Pirate Emporium ruined Sea of Thieves

@d3adst1ck That's weird, because other than MMOs (which SoT is not) I never had to pay anyone other than Microsoft or Sony with their respective online console services a sub fee to play games at any time between 2004-present, most of those games having more content than Sea of Thieves even has now. Even now there are plenty of games that have zero microtransactions and stay afloat just fine, most of which are indie games at that. It's really only the AAA megacorp titles that "have to" use this method, weird right?

That aside, even then I have no problem with the Bear and Bird set or the Pirate's Life cosmetics being Emporium exclusive content. It's the things like changing your ships name, character's appearance, shipsets like the Ruby Splashtail, Shrouded Ghost Hunter, Wrecker etc., and anything else that's literally just Sea of Thieves lore based content being in there that is just outrageous. You get borderline nothing for 200+ hours worth of Hunter Call content and the Shrouded Ghost is so rare it's a meme that it doesn't even exist, but then they throw in multiple sets that would be ample rewards for that content into the cash shop as if the entire game studio would immediately shut down if they didn't. All this while they dripfeed recolors in the actual game. I haven't played since 2020, it is almost 2023 and the amount they've added to buy with gold is maybe 2% of the amount they've added to buy with real life money. There's literally no defending that, that's blatant greed.

At the end of the day, the gameplay is still the same. I'm also a little annoyed at the way the emporium gets all the cool sets but uninstalling just because of optional microtransactions is weird to me.

@wolfmanbush What do you mean? There's been no effort at all. Why get the Ghost set when there's the Soulflame set? Why even look for the Shrouded Ghost when all you get for finding it is a title and the Emporium has a whole set, costume, and weapons dedicated to it. Why even touch the entirety of the Hunter's Call content if you can get better Hunter's Call rewards in the Emporium? Heck, why even play the game if all the gold you get from playing the game can get you borderline nothing in comparison to the cash shop. The gold situation is so bad that they literally made a set where the lowest priced item is 600k+ just to clear out your in game wallet and people still have tens if not hundreds of millions. There is not a single game in existence that can't sustain itself off of sales alone and that used to be the standard. Now games with no microtransactions are the exception.

@wolfmanbush ah, they recolored The Hungering One figurehead from 4 years ago and added a small wooden bust that also has recolors you can put next to your stove if you're the captain of that ship. That's so much better than a weapon, a costume, and an entire shipset. All is forgiven.

@finicaltrack706 You could take the trading companies, currencies, and all cosmetics out of the game and you'd still be left with the same gameplay, but what would be the point? Gameplay alone doesn't make a long lasting game. You need rewards and reasons other than "number go brrrr" to do the gameplay. Sea of Thieves is sorely lacking in that. Tall Tales are the best content the game has to offer but you won't catch anyone doing them past the achievements. You know why? Because what's the point? There isn't one. And that's most of the content of this game. Fought one Skeleton Lord? Well now you've fought them all. The only different one is the flaming one. Done a fort? Congrats, there's no variety here either. Sea Fort? Same story. The only reason you have to do near 90% of what this game has to offer is the cosmetics and by god that used to be enough for me. Take that away, which is exactly what they did, and you don't even have a game anymore. Just hop on an update every month, do the content a few times, go "that's cool," get off, and repeat ad nauseum.

@pixlisreal True, but there's always more things to work for if that's what you want. If you're desperate for more cosmetics to work towards just go full completionist and grind out every single one.

@callmebackdraft The game is at 30 million players. If Rare made even just a single dollar off of every player they have, they'd have enough to fund at least 20 years worth of your estimate. Mind you they make way more per copy. Microtransactions have in no point in history been a necessary evil for any game. If a game fails without microtransactions, it's not because of the lack of microtransactions, it's because the game is bad.

