Griefing has put me off the game for good

Avast ye scurvy dogs, Zevaryian is on deck!

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Reading through this thread, man, has slightly put a damper on my night. Personally speaking, I love to go through the suggestions people post for the game, and 9/10 times, I'm just left with the though of, "That was actually pretty nifty."

This post, though. This one has left me sad. Even though, yea, I can agree the greifing can get out of hands and hooks sometimes, I don't believe we should let the players who are trying to hold this community together be pushed apart by a toxic behavior.

This goes beyond 'being mad because people play differently', or 'whining because you were sunk'.

I constantly hear or read people saying, "It Sea of Thieves". Yea, thanks, that's the title. It's a pirate game, but you know what most people don't know about? Pirates.

Pirates were a very democratic society, often spending any time on shore amongst the crew they sailed with or the commune they called home, like Port de Rocher on Tortuga and The Brethren Of The Coast. Pirates still had standards, and more often than not, shared the belief of 'Honor amongst thieves'.

For example, The Brethren Of The Coast was one of the most notorious Pirate Communities, and you wanna know what they did most of the time? Free slaves, recruit the freed slaves, and stole supplies for their home and crews. Pirates didn't just go around slaughtering people just for fun, that's serial killers. We have Friday the 13th for that.

Personally speaking, I believe that we as the Sea of Thieves community should hold ourselves to the same standards, showing honor amongst us. Though we may disagree, and though we may both have valid points, it's still better to seek to understand why people are wanting these changes. And the reason they want theses changes? Griefers.

Spawn killing, and essentially preventing the other person from even playing the game, is inherently bad sportsmanship. If you're keeping them from progressing, then you're a greifer.

I would like to clarify, though, that if you steal someone's loot, either while they're not watching or by sinking them, you're still giving them a chance to farm more loot or try to kill you for their loot back. Spawn killing? Yea, kinda prevents any fighting back, so essentially preventing others from playing.

Now for the toxic chat? That's something that should definitely not be tolerated. Sure, I know my mom is fat, but I don't need to have some random 13 year old repeatedly tell me that while spawn killing me and saying how he'd do explicit things to her. You see the difference?

The line between greifing and PvP is pretty darn clear, and with that being said, I'd like to just take one last moment to touch on the main subject of this thread: PvE Servers.

Now, I don't necessarily believe a PvE mode should be needed, however I can understand the reasoning why people would want such a thing. I've posted another thread, not about a different game mode, but rather a safe haven where you could play the game unimpeded by PvP if you so chose, however, the dedication of an entirely different game mode may be a bit much. Though, again, I do wish to say that I recognize that greifing is still a problem that needs to be addressed. Maybe a PvE server is the way, maybe only safe zones, and maybe nothing at all. I suppose only time will tell.

@knut-skallagrim You do realise that those same server's you talk about as being an indication that there is nothing wrong with PvE only servers, as the same ones that the Developers and Joe has said is not in the spirit of the game and is something they are looking to prevent.

So how is it an indication that it is allowed or should be done?

@knut-skallagrim hahahaha that you are right, but you also seem to be omitting the fact it was for content creators, and is speculated to have no progression.

But if you watched the Dev updates last year, you would know how he feels about the farming servers. I am currently trying to remember which one it was in to link it for you.

@badassfro I would personally love to hear what the devs or community managers have to say on farming servers if you're still looking for that link!

Something that has fascinated me since I stumbled upon one was farming/alliance servers. While they're actually fairly common now, often times they tend to be full since most people (I know) are trying to make money without being interrupted. I personally love the idea of being able to have the entire server working together, however, as I've said previously, this could be viewed as a form of, and I say this loosely, 'griefing'. Given that I mentioned preventing others from playing the game is (in my opinion) considered greifing, I suppose that taking over a server so you and others can farm unhindered could technically be looked at as preventing others (more pvp eccentric players) from being able to fully play the game. Then again, chances are that the pvp players might just end up on a server by themselves instead and fully enjoy their time while the pve players enjoy theirs!

I suppose it just depends on your perspective :D

@capn-jack-5000

PvP opt out is and never should be the solution. It would not make the seas more friendly, it will make them more hostile to the unplayable where one has to choose at the menu and as a result destroy the PvEvP environment.

