PVE Feedback and suggested reworks.

  • I have noticed that PVE overall is, well, not challenging at all once you understand the basics of how the Megalodon Kraken and other threats work. Even when solo really only skeleton ships are a threat. Megalodon and Kraken are really easy to kill solo, here will be my ideas for improving PVE (making It an actual challenge)

    Multiplier for Crew Sizes
    This is my idea for how you could make the crew size difficulty multiplier work, make it
    75% for solo, 100% for duo, 125% for trio, and 150% for a full galleon. I will be having all my numbers be for duo.
    Megalodon Tweaks
    At the moment Megalodon takes very little effort to kill, just around 5 minutes of your time and a small amount of materials. Megalodon really should be a actual threat, even to experienced crews. I think that making it be harder based on region (and crew size ofc) would work well. With Shores of Plenty being the easiest, Ancient Isles medium, Wilds hard, and Devil's Roar very hard. Megalodon type and colour would still spawn as they do now, but they would deal more damage and have more health. In Shores of Plenty they would have 5000 hp (cannon shots are 100, EOR 70, et cetera) and deal 2 full sized holes upon impact. Ancient Isles would have 7500 hp, and deal 3 full sized holes upon impact. Wilds would have 10000 hp, and deal 4 full sized holes upon impact. Devil's Roar would have 10000 hp, but deal 6 full sized holes upon impact. You could still run into shallow waters to escape them though.
    Kraken Changes
    At the moment, Kraken is fairly easy to take down, especially on sloop. I believe these changes would make it harder. It would also have Shores of Plenty be easy, Ancient Isles medium, Wilds hard, and Devil's Roar very hard. I believe that it should go 1000 hp per tentacle for Shores of Plenty, 2000 per tentacle for Ancient Isles, 3000 per tentacle for Wilds, and 3000 per tentacle for devil's roar. For damage it would be 3 full sized holes for a slap or wrap around, with SoP being 50% damage, AI 100%, Wild's 150%, and DR 200%. It would still only occur during the time between Skull Forts and Skeleton Fleets.
    Skeleton Ships
    Skeleton ships at the moment are fairly balanced but could use a bit more difficulty.
    I would add in a skeleton brig for some variation and then change what spawns on what/wanders where for the ship types/regions. Sloop would have Skeleton Sloops spawn on them, Brig would have a Skeleton Brig spawn on them, and Galleon would have a Skeleton Galleon or 2 Skeleton Sloops spawn on them. For wandering Skeleton Ships Shores of Plenty would have the majority of the Skeleton Ships be sloops (Ships of higher classes can still spawn but are just rarer) , Ancient Isles would have mainly Brigs and Sloops, Wilds would have mainly Brigs and Galleons, Devil's Roar would have wandering ships wander as fleets. 2 Sloops spawn together, a Sloop and a Brig, 2 Brigs, A Brig and a Galleon, or 2 Galleons. Mechanics would be same as now. Skeleton Brig would be similar to the player brig.
    Skeletons on Islands
    Skeletons on islands are fairly balanced, gun spam can be a pain but without it skeletons are very easy. I would like to suggest adding Skeleton Snipers back in but they would only spawn 1 at a time.
    Devil's Roar and Miscellaneous
    Crashing into islands in general should be much more devestating. Anyways, Devil's Roar is way too easy right now and needs a massive buff. A galleon should not be able to park right by a erupting volcano and not even get close to sinking (like I have done a lot). If you are at a erupting island you should be dead if not barely alive.
    Disclaimer
    The numbers I put here were more examples and might be a bit too difficult, constructive criticism is expected and appreciated. Thank you for your time reading this. This is just my personal opinion on how the game could use some buffing.
    Edits based on feedback
    Will be putting feedback that would work well here with credit to the original suggestor

    1. Maybe have difficulty also be based off of playtime or reputation? - Archangel Timmy
    2. (re?)implement a sloop-warning and integrate a LFG system to encourage multiplayer -WilbyMagicBear
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  • I would have to find it, but I suggested something similar but with a modifier based on players reputation levels. The higher their rep or time at sea would increase the difficulty modifier to where an experienced crew would have more of a challenge than a new player crew of the same size.