@lizalaroo My circle of friends doesn't endorse this sort of behavior either so that really only leaves open crews, and that's a can of worms I'm not willing to jump into. I shouldn't have to rely on anyone to give me a semblance of how the game should be. If I slay the something as rare as the shrouded ghost, I should get the shrouded ghost hunter set. If I go out of my way to grind for hundreds of a specific species of fish like the Ruby Splashtail or Wrecker, I should get that set. If I get the legendary version of those accommodations I should get the collector's variants. I shouldn't get lower tier rewards for grinding or straight RNG while someone who has only spent 30 minutes on the game and never touched it again has the premium quality items that relate specifically to the thing I grinded. But that's the reality of this game and it's such a missed opportunity on Rare's part.

@schwammlgott Bloodborne is an exclusive but not owned by Sony. Sea of Thieves is an exclusive but is owned by Microsoft. That's as far as my comparison went which you'd know if you actually read enough like you claimed.

I much prefer this model where we're not charged for each release of new content, it's all free, I can choose to spend money to support the game and they're all cosmetic and don't add actual in game advantages. If stuff was a bit cheaper I suspect it'd be more accessible and potentially bought more as the ship sets are pretty expensive but I much prefer this way

The best part of this game for me is the fact the only thing you can unlock and buy are cosmetics. A new pirate has the same equipment as a day one pirate. I play the game because I really enjoy the gameplay, not because I have to grind for something. There is no grind for the best gear to give you the best chance of beating someone, we are all on the same playing field (though DA sails and Sovereigns do give some advantages!)

If there is an unlockable cosmetic you want, you can grind to unlock it if you wish. I have no issues with the pirate emporium, it is bonus cash flow for a game that gives us repeated free updates. Calling it corporate greed is a bit much, you don't have to buy them, they are cosmetics, not to pay to win must have weapons.

Claiming Rare can survive with just game sales alone without any data to back that up is a stretch, you are omitting the fact this is on Game Pass, I have been playing for nearly two years and have never bought the game, so I am more than happy to spend a little on a cosmetic I might want.

On the other points raised, yes it is annoying that you have to re-do many things you have already done to unlock captaincy trinkets and such but it would be short lived excitement if you just automatically had everything unlocked on day 1, I can see why they made that decision. To claim that these unlockable trinkets/banners have ruined the game for you...I mean you don't have to do them, the game still exists as before, they are just small cosmetics.

And I don't believe the ships/ saving parts are expensive, this is endgame content, it should be pricey. I haven't had anything to spend gold on in a while, it is a welcome gold sink. And if saving a ship part is too expensive for you...don't save it? Just do as you did before the update.

@callmebackdraft But you know, even after all of that math in your estimation the cost per player only ever reached 19.2 dollars per player. In Sea of Thieves' first week it had sold 2 million copies full price. In it's, again, FIRST WEEK and no that doesn't include game pass (source: https://twitter.com/aarongreenberg/status/979005629971931136). In it's first week it had made $120 million before taxes and it was the fastest selling IP on xbox period at that time. I don't think I can stress enough that that was it's first week and the game has been out for 4 years, again selling another 5 million copies on steam. That's already 7 million of those 30 million accounted for and confirmed and there's bound to be way more unconfirmed non-gamepass sales. Plus it's not like gamepass isn't profitable in itself. Why would Microsoft put a Microsoft owned game on gamepass or even create gamepass if it wasn't profitable? Also, it doesn't matter if they spent 7k hours or a whopping total of 2 seconds on the game, if they even have access to it Rare got their money (unless ironically... they were pirates).

No, it's naive to think that a game can't sustain itself off of sales alone. And even then, I'm not even arguing against microtransactions as a whole. GTAV is another live service game with microtransactions but every single last byte of content is earnable 100% for free past that initial purchase. Yes, you can play Sea of Thieves without the PE, I'm not saying you can't. If Sea of Thieves never had cosmetics period it would still ultimately be the same exact game, but do you really think Sea of Thieves would've even made it past it's initial year with no incentive to actually play its content?

