SBMM was an actual lie?

  • @klutchxking518 said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    @klutchxking518 @Meroviel I think it was you who said this on the discord?

    Can you post a link or point out where it is? I've lost over 450+ matches on a solo brig and 99% of the teams I faced were placed against me because of region.

  • The absurd Queue times prove that there is some kinda matchmaking, but like everything else in this game, it's based on spaghetti code and not likely ever going to change nor do what it's intended to do. They should just remove the facade altogether so at least we get quick queues.

  • @ssolutionss said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    The absurd Queue times prove that there is some kinda matchmaking, but like everything else in this game, it's based on spaghetti code and not likely ever going to change nor do what it's intended to do. They should just remove the facade altogether so at least we get quick queues.

    or we could wait for the next patch, see how it goes, give feedback and continue that on throughout the season lol

    it'll improve in the near future and patches down the road

    it's got a lot of promise

  • I'm only lvl 23 and am getting matched with people with the ghost curse as well on solo sloop.

  • @mouse-n-keybord
    Messages are from j0toro in SoT official Discord.

    It’s Win Based Matchmaking MMR. An average of your crew’s Win/Loss streak vs the enemies average. It has little to do with skill. The game tries to match winners with other winners, and losers with other losers

  • Because it's based solely on win/loss ratio. Which really doesn't make for great balancing. Many have found it's faster to hit 100 by intentionally losing as fast as possible as some games can go on for hours. If you lose your way to 100, you could be great at fighting but still be in bottom tier elo

  • It's session-based ELO though, which is what I had thought. If you win one, you'll be matched with someone winning one. If your streak is 5, you'll match against a similar streak. The next new or reset session you are back at bottom. Losing 100 in a row doesn't have any advantage in matchmaking versus say, losing once.

  • @wolfmanbush said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    @ssolutionss said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    The absurd Queue times prove that there is some kinda matchmaking, but like everything else in this game, it's based on spaghetti code and not likely ever going to change nor do what it's intended to do. They should just remove the facade altogether so at least we get quick queues.

    or we could wait for the next patch, see how it goes, give feedback and continue that on throughout the season lol

    it'll improve in the near future and patches down the road

    it's got a lot of promise

    I personally do not think a matchmaking system inside of a "sandbox" game is good for the game. Nonetheless, it should be its own mode outside of the main game. But we all know that failed with arena. Idk why they think this will last. Its weird

  • @klutchxking518 Well I was certain of it but I have to yield to proper evidence. SBMM was a lie we told ourselves, it seems.

  • Pretty sure I fought Pace the other night. No way that should be happening if SBMM is working. Spent more time on the ferry than I did on my ship.

  • It seems that the j0toro quote contradicts what is said in the Deep Dive video by Rare (https://youtu.be/SRDJL089EAg?t=253).

    Here is a screenshot of their description of the system and it is textbook SBMM : https://imgur.com/a/tJpOjDU

  • I wouldn't go as far as to call it a "lie."

    I just think this is yet another example of employees not being on the same page when informing players.

    Skip to 4:14

    Insiders may (or may not) have been told one thing, public video says something, community managers on discord saying something else.

    Rare business as usual.

  • Well we all know for a fact that the system isn't working. Region comes first. If anything I just don't want to sit in a bugged "less then 1 minute" queue for 10 minutes.

  • @wolfmanbush 14 more days left and the season is gone. I don't think we can give this much time left.

    Also, where was the PVE part where you can level up the hour glass? I did not see it. Also, hard to get a fight, since waiting time is 30 minutes to an hour.

  • @meji-kino said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    @wolfmanbush 14 more days left and the season is gone. I don't think we can give this much time left.

    Also, where was the PVE part where you can level up the hour glass? I did not see it. Also, hard to get a fight, since waiting time is 30 minutes to an hour.

    This season was late. The next wont be till March.

  • @mouse-n-keybord Why can't they just make content, and forget about seasonal stuff for a while? I get so tired of waiting for other players for the pvp and for just trying to grind the same old stuf again to get pirate legend. Almost there with Merchant and Souls to 50. Just 5 to 6 more levels and I am 50, 50, 50.

    They should have done better with this season. At least find alternate ways to get the hour glass up, since pvp is not doing that well.

