Streamers Are Abusing Their Power

Aye. These be scary times.

Hopefully Rare still takes the time to investigate thoroughly those claims as well as any other claim, streamers aren't above the rules or more important than other players.

Even if a streamer asked all their viewers to report a gametag, surely it would look fishy to the support team to see thousands of reports coming in a the same time against a particular player.

@xultanis-dragon said in Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

@manbun-magic

Rare takes their time investigating.

I've been reported a few times for stream sniping already which never led to anything. There was a streaming whose lobby I was in one Arena match. Destroyed him 2 matches in a row. He leaves to a different lobby. My crew leaves so I join another one of LFG and guess whose in my lobby again lol.

He screamed stream sniping but I told him I got into his lobby by invite from a different crew. He wasn't having it, reported me, said he got all his viewers to report me as well.

Nothing ever happened from it.

I can't say for certain how my cases were handled or how things went down. Maybe they threated with reports but never did? Maybe they did report and Rare told them to go suck on an egg and to stop being such babies?? I don't know.

However one thing I do know is that Rare takes things seriously and they do their homework before smashing down with the hammer. They might have been overzealous a few times.....(while checking the bump on my head) but I want to at least believe they have tried to be unbiased and fair in their decisions.

Based on previous incidents, your thoughts on Rare "taking thing seriously and doing their homework" is not entirely accurate.

My problem is not with streamers filing reports, it's with streamers thinking it's ok to leverage social media to report players they feel are stream sniping and abusing their platform to pressure Rare staffers. Simple as that.

@manbun-magic I agree. If I worked at Rare and someone was using thier social media and streaming to publicly shame people and posting thier gamertags, I'd definitely ban that person from my game. That's straight up harrasment.

I saw the thread on Reddit.

That streamer talked trash just because she got sunk by other players. Arena has few servers and it's easy to coincide with renowned streamers. I myself did. So tell out someone for stream sniping in a game mode that push players to fight among them, is a serious issue to take it lightly.

@guilleont said in Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

That streamer talked trash just because she got sunk by other players. Arena has few servers and it's easy to coincide with renowned streamers.

We need PVE Arena servers, obviously. :)

Although I don't care much about streamers and the act they perform for whatever reason, I do believe that the issue @Manbun-Magic describes requires an official statement from RARE. But I have this feeling that this issue will be swept under the rug like they always do with concern from 'regular' players.

Coming from two decades of online gaming I can tell you this. It’s not what it used to be. Which is a shame as I thought with time it would only get better. The issue I see is the current age of players in gaming today are the I and Me types. They think everything revolves around them. There are a few dinosaurs like myself roaming around still but we are outnumbered.

Personally I think people watching people play is the most ridiculous thing ever. Watching people play a game when you can ply is crazy. The people who say, “well I’m not at home to play so that’s why I watch.” Then it sounds like your responsibilities are terrible and you should be working or paying attention in school or enjoying the time with who your out with.

From a business standpoint I can see why companies like streamers; it’s free publicity. However the companies should never bend their will to what a streamer wants. I’ve her people say “well you should listen to streamers since they keep your game getting noticed.” To those people I say that’s an Ignorant statement. Before a games release how much video do we actually get to see but it’s still purchased? If the game looks good and plays good it doesn’t need a streamer to keep it afloat. Those who think a streamer does this for a game are very naive.

If i got banned for purely dominating a streamer in PVP, i guess in a wierd way i beat the game? Haha.

If i ever watched a streamer and they cried about losing then i would instantly unfollow/

We need to breed a culture of strength.
Show weakness, you lose your followers.
The seas are salty enough.

@crimsonraziel dijo en Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

@guilleont said in Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

That streamer talked trash just because she got sunk by other players. Arena has few servers and it's easy to coincide with renowned streamers.

We need PVE Arena servers, obviously. :)

LOL. One crew we blame for PVERs answered us back "Arena is not PVP mode" hahahaha. Since you have to compete against other players, it's full PVP.