Also, I sail alone a lot.. yeah there some people that just head straight at you, yet if you spotted them on time you can either just out sail them, battle it out or use more creative solutions to handle them.

My honest opinion is that you are not willing to accept the fact that a session is not set is stone and that this is a shared world. You expect to set out with a goal and that it will go as you planned, the success is based on whether you hit the original goal... yet that is not how shared, open world games function. Everyone has a say in the world, plans and goals might need to change, it is about the unpredictable nature of it all. Take a step back, adapt to the situation and respond to these hyper aggressive players according to your preferences, play on your terms and enjoy.

My personal favorite way to deal with them is to sail around, avoid the combat they seek and move it to the open waters.

@capn-jack-5000

With the exception of Tall Tales, all of the content Rare adds to this game, especially through the course of this year, has been specifically catered to fostering player interaction and bringing people together for encounters that can end out in battle or cooperation. Most of what they added would have no purpose and/or make no sense without the possibility of having other hostile players around.

I'm an adult too, I don't have unlimited time to play either. It's hard to get my main crew together because they are also adults who work 40 hours a week, have other responsibilities, and games they want to play just like me.

We've had nights where the tides were not in our favor, and we didn't really get much done in the way of progression. We still had fun because we were in the world of Sea of Thieves together, and we had fun while gathering up the things that we eventually lost. It's called "laughing it off" because it's just a game, and games are meant to be fun. Losing is part of the fun.

Some people will never be happy until they have a total safety net from losing... For Rare to accommodate that would just be terrible game design. The game is working as intended. Let's not suggest things like PvE servers or PvP-opt-out that would ruin the game simply because players seem to only think a game is fun when they're winning.

@lepr3chaun420

@nabberwar what times are you playing? Also what ship I’m guessing the brig, or gal. ?

Whatever ship meets the crew quantity that night of the regulars I sail with. However, regardless of ships size the sentiment is the same. We are ignored by everyone, no one seems to want to attack, so unfortunately I can't relate to any of these types of posts. Too many people want to sit here and talk about this non-stop action, yet most of their stories start the same, "I lost 3/4/5 hours of work by big meanies, we need PvE servers!" These statements are self contradicting, can't have non-stop action yet have 3/4/5 hours of uninterrupted game-play.

See your the good type of pvp’er actually use the flag.

Small Addendum, I meant to say Reapers chests earlier. We do use the flag every once in a while, but its more of trying different things. For some people in this game, ship size and Reaper's flag causes deterrence, we don't want that. We attack everyone we can catch. Some odd situations, but we actively enjoy the piracy. Someone on another thread said that real pirates mostly stole supplies, so we now drain supplies. People like to throw insults when that happens, but if we are feeling snarky, we just tell them that's what real pirates steal.

I don’t get how ppl must keep on , and god help you if you kill them then they keep on and on ... There excuses is to ruin my night..

I love it when they return, had a ship we drained and left on fire decide that we needed a lesson. Lesson failed to reach us all 3 times after that initial encounter. I can't relate to comments about "ruining my night," I don't consider it possible to ruins someone's night by playing the game in a normal capacity. I try not to hinge my fun I have in the game on whether I succeed in my goals that night. If you had fun all the way up to the end, its not as if that fun didn't magically go away just because of failure.

@capn-jack-5000 said in Griefing has put me off the game for good:

@opticdash I love how half of the responders here insist that this is either not your true experience, or entirely your fault. Not a good look for the community to blame the victim, in my opinion.

You're not a victim, you're in the spirit of the game. Sometimes you win some, sometimes you lose some. Some days you go without anyone attacking, other days it seems like everyone's after you.

If you see the ship first with your naked eyes...its too late, they’re already on you.

Thats why your trusty spyglass can save your ship if you use it often.

@zevaryian

"It Sea of Thieves". Yea, thanks, that's the title. It's a pirate game, but you know what most people don't know about? Pirates.

I'm not going to quote it all, but essentially you want people to act like real pirates am I right?

Pirates were a very democratic society, often spending any time on shore amongst the crew they sailed with or the commune they called home, like Port de Rocher on Tortuga and The Brethren Of The Coast. Pirates still had standards, and more often than not, shared the belief of 'Honor amongst thieves'.

