A serious complaint regarding PVP and more

@doctorcarnage28

Maybe before you demand the game to change, you learn to become a better pirate? What you are asking for will not work in this game, give people immunity and they will just grab what they want and you have no way to counter it. Treasure is not yours until you sold it.

You point out exactly the difference between you and them, experience! You know how they gotten that experience? By being killed, murdered, sunk and had all their treasure stolen. Learn from your mistakes, Learn from your opponents, if you don't like what they have to say, mute them! Embrace the dangers of the seas and learn to deal with them and this includes the threat of other pirates.

Don't farm for 4, 5 hours straight without selling... don't sail around with more loot than you are willing to lose. Hoarding loot is for the brave and the salty...
Don't just head to an outpost that already has someone there, pick your destinations with care.
Watch out for mermaids, they indicate pirates are near.
Watch out for rowboats, they might have been carrying pirates.
Watch out for sails, they for sure have a crew sailing below them.

Learn how to sail, how the mechanics work, learn to watch the horizon like a hawk and decide how you want to respond to those sails. You are not a master of the seas yet, you are no legend! To become a legend you must earn it, learn how to navigate the waves and adapt to the flow of the seas you are on. #BeMorePirate Nobody said that being a pirate would be easy, rise to the occasion or sink to the bottom of the seas! The choice is yours, what type of pirate will you be and how will you respond to those sails on the horizon? For the record, fleeing is a totally viable way of responding... there is no shame in that. If you don't want to battle you don't need to, but don't come here and complain when you get caught... you cannot always win, yet there was always a chance and opportunity to win.

You complain that there are larger crews than your own, if you want you can expand your crew and recruit more men/women if you want! The choice is on you and for the love of god... stop acting like a sloop is some hopeless little vessel, in the hands of a competent crew it is one of the most powerful vessels on the seas. Your steady crew of two is able to wipe out a galleon, if you learn how to optimize your crew and vessel. If you choose to flee you should never be caught by a galleon... if you learn to sail the waters properly.

Numbers will always outpower, but they dont judge the results.
Galleon of 4 newb pirates, because on a Galleon they have the power to do stuff. But clever pirate on a Sloop can easily take them on. Even a rookie can out best a Vet.

Reposting from the locked version of this thread:

Sounds like you got sunk by some loot hungry scurvy dogs, but fear not there are things that you can learn from this without the game needing to be changed!

1. There isn't really any good way, beyond maybe the Pirate Legend cosmetics, to ensure that another crew has much more experience than you. They may well have numbers on you, but you will find that this is possible to overcome with some careful planning. A key will be to keep them off your ship, as that can make things much harder to recover from.

2. There are 6 Outposts located on the main map, with an additional Outpost located in the Devil's Roar. There are a maximum of 6 Ships on a completely full server, which means there are always at least 2 Outposts that can't have a full crew at them.

3. If you come to an Outpost that has another Ship at it, you need to expect that Crew to contest your attempt to use that Outpost. You may not be hostile, but they can't be sure of that and the Outpost is mainly used to sell so they will feel vulnerable as you approach and will likely attack on sight. Choose another Outpost.

4. If you come to an Outpost and there is no Ship, that doesn't mean that Pirates aren't there. Circle that Outpost and keep an eye out for Mermaids in the water or conspicuous Rowboats at the Outpost. Rowboats don't spawn here, and Mermaids only show up when a Pirate is away from their Ship (since you're on your Ship, it won't be yours). If you see these, either be careful or move on. To be careful, maybe send an advance scout to the Outpost (fire from a canon) and check for someone.

5. If there are Pirates at the Outpost and they don't have their Ship, they also don't have a respawn point here. This means you just need to kill then once and it is over for them. Meanwhile, you have your Ship which is your spawn point. So, they have to sink you without a Ship, you just have to kill their Pirate.

6. It is important to remember that in this game, loot is not yours until the moment you sell it. This also means during the walk from your ship to the Faction Vendor. You are not required to hold loot your whole play session. If you have more on your ship than you are comfortable losing, even if it is right at the Outpost, you aren't selling often enough. Start selling more regularly.

