At What Point Does Repetition Become Insanity?

Sigh...

Rare, how many times must I ask this question?

What's in the game?

This so called "bespoke" experience is the same one you've been showing off for over two and a half years. And you know what...I'm too frustrated to take the time to go into this. So to the archives!

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From a May 8, 2017 thread:

1. It won't be released until mid 2018 or later

I'll agree with you on this one. If it doesn't come out before E3 2018 and it makes an appearance there...that'll be a new kind of frustrating and annoying.

2. It's going to be just a collection/gathering game - get bananas, planks, cannon balls, treasure chests

See, I fear it'll be a hollow game much to dependent on "emergent" gameplay and the players making things happen instead of the developers providing the tools needed for such things to occur properly.

3. Solo is going to be hell especially in combat (navigating the ship, firing the cannons, patching the holes, and eating those bananas)

Hard to tell on this one since only Rare have been able to test out any ship other than the 4/5-man, 8-gun galleon that we've been shown for nearly two years now.

4. No main story or campaign

Yep. Going back to their desire to place everything on the players I do wonder at times if the Lore of this game world will be nearly non-existent. I find it silly that Rare's worry about players being jealous of NPC has caused them to leave out potential story avenues. That and the illogical bit about players basically being the start of the Golden Age of Piracy in this world even though there's apparently only whispered rumors and legends about what lies within the Sea of Thieves. Which is itself silly since there was apparently tons of something that drew all those poor sots who are now reanimated skeletons to the area and provided them with freaktons of precious items to bury every which way. Seriously! That makes me very curious about their stories and what brought them to the Sea of Thieves. Rare seems to just want to drop players off in a world that's supposedly rich in lore but who's story isn't supposed to exist until the player enters it. I find that worrisome. That and the constant use of "emergent".

5. I won't be able to fish

I'm worried fishing will be solely restricted to poles only and be mind numbingly boring.

6. It will be a griefer's paradise

I share this one as well. I also worry that the PvPers will be the ones to dictate any nerfs/buffs that happen, much to the detriment of the PvEers.

7. Communication is going to be a nightmare, and sailing with a crew is going to get old fast

Assuming we get multi-channeled text and voice chat channels with all the bells and whistles for setting them up, running and managing them I think we'll be fine.

Constantly playing with others can be draining that's one reason why I eagerly await the addition of solo ships to the game.

8. I will forced or only allowed to play it once a week at 1am for 3 hours

At some point here Rare will need to expand the hours the servers are operational for, all the way up to the point where they're up 24/7. That and figure out the best time to run maintenance and push through patches to inconvenience the smallest group of players possible while giving them ample time that day and the rest of the week to troubleshoot any issues that arise (hint: Tuesday in the AM is the right answer).

9. I'm going to miss fighting against the Dutch East Indian Company

I won't. Assuming of course that there will actually be factions equivalent to them roaming the game world. Such as the merchants of the Spring Lily Trading Company. But going back to the lore bit I'm worried that such entities won't make it into the game. Even though their inclusion at the outset would help to shape the gameworld in the years to come through their actions and players interactions with them and their ilk. But seeing as how there won't be NPC ships and how heavily player dependent things might be...anxiety!

10. I won't be able to use The Playstation VR on the PS4 Pro version

Seeing as how you put something silly here I'll just take that as a chance to post a Quest/Activities list that I've been slowly building for months. My concern is that hardly any of it will make it into the game and what does will be overly reliant on PvP.

• Seize a ship (general pirating and privateering)

1. Random encounter - Merchants or Treasure or Military
2. Contracted to find, intercept and seize
3. Seize a treasure ship or treasure fleet

• Raid an estate/village/town/port/fort

• Seize an estate/village/town/port/fort

1. Unaligned Freehold
2. Faction Based

• Anti-pirate ship or squadron

1. Destroy
2. Avoid
3. Assist

• Invasion/Survival/Outlast

1. Skeletons and/or other mythical creatures
2. Local/Aboriginal populations
3. Various government forces and factions
4. Trade Companies

• Sabotage

1. Local/Aboriginal populations
2. Various government forces and factions
3. Trade Companies
4. Opposing factions

• Treasure Hunt

1. Single Chest, Single "Clue"
2. Multiple Chests, Multiple steps to find
3. Multiple Chests, large reward
4. Multiple Clues, single reward
5. Dungeon/Cave dive, shifting maze depending on key used