I wouldn't worry about it much. Months back I sent RARE a video of a certain person who hit 10 shots in a row standing on the tarpoline of a sloop in a violent storm on the Northwest side of the Wnderers from about 100 meters out while my partner and I were bunny hopping beyond the cannon and behind the rocks in the passage between the Northern neck of the island. He completely drained us of bananas eventually killing us both ( In a little over 1 minute). Aim assist and trigger assist were definitely in play. Months later I see this same person sailing in the Arena competition for money that Rare put on with some prominent streamers! RARE showed no scruples in the handling of the situation as they seem to think they need the popular streamers and their cohorts to advance the popularity of the game.
My feeling about their lack of action is torn for on one hand I understand RAREs plight (Make the game more popular which helps us all) yet on the other I think to myself "If I was them would I jeopardize my integrity in the name of gaining that popularity".
My point is that due to my personal experience most likely nothing happened to those who got reported.😐 Have a great day on the seas today!

@manbun-magic I can agree with this, I am against people going out and ruining other peoples fun but streamers need to know if you're playing poker and showing your hand to the world don't get angry if someone happens to see it.

Yup, many streamers whine too much and are too serious, in my opinion. I enjoy the chill types, much more.

@k1lroyw4sh3r3 said in Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

Coming from two decades of online gaming I can tell you this. It’s not what it used to be. Which is a shame as I thought with time it would only get better. The issue I see is the current age of players in gaming today are the I and Me types. They think everything revolves around them. There are a few dinosaurs like myself roaming around still but we are outnumbered.

Personally I think people watching people play is the most ridiculous thing ever. Watching people play a game when you can ply is crazy. The people who say, “well I’m not at home to play so that’s why I watch.” Then it sounds like your responsibilities are terrible and you should be working or paying attention in school or enjoying the time with who your out with.

From a business standpoint I can see why companies like streamers; it’s free publicity. However the companies should never bend their will to what a streamer wants. I’ve her people say “well you should listen to streamers since they keep your game getting noticed.” To those people I say that’s an Ignorant statement. Before a games release how much video do we actually get to see but it’s still purchased? If the game looks good and plays good it doesn’t need a streamer to keep it afloat. Those who think a streamer does this for a game are very naive.

I'm one of those dinosaurs, been playing online games since Diablo I. I don't go around watching streamers but I do enjoy watching their highlights. I tend to only watch them on lunch at work, including rare streams for info. It can be very entertaining, but no way would I watch some guy hide on a boat for 2 hours in hopes to steal a chest.

Watching streamers for me is like when a football coach watches another team play you can learn tips and tactics to make you a better player. So yeah I don't understand why people spend all day watching streamers or give the money but on the other hand I can understand why sometimes they do.

I don't know where I stand about this. I definitely think Rare should try to get out in front of it though.

Joe talked about how Rare had fostered the Sea of Thieves community through "openness, transparency and trust" on the Twitchcon 2019 SoT/Creators Panel

https://youtu.be/yKzxt9KmWn4 Timestamp - 28:15 for record.

Time for a bit more openness and transparency, I think, or else trust may be in jeopardy.

@bugaboo-bill said in Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

Streamers will allways be attacked by me and my crew.
We always wanted to become famous and part of a "TV" show.
I find sinking a streamer ship extremeley enjoyable, because they feel special and need to know they are not imho.

Although i can easily get these sails and partake in this program i refuse by choice.

I already like you for saying this. Can somebody explain to me why is sinking a streamer is considered an offense against the code of conduct?

The ins and outs of stream sniping are irrelevant. Rare have said it's not on. Their game, their rules.

There's a no witch-hunt policy on these forums though. Which is why it's alarming to hear that a streamer has made multiple disengenuous reports to Rare, some of which have been actioned, via a private back-channel discord that is unable to be scrutinised by the general population and therefore has no demonstrable oversight.

This person in particular appears to operate with an attitude that is toxic towards the community of this game. I'd like to think that Rare have good reasons for supporting this person's shady and toxic attitude, but without an explanation of this situation from Rare, all I can say is that: if these are the people who you want representing your game as partners, I'm not sure I want any part in it.

People raged about Summit's tactics, so you dropped him from a Dev stream, the actions of the person in question as they relate to this scenario go much further beyond the pale and demand an answer.