  • Here is part if it from the original thread.


    The game has been getting easier and easier, which makes sense considering new players are getting slaughtered in PVE and PVP, but this also pulls some of the fun away from veteran players who know how to play.

    Please consider scaling difficulty based on Crew Experience rather than just on Ship Type and/or Crew Size.

    Crew Experience would be based on a calculation against the entire crews' specific faction reputations averaged and weighted by ship type, perhaps even manipulated by playtime or meters sailed. Below is a very quick rundown of what I am referring to... The final difficulty would determine the type of danger that can/will spawn and how difficult the encounter will be. Sloops would mostly encounter Skeleton Sloops (Skloop), but have an increased chance at a Skeleton Galleon (Skelleon) if their difficulty calculations are up there.

    Again, this is a very rough set of scenarios. Please consider the concept and not so much my implementation :)

    Ship Modifiers:

    • Sloop: 1
    • Brigantine: 1.1
    • Galleon: 1.2

    Solo Sloop: (Newbie)

    • GH: 0
    • OoS: 0
    • MA: 0
    • A: 0
    • Total XP: 0 / 160
    • Crew XP: 0 / 160
    • ShipModifier: 1
    • Difficulty: 0

    Solo Sloop: (Moderate)

    • GH: 15
    • OoS: 15
    • MA: 15
    • A: 2
    • Total XP: 47 / 160
    • Crew XP: 47 / 160
    • ShipModifier: 1
    • Difficulty: 47

    Solo Slooper: (PL10)

    • GH: 50
    • OoS: 50
    • MA: 50
    • A: 10
    • Total XP: 160 / 160
    • Crew XP: 160 / 160
    • ShipModifier: 1
    • Difficulty: 100

    Duo Sloop: (Newbie + PL10)

    • GH: 0, 50
    • OoS: 0, 50
    • MA: 0, 50
    • A: 0, 10
    • Total XP: 160 / 320
    • Crew XP: 160
    • ShipModifier: 1
    • Difficulty: 160

    Duo Sloop: (PL10 + PL10)

    • GH: 50, 50
    • OoS: 50, 50
    • MA: 50, 50
    • A: 10, 10
    • Total XP: 320 / 320
    • Crew XP: 320
    • ShipModifier: 1
    • Difficulty: 320

    Duo Brigantine: (PL10 + PL10)

    • GH: 50, 50
    • OoS: 50, 50
    • MA: 50, 50
    • A: 10, 10
    • Total XP: 320 / 320
    • Crew XP: 320
    • ShipModifier: 1.1
    • Difficulty: 352
  • This makes no sense.

    Just sailing a Galleon is 10X harder than any other ships. I can solo both the Brig and the Sloop like I’m JFK cruising around Martha’s Vineyard.

    Keeping the Galleon a float? Damn thing is built to sink and built to sink fast!

    Sloop is nigh unsinkable! (Unless I die I can keep a Sloop afloat forever!).

    I’ve seen 2 man sloops take 40 + cannon balls and not even miss a beat (cause they so easy to bail and keep afloat!).

    The difficulty of the game is already scaled.

  • @glannigan Galleon has 4x the players, so it can deal a lot more damage (400 per broadside instead of 100 or 200) Galleon sinks quicker yes, but has more players, also take into account that it isn't taking on water from 100% of the holes, unlike sloop and brig. (6 holes could be 3 actual ones) it can bail at roughly half the rate (2 decks instead of 1), but has 2x the players so that makes sense.
    If you are coordinated you can keep a galleon afloat, it can also run away quicker (such as to get to shallow water) What I think is that sea monsters should be actual monsters, not just easy things that you take down every day with no challenge whatsoever. I admit the numbers I gave were a bit too high and could use a bit of scaling. If you give me specific variables for damage I can add that in. My main problem is that the only "real" threat is other players (I personally don't find them a problem since you can always run away but others don't always understand this)

  • How about 200% dofficulty for solo players, so we see more crews our there?