  • @meji-kino said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    @mouse-n-keybord Why can't they just make content, and forget about seasonal stuff for a while? I get so tired of waiting for other players for the pvp and for just trying to grind the same old stuf again to get pirate legend. Almost there with Merchant and Souls to 50. Just 5 to 6 more levels and I am 50, 50, 50.

    They should have done better with this season. At least find alternate ways to get the hour glass up, since pvp is not doing that well.

    there will be a patch at some point and we can see how it goes. I'm sure they are aware of some of the main issues.

    If they can speed up fight times both for fights being had and matchmaking that will improve things a lot.

    Some of the main feedback lines up quite a bit across the board so there will probably (at some point) be some decent improvements

    A lot of the foundation of it is solid, just gotta speed things up and make some decent matches more consistently, personally I think that will happen to some degree, enough to improve qol for the content.

  • @wolfmanbush I hope so. It is getting tiring of waiting for 30 minutes to an hour or so. I just want to win or lose and not have to restock everytime. I remember buying a 17,500 crate, then going to a ghost fort to take supplies and treasure. Then turn on the hour glass only for nothing to happen within 30 minutes to an hour. I was just sailing around. Then I turned the loot in and logged off. So, I hope they fix things, it does get boring waiting after preparing for matches.

  • @meji-kino said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    @wolfmanbush I hope so. It is getting tiring of waiting for 30 minutes to an hour or so. I just want to win or lose and not have to restock everytime. I remember buying a 17,500 crate, then going to a ghost fort to take supplies and treasure. Then turn on the hour glass only for nothing to happen within 30 minutes to an hour. I was just sailing around. Then I turned the loot in and logged off. So, I hope they fix things, it does get boring waiting after preparing for matches.

    for sure, it's definitely frustrating for people

    when this game came out it was pretty bare bones, not much content. It had promise but there wasn't enough yet to really let it shine, they got through it and brought in more appealing content and scenarios that lead to interaction and pvp

    that's kinda how this is, it's promising and as they make some adjustments and help boost the appeal then more can embrace it and have fun, more consistently

    once they get fights moving along (there really isn't any reason to think they can't/won't do this) people will enjoy it more.

    Really, the consistent delivery of fights is most important imo, with advertising like on demand pvp we gotta keep those fast food fights flying out the door. Quantity increased while the quality is improved.

  • @klutchxking518 said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    According to a Rare CM on discord they never said SBMM was a thing. I believe they said that winners are matched with winners, losers are matched with losers, and the matchmaker is streak based.

    This is false. Today we matched the same try-hard (bunny hopping, double gunning, landing every sniper shot 10+ boat lengths away, boarding through point blank blunderbuss, grabbing ladder through windows, etc... the typical behavior of the pvp only SOT crew) crew 4 times in a row which is obviously feeding their streak. There is no algorithm behind matchmaking... just matching like-sized crews... And frankly, this is likely by design.. as if matchmaking were truly fair and matching teams based on skill.. or even streaks.... 10+ streaks would be mathematically improbable when there must be a 50% win rate across all boats.

    This mode will be dead soon if it's just randomly pitting boats and the only ones left are the seal clubbers. Just like arena. No one is going to tolerate the long queue times for lopsided matches which is what sunk Arena too.

  • @wolfmanbush said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    once they get fights moving along (there really isn't any reason to think they can't/won't do this) people will enjoy it more.

    Really, the consistent delivery of fights is most important imo, with advertising like on demand pvp we gotta keep those fast food fights flying out the door. Quantity increased while the quality is improved.

    It's not going to happen WITHOUT true matchmaking. If they are matching casual crews against the sweats with zero regards to past performance, those casuals will be gone. The mode will self-select with those who only PVP in SOT until they move on to whatever is getting views on Twitch.... just like arena did.

  • @artie said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    @wolfmanbush said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    once they get fights moving along (there really isn't any reason to think they can't/won't do this) people will enjoy it more.

    Really, the consistent delivery of fights is most important imo, with advertising like on demand pvp we gotta keep those fast food fights flying out the door. Quantity increased while the quality is improved.

    It's not going to happen WITHOUT true matchmaking. If they are matching casual crews against the sweats with zero regards to past performance, those casuals will be gone. The mode will self-select with those who only PVP in SOT until they move on to whatever is getting views on Twitch.... just like arena did.

    Day 1 has long past when there was no stats... There has been more than enough time and data for them to be able to rank players on an ELO ladder.... There's no excuse for a new crew to be matched against crews with multiple streaks on their record.