Here is the caveat, we are not all the same crew, every ship we come across is a whole different crew. We don't even share a port. We are all crews that entered the shroud, not started their. So in a sense everyone is fair game. I would also argue, that Piracy by definition is theft at sea, if someone is the PvE type, they aren't a Pirates. If you aren't stealing you aren't meeting the minumum requirement to call yourself a Pirate. They are Merchants, maybe one could argue smugglers, but certainly not Pirates. So every PvE player I come across is me doing the only possible avenue of fulfiling my duty as a Pirate in this game, robbing merchants at sea.

For example, The Brethren Of The Coast was one of the most notorious Pirate Communities, and you wanna know what they did most of the time? Free slaves, recruit the freed slaves, and stole supplies for their home and crews. Pirates didn't just go around slaughtering people just for fun, that's serial killers. We have Friday the 13th for that.

So if I want to be a true blue Pirate, I need to be stealing supplies as well and leaving them alive? Great! I do that already, not a single banana, plank, or heavy iron ball is left after I am done.

Spawn killing, and essentially preventing the other person from even playing the game, is inherently bad sportsmanship. If you're keeping them from progressing, then you're a greifer.

No crew will allow me to just casually steal from them, plus they respawn. How am I supposed to be a real Pirate if I can't steal their supplies?

I would like to clarify, though, that if you steal someone's loot, either while they're not watching or by sinking them, you're still giving them a chance to farm more loot or try to kill you for their loot back. Spawn killing? Yea, kinda prevents any fighting back, so essentially preventing others from playing.

Now you are just contradicting yourself, I'm supposed to be a Pirate, but now I am not supposed to be one?

Now for the toxic chat? That's something that should definitely not be tolerated. Sure, I know my mom is fat, but I don't need to have some random 13 year old repeatedly tell me that while spawn killing me and saying how he'd do explicit things to her. You see the difference?

Mute and report, its that simple.

Maybe a PvE server is the way, maybe only safe zones, and maybe nothing at all. I suppose only time will tell.

PvE servers essentially remove all Pirates in the game, if you aren't stealing, you aren't a Pirate. Maybe we should call this mode Merchant Mode?

@capn-jack-5000 If a crew boards "your ship" it is not YOUR ship anymore.

You can always scuttle.

In fact looting ships is the fastest way to stock on provisions, everything else takes too much time. The problem is people will try to fight you till the very end, so you have to loot, kill, loot some more.

Scuttle. That's why the option is there. Once you can't spawn anymore, it's not your ship. You aren't entitled to anything in the game except for your loadout and gold/dobloons. What you dig or find or steal is YOURS after you cash it in, before getting the gold off the vendor, it is fair game.

@nabberwar To address the few things you've brought up in regards to my previous post:

• A Pirate, yes, is by definition some who commits acts of piracy. While piracy is defined as robbery at high sea, it's also defined as simple acts resembling robbery. What you're saying is that you're not a Pirate unless you loot, kill, and loot some more. So, Merchant's Alliance aside, are we to say digging up another pirate's buried treasure and making off with it isn't robbery? Smashing a skeleton and taking their skull, which was probably not willingly given, couldn't possibly resemble robbery? Not to argue, rather just a friendly debate, I just think that there may be a side to this you might not have considered.

• As for the entire thing of stealing from other players without spawn killing? There are other ways you can steal supplies, even on hostile ships. Tucking on Galleons or Brigs, even sneaking into Sloops while they're parked at an island! There's plenty of ways that don't involve relinquishing their chance to fight back.

• Also, the main issue I had originally intended to address, and probably could've clarified further, was the briefing and needless spawn killing. Mainly, to speak on the times when there isn't any loot, when you're trying to do a Tall Tale, or when people are just doing to just do it. Or, after they've taken your loot, and they refuse to sink you just so they can get away while spawn killing you. That's just too far, man. Can you at least see where I'm trying to come from? I can get your point, I really can, but the unnecessary use of spawn killing to manipulate whether an enemy has a chance to fight back/play/do anything other than leave the game or sit on the ferry, that's kinda the thing that's more than a bit rude. At least in my personal opinion. Again, while scuttling is an option, it doesn't mean the behavior it was trying to address should still keep happening. I'm just saying, in my personal opinion.

• Lastly, for the comment you made about what I said in regards to toxic chat, I would hope that simple solution would be the first choice to come to mind for any player. I had assumed that would have been a given, thus I didn't bother to outline the reporting and blocking process. My apologies for the lack of explanation.