• Assassination/Elimination

1. Local/Aboriginal individuals or entire groups
2. Various government officials and/or officers
3. Trade Company officials
4. Opposing faction leaders or key figures
5. Mystical creature(s)

• Exterminate/Cleanse

1. Local population
2. Invasive population/Mystical creatures
3. Local wildlife
4. Invasive wildlife

• Retrieve/Find Item or Information

1. Salvage a shipwreck (pre-generated or newly sunk player ship)
2. Retrieve someones item(s)
3. Find/Steal information for a trader/broker

• Rescue

1. Individual
2. Marooned crew

• Escort

1. Ship(s)
2. VIP
3. Settlers/Explorers

• Kidnap

1. NPCs only

• Bounties - Player and NPC

1. Kill
2. Capture (NPC only)

• Trader (low, medium, high risk)

1. Commission, build, purchase or steal an item to deliver to the buyer
2. Resupply a village/town/port
3. Point A to point B, profit
4. Supply and Demand, learn the market, stockpile goods in a warehouse from your voyages, buy low - sell high
5. Trading triangle, one commodity traded for another to then deliver and profit

• Whaling (some products require specific whales to harvest)

1. lamp oil (from sperm oil)
2. margarine and cooking oil (from whale oil)
3. candles, soaps, cosmetics and perfumes (from sperm oil)
4. corsets and umbrellas (from whalebone)
5. whale-meat for human consumption
6. animal feed (from meat meal)
7. fertilizer (from bone meal)
8. string for tennis racquets (from tendons)

• Fishing

1. Nets, from or with ship
2. Nets, from shore
3. Pole, from shore or ship
4. Harpoon, from ship or underwater
5. Spear, from the shallows or in rivers
6. Lobster traps
7. Pearl diving

• Hunting

1. Kill, sell meat (make jerky for more money) and hides (make clothing for more profit)
2. Capture/trap, sell

• Monster Hunting (Krakens, Leviathans, Giant Squids, Vengeful Narwals, etc)

• PvP Dueling

1. Ship v. Ship (Matchmaking will group people with this quest onto servers)
2. Arena/Club/Brawlers Pub (betting and spectating possible)
3. Dueling - Pistol or sword/melee

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Post from May 18, 2017:

@Daimyo-DoriMa said in The Road to E3 2017 - What's Next for Sea of Thieves?:

I'll just reiterate some things I've said before. This will be Rare's third appearance at E3 and showing people what this game actually is, is very important to their credibility with certain gamers. It's also important for Microsoft since they've had some high profile studio closures and game cancellations over the last year or so. No more videos that basically show the same limited features over and over. I still love the developer gameplay videos, there just needs to be more revealed about what Sea of Thieves will have to offer that will not only attract players in the first place, but keep them coming back for more. E3 2017 should be the time where Rare finally lets people in on what those game features will actually be and what the game as a whole has to offer gamers.

Anything they put forward should be definitive and truly answer questions. No more of the "we're not talking about that right now" or other such lines from them. The Electronic Entertainment Expo is a trade show for Pete's sake! You're there to sell your product to the consumer. So if you're unable, for whatever reason, to answer certain questions make sure to communicate that before hand with gaming journalists so there aren't any awkward or dead sections to the interviews. Though those instances make up only small portions of some interviews, they can still leave people wondering why you're even there if you're not answering questions. Again, this is a trade show and you want to convince people that your product is for them so please prepare yourself now for some pre-interview prep time with the journalists at E3.

I appreciate that @MikeTheMutinous has taken the time to address the community and many of his posts clearly define Rare's intent. Though with his last one, The World of Sea of Thieves (and an NPC’s place in it), I was left feeling that I'd already heard a lot of this before. I also felt like I'd just got a sales pitch from an insurance salesman where everything mentioned was rather nebulous and I wasn't going to get a clear picture unless or until I purchased the product I was asking about. I'd also say I was "Dr. Jay'd" but since that's a completely personal reference to a college professor of mine it would hold no meaning. I and others have asked: "What is Sea of Thieves?" Though Rare has attempted to answer that I think it's time to expand upon and clarify that question. When will we see what Sea of Thieves is? I'm hoping E3 2017 is the place that question is answered. Preferably by answering much of the following.