And edit now that I'm caught up with the thread: For one, yes ancient skellies exist, but you really think being able to spend 30 years of your life and still not get enough to even get 1% of the PE justifies it? For two, from the DLC age to the live service age whether it's one and done games or dripfed content doesn't matter in the slightest. Every single game that has ever been made has had the ability to make a profit off of sales alone. If it couldn't it wasn't a good game, simple as. If you are making any form of media, your first priority should be pleasing your fans period within reason. Not adding microtransactions is within reason for any game that isn't a live service strictly free game.

@callmebackdraft Microsoft is literally the 2nd richest company in the entire world. If they wanted to they could afford to keep up a game at even a 20% loss and it would still be the equivalent of me dropping a quarter down a storm drain. Rare is funded by this company and still makes a lot of money of the game sales. And even with you, or heck any single business be it culinary, entertainment, retail, or otherwise, there's a huge difference between being profitable and being greedy. If you can choose between making a 20% profit and pleasing tens of millions or making a 150% profit and pleasing thousands and you choose the latter, that is nothing more than capitalistic greed. With either one you could still more than sustain yourself and afford luxuries to boot, the very definition of living comfortably.

@neon-ic0n I will say Season 7 isn’t over yet. We still have at least two more monthly updates that could bring another set, hopefully frostbite. Since we got Eastern Winds Jade back in season 6, which I’d argue is one of the best recolors we’ve seen.

I love everything about Sea of Thieves!

I agree it’s gone out of hand. I’d rather pay for DLC expansions than a lot of these emporium things. I feel like the emporium cash funds the emporium mostly. But maybe if we could buy a DLC that offers a new region or something to expand the playground, maybe that’d leave a less salty taste in my mouth. I don’t know, I still don’t like the idea of that either. Emporium has to be done carefully.

I totally understand your frustration. I agree it does seem that the Emporium gets the majority of the "good" cosmetic sets. There are cool things I would want but don't want to pay real money for them.

There are totally merits to your argument, and there are also pitfalls. For any amount of math estimation anyone does, the true cost of developing for Sea of Thieves, advertising, server cost, etc etc will never be known. So arguing about those specifics is not really going to help anyone, as they are basically made-up numbers. They may be well thought-out estimations, but in the end we just don't know enough to be sure of what Rare might be making in profit vs Microsoft vs what they are putting into development.

I think the bigger over-all problem that you and others seem to be having is the lack of "good" cosmetics and quantity of cosmetic updates in the game that can be purchased in-game with gold. And I'll agree with that. But that's what we should be focusing on. Asking for more quality cosmetics in-game vs the Emporium. Requesting that something like the "Shrouded Ghost" set be earnable in-game for completing commendations. Etc. Saying "Emporium ruined Sea of Thieves" is hyperbolic and doesn't achieve anything in driving discussion, because then there is a debate over "is it ruined, what does that mean, without cosmetics it's the same game," etc etc etc. And honestly, the Emporium is probably fairly necessary to keep Rare's doors open, or may even have been a directive from Microsoft to add to the game. I know in Mass Effect 3 there was a big push from EA for Bioware to add Day 1 DLC (Javik) and loot-type boxes to the multiplayer so that people "could" spend actual money on the game beyond its initial launch. There very well may have been some directive from Microsoft in a similar vein that Rare simply must adhere to.

For these reasons, I'm fully behind requesting that Rare add more cosmetic options to be purchasable in-game with gold, and have those cosmetics share a similar quality to the new sets in the Emporium. But saying "Emporium ruined Sea of Thieves" is inflammatory, and merely distracts from the real conversation we should be having.

@klutchxking518
I understand your wants with that, but I think having any DLC that must be purchased would invariably split the player base, and that is something Rare has always said they are against. Anything that would "leave players behind" is a no-go in their book, and I respect that. They very easily could have locked the Pirates of the Caribbean Tall Tales behind a pay-wall, and probably made bank with it. But they did not, so everyone could be included, and I think that's commendable.