Cutlass Is Op Repost

@fresherfoot at the moment i think the mechanic feels a bit clunky and i believe after the 1st hit you just cant move at all idk if this is intentional but maybe its just beta life

@fresherfoot said in Cutlass Is Op Repost:

@mythicalfable https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/topic/33162/training-with-subzarr-advanced-swordplay-guide

I'm gonna refer to this guide as well on the image. Some of these feel like bugs though, but anyway.

@bkr-vasily maybe a lot of things will be changed when the real beta is given not the test beta because after all these last plays were just scale test for servers, not gameplay.

@mythicalfable I think a few are glitches but like many games, glitches can become apart of the game, those moves do make the cutlass stand out and if used right, can show a skilled player vs a nub.
The lunge jump is all timing it's not as easy as it looks trust me lol.
But that hold block and heavy attack I did notice a feeling of a brief movement speed buff before the lunge, like faster then normal movement speed as if it's like a Samurai running and at the end doing the big slash lol.
If on purpose I could see that move being used as an attack to chase your opponent that is on the run and do one last attack before the opponent outruns you. With it, it could be used as a gap closer but if you miss your hit then you would stun yourself, risking return attack from the opponent or the opponent gets away. (The heavy attack does do self-stunning if missed.)

@fresherfoot but if you get stunned you die and if you are stunned you can't bring up your sword to block. Also the clunkyNess of the MS slow makes it even harder.

I recommend making the stun something that can only happen with a charged attack. But give the sword more damage for regular melee attacks as well with giving you more MS when you have the sword out. This will give a reason to take the sword instead of 2x gun and will bring balance

@uber-knight72 no one takes you seriously if your rebuttle to an argument is get gud.

lol i think alot of people underestimate blocking. you can only attack in combos of three strikes at a time. after which you enter a short cool down before being able to strike again. during this time if you dont block immediately the opponent can start his combo giving one or possibly two free hits without trading with you before needing to block again.

Also its possible since most people spam attack on you with the sword to block all three attacks then swap to blunderbuss and blow them away during their attack cooldown.

the stun lock is annoying yes. but they can only do the three hit combo if the first strike hits. so if you back step or dodge the first hit they immediately go into the strike cool down in which they cant block or strike allowing you to counter.

There is alot more to sword combat than most people get lol i think alot of complaints come simply from ignorance. ^.^

I hope this helps

@toastywrath so you dont think the stun locking mechanic or how much your movement impaired is at all overpowered

@bkr-vasily I think its more annoying than overpowered. I haven’t had a huge issue with it. Though I would prefer it was removed.
I did just give a complete explanation on how to counter it.

@toastywrath i understand how to counter it, but having an explanation to a problem doesnt mean its not broken. I see where you are coming from but wouldnt it be better if the stun was only a stun after a charged attack

@uveallynx its a discussion no one is arguing. all good vibes here

@uber-knight72 Finally someone understands that the blocking does have a play in this.

@bkr-vasily I said the last post talking about this, the first thing you do is block and don't panic,

Supporters who agree that blocking is the way to counter the stun: @ToastyWrath @Uber-Knight72

I for one think the stun is on purpose, I think the stun may actually be the cause of swinging after the opponent have already swung, making it where you get stunned for "missing" because the other player hit you and in turn canceled your attack, not a bug, I think this is how they made it encourage people to block and like @ToastyWrath and @Uber-Knight72 wait to be able to attack after the 3hit swings,

@fresherfoot im not saying there isnt a counter to the stun, im saying the stun and the slow how it is right now in the game is busted. whether it be from 3 auto attacks or from the opponent missing i believe it should be from a charged attack and allow autos to do 25% of your hp per hit.

@drone-bros if you happen to block it yes of course its not going to be a problem my concern is when someone happens to attack from the side you get slowed and chain stunned. now before you say dont get hit from the side or the back thats not a way to counter an argument. we have to look at the sword by itself. maybe a rework even tho its too early, the game hasnt been released yet but what i have pieced together as far as a decent rework is as follows

1. Remove slow and stun from auto attacks.
2. Make the stun come from a charged attack that deals more damage.
3. Increase damage to regular autos. 25% hp per hit: 4 hits = a kill
4. Increase movement speed with sword out

what this will do will give more players a reason to take the sword as a primary or secondary and will ensure the sword play runs more smoothly

Note : you can even play with a backstab mechanic

@personalc0ffee im not sure if its 100% zero counter play but it sure does feel like it. maybe its clunky due to it being in closed beta but i believe the stun has to move to a charged attack

@drone-bros i agree the stun is somewhat a problem but dont remove it from the game. the cutlass is what makes a pirate and it needs to stay like that. although i do believe something has to be done and i believe as stated before the rework would do some good

@drone-bros it was mentioned above something like a backstabbing mechanic but i think it would be a bit weird. remember a game like this needs to have alot of content and things to keep the community playing that way the game doesnt die within 3 to 6 months. they just need to make sure they put the correct things in the game to keep it interesting

@personalc0ffee this just proves that the sword is broken lol "if you know you are going to miss aim at the floor to keep the combo alive"

@personalc0ffee lol posted that post already before on here lol

@bkr-vasily I already posted that link beforehand to prove to you the combos I was saying in a post beforehand.

