The Hostility on the Seas...

@d42striker It would be interesting to know if you get different results once the "Speaking Trumpet" is a thing and you can broadcast your intent from further away.

Most people are hostile because they've been burnt so many times.

Sloops are the absolute worst.

All I am trying to do is get my merchant missions up but almost every sloop I come across is trying to sink me.
So tired of it all now. Three hour stints to get all my animals killed or drowned, and now with super aggressive sharks I have an even tougher job rescuing anything.

It's pretty tiredsome to be honest but it's fine, soon I'll be a pirate legend and move to SAS mode. Sink All Sloops.

@d42striker

That's why for some...

we run the don't fire unless fired upon tactic as well, with the clear exception of strongholds.
If you're at a stronghold, we will open fire.

At the same time we run a strict "until hell and back.... twice" mentality.
You shoot as us? Fine... we'll hunt you down. We will board you, we will repair your ship and we will keep it afloat and spawncamp you until you scuttle.

@lefaux2 said in The Hostility on the Seas...:

we run the don't fire unless fired upon tactic as well, with the clear exception of strongholds.
If you're at a stronghold, we will open fire.

At the same time we run a strict "until hell and back.... twice" mentality.
You shoot as us? Fine... we'll hunt you down. We will board you, we will repair your ship and we will keep it afloat and spawncamp you until you scuttle.

Proud griefers. Nice.

What on earth has happened to this game. What a shambles.

@vexed-anemone said in The Hostility on the Seas...:

Proud griefers. Nice.

There is a difference between handing out a warning and being proud of doing something.
Here's the thing: you try to ruin our day? That's fine, the game allows you to try.
We didn't start it, but we will sure as hell finish it.
In fact, half of our ingame communication consists of stating our intentions loud and clear. If you mess with us, you knew what you were getting into.

Sidenote: Once the next update hits, we will adjust this tactic to only force a scuttle if somebody is flying false flags (like parlaying and then trying to kill us off).

Because what else can you do... the game mechanics need to be added, maybe the flags would do something, but I doubt it... there has to be something where their is a reward for allying with another ship

@jonavuka said in The Hostility on the Seas...:

there has to be something where their is a reward for allying with another ship

When slooping a contested stronghold we always try to pair up with another sloop and then equally divide the plunder afterwards.
4 people clear a stronghold fast enough that the time saved feels like equalling out.

@lefaux2 no I'm talking IN game mechanics, that's sorted out by the players

Actually now that I think about it the flag system could work. Maybe you can have if you have the same flag up as another ship than you guys are allies and you can only change your flag every 10 minutes so not to have insta flag changing. Their is the rogue flag (the one with skulls and bones) so the ship won't and can't ally (even if two ships use that same flag)

@jonavuka said in The Hostility on the Seas...:

Actually now that I think about it the flag system could work. Maybe you can have if you have the same flag up as another ship than you guys are allies and you can only change your flag every 10 minutes so not to have insta flag changing. Their is the rogue flag (the one with skulls and bones) so the ship won't and can't ally (even if two ships use that same flag)

yeah, let's wait until tomorrow when the flags are implemented (it's tomorrow, right?).
The flag-change cooldown would indeed be very helpful, but I doubt RARE will implement it because it offers too much room for abuse.
Think some random crewmate just raises the jolly roger and you're in for fights - whether you like it or not.
But RARE could implement the voting mechanism for that...

@jonavuka
Good suggestion but I have tried something similar but got shot down by the fanboy club. Unless they use these flags in a way such as you suggest, the flags will be nothing more than more decoration to go with your sails.

@Lefaux2

Repairing and staying on someones boat, then spawn killing them until they scuttle is not finishing it, it's griefing.

Sinking their boat so they have to spawn elsewhere is finishing it.

I as well have good luck with players being friendly, It's all about the approach. If you drive straight at them it will scare them so do it with an instrument in hand. I think with HD and the new flags it will be better for immersive players, You can't really count the CODKiddies that play this game, They will attack anything.

@vexed-anemone said in The Hostility on the Seas...:

Staying on someones boat and spawn killing them until they scuttle is not finishing it. it's griefing.

Ok, that's fair.
What would you suggest how to go about the learning effect.
Sinking a crew that started a fight with a friendly vessel results in "ok, so we lost one fight, no biggy".
How would you achieve that they won't do it the next time?

@lefaux2

I don't think you can, unless you use a mic, which is a tactic I'm happy you take.

If you force scuttle, they're just as likely to attack again and be really salty about it.
If you sink them, they're as likely to say, don't mess with them as they are about getting revenge.

You're probably more likely to force them off the server using your tactic but perhaps also force them away from the game. Which, by the way the game is going, is definitely not the lesser of two evils.

@d42striker Its a pvp game, sure some people are dicks, but probaly most of them tried to sink you because they think that you are scheming to sink them!