7. Due to server population, it is wildly unlikely that you could possibly be targeted at the frequency you describe (24/7) unless you are sailing for hours loading up your ship and then finally encountering these scurvy dogs. That tells me you had hours available to you in which to sell and didn't, then lost it all. This could happen to a Kraken too, so just don't let this be a thing.

Anyways, hope you start having some better luck. Welcome to the Sea of Thieves, see you out there, and #BeMorePirate!

@doctorcarnage28

1. Reapers hideout should never be safe
2. look for mermaids before you try to sell your loot
3. look for ships before you try to sell your loot

@doctorcarnage28

My suggestion here would be to make the outposts, reapers hideout and a bit of the surrounding area neutral grounds where nobody can be damaged and ganked up on. We are working hard for our loot and being camped, ganked and shot from behind really ruins the game for us, since everytime we are trying to sell our loot, it ends up being taken by some campers. Yes, this game is called "Sea of Thieves", not "Sea of Campers, ganking on newbies" but still, this part of the community, who are not working hard for anything, but gaining something by harming others just damages my relationship to that game.

You are right, it is called Sea of Thieves. It is a pirate game and stealing loot is apart of that. The developers have said that fighting other people and defending your loot as apart of the path to Pirate Legend. It can be upsetting to get ganked by other players, but you have options. A galleon doesn't just materialize out of thin air and then start killing you, they would of had to chase you for many minutes before being able to cannon you. Next time you need to look at your surroundings and watch out for other people trying to come kill you.

Developers saying that the path to Pirate Legend involves danger and fighting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=3681&v=e_yrN70591Q&feature=emb_logo

Yes that might be the core of pirates, and i don't care if someone steals loot from us, but I also do not want this to be the case 24/7 If another sloop attacks us, we enjoy these fights, but this happens quite rarely. Most of the time we get hunted by a Galleon across the map, just because we are just 2 peeple, that do not well with random people in a team. We want to enjoy this game, without having 4-5 hours of farming go to complete waste because of some toxic campers near an outpost.

It doesn't happen 24/7 I RARELY get someone to come fight me unless I actually go over and kill them, and this is how most people's adventures go. You don't get hunted across the map because you are a duo sloop, you get hunted because you have 4-5 hours worth of loot on you. You should always sell whenever you get a chance because the longer you stay around and the less you sell, the more likely someone is going to find you and want to kill you for your loot.

A private lobby without uninvited people, but also with some limitations regarding loot would be perfect for us, as we do not want to waste any more of our time by killing a Megalodon, Ashen Lords, a Kraken, etc, just for someone taking the loot from us near an outpost. This is just frustrating and extremely unrewarding. I hope private lobbies and/or at least neutral grounds where nobody can be camped and ganked up on will be reality in near future so that REALLY everyone can enjoy this game.

No, the PvPers would now not REALLY enjoy the game, and because there are more PvPers than PvErs, they will not add this.

i really feel like it should not be at the cost from someone who worked hard for everything and just wants to enjoy the game the way they like and whith neutral outposts where everyone gets along with each other.

If your reason for why they should add safezones and private servers with PvE only is because some people want to play the game how they want to, then what about the PvPers who want to steal loot? Why does their way of playing not matter to you?

If you truly want to know why things are the way they are and to understand how to make this game more enjoyable, I would suggest you read this in full. If you just want to be mad and upset that this game doesn't have a PvE only server, then skip it and stay mad.

Your idea has been posted many times of adding a PVE only server / a server for only friends / a server with only friendly people and no PvP. This is why this idea will never be implemented, and why it will never work:

Let's say you want to stack the FOTD 10 times, that will take you around 8 hours to do if you're quick. Would you rather go into a server where:

(1) You could be tucked on
(2) You could have your loot be stolen
(3) You waste 8 hours of work because a pirate boarded your ship
(4) You're always under constant threat that you could die

OR, would you rather be in a server where you are safe from all of those problems, and don't have to worry about some pirate stealing your loot?