Unfortunately the scenario of streamers having too much influence is becoming rampant across the gaming community as a whole. One just needs to look at the Battlefield community for another example. Players like Levelcap seem to gain "favor" with the developers because their channels and streams become popular, but once those streamers make those corporate connections, they start to influence the game "their way" and not always for the best of everyone. And of course, they can get away with certain behaviors that normal players can't and can often report players for bogus infractions simply because they out-played the streamer.

Game companies like Rare, EA and Dice should not allow these people to directly influence the direction of their games UNLESS they make those streamers actual employees, in which they would then be subject to the policies of the company and can be held responsible for their actions while representing the company.

@kiethblacklion Yeah, but I rather someone who plays the game all the time influence the game than all the noobs who don't understand the game and flood the forums with silly topics like "This game is too hard" "OMG we need PVE servers!" "all PC players are hackers!"

I'm not going to weigh in on this particular "scandal" specifically but I am hoping that any "toxic" behaviour by streamers of a certain size will be dealt with by the rules of the new SoT Partner programme, which binds them to a Code of Conduct.

Influencers are always going to have a bit of power when it comes to any business because they are earned media - very little cost for a lot of marketing pull. If they do something wrong, while it looks bad, the business can cut ties and distance themselves more easily than if it were done by their own marketing team.

These "backdoor channels" to Rare are not some big secret, if you watch any of the bigger streamers of the game long enough you'd know they have connections and frequently talk about them - this has some benefits for the game, as problems (bugs/exploits) can be reported more efficiently and with a lot of video evidence to show support.

This is not unique to this game, or any business for that matter, if you know people at the top and they trust you, you are often given more benefits in terms of reporting certain things or getting access to certain privileges.

A lot of the top streamers are also full-time so rely on streaming the game for their main source of income, so in many ways it is absolutely a business concern for them and, unlike the average player, they have a business relationship with Rare.

That said, if it is found that some people are actually abusing this trust for their own gain at the detriment of the community, they should be dealt with accordingly.

Finally, I will say this, this is up to Rare to deal with and the calls to invade this person's stream that I saw on Reddit are 1) despicable and 2) counter-productive. Let Rare handle the situation and, if dissatisfied, show it with your wallets.

@zormis said in Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

@kiethblacklion Yeah, but I rather someone who plays the game all the time influence the game than all the noobs who don't understand the game and flood the forums with silly topics like "This game is too hard" "OMG we need PVE servers!" "all PC players are hackers!"

Sometimes I wonder if some of these developers rely too much on a select few players because of their popularity, NOT because they actually know how to improve the game. Just because someone plays a game a lot, doesn't mean they know what's best for the multiplayer aspect of the game.

@realstyli well said and good points.

In particular about the calls on reddit. Some of the abuse directed at the person in question has been frankly disgusting and the thought had crossed my mind that we've all been hoodwinked into a campaign against her by people with malicious intent.

I can accept people having a special level of access to Rare, but I, like you would take issue with that access being abused to the detriment of legitimate players. Streamers are lucky to be playing Rare's game, not the other way round.

Whatever the true story is with the scandal, it is legitimate to ask Rare to address it. The partners are supposed to be Ambassadors for the game. Can you imagine the ambassador of your country going around accusing people of crimes and calling them abusive names? That's unacceptible. We, the sea of thieves community deserve better Ambassadors than that.

@daringclarky dijo en Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

We need to breed a culture of strength.
Show weakness, you lose your followers.
The seas are salty enough.

Hell yes!

While I consider stream sniping unfair, the streamer with observant and/or helpful watchers has also an unfair advantage against other crews on the seas. They can help the streamer with spotting sails on the horizon, hidden opponents, help with names or positions of Islands and so on.

@lem0n-curry said in Streamers Are Abusing Their Power:

While I consider stream sniping unfair, the streamer with observant and/or helpful watchers has also an unfair advantage against other crews on the seas. They can help the streamer with spotting sails on the horizon, hidden opponents, help with names or positions of Islands and so on.

Precisely that. I watch a couple of streamers to learn about the game. I have, before, seen my favorite streamer getting information from their chat. This is for things they didn't see.
I doubt they even think of it in this fashion, but that is an unfair advantage and unbalances the play.