okay with considering removing it is because 95% of players didn't use it

    Or because it wasn't intended or was redundant. Because if it was intended wouldn't they make an active effort to keep it in the game? Sword lunge while blocking is still here, they didn't allow players to jump/move as freely while lunging if they didn't do it while blocking so they know the tech is still here and they kept it in. You are still defending this pseudo-technique on baseless claims, and still has not presented the reason why the tweaks to the sword are good or bad. You are making this change be more about a personal quarrel than a genuine interest to improve upon the game's overal combat mechanics, hence why you are pretending this is a bigger deal than it actually is.

  • Papy Pitch
    Commander
    Insider

    @ticklepantzz a dit dans Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely? :

    @galactic-geek

    Yeah okay I see your point. The thing is though the solution proposed now is like playing black jack. You shoot and pray to the stars that your shot wont go 45 degrees away from target hahaha XD

    Well... Yeah... Then don't use it at point blank range. There are 2 other guns for that. One of them is even specialized for that specific case. I don't see the problem.
    At least now there won't be a stupid "meta". There won't be one perfect loadout/weapon for every possibilities. You can get away with pratically all of them but you will have to change your loadout at some point. And I think that's how the game should be.

  • BinaryPlayerOne
    Master
    Insider
    Founder

    It's a long rifle with a scope. Your supposed to raise it, aim and shoot. It's Sea of Thieves. Not Call of Duty.

  • Chronodusk
    Commander
    Insider

    @borges1091 said in Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?:

    I think you and a lot of other people here are mixing up "nerfed" with "broken". Not being able to hip fire people from 5-10 meters away would be fine, but 1 meter? Lol. You can see how cheesy and casualized they tried to make it just by shooting it in the sky might as well give everyone teddy bears and remove pvp in that case.

    No you still just don't get it, it seems. And I don't think you ever will if you failed to understand with how clearly I explained it.

    The EoR used to be the meta because you could use it for everything. They stopped it from being an ALL PURPOSE weapon, because it IS only a sniper. You might actually have to try mixing up your weapon set now and use some skill rather than relying on the most meta relevant tool.

    If you don't want to deal with the hip fire nerf, then use the EoR as intended and aim it via the scope. You people are acting like this one single thing destroys and casualizes PvP. And I know why you're acting like that - you got used to how you could use the EoR for everything, now you can't and you have to learn something different.

    What's wrong with giving each weapon a specific purpose?

  • UrihamRayne
    Legend
    Insider
    Founder

    @chronodusk

    What's wrong with giving each weapon a specific purpose?

    It's part of a larger symptom of the game not having enough variety in the weapons department, so small tweaks are felt tenfold.

  • GhosstWalker
    Vanguard
    Insider
    Founder

    @borges1091 Played yesterday with some friends that I invited with Friends play free codes. Was doing the mercenary voyage when a skeleton came close to me, like literally in front of me and since I had my Eye of Reach, I just hip fired him but it did not hit him xD for a second I was like wha?? how? and then I remembered they released the update. Wasn't mad about it, it was quite funny.

  • rockinpodunk
    Captain
    Insider

    @borges1091
    "As well as the reduced damage? It's doing like 5 more damage than the pistol, which is terrible. Maybe reduce damage 5 or 10 max, not 30."

    They reduced the damage from 80 to 70. that's 10, just as you have suggested. They also removed the damage dropoff that occured with distance, so longer shots can actually do more damage than they did before.

  • Liljimothy2306
    Seafarer

    @ticklepantzz said in Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?:

    @fractal-pitch To me it seems like he wants the game to make sense the best way to have fixed this issue was the make close range shots do same damage as a pistol, problem solved.

    Making a gun hip firing you at less that 1m go in a 45 degree angles or directly to the ground is absurd.}

    No some hipfire deviation is ok but not 90 degrees top kek. It looks like they're trying too hard to fix it or balance it.

  • Liljimothy2306
    Seafarer

    @chronodusk said in Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?:

    @borges1091 said in Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?:

    I think you and a lot of other people here are mixing up "nerfed" with "broken". Not being able to hip fire people from 5-10 meters away would be fine, but 1 meter? Lol. You can see how cheesy and casualized they tried to make it just by shooting it in the sky might as well give everyone teddy bears and remove pvp in that case.

    No you still just don't get it, it seems. And I don't think you ever will if you failed to understand with how clearly I explained it.

    The EoR used to be the meta because you could use it for everything. They stopped it from being an ALL PURPOSE weapon, because it IS only a sniper. You might actually have to try mixing up your weapon set now and use some skill rather than relying on the most meta relevant tool.

    If you don't want to deal with the hip fire nerf, then use the EoR as intended and aim it via the scope. You people are acting like this one single thing destroys and casualizes PvP. And I know why you're acting like that - you got used to how you could use the EoR for everything, now you can't and you have to learn something different.

    What's wrong with giving each weapon a specific purpose?}

    "And use some skill" lol yeah wow that 10 projectile barn hitting blunderbuss and button mashing spawn killing sword requires tons of skill. Man this game is just meant for carebears. Eye of reach still takes the most skill to use. The thing is I can still use the eye of reach for everything cause I can actually aim unlike half of SoT's population. So everyone is just spamming swords because it takes literally no effort now. You're not understanding how actually silly it is coding the weapon to deviate 90 degree angles from hipfiring regardless of what range it's used for.

    What's funny to me is how they made ALL of these changes because of summit streaming the game and making a bunch of kids get mad and complain because his skill level is much higher. Since release half of these issues weren't even brought up until a number of salty PVE carebears started getting wrecked by good plays and their only option was to complain on reddit. It's just another symptom of reddit whining that usually ends up going too far and kills games instantly, lowers the skill curve immensely, or just deletes fun factor..but as long as you feel super safe in your full 4 man galleon crew grinding forts 24/7 and zerging every other ship.

  • fluidsc
    Master
    Insider

    @borges1091 said in Why was eye of reach hipfire ruined completely?:

    I understand this update for double gunning, but was making eye of reach hip fire completely useless necessary? I mean it was supposed to be "reduced" not turned into a pulp. If you're aiming straight ahead the bullet can deviate and hit the ground 2 meters in front of you, or literally go into the sky. Definitely over the top, and needs to be fixed. You can't even hit people 1 meter in front of you, which is broken not balanced.

    As well as the reduced damage? It's doing like 5 more damage than the pistol, which is terrible. Maybe reduce damage 5 or 10 max, not 30. Not liking this update at all, pvp feels terrible. Also like someone else mentioned here the gun delay from sprinting needs to be completely removed.

    The answer is: crybabies and whiners.

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