90% of players will take the second option, because there is no reason to put yourself in a situation where bad things could happen when you could alternatively be completely safe from other players.

The problem with this is because 90% of players who do PVE missions will go to this private server, who's left on the normal servers? People who want to steal loot, but there's no loot to be stolen because everyone is off in fairyland completely safe from any problems that would arise. So all the PvPers leave the game, not to even mention that the most popular streamers have built their career by stealing loot. Pace22 would immediately leave the game because there's nothing left to steal, and many more streamers would leave, as well as most of their viewers, which means that SOT no longer has an internet presence. Now that all the news has gotten out that Sea of Thieves has a SEVERE drop in their playerbase, all of these articles will come out online saying things like,

"Sea of thieves is a bad game," and "Sea of Thieves doesn't care about it's playerbase."

So now that there is all of this stigma around SOT there will be no new players because there are only bad reviews. So people who want to buy Sea of Thieves won't, because there are all of these videos and articles saying that it's a bad game. So Sea of Thieves will no longer be getting an influx of new players, which also means that Rare won't make any money from people buying the game.

What do you do once you've reached 75/75/75/20? By that point you'll have all of the cosmetics, and with the emissary system you can easily get the highest level in a 2-3 months. People will get bored because they're not working towards anything, they already have everything in the game and the highest level in the game, what now? Most players who are max level would normally turn to stealing loot so they don't get bored, but because of PVE only servers that's not a thing anymore. Eventually all of those people will leave because there's no point for them to play anymore, so the only people who play SOT are a few hundred people who didn't get max level and only play Sea of Thieves for 2 hours a week.

Most people who play adventure mode don't play it because they want PvP and ship vs ship battles, if they wanted that they would go to arena. People play adventure because they like stealing loot, so you can't just get rid of the loot.

That's why adding PVE only servers are bad, the PvPers will leave, all of the streamers will leave, people will get bored, the internet starts hating on SOT, and then you have a dead game. Not to even mention the fact that the developers themselves have said many times that they want this game to be one where people of all ideologies can play together. The PVPers, PVEers and the RPers can all be in the same server together, and they will do everything they can to keep that in the game:

Developers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_yrN70591Q&feature=youtu.be&t=3578

Developers: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e_yrN70591Q&feature=youtu.be&t=3681

As the developers said, the path to pirate legend involves the threat that you could be fought by other players. That's why they aren't going to add a PvE only server, as they believe and the majority of players believe that the path to pirate legend includes the fear of being fought by another pirate and losing your loot. There is no reason to pander to the couple thousand people who want PVE only servers, when you have hundreds of thousands of players who have bought and actively play the game because of the PVP factor. It doesn't make sense to change the game for a few, when the vast majority don't want that. Since most people fall into the category of PvPvEers, that would mean that if you remove the PvP aspect of the game, most of the playerbase would leave.

People are always upset that in a PVP game, which has PVP in it, which is advertised as having PVP, a game that has always had PVP since the beginning of it's existence, a game that YOU bought knowing full well it had PVP, has PVP.

People who think PVP doesn't belong in Sea of Thieves and complain that PVP is, "toxic," are the same type of people to play Minecraft and complain there are no guns.

If you've made it this far into the post then you're at least willing to hear reasons as to why things are the way they are, and because of that I'm going to give you some solutions to help in your voyages. Let's move past the whole idea of, "I want a PVE server," and accept that it will never happen, so that we can find solutions to make your time on Sea of Thieves better.