  • @jofjjay Your opening post has been edited as it goes against the Forum Rules.

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  • @jofjjay
    I guarantee Rare will not increase the difficulty. Why? Because they have spent the past year decreasing the difficulty of the PvE threats.

    Also, the real difficulty comes from facing these PvE threats at the same time as another PvP crew. I don't know if it's just me, but I feel like I have seen more Megs spawn during PvP battles recently. Probably just the RNG... but who knows.

  • @triheadedmonkey Ok, idk exactly how I did what I did, was trying to make something bold and probably messed up, will try to refrain from doing that in the future, thank you for changing it.

  • @wilbymagicbear 200% difficulty for solo would be fun, would probably drive people away from the game if they didn't want to do open crews (or for some reason didn't want to use stuff like discord lfg for getting a crew of "randoms") and didn't have any friends that played though.

  • I just want to say that my son and I still find the Megs and especially the Kraken very challenging. I applaud those of you who find them easy, but for us it's still scary to run into them and we have to use all our focus to beat them. We don't always win. Maybe it will be easier for us one day, but right now our experience is that we find these monsters exciting.

    Mentioning, so that the perspective of these things being "still plenty hard" gets representation.

  • @jofjjay looks like there were too many spaces in front of the first paragraph, for some reason that messed it up.

  • @ruggles-forever Here is what I do to counter Krakens and Megs on sloop (assuming you guys are on sloop) figure you guys might find it useful. For the megalodons immediately raise sails once they pop up and start turning the ship in a way that you can get more shots in than with them just circling around, this also tends to reduce the amount of times you are hit.
    For Krakens you should go below deck whenever the kraken either makes you start seeing brown "dust" (for lack of better words to describe it) or if you want to be extra careful whenever he starts making noises. Shoot cannonballs into him when he isn't making noises. For weaponry use sword for slashing him in case he does start eating you (I tend to never get eaten anymore so if you get used to it you really don't need it but I would always carry it just in case) and EOR for quickscoping him. When you have to go below deck shoot him through the back or side ports since the Kraken cant get you as long as you aren't above deck. Bail through these too, they tend to be more efficient than bailing out the front. Hope this helps you guys, Good Luck!

  • I would like an adjustable slider for your pirate, you can move it up or down to increase or lower difficulty. The higher you go the more gold you receive and vise versa.

    For Crews it would use the lowest difficulty a player has set up, so if it was 50, 50,80, 40 It would apply the 40 to all.

  • Its balanced on the idea that you may have more than one threat at a time.

    Increase the difficulty of kraken/meg and you just made a scenario where a passing by ship gets a free sink

  • @steveboddy Except you can avoid Meg and Kraken. Making them harder would just mean that you would have an actual reason to avoid them. Individual "threats" should be a problem and should not have to rely on other threats also being there to be a threat. When I first got the game Kraken and Megalodon were actually kind of hard, simply since I didn't know how to counter them, once you learn how to counter them they are a bit too easy, Making them at least scale with your reputation (maybe the amount of them you kill) would make them at least a threat to experienced players, which they should be, not the jokes that they currently are.

  • @jofjjay

    They just spent the passed few months nerfing the spawns on these encounters. They aren't going to buff them back up. Too many noobs that try to play this game solo and then whine when they get sunk.

    We the experienced players of the game tried to give them advice but we were met with disdain. They would claim all we were doing was telling them to "git gud" and that we were being a bully and being mean to the players.

    So after a solid year and half of the game they nerfed the Kraken to where its basically a joke to solo. Brig is no different still easy as hell but you'll notice that players still complain about the Kraken wrapping the stairs and crying over split milk.

    Sorry man. I want to have faith in Rare but they are really bad at changing and re-balancing the game.

    They had a good thing with combat and changed that now its completely garbage and the balance is out of whack. The PvE encounters were getting better then they went ahead and hit everything with a nerf hammer.

    The problem is that to Rare time spent=difficult.

