Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?

@lividfire715679 said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@dlchief58 said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

No, it does more than that which you and your ilk continue to ignore. It removes friendly players from the High Seas which in turn decreases the chances of a friendly or cooperative encounter, shifting the balance to a more hostile environment. This suggestion of separate progression also punishes players who might want to participate in both High and Safer Seas where their progression in one would not carry over to the other, causing them to repeat the grind or not get credit for commendations earned in Safer Seas (such as Tall Tales) when they swap over. Also this discourages people from moving up to the High Seas (or using Safer Seas for specific content) due to the progress not being connected.

So your first point is it lowers the chance of having a friendly encounter on the high seas shifting the balance to a more hostile environment.

You view this as a negative but I don’t see it that way at all.

If safer seas had the same number of crews sharing the world as the high seas but all PvP was disabled I could sail the safer seas for guaranteed neutral to positive encounters with other crews whenever I want. Like if you want to go socialize and work cooperatively with other crews with absolutely no chance of PvP happening the safer seas could be where that type of encounter happens all the time.

If I do that for a while and realize I wish I could damage other player ships and kill other pirates guess what? That option is available to me if I switch up the seas and sail the high seas. Crews sailing the high seas will be much more likely to want to fight or at least properly defend themselves which is what I expect and want when I choose to sail the high seas.

You are completely missing the point. Most of us are not looking for pure PVP or PVE, we want the game we bought as it was advertised which is PvPvE. We want to play as either depending upon the mood and do not wish for the balance to be shifted to a primarily PvP mode...nor have interest in playing without any threat. I value both types of encounters and enjoy where the balance currently lies which is about an even mix, varying slightly depending upon day or time. We value the unexpected nature of the game and no desire to have it become a shoot every player on sight just to play. So yes, this is most certainly a negative for the majority of players who've stuck with the game since launch.

“ This suggestion of separate progression also punishes players who might want to participate in both High and Safer Seas where their progression in one would not carry over to the other, causing them to repeat the grind or not get credit for commendations earned in Safer Seas (such as Tall Tales) when they swap over.”

So if they don’t make progression separate all the people who completed their commendations on the high seas may protest that now anybody can do most comms on safer seas with no threat of PvP.

And to be honest the game modes are entirely different takes on SoT and different ways to play and enjoy the game so it makes sense that progression would be separate and not carry over.

But if Rare really wanted to they could just make it so progression is shared between the two modes. This would upset a few veterans but maybe it’s for the best.

The incoming model HAS that already, shared progression regardless of which way you decide to play. You play with reduced threats, you get reduced rewards and limited progression. You want the full experience, then you move up to the High Seas taking everything you already earned with you. Most veterans are fine with this model as it is a pretty fair compromise, even too generous in some points (like level cap - should be lower unless there is a plan to increase the overall cap soon). Splitting the progression does more to permanently split the player base and thus hurt the game in the long haul as well as punish players using both models by increasing the grind and making it less attractive to move between modes, thus creating a hard split in the player base which is never a good thing for an online game's longevity.

@lividfire715679 said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@dlchief58

High seas will never be pure PvE or PvP it’s a mix of the two. You’re missing the point.

Forcing everyone on to the high seas with PvP enabled after they reach the caps in safer seas is just a bandaid/temporary solution to a foundational issue with the game.

Not everybody enjoys fighting other real players.

I love how you make it seem like adventure mode interactions now are 50/50 friendly/hostile which is an absolute lie.

If any crew is beelining towards your ship they are most likely hostile.

If any crew ignores your ship and sails right on by they are likely non-hostile.

That’s about the level of experience you can have.

Now you can go attempt to approach the non-hostile crews but about half will just run away from you.

The other half (the precious, innocent few) you can probably form an alliance with until they themselves get betrayed by a crew in their alliance and they never trust other pirates again.

OP is way better at staying patient and respectful in their responses to the criticism of the OG idea of this topic but I 100% agree with OP.

Players should have the freedom to choose their experience with or without PvP and they should be able to access as much of the game as possible that’s not directly tied to PvP. And the social aspect of the game ie open crew and other crews sharing the world should NEVER be removed from the experience. The SWAG concept is the soul of the game.

Just because my experience on the seas does not match your agenda does not make it untrue and I am offended by you referring to it as "lies" as it most certainly is NOT. I have many friendly experiences, and you know why? I communicate! I have many times turned a hostile encounter into a cooperative one simply by communicating with the other crew - your should put in the effort and try it some time. It is not always 50/50 but the average is most certainly within that realm. You like to use a lot of examples which are pure hyperbole and assumptions in order to support your narrative as a poor attempt to prop up your own weak argument.

You want the full experience? Then accept the full difficulty of the game. You want to play in the safe zone, then deal with the fact you are undeserving of the same rewards as someone accepting the full risk involved in the game and thankful that Rare even considered making this compromise of their vision for the game. Other players are easily avoided IF you take the proper precautions and be aware of your surroundings the vast majority of the time, or defused if you have good communication skills.