The first thing you can do would be to play with other people, I don't know your experience in the game but having more people is always better as you can keep 1 person in your crows nest as a lookout for incoming ships. Using the official Sea of Thieves discord, you can easily find likeminded people who are more than willing to play with you. The discord has over 160,000 players, and there are constantly requests to join people's crews, or people asking for players to join their crew. Discord link: https://discord.gg/seaofthieves

Now that you have some people to play with, ALWAYS keep someone as a watchguard, if you have 4 people on your crew, you can easily send one of you to stand watch in the crows nest and have the rest of you do the voyage. Another thing to keep in mind, there may be tuckers on your boat, people who park their boat behind a rock or an island, then take the 3 minute swim over to your boat. So always make sure that whenever you leave the island you were just at, have at least 1 person check around your ship for tuckers. I'm not going to bore you with every single tuck spot in the game, but in general equip a sword and slash the ship. The cannons, masts, wheel, sides of the ship, barrels, etc. Anywhere where someone could hide some of their body inside something, sword that area. If you hit them, they will stand up and there will be a sound effect letting you know that you hit something.

Whenever you load into a game, check the emissary tables next to the respective trading companies. If you see a tiny ship on the emissary table it means that someone is on your server doing that emissary, so if you see 4 people doing quests you may want to consider leaving that server as there are many people active. Always check the reaper's bones quest table, if there is a tiny ship on the emissary table or a reaper's marked ship on the map, leave the game as that ship has a high chance of trying to attack you and steal your loot. Try to minimize the risks before you even start your voyages.

Those are some of the tips I can give you, hopefully these will help you in your voyages to come. I understand that it can be annoying when pirates come over and take all of your loot, but the sooner you can accept that it's a part of the game, the sooner you can improve and become better at avoiding those situations. Who knows, you might become a PvPer yourself.

At the end of the day whether you want to add PvE servers or not, the developers themselves have said multiple times that they don't want to separate players into different servers. They want this game to be one where players of all groups, PvPers, PvErs, and RPers can all be in the same server together. The only thing that can change the developers vision for the game is if the community comes together and says that they want something different. That isn't happening, and they still have a very strong community in favor of PvPvE, so there's no point in trying to do something that could backfire into something very deadly.

The only way that SOT will add a PvE only server, is if a majority of the community says that they want PVE only servers, until that happens, a PVE only server will never be added. When you are the owner of a video game, you have to do what the majority of people want or you risk killing your game, and right now the majority of people do not want PvE only servers, so they aren't going to add them.

This game was MADE and is a game for PvPvErs, not for PvErs or people who just want to do missions and voyages without any threat whatsoever, the sooner you accept that this game was BUILT for PvPvE, then sooner you will be able to have fun in the game.

@doctorcarnage28 Welcome to the seas, mate!

The posts above are super helpful and I'm glad you were able to learn from them! That being said, if you and your friend ever wants to sail with a larger crew and maybe learn a few more things, add me and I'll gladly sail with you! I also sail with a larger crew that would be happy to welcome you to the ranks!

@doctorcarnage28 said in A serious complaint regarding PVP and more:

Yes that might be the core of pirates, and i don't care if someone steals loot from us, but I also do not want this to be the case 24/7.

You answered yourself, good job. Just get even better at the game, you can do it.

I call bullshtein, and I say that your perception (or assertion) of what is happening does not match reality.

I can login to this game casually... to screw around for while as I'm engaged in other activities, and I can make to treasure and back to the outpost again and again and again without ever been spawn camped, chased, or otherwise ambushed.

My estimate is that unless I'm looking for trouble, 85-90% of my sessions are trouble free.

One of two things is happening here:

1. You're focusing so much on the moments of loss, that you are forgetting all of the offsetting moments of gain.
2. You're using hyperbole to complain and make your appeal.

My money is on both, but especially with #2. And I think that you're using #2 simply so you don't have to stop and reflect on what it is that you're doing to put yourself in the position of being railroaded more often than most other players.

No One gets "constantly" ambushed or chased or camped in this game who doesn't invite it. There simply aren't enough ships per server for that to occur. You need to watch some beginner's guides on YouTube, and take stock of what it is that you need to change to prevent it from happening.

@rummy-richard said in A serious complaint regarding PVP and more:

Maybe not necessarily the Reaper's Hideout as a safe zone... But I've entertained the idea myself as well for a long time, that maybe certain Outposts could be safe zones where your as a player cannot be killed (thus eliminating the problem of spawn camping). But your ship and loot can still fall prey to other pirates. (...)

