3 necessary changes to combat encounters to prevent exploitation

Perhaps it could be good to bar ships from being in the circle if they are opted in already or joining if they are already in the circle, but people just doing quests getting barred from entering could be annoying if there is a battle going on around the island that their quest is at.

@gallerine5582

1. There's only one Tall Tale that could provide anything remotely exploity or unfair, and that tale is already blocked from use with the hourglass.
   All other talls either do nothing or impact both ships equally, making them fair. Defenders should be allowed to do Tall Tales while queued as defender if they want to.

2. No, it doesn't and shouldn't.
   First of all, if a player just happens to be nearby when someone gets invaded, the obviously shouldn't suddenly find their ship to be in red sea while they're just trying to do whatever pve thing they were trying to do.
   Besides that, arbitrary ships on a server should absolutely be able to sail upon and partake in an ongoing faction war fight. Plus Rare has already plainly stated they want that to be possible.

When you use the hourglass and the war map, you are not opting in to a totally fair 1v1 crew vs crew fight. You are opting in to having your ship relocated near another ship, to save you the time and effort of having to find targets manually, while remaining fully subject to anything and everything adventure offers. Including the other 4 ships on the server.

Tall tales need to be locked off when representing a faction.

The PvP is an "Invasion" an attack on players who are part of the same war but not looking for a fight, but welcome them.
I will admit a few TT should be locked off but not all of them. But again, your invading an Open World.
You should also say the same while doing Forts & Fortress, the things that shoot cannon balls at you...and Fleets.

The fighting arena needs to be an "off-limits" zone for other crews not involved in the duel.

Same as Above. Your invading someone, what if you invade someone who was in the mist of attacking someone not using the hourglass, just random ship?

The fighting arena needs to shrink over time

So what happens when the circle shrinks down so small, it destroys both ships? or destroys one? I dont like to feel I won because of out of bounds.

@hxr141 said in 3 necessary changes to combat encounters to prevent exploitation:

Completely agree with the 1st and 3rd but the second point is unnecessary and impractical.

I suggest the second one with the mindset that it is necessary because of things like this:

Personally I'm with Ambrossa, there is no reason that 3 ships should be able to just sit there, gang up, and ALL receive rewards from it.

@the-old-soul800 said in 3 necessary changes to combat encounters to prevent exploitation:

@gallerine5582

1. There's only one Tall Tale that could provide anything remotely exploity or unfair, and that tale is already blocked from use with the hourglass.
   All other talls either do nothing or impact both ships equally, making them fair. Defenders should be allowed to do Tall Tales while queued as defender if they want to.

Clearly, that tall tale that affects gameplay has NOT been actually blocked from use, because I've seen many screenshots of people abusing it. It needs to be fixed, and on what planet would someone want to be playing the storyline of the game and be defending? Blocking all would be easier, but blocking TT9 is absolutely necessary.

2. No, it doesn't and shouldn't.
   First of all, if a player just happens to be nearby when someone gets invaded, the obviously shouldn't suddenly find their ship to be in red sea while they're just trying to do whatever pve thing they were trying to do.

While I can understand that, it's also actively allowing alliance servers or whatnot just bully crews who were on a hot streak or something, expecting a fair and even fight. This video on Twitter is a prime example of this. It's a tough choice but personally, I think that something like what the video has displayed is scummy and unacceptable. If it was agreed upon for a 3v3 fight I could understand but this "strategy" is just sad to see honestly. Maybe

Agree with banning tall tales while using the hour glass, no to 2 and 3.

This is adventure, not a 1v1 only match. If I'm on my ship and see 2 ships fighting out, why shouldn't I be allowed to join in, that's potentially 2 emissary flags I could net and if I vote on the hourglass to be passive, a bunch of allegiance. This is still a pirate game, opportunity to gain from another's weak position should always be present.

With regards to point 3, on a sloop it's possibly easy enough to move your ship to respond to a shrinking red sea, this is going to be a pain on the Galleon and imagine having the advantage in a long battle but the shrinking circle negates your advantage causing you to lose. You'd be beyond annoyed.
Forcing a closing circle is just going to encourage even more this dull boarding meta rather than naval.

@burnbacon said in 3 necessary changes to combat encounters to prevent exploitation:

Tall tales need to be locked off when representing a faction.

The PvP is an "Invasion" an attack on players who are part of the same war but not looking for a fight, but welcome them.
I will admit a few TT should be locked off but not all of them. But again, your invading an Open World.

Just locking off all is easier to say probably but at bare minimum they should be locking off the one that is causing issues.

You should also say the same while doing Forts & Fortress, the things that shoot cannon balls at you...and Fleets.

The difference is, these are naturally occurring things not actively voted on, in a situation like that, it comes down to "that's unlucky but it is what it is", for the exploit I have in mind, it is not at all "it is what it is", because it is 100% deliberate and being used to force an enemy to either out-wait the exploiter, or leave.

The fighting arena needs to be an "off-limits" zone for other crews not involved in the duel.