@bkr-vasily said in Cutlass Is Op Repost:

Taking the sword to a gunfight should never be a thing. Most of the guns in SoT are for CQC "exempting the sniper which is trash anyway". The utility that the sword provides is way too good. The stun lock, push back, and swing speed, combined with the ability to strafe around is really strong and thus it is my opinion that the sword will need a nerf upon release.

Ok let's break this down, buddy, you want the swords to be nerfed because you claim players shouldn't take a sword to a gunfight (Blunderbuss, Pistol, Rifle). But now you want to increase/change the utilities of the sword just because you don't want to take out your own sword to block the attacker before getting stunned by normal attacks. Your claim on the Swords vs Guns makes me think you just want to use the Blunderbuss for the easy one hit kills and not be stunned, but your nerf is more like a buff now, contradicting yourself.

Removing the "slow" and "stun" from auto attacks, Decreasing the auto attacks "attack speed," Increasing the auto attacks "damage."
Increasing the "damage" of the lunge attack, making the lunge attack have a "stun."
Increasing the player's "movement speed" with the sword in hand.

Pros: more damage in both attacks, stun on Lunge Attack, Movement Speed

Lunge Attack: (Fyi since it is heavy, it can not be blocked) not only it already does almost kill the player in one shot, it now has more damage meaning you're likely to die in one hit, but this also has a stun that is now guaranteed (cannot be blocked because now heavy attack),
With the stun and more damage to the Lunge Attack, if you were to somehow live with the damage from the attack, you are now also stunned meaning the player can just smack you with one hit and your dead.

Movement speed: Even better chances of dodging enemies gunshots (even if the guns were to be increased sensitivity they won't hit, "U Can't Touch This" MC Hammer). Now the player can strafe even better with the sword and wait for the missed shot to go in with that Lunge Attack to get that damage and Stun off and more likely kill you in one hit (Cutlas will seem more "OP" to you then it is now, At least you can block the stun beforehand). The Lunge Attack while strafing will be so much better now with the extra movement speed and the extra damage in the Lunge Attack with the extra Damage (sounds like this is the real point of your forums is to make the Cutlass "OP") (By the way, I think the Cutlass at the moment is way more balanced then what you think, but the alternative way of your thinking makes the Cutlass actually "OP" or "Broken").
There are much more applications into the changes you presented, that would actually make the Cutlass "OP" or "Broken."

I don't think you are actually understanding the point, that 3 of us in this forums page have said regarding how to prevent the stun and how to counter it,
your focus on the fact that there is a stun and want the cutlass to not have a stun.
You do not want to accept the how to defend against the stun and how to counter it or even turn it to your advantage.
Instead, you want to remove it or move it to another ability not even thinking ahead and then also add more to it, contradicting yourself and the very purpose of your forums post by making the Cutlas actually be more "OP" or "Broken" then it really is.

Where do you nerf the cutlass? - Attack Speed

This will ensure that the sword doesn't get as much utility value and should compensate with a damage buff so that way people can still use it and not feel like its trash.

@bkr-vasily said in Cutlass Is Op Repost:

@drone-bros if you happen to block it yes, of course, it's not going to be a problem my concern is when someone happens to attack from the side you get slowed and chain stunned. now before you say don't get hit from the side or the back that's not a way to counter an argument. we have to look at the sword by itself. maybe a rework even tho its too early, the game hasn't been released yet but what I have pieced together as far as a decent rework is as follows

1. Remove slow and stun from auto attacks.
2. Make the stun come from a charged attack that deals more damage.
3. Increase damage to regular autos. 25% hp per hit: 4 hits = a kill
4. Increase movement speed with a sword out

what this will do will give more players a reason to take the sword as a primary or secondary and will ensure the swordplay runs more smoothly

A rework on the Cutlass is "not necessary" because all you need to do is learn the game and the mechanics that are not just smashing your left click. Use Block and to be able to counter play other players and be able to survive and win with the Cutlass. @ToastyWrath @Uber-Knight72

@bkr-vasily check out my forums post on about ideas for Quest and what not. https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/topic/34600/physical-puzzles-for-quest-and-secret-quests-side-quests

Getting all the stuff to the image I promised to make takes awhile. I'll try to get it done today though. The patterns may be a bit difficult to understand at first, but I will explain them in case someone wonders.

@fresherfoot at work at thr moment I will check it out when I get home

@l2l-havok-l2l what do you disagree with

@maldred-gr said in Cutlass Is Op Repost:

For me things are good, the same weapons are available to everyone and finally,...

That makes voyaging even, up to a point.

...most importantly, it is a game and realism is not sought in it.

Every game may not be about realistic directions, but they all are derived from believable reality.

Every war needs every man, but not every man needs every war.