To be honest i think your experiment is a bit pointless, this game is a pvp game, people are meant to fight and you can't blame them for those reactions. Furthermore its a pirate game, if you came up to a pirate ship and said that you have free loot they would say thank you and shoot you in the face and then proceed to aliviate you from your burdens. As the old pirate saying goes: "its easier to search dead bodies"

I think what you should look for and chase the devs about is a sort of non-combat action. Imagine a white flag that if you wave you can't fire the guns unless you have been fired upon. In this case when you approach those ships they can be 100% sure that you are not going to attack them.

Now I would still shoot you. not beacuse i am a d**k or i want to harras you but because this is a PVP pirate game and I play it the way the devs have designed it to be. I won't to out of my way to intentionally harm you or grief you in any way. but the way i see things is that i am a pirate and that all other ships out there are bounty ready for the taking. If this mentality upsets you, then I fear you might have chosen the wrong game.

@vexed-anemone said in The Hostility on the Seas...:

If you force scuttle, they're just as likely to attack again and be really salty about it.

I'm 99.99% sure that scuttling enforces a server change.
That's why we do it in the first place.
If that info is inaccurate, we will need to adjust our neighborhood-watch tactic.

...but perhaps also force them away from the game. Which, by the way the game is going, is definitely not the lesser of two evils.

I need to interpret something you said now, so please accept my apologies if I misinterpreted you here:
Your point is that driving players (that ruin the game for others) away from the game is worse than people quitting the game because they don't enjoy it?
I'm not trying to make my point yet, I just want to establish a baseline so I am sure we're talking about the same thing :)

P.S. hey, I honestly appreciate the time you take here discussing the topic.

The reson for most of the hostility is that when they get you with your pants down, you start with a massive disadvantage and cannonballs can reach you way sooner than other captain's voice. It's always confusing when we see another ship approaching (we generally don't attack other ships when we sail) and wonder if they are hostile or not. Almost every damn time we chose to let them come close, they fired uppon us at point-blank range.

If you want to approach another ship, you have to make them approach you. You sail towards them your nose against their side, so that your cannons are in no position to fire. Then you go half-sail and approach slowly. Current mechanics really make people wary of strangers, there's nothing strange about the "fire first, ask questions never" attitude I'm seeing.

Just wanted to give a quick reply. Me and my crew mates always try and get people to come together and we usually get a few sloops and a galleon. I think the problem with you is that your in a solo sloop aka an easy target. The guys that didn’t want to be friends we ether snack or they ran away

@dustlessboot said in The Hostility on the Seas...:

Now I would still shoot you. not beacuse i am a d**k or i want to harras you but because this is a PVP pirate game and I play it the way the devs have designed it to be.

Just to define a clear baseline here:
If the game was designed to shoot others on sight, the cannons would fire on their own ;-)
So I think we can agree that it's still your decision to fire, right? :)

I won't to out of my way to intentionally harm you or grief you in any way. but the way i see things is that i am a pirate and that all other ships out there are bounty ready for the taking.

Which is fair.
I hope the flag system will bring some equalization to this.

I've found it to be a mixed bag as far as hostility is concerned. The previous comments regarding reasons for the hostility all resonate with me.

I tried and failed at my first attempt at the Banana challenge today. To be fair I should have used my mic instead of trying to do it silently like its creator did. lol in any case I'm always pleasantly surprised to find friendly pirates out there. However they always manage to get me to change my attitude to give the next player the benefit of the doubt if they don't shoot first.

This has had a 100% fail rate after meeting friendly pirates previously... Hilarious.

Anyway I can understand if people are apprehensive on the seas. You can strike it lucky on some days and only find journeyman or friendly pirates. Some days - all idiots.

I'm hoping that the flag system and trumpet help to lessen the unneccesary conflicts. The guy I tried the banana challenge with was obviously spooked when I approached his ship, even with banana in hand. Maybe either of the new tools could have helped.

There are numerous other situations where either of those tools may have made things a bit friendlier overall and intentions made clear.

I hope the flag system will bring some equalization to this.

Yeah, for the first five minutes before pirates start abusing it to get close without being fired uppon.

What might change the situation a little bit is the speaking trumpet. A bit, because it always comes down to how people handle the tools given to them.

What would actually help, but would definitely be a move I wouldn't advise, is either:

• Create PvE servers, where you can't shoot at other players or take anything from their ships etc. To balance things out cut the rewards you get from stuff there.
• Add something that changes with ships sunk in the last, let's say, 48 hours. Something you can actually spot, so that you instantly see the obvious dangers (doesn't mean you're safe by a longshot though). Something like a killcount flag.

Both options would work in their own way, but both are horrible.

There could be balancing changes, that would probably help as well. Like add armor to ships, so that if you didn't get hit or hit anything in the last ten minutes or so, the first shot (for the sloop) / couple of shots (for the galleon) doesn't do damage. It would make things slightly more difficult for sneaky pirates, but could help with the "Han shot first" problem.