    Like the Tall Tales. The bosses are just time consuming. That's it. They have a ton of life and all you do is just whack away at it. The more crew you have the more life they bosses have. Just time consuming.

    The skeletons AI with guns is crazy overpowered, still doable but again takes time to chip away at the numbers.

    Devils Roar used to have Auto aiming Volcano's that would immediately erupt after arriving to the island and then if you waited outside its range just to return later it would erupt again within 1 minute. It wasn't difficult just time consuming and an annoyance.

    Now the issue could be that they are limited to what they can do. If you look at the game structurally, its kind hard to really do outlandish changes and balances to the game. The game is based on simple mechanics.

    I used to be happy when I solo slooped and the Kraken spawned. You had to kill 4 tentacles before nerfed it and I would get crazy loot. For some reason players still think its a myth that the Kraken drops fort loot. I still get it now and then but I used to get it all the time before the nerf.

    So I doubt any changes are going to happen or will happen. Also any idea that makes it harder for a player to avoid a PvE encounter is not a good idea. The game is based on choice. Whether or not we want to run or fight. Making it significantly harder to run from something is going to cause a lot more headaches from the players who STILL complain that everything is too hard.

  • @jofjjay This is really nice of you. We'll add this to our own tested strategies and maybe see some improvement.

    Thanks for being so friendly.

  • @ruggles-forever No problem, if you guys ever need any tips or help let me know, I will mainly be able to help in pvp-related things though.

  • @xultanis-dragon wait... youre defending the tall tales bosses?

    Theyre such a basic fight that brings nothing to the table. They just drag on so long that it stops being fun.

    I havent completed the shores of gold x5 for the simple fact that i dont want to (as you put it) whack away at it for twenty minutes.

    The "this is cool" factor dies off halfway through the fight and becomes "omg just make this end"

    Both times ive killed it, i wasnt even happy. Just annoyed like "finally"

  • @triheadedmonkey Ok, thanks for the help, I would normally use tab for paragraphs so things are nicer but for some reason that doesn't work on here. Is there any other way to indent or do I just have to find others ways to make my writing not a wall of text? Thank you for your time moderating these forums.

  • @steveboddy

    Re-read what I wrote :):)

    I was correlating with Rare's belief of what constitutes as difficult.

    Rare makes things "more difficult" by making things taking longer which is not fun and just purely annoying.

    However the thing is that the game has an issue structurally. They can't balance or make a wide number of changes because of how simple they have the mechanics.

    Simple mechanics isn't a bad thing but you can't use simple mechanics to make a game with innovations or complexity.

    SIDE NOTE Interaction between players, negative or positive, is suppose to be a huge part of the game, however, we have a good portion of the player base that continuously begs to remove or somehow avoid these interactions and so Rare tries to mitigate the avoidance with other things.

    Again this is our fault as a player base and Rare's fault for not taking a stronger stance of their vision.

  • @jofjjay Integrating LFG into the game and bringing back the sloop warning at launch would have done wonders. I belive we'd have a totally different game if multiplayer was/is encouraged.

  • @wilbymagicbear Yeah for sure, sloop warning (in my case brig) wasn't around when I started but I knew it was going to be hard and learned quickly. It really annoys me how many solo players I encounter, (especially since most are really bad and thus I have no challenge whatsoever, I would do arena but random crews in there are awful and discord LFG for it can take a while, plus my ping tends to be really really high there so its hard for me to play) it tends to be me in a solo-sloop (or sometimes brig when I feel like it, don't solo-brig very much at all anymore) and the rest mainly solo or 2 man sloops/brigs. I rarely see a galley and really wish that I saw them in every server. LFG being implemented into the game would be great since for now we have to use discord servers and other 3rd party sources. I wasn't actually playing or involved during beta but watched a few videos from back then, wasn't sloop added in secondary? I assumed that based on how it was presented. Maybe Rare should do an actual tutorial so that people are at least...…. half-decent? Maybe then open-crews (also an integrated LFG) would actually be bearable?