• This is a bit of a last second thing, but by the way, a Merchant's Mode honestly wouldn't be a bad idea.

Anywhoozle, boy-o that one was a bit long for me to type on my phone! But I'm still looking forward to some more friendly and constructive conversation! I think you had some valid points, but as I mentioned before, I think there may be a side to this you might not have considered. It's just something to think on :D

@zevaryian

What you're saying is that you're not a Pirate unless you loot, kill, and loot some more.

Not quite, I never specified killing, but the reality of it, is no one is going to simple let you sail up and take their stuff. I am being pragmatic.

So, Merchant's Alliance aside, are we to say digging up another pirate's buried treasure and making off with it isn't robbery?

I would say no, its reclamation of property no longer belonging to anyone. If its the skeletons, they have been long dead. All jobs are given and distributed by the Gold Hoarders group. This is essentially guild issued reclamation work. One could argue we are acting within some laws when they issue these.

Smashing a skeleton and taking their skull, which was probably not willingly given, couldn't possibly resemble robbery?

I would also say no, this is bounty work. Specifically bounty work with potential criminals/ threats to living kind. Skull is just proof of kill, this is no different than medieval times when they brought the head in for bounty claiming.

As for the entire thing of stealing from other players without spawn killing? There are other ways you can steal supplies, even on hostile ships. Tucking on Galleons or Brigs, even sneaking into Sloops while they're parked at an island! There's plenty of ways that don't involve relinquishing their chance to fight back.

Completely impractical, when you get experienced enough, this game stops being a stealth game. Its been over a year since our ship has had a successful stow-away. Boats are obvious when coming on the horizon, and mermaids always prove the presence of players.

Mainly, to speak on the times when there isn't any loot, when you're trying to do a Tall Tale, or when people are just doing to just do it.

Or, after they've taken your loot, and they refuse to sink you just so they can get away while spawn killing you. That's just too far, man.

Their is still supplies to take though, while not all spawn camp for this reason, scuttle option always exists. Tall Tale players can also hide/stash items on shore if they think they will get caught. Their is no shame in scuttling the ship. I play the same game as everyone else here, those complaining included. I can quite easily relate, I just don't see a need to do anything. If I lose a Tall Tale item, I just go oh well. Losing loot isn't a big deal for me. Quite frankly, many people need to just relax in this game. They take it way too seriously, its just a game.

This is a bit of a last second thing, but by the way, a Merchant's Mode honestly wouldn't be a bad idea.

I'd disagree, but frankly I'm not going to get into it. If you buy a PvEvP game, expect a PvEvP game. I don't buy COD and expect it to cater to my love of puzzles by adding puzzles if I beg enough.

@knut-skallagrim said in Griefing has put me off the game for good:

@badassfro if you google private servers and Joe sea of thieves you’ll see that they are actually looking into a way to do them so i don’t really know what you are talking about

yeah but pretty sure if they do put in private servers it will not include character progression, it will be more for games people invent, such as that popular spy game.

Making farming private servers would destroy the game

@zevaryian I honestly think the reason why there is more griefing and they aren't even taking your loot is because almost everyone is a pirate legend now. There is nothing to do for pirate legends other than athena voyages that are extremely repetitive and boring. If the dev's added more features for us to achieve towards then we wouldn't feel the need to grief people because we would actually have something better to do.

I hardly ever get griefed.
I actually find the forums more toxic than the game itself.

As for gameplay, i rarely get ambushed.
I know how to escape ships with relative ease.

I enjoy this aspect of the game, it creates tension and id hate to see this game without that element of risk to it.

@ultmateragnarok said in Griefing has put me off the game for good:

@crescenttide

The developers tried safe zones once, it didn't go well. People would sit outside of the zones and camp, or lob cannon rounds into it. They would steal treasure and commandeer boats with no way to stop them, as they could not be killed. They would set off gunpowder kegs and run ships aground or into one another, sinking them. People would run to there instead of risk attempting fighting or out-sailing their opponents. It was detrimental to the game, heavily, and as such was never implimented.

Thats exactly what i’d do.
I would grief the players more to force rare to take the safe zones away.
Those guys were heroes 😂😂

Im very anti-make-the-game-less-pvp 😂

I never knew that happened though, thats hilarious haha 😂😂😊