"The SWAG concept is the soul of the game."

This is the only thing you have said that was true, but your intent destroys that by forcing a split in the player base with no incentive to switch between the modes. Safer Seas is hardly a SWAG as envisioned by Rare when they designed the game. You want the full experience, then participate in THE FULL EXPERIENCE which is the High Seas. You want the safe, watered down version, then deal with the same in terms of your rewards - it is the only fair compromise that gets those players what they are asking for while respecting veterans of the game and their accomplishments. Asking for more is pure entitlement.

@lividfire715679 said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@dlchief58

I’m not wasting any more time going back and forth with you.

You would rather see SoT die as a forced PvEvP game than see the game evolve into having two modes where players can choose if they want PvP or not in their session and not be penalized socially or progression wise for choosing to play without PvP.

You may just get your wish if they don’t start pumping out new, repeatable and fun content rather than a lot of behind the scenes type updates and improvements and one time only content.

Spare us the doomsday scenario as the game is nowhere near "dying" as shown by it continuing to be one of the top played games on Xbox Live since launch. This was achieved without catering to those who refuse to get what the developers intended for the game. So which is it? Is Safer Seas going to bring in millions of players like many of you laughably claim or is it going to die because they aren't catering to your entitled requests for full rewards with no tangible risk? Can't be both.

I obviously care more about the game's health than you, whereas you care more about your own self centered desires than the continued health of the game by insisting on a permanent split in the player base (which would happen with this suggestion) with no incentive to change while failing to respect the achievements of veterans & those who play as the developer intended. I have seen far too many games ruined by developers listening to "fans" and implementing those suggestions only to kill their game within months of listening to those fair weather players instead of sticking with their core base that made the game successful to begin with. You lose your core base, you have lost your game.

And in case you aren't aware, MANY have asked for Rare to skip some of the content output in order for them to focus on bug fixes, removal of cheaters/exploiters and quality of life improvements. Guess this just shows where your priorities lie, and it is not with the general health of the game obviously.

@ghutar said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@cupobunnies
Overall - the caps and xp proposed by SS are quite well tuned to no risk involved. Im strongly against spliting rep and gold as it kills eny encouragment to move from SS to HS what is intended by developers.

To the last sentece:
As hard as it sounds nobody is punished or forced to do pvp, not when you are avare that you buy open world pvppve game. If eny one forced you it is you yourself perhaps buying noth right game for yourself.

The game's description doesn't discuss PvP gameplay and certainly doesn't say players are forced into hostile gameplay. I posted this on a different thread when I had people try to tell me I should have read the game description before purchasing/spending money on the game.

Have you read the game description?

About the Game:
"Sea of Thieves offers the essential pirate experience, from sailing and fighting to exploring and looting – everything you need to live the pirate life and become a legend in your own right. With no set roles, you have complete freedom to approach the world, and other players, however you choose."
No where in that description does it say that players are forced into player vs player interactions.

"With no set roles, you have complete freedom to approach the world, and other players, however you choose." indicating that players have freedom over the interactions, including whether or not they wish to partake in aggressive encounters.

"Whether you’re voyaging as a group or sailing solo, you’re bound to encounter other crews in this shared world adventure – but will they be friends or foes, and how will you respond?"
This really is the only line that vaguely indicates some kind of negative player interaction but doesn't explicitly state or indicate that aggressive interactions are forced on a player.

In one of the last paragraphs it states: "A Game That’s Always Growing
With each Season bringing in new game features every three months alongside regular in-game Events and new narrative Adventures, Sea of Thieves is a service-based game that’s still growing and evolving. Check back regularly to see what free content has been newly added, and see how far you can climb through each Season’s 100 levels of Renown to earn special rewards."
"service based game" indicating that they are willing to evolve and grow depending on the audience.
If you dont know what a service-based game is.
"In the video game industry, games as a service (GaaS) represents providing video games or game content on a continuing revenue model"
Essentially they are staying that if there is money to make...

The rest basically just goes over the "A Pirates Life" update and talks about all of the PvE aspects of the game such as voyages, trading companies, fishing as well as the PvE mobs such as Skeles, Sirens and Ocean Crawlers to name some.

Even in the tags on steam it doesn't just mention Online PvP and even if it did tags don't really indicate the full extent of the game play. Lots of games have Online PvP but also provide "peaceful" sessions too.

@ghutar

All of my points still stand, SoT could 100% incorporate PvE Servers for players who enjoy that gameplay. I hope that with Safer Seas we see more PvE friendly changes and even some improvements to the match making. Regardless of whether or not the game description is an accurate representation of what SoT is right now, there is no reason to not accommodate to a more diverse audience.

Players will still seek PvP, nothing will change, except for the experience of those who want to enjoy SoT without Player VS Player interactions.
By separating them, High Seas players can still keep their "prestige" of achieving their goals in a more risk/reward environment.