  • Ahoy!

    We do have skill-based match-making — it's based on a variant of the Elo system. We take into account the win/loss ratio of the crew combined, not any session's streak, and this informs who you're matched against when you opt into a battle. However, if there aren't any perfect matches waiting for your crew when you opt into your next battle, then we'll broaden the net of players you could play with over time to ensure you'll always find a match.

  • I find this hard to believe as someone who went 40w-120L and got instantly matched with a 107 skeleton curse without delay as a solo slooper. By this logic wouldn't I have to wait longer to match into someone that is going to absolutely pound me into dust? I seem to endlessly instantly match into players of much higher skill level with what feels like 0 matches of equal or fair skill rating.

    Is something off with this for solo players VS crews since it so consistently seems to not hit that mark? I don't feel like anyone in my position should be consistently paired with skeleton/ghost curses.

  • @jolaton said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    Ahoy!

    We do have skill-based match-making — it's based on a variant of the Elo system. We take into account the win/loss ratio of the crew combined, not any session's streak, and this informs who you're matched against when you opt into a battle. However, if there aren't any perfect matches waiting for your crew when you opt into your next battle, then we'll broaden the net of players you could play with over time to ensure you'll always find a match.

    That's what the documentation says. However, MM is clearly broken... When you get matched to the same boat 4 times in a row as a new to the mode crew vs a clearly experienced crew... on a dual sloop in Prime hours. something is not right. This mode is going to die if this is not addressed ASAP, unless of course you only want the sweaty double gunning teams playing it. The matchmaker also needs to report accurate wait times based on the skill rating of the boat so crews can make an informed decision to accept queueing up when the likely match up will be lopsided.

  • @jolaton said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    Ahoy!

    We do have skill-based match-making — it's based on a variant of the Elo system. We take into account the win/loss ratio of the crew combined, not any session's streak, and this informs who you're matched against when you opt into a battle. However, if there aren't any perfect matches waiting for your crew when you opt into your next battle, then we'll broaden the net of players you could play with over time to ensure you'll always find a match.

    This doesn't explain why some people are diving, and instantly getting matched with players above their skill level. Unless its because the following
    Ship 1: Has been searching for 20 minutes for a match, and is now in the broadening zone of matchmaking
    Ship 2: Just dove and instantly gets matched with ship 1, because they had been waiting 20 minutes for a match

    So the question's I have are:
    What is the time before it starts "broadening searches"?
    Does someone else well above that time, override system caring about the new player that just dove? (in example above)

    There's something broken here for sure, because if i'm tanking my Win/loss ratio on a sloop to be as bad as possible, and then I dive, and instantly match with someone with the best win/loss ratio who's been waiting for a while, The system is broken in favor of those sitting in the que longer, regardless of their ranking

  • @rakash3337 absolutely happening to us also. Making me pla6 against known cheaters and putting us in oc lobby with either highly cracked players and some cheaters who we already have blocked. Put us against some 3 times this morning alone let alone so many over weekend. Algorithm isn't working. We sunk so much and still wete against the same people

  • @stillvill definitely broken. It's not an accurate matching system at all. I keep getting matched with people way beyongmd cracked, cheating and people I've had blocked prior to them using five or chronic zen box cheats
    Same experiences as far as losing and completely being matched 3 times in a r9w with the sane people that just destroyed us

  • @rowenarogers the matchmaking is broke. I tried to submit a ticket and they told me to go to forums or mega threads to write about it.

  • @fishyjoesalt said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    @dragotech123 said in SBMM was an actual lie?:

    I hope that soon I can get matched against people like me. I admit that I'm terrible, like very very bad, and I get steamrolled a lot. I haven't won a single match yet. I need to learn how to fight properly. Until then I calculate that I'll need like 500 matches before I reach level 100, I'm glad that losses will award me XP.

    (If anyone can point me to any guide or tips video, I will really, really appreciate it. Have a great day and a wonderful week, pirates!)

    PhuzzyBond has some of the best videos I've ever seen on YT for learning the ropes

    Phuzzy bond nooo just no anyone but that clownfish.

    If you want a real player check out mixelplx he is unanimously the best solo pvper hands down even if he can be a bit intolerable.

  • @ill-deadly-ill That checks out, I really believe it needs tweaking or for something to be done.

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