Same as Above. Your invading someone, what if you invade someone who was in the mist of attacking someone not using the hourglass, just random ship?

While that is an issue it's also a big concern seeing people alliance with 2 other ships as this Twitter video displays. There is no reason this should be allowed, they know damn well what they are doing.

The fighting arena needs to shrink over time

So what happens when the circle shrinks down so small, it destroys both ships? or destroys one? I dont like to feel I won because of out of bounds.

I doubt at any point it will come down to the point that they're sitting right next to each other and not sinking, but theoretically, just deal damage over time to both ships.

Agree with all three points. I think I know exactly which TT you're talking about too which is a really bad look if people are doing that. Making the ring shrink over time is also a good solution to the problem of blocking off a portion of the map for some time. Makes the fight more intense as well as encourages bolder strategies to end engagements quicker.

TT9 is blocked, but this is Sea of Bugs. A few people have been able to activate it when they shouldn’t. If you see this, report it to rare. I’ve already reported to them how to recreate the conditions that allow it to happen and I hope it will be a quick fix. But they did block it before the season came out, that block just isn’t working 100%.

They also specifically said they wanted people to be able to third party. Allowing that opens up the unfortunate possibility to team up one a single invader. This should absolutely not be allowed, but how do they allow natural third party interaction while still blocking people from cheesing it?

I also think that the ring should start shrinking after a certain time period. I don’t see it getting to the point it has closed on both ships. One of those crews is going to be more level headed and figure out how to survive. Alternatively it could stop shrinking at a certain point, where you have just enough room to still circle one another but not run.

@gallerine5582 said in 3 necessary changes to combat encounters to prevent exploitation:

@the-old-soul800 said in 3 necessary changes to combat encounters to prevent exploitation:

@gallerine5582

1. There's only one Tall Tale that could provide anything remotely exploity or unfair, and that tale is already blocked from use with the hourglass.
   All other talls either do nothing or impact both ships equally, making them fair. Defenders should be allowed to do Tall Tales while queued as defender if they want to.

Clearly, that tall tale that affects gameplay has NOT been actually blocked from use, because I've seen many screenshots of people abusing it. It needs to be fixed, and on what planet would someone want to be playing the storyline of the game and be defending? Blocking all would be easier, but blocking TT9 is absolutely necessary.

2. No, it doesn't and shouldn't.
   First of all, if a player just happens to be nearby when someone gets invaded, the obviously shouldn't suddenly find their ship to be in red sea while they're just trying to do whatever pve thing they were trying to do.

While I can understand that, it's also actively allowing alliance servers or whatnot just bully crews who were on a hot streak or something, expecting a fair and even fight. This video on Twitter is a prime example of this. It's a tough choice but personally, I think that something like what the video has displayed is scummy and unacceptable. If it was agreed upon for a 3v3 fight I could understand but this "strategy" is just sad to see honestly. Maybe

TT9, Shores of Gold, is blocked. It's not possible to have both the shroudbreaker and the hourglass at the same time.

Actively allowing alliances to gang up on invaders is intentional, allowed, and is not itself an exploit.
As I already said but you cut out of the quote:

arbitrary ships on a server should absolutely be able to sail upon and partake in an ongoing faction war fight. Plus Rare has already plainly stated they want that to be possible.
When you use the hourglass and the war map, you are not opting in to a totally fair 1v1 crew vs crew fight. You are opting in to having your ship relocated near another ship, to save you the time and effort of having to find targets manually, while remaining fully subject to anything and everything adventure offers. Including the other 4 ships on the server.

@abjectarity said in 3 necessary changes to combat encounters to prevent exploitation:

TT9 is blocked, but this is Sea of Bugs. A few people have been able to activate it when they shouldn’t. If you see this, report it to rare. I’ve already reported to them how to recreate the conditions that allow it to happen and I hope it will be a quick fix. But they did block it before the season came out, that block just isn’t working 100%.

Ah good to know, thank you, people were saying certain things were blocked but knowing it's bugged is helpful at least.

They also specifically said they wanted people to be able to third party. Allowing that opens up the unfortunate possibility to team up one a single invader. This should absolutely not be allowed, but how do they allow natural third party interaction while still blocking people from cheesing it?

Yeah honestly when I was making the post I didn't really consider natural third party encounters. Personally, I think it's a worthy sacrifice, but then again that's why I don't have say over what changes in the game. I reckon with a generally smaller area to fight in would be alright, or just make it so ships already in the zone have limited use of things or something...? I dunno it's a tough thing to balance, but it's just so scummy seeing alliance servers already abuse this system.

I also think that the ring should start shrinking after a certain time period. I don’t see it getting to the point it has closed on both ships. One of those crews is going to be more level headed and figure out how to survive. Alternatively it could stop shrinking at a certain point, where you have just enough room to still circle one another but not run.

yeah the chance that it's fully closed is very unlikely. Forcing them within cannon range but not closing entirely would be the better option, I agree