  • @jofjjay

    Some lesser known facts about this:
    -Megalodons are different in difficulty, scaling with rarity (excluding the Crested Queen and the Hungering One, think of it as a seafarer's chest to a castaway's)
    -Kraken tentacles can be driven off once, at which point they go down and resurface elsewhere. It is after being driven off again that they do not come back, and drop their reward. This, coupled with the critical hit zone aspect (they take less damage closer to the base of it, the inner mouth is a critical hit zone), is why players who know the mechanics can easily solo a kraken, even on a galleon. It also has a limit to how many must be killed completely: Two on a sloop, six on a brigantine, and all eight on a galleon. This means the galleon must effectively fight off 16 of them, while the sloop only 4 (though a very unlucky new one may end up destroying 10 before it leaves).
    -The game cannot keep track of crew size, only ship size as of now. This is why duoing all of the skeleton captains and Lords in the tall tales on a sloop is the easiest way to do it, why soloing a galleon gives you the same difficulty of threats as a full one, and why sea creatures on a sloop is so easy - the sloop is scaled for solo play (also, you'll never have a better coordinated team then a solo crew).
    -Only things which spawn for a ship specifically scale for it, meaning things like strongholds, roaming skeleton ships, skeleton fleets and volcanoes are the same for every ship.

  • @ultmateragnarok Thanks! For the megalodons I never really payed attention to whether they were harder or not, just did the same strategy. Did not realize they took more damage with the mouth so I will use that from now on. I didnt realize it was based on ship size and not player count for stuff the spawns. Thank you for giving me some info, did not realize some of this, hey you learn something new every day, I will apply this all, (especially the kraken one, its already easy for me, now it will be even easier lol)

  • @xultanis-dragon
    Yup. Massive health pool should never be a solution to make things harder...

    Gold Hoarder boss is quite boring, why not add a canon inside that we could use ? Why not add a trap mechanic like the ones already used in the tale Art of The trickster to deal the boss more damage ?
    Why his blast attack is affecting you when you're behind a huge pillar ? Why is there no way for us to escape this attack ? It's like: "Here it comes ! Run !" And you take damage anyway. There's nothing particular to do. Run to him, slash him, retreat, heal and repeat.

    Athena skeletons also are a good example of this. Why the massive health pool ? I'm sorry, but fighting skeletons isn't that interesting anyway so I don't really understand why we should slash one 9 times in order to kill it.

    It's not challenging, it's time consuming. That's all.
    Like the Devil's Roar. The area is a both a frustrating and a far too easy experience. Wich is bad in my opinion.

  • This game has been nerfed since launch. I love this game but new players continue to whine and whine about difficulty and then they make things easier. Everything used to be challenging. I literally solo forts without dying while my boat is off doing other things. I’m all for helping out new players but making the game easier isn’t the solution.

    Sorry just had to blow off some steam. Long story short I agree would be nice if everything was more difficult. I just Hope increasing the health isn’t the way they do it.

  • @andyxxpanda1290 a dit dans PVE Feedback and suggested reworks. :

    This game has been nerfed since launch. I love this game but new players continue to whine and whine about difficulty and then they make things easier. Everything used to be challenging. I literally solo forts without dying while my boat is off doing other things. I’m all for helping out new players but making the game easier isn’t the solution.

    Sorry just had to blow off some steam. Long story short I agree would be nice if everything was more difficult. I just Hope increasing the health isn’t the way they do it.

    Exactly. I also hope that Rare knows that "increasing the difficulty" does not necessary mean "being a nuisance and annoying". Because for me, this is exactly what the Devil's Roar and the "high level" (lol) skeletons are.
    Forts skeletons are okay. They don't have a massive health pool and they are more fun to fight. I still find times when their aim is way too absurd.
    I just don't like when skeletons perform near impossible actions (by a good player) on a regular basis.
    Difficulty should be something challenging interesting and fun, there's a balance to find between those three. It's hard to find that balance but I really don't think it's there.

    Sure if you give an enemy gazillions pv and insane skills, it will be hard to defeat it, but will it be fun to fight it ? Will it even be interesting ?

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