You want it to be impossible to defend yourself against people who take your chests and skulls ?

If you are on an outpost that has campers on it without their ship, you just have removed your strength against them. If they can't be killed they don't even need their own ship to spawn back ...

@rummy-richard said in A serious complaint regarding PVP and more:

Maybe not necessarily the Reaper's Hideout as a safe zone... But I've entertained the idea myself as well for a long time, that maybe certain Outposts could be safe zones where your as a player cannot be killed (thus eliminating the problem of spawn camping). But your ship and loot can still fall prey to other pirates.
This whole Sea of Thieves community is a horribly toxic one, but I assure you, if you keep playing it you will meet pirates who are pretty chill.

we aren't toxic we are pirates.

I can't pvp very well so let's change it to suit me and everyone else who enjoys the game can suck it!!!

Ugh, go play a single player game noob.

@doctorcarnage28

I feel the pain.
Its uncanny how similar new players posts are. i remember making a similar post years ago asking for ports to be a safe place. Now that i have more experience under my belt its clear that would break the game.

My advise is dont get discouraged this is a game of high highs and unfortunately some really low lows. Keep playing and learn from your experiences.

I also prefer to sloop as i believe many other pirates do. you will soon learn that your superior agility in the sloop can be devastating to a galleon once you get the hang of things.
Take note of this chart and use it to your advantage when encountering larger ships.
https://www.reddit.com/r/Seaofthieves/comments/bcqzwk/amazing_windsail_direction_guide/

Pirating is a part of the game and its what makes it so exciting. I completely believe that if you keep playing soon you will have stories about how your sloop duo took down multiple galleons for a big haul.

Dont let the bad experiences ruin the good.

@ghostpaw
lol i was hoping people wouldn't dig up my old post

but yea you can see i was basically asking for something very similar.
@DoctorCarnage28 I know being in your shoes you probably feel like we arent even considering the idea. but hopefully this shows that most of us have considered this idea at one point or another and realized its not the solution.

Now to back pedal a little bit:
i dont think it would be a bad idea to have 1-2 stationary cannons added to most or all outpost that overlooked the main dock and not much else.
Not manned by guards or anything like that just some added defense.
Reapers outpost already has this but i think that amount of cannons would be overkill for most outpost.
From a lore perspective you'd thinks outposts would have SOME defense.
But these cannons wouldn't by any means make the outpost a "safe" place since they could be used for nefariously as well as defensively.

@ghostpaw
Nah leave it for others to see.
That post was after a particularly long night trying to get some friends invested, and that experience basically turned them off. Reading it back now im cringing a little reading my own comments adamantly* defending an idea i wouldn't support today.

Edit: Spelling

@comrade-molly said in A serious complaint regarding PVP and more:

@wisdom-eternal said in A serious complaint regarding PVP and more:

Yes, the other players can be griefers. Yes, the title of the game gives these people an excuse to act horribly. Yes, PvE is a great aspect of the game. I enjoy PvP and PvE. However, making safezones or PvE dedicated servers are not the answer. Honestly, in game mechanics could fix most of the issues with PvP. For starters, put in-built Pirate Code rules; meaning you can't break them even if you wanted to. Just as the OP was exaggerating about how often he's attack, be honest, most of you are exaggerating on how often it's not. Every day I get on, I'm attacked at least once or twice. It's not game breaking for me. But when I'm enjoying a grog at the tavern, and someone burns down my ship and I'm met with a 3-man crew, just to kill me. Yes, that's griefing, and what makes this game toxic. You didn't gain anything from that, I had no loot, you didn't take my ship. You did it just to be jerk. This, in no way is an argument for PvE, I would hate that. But a little enforcement of the Code would be nice. An offline mode would also be nice. Here's why. If you always have someone to sail with, I applaud you. I know I don't. And a solitary pirate, is a dead pirate; I don't care what you say. As for those crying that it would ruin the game. Really? Millions of people live for PvP in Dark Souls, It's not even dedicated to PvP. Games such as Conan Exiles are doing fantastic. They not only have an offline mode, but dedicated PvE. Again, I don't want to see a PvE server. I hope that Rare keeps the no PvE promise. But an offline mode? Sure, you want to have a nice relaxing time at sea, either solo or with a couple of mates, I don't really see the problem with this. You'll find PvP players care far more about bragging rights than any PvE player. Am I saying that no PvE player brags? No, I didn't. But I don't really hear anyone cheers about how much treasure they dug up. How many players they jacked, all the time. Anyway, again, as someone who enjoys both, I see both sides. And would love to see some changes - changes that don't involve PvE servers, private servers, etc. But do allow a bit more relaxed play when you want, and to gift the griefers with true pirates ready to blow them out of the water.