@schwammlgott

Don't get me wrong, I enjoy the game. I just think the experience could be improved for many of us and if it causes no harm to the High Seas, why not?
Lots of games have and advertise their PvP modes because there is a big audience for that, that doesn't mean the game is exclusively PvP.

@cupobunnies said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

I believe that a large part of the SoT community would agree that many of us would like to have the option to enjoy PVE. Why gatekeep this incredible game when many different audiences could enjoy it.
In my mind separating High Seas Gold/Reputation from Safer Seas would allow everyone to enjoy the game on their own terms.

This would negate the purpose of Safer Seas and turn it into a separate game altogether.

The purpose of this mode is to educate people and let them learn about the Sea of Thieves. It’s not meant as a replacement which is why certain features are locked and progress is capped at LV 40.

Yes, veterans like me can play Tall Tales in peace or create amazing screenshots for the “Capture a Code” competition. I have no use for gold so I can complete a few commendations in peace. Why would I play Safer Seas if I have a second and separate progression level?

You are also wasting your time. Like the Arena, the decision is final and Rare isn’t changing anything.

@tesiccl

I rather think that the developers are afraid that then only the hackers and trolls will be on High Seas and the players who want to play honestly on Seafer Seas. I quit because it was just a toxic cheater community. I also thought it would be better to separate the community instead of trying to force players to play High Seas again. And when I see how many hacks and ceats are classified as undetected, the developers should rather worry about that than players who want to play in peace and bring money to the company.

@derlikato as you said, you quit, so why does it concern you now?

@tesiccl sagte in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@derlikato as you said, you quit, so why does it concern you now?

Wow at the answer........

Since I have been actively playing Seafer Seas and have even put money into the game, money that ensures the development and continued existence of the game. Which apparently they haven't understood, as I can see from their defiant comment. If you can't handle criticism, then don't bother responding to it. And even if I didn't play it, I would have bought it and could then give my opinion and experience.

@derlikato just because you spent some money on Rare’s game, it doesn’t mean you’re entitled to be listened to. Rare make their choices for the overall benefit of the community and the game. You can absolutely give feedback, but don’t expect anyone to take you seriously when you give the “I spent money on you, you must listen to me” line.

@tesiccl sagte in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@derlikato just because you spent some money on Rare’s game, it doesn’t mean you’re entitled to be listened to. Rare make their choices for the overall benefit of the community and the game. You can absolutely give feedback, but don’t expect anyone to take you seriously when you give the “I spent money on you, you must listen to me” line.

Reading and understanding is difficult, interpreting is quite easy. I never said you have to listen to me because I spent money, but I can give my opinion. I wrote I spent money because I enjoy playing it, money that ensures the development and continued existence of the game. Since they don't contribute anything to the development of the game, we can leave the discussion alone.

If the time that some users spend crying and crying continuously about PvP, had been invested in using Safer Seas for what it was designed for (Practice and learn, not grind gold, sorry, it's reality) maybe you would have a decent level and you could defend your loot.

I repeat, there are no PvP players and PvE players here, there are Sea of ​​Thieves players, who enjoy both aspects of the game while they COEXIST in a shared environment.

Those who do not fit in are you, those who do not accept the nature of the game are you, therefore here the only ones to blame for what happens to you are you, you have gotten into a game with a PvP component because you felt like it, If you are not able to deal with that, you can leave because for each one of you who leaves, two enter who do want to enjoy what SoT offers.

If you want gold, you have to fight for your loot, it's very simple to understand.

[mod edit]

By the way, to the person who wants to compare WoW with SoT, I'm going to give you a couple of notes based on my almost 18 years of experience playing WoW.

Where did the downfall of the game begin? At the time when PvP became optional and you didn't have to fight for the world's resources, making the world feel empty and meaningless and destroying the Auction House economy by Pve farmers.

When did Wow explode again? When Classic came out, a shared PvPvE world in which you fight over mines, plants, world bosses.... people preferred to play Classic, cluncky and outdated, than retail.

"WoW Classic has PvE servers" Yes, all empty except one, the Roleplay one. I wonder why it is

If you don't like the game, leave, we've been without you for almost 6 years, we can continue for quite a while longer without needing your presence.

The $40 you spend on 4 cosmetics is not going to make Rare richer, you are not shareholders or anything like that, you are people who had no idea what you were getting into and now instead of adapting, you want the game to adapt to you.

They close your posts again and again and you continue the same, you are extremely annoying
[mod edit]

@guildar9194 said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

[mod removed]

[mod removed]

I don't condone name calling on either side but this probably shows the true nature of most "toxic encounters", bickering and escalating.

My vision of the game is not threatened by absolutely anyone, since it is the same vision that the devs have (the same ones that have closed all your posts)

You can twist my words all you want to try to continue justifying your point of view, at the end of the day, you are going to continue selling the loot for 30% of the gold and I will get the same in 1 hour as you in an entire afternoon.

[mod edit]