• Without NPC ships to raid or escort or trade with. How am I to be the pirate I want to be?
• With this game "being on the edge of civilization" and settlements reduced to mere "outposts" with minimal NPCs. How am I to be the pirate I want to be?
• How am I to be a privateer if there are no large towns/ports/forts to house government or mercantile factions that can be sided with or reaved upon?
• How populated will each server be?
• What hostile NPCs are there beyond skeletons and the as yet unseen kraken?
• What governmental factions will we encounter (perhaps the stalwart minotaurs of the Moohoovian Republics)?
• What mercantile factions will be included (perchance the silver tongued merchants of the Spring Lily Trading Company)?
• What aboriginal factions will we come across (shall we be waylaid by the little blighters that make up the tribes of the Neatite Bushmen)?
• What are the plans for factions?
• What ship customizations, cosmetic and functional, will be available?
• What weapon customizations, cosmetic and functional, will be available?
• What character customizations, cosmetic and functional, will be available?
• What will character creation entail?
• How will the economy of the game work?
• Will inter-player trading be allowed?
• How will personal and ship inventory management work?
• Is there to be an auction house or any sort of easy trading market?
• How will NPCs help facilitate trading (among other game features)?
• What crafting will be possible: weapons, clothing, food, equipment?
• How are ships purchased and upgraded?
• How many ship types are there to be?
• What is there to do beyond treasure hunting?
• What quests/activities are there to equally fulfill PvE and PvP motivations?
• How are PvE players to feel welcomed to a game that has so consistently shown itself to be PvP centric with an attack on sight mentality (what was that about not wanting A.I. because of their predictability)?
• What are the long term goals for this game?
• How often will players be yanked out of the game world to interact with third party software to accomplish some action in game (Voice chat, group finding, etcetera)? Conversely, what will be done to minimize players being taken out of the game to accomplish certain actions?

EDIT: Added questions about factions.

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@Daimyo-DoriMa said in E3 2017 Sea of Thieves - Pros and Cons:

@Soulless-Rager

Well, my enthusiasm for the game pretty much tanked during E3. @JoeNineTee mentioned a time or two how people were wondering what Sea of Thieves was so Rare figured they'd show people what it was. The problem with that is they chose to show the same stuff they've been showing since E3 2015: skeletons, treasure hunting and ship versus ship combat. I'm sure those things are fun but they're not enough to keep a good population of players coming back time and time again for years to come. There's no depth to it. As it stands this is a twenty dollar game - at best. One that, for my money, is out done by a singleplayer scifi game called Rebel Galaxy that was put out by a development studio consisting of two guys. Not a development studio with two hundred or so employees.

What made it worse was when @MikeTheMutinous said: "We believe that Sea of Thieves is the pirate game that you've always wanted." How can that be so when they've clearly stated that NPC ships won't be in the game, nor were they ever considered? How can this be the pirate game I've always wanted when there are no merchantmen or treasure ships to capture? Where are the bustling towns, ports and forts to reave or visit? Where are the factions to work with or against? Where is the player versus environment gameplay that truly captures the quintessential pirate experience for those of us who look to actual pirates and not romanticized works of fiction?

Compounding all this was yet another bit from Joe during his GameSpot interview. I'll paraphrase what he said. Is there going to be any game that's going after the same thing as Rare? Rich shared world, players all with different goals, with the rich feature set and unexpected encounters within a world. Also a massive success with streamers. To this he said he's yet to see that under any theme. Funny thing is, the first game that popped into my mind and the minds of other PC gamers I mentioned this to was Star Citizen. It's hands down the richer experience of the two. Not to mention far and away superior in sharing what the game is to be.

Rare obviously believes they have something amazing here. But I'm not seeing it. All I'm seeing is two years of hopes slowly dashed as Rare shows the same things over and over. I'm thinking it's reached that point where I need to spend far less time hanging around the forums. It's just becoming too frustrating not knowing what this game actually has to offer - assuming it's to be anything beyond what they've thrice shown at E3. Less time spent around the forums might also help me maintain a little bit of hope that Sea of Thieves can still deliver some semblance of a proper pirate experience for me.

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“The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, but expecting different results”

I still can't decide whether that quote is better suited to Rare or to me. Rare for continuing to show the same game loop/content: treasure hunting, skeletons, and ship versus ship combat for over two and a half years. Or me for pointing out the lack of content and expecting Rare to actually fill the community in on what their product contains.