Cheers you rats!

If I see a boat at an outpost not doing anything, and I don't have any other boats I see to attack, I'm attacking that one at the outpost. I don't care if you don't have loot and just want to fake drink fake booze in a fake tavern, there's limited slots in the server and I'd rather have yours taken up by a crew who actually wants to fight me.

Nobody is required to engage with you in the same way that you want to engage with them. You choosing to RP at someone and them not RPing back doesn't make them toxic.

I mean you are RP'ing
You're Comrade Molly, Destroyer of the innocent, Slayer of Friendlies.

@DoctorCarnage28
This can be fun and all but i find friendly gameplay a lot more rewarding. sure you come across people like Molly who just want to attack you no matter what. but you will also find some great people who enjoy the game for the experience not the pew pews. which can lead to epic multi ship fights.

The amazing this with this game is every time i play its a new experience. You can start the game with a clear plan but the seas may have different ideas. Best advice is dont fight the flow, if the game throws a kraken, skeli ship, and a player at you. well it might just be your time, or you might just come out of it with an awesome story to tell over some grog while you watch your boat burn at the end of the night.

A lot of it depends on your attitude, if there is a Molly chasing all the friendlies off the server say gg and server hop. A lot of the time its easier to just restart a voyage than deal with Molly, at least until you are more confident.

Sorry i know im giving a lot of advise, WFH an all.

@doctorcarnage28 said in A serious complaint regarding PVP and more:

@daringclarky This is what I would consider a perfect example for an unproductive, not really helpful sentence that a child would write when he couldn't think of anything but wants to join a conversation

You seem to have a problem with pirates in a pirate game.
So no offense mate but your opinion of me or what i have said is irrelevant. You want to change the game against its core vision...because it suits you. Despite many others loving the PVEVP.
That in itself is childish.

Dont throw stones in glass houses. 🧐

@seadinkledorf
If all i saw was sloops when i was slooping i would be disappointed.
Larger ships have larger crews but they also require more coordination to sail properly. AND if they are hot micing then thats even better for you because they are broadcasting their communication to you. if they are just chasing you endlessly use it as an opportunity to practice boarding.
look for barrels in the water indicated by the smaller bird circles, you might get lucky and find a keg. 1 player with a keg can take down a galleon or at least dissuade them. Also with a little practice you can run from a galleon forever. Sloops will be faster going directly into the wind. and you can bank around little shallow islands better .
With that in mind a good strat is to sail by a fort, and either use a keg and swim out or use the cannons on the fort to shoot the ship as they pass by chasing your boat. then mermaid back when you dont have shots.
If you dont have a solid duo partner it makes a world of difference and soon you wont be afraid of larger ships, you'll see them as juicy targets digging up all your treasure for you.

also not always but a lot of the time larger ships like the galleon have 1-2 good players and 1-2 new players so 1v4 is actually a lot more viable than it may sound. Practice your shots, a good trick is to shoot the bells on your ship as they make a very audible DING* when you hit them, if you have a duo partner you can also practice shooting at them, but the fleshy hit sound is a little harder to distinguish in my opinion.

Keep playing i have faith in you