Burning Blade needs some weak point

  • I've done a lot of BBs, taking control of it and doing series of 8 rituals, doing some fod with it, or attacking it for lvl 3+ swords.
    I don't need anything from it anymore, but I still do it for friends that need rituals or swords.

    Now, I'd like to give my honest opinion about it, and I'll go to the point. The Burning Blade needs to have a weak point.

    When I've been in control of the BB, I've always, in any type of situation, felt all mighty. Wether it's against an experience Galeon crew, several Brig attacking at the same time, etc.
    As long as you are a crew of 3 people on the BB or more, you are invicible.

    To sink the Burning Blade, the best way I found is to spawn camp players (and skeletons), keeping it anchored, until no skeletons appear anymore. Then you can pressure it and kill it almost like a Galeon.

    • With a solo Sloop, you have almost no chance to take down a crewed BB, whatever the size of the enemy crew.
    • With a duo Sloop, things are stacked against you. You have to camp players for a while, keep the BB immobilized, keep the Sloop repaired and in the back blind spot of the BB.
    • With a Brig, things are getting a bit better, you are not so severely outnumbered, but it is still a very hard fight most of the time.
    • With a Galeon, it's not that much better, you have one more man, but if you take the fire, you're done for.

    Keep in mind I'm still not talking about skill here, so I'll add that:
    To even begin to think to sink a crewed Burning Blade, in my experience, you need to absolutely crush the enemies in terms of mechanics and skill, whatever the size of the BB crew.

    Where am I going with all of this ?
    I think the Burning Blade in it's current state, despite the situation I'm painting, is alright. It is an absolute beast, it's the best ship outthere, no questions asked, this is the entire point of it.

    But it needs a weak spot.
    Currently, you can apply canon pressure by shooting at it low on the sides, and... That's about it.
    Burning Blades are extremely hard to immobilize with the hard masts and fast anchor. With 5 canons on each side, one broad side means instant death. After a hard 40min fight where you destroyed all skeletons and players on board, this is devastating.

    Let's cut to the chase, I see 3 main issues with it:

    • The masts are very hard to take down and players can focus on them since skeletons repair downstairs.
    • The anchor is very fast to raise and players can focus on it since skeletons repair downstairs.
    • There is no bottom hole at the back of it, therefore, it is impossible to apply pressure if the Burning Blade is running without taking the risk of loosing instantly to the broad side.

    To fix these issues seems quite simple to me:

    • Put regular masts on it. Maybe keep one hard mast on the back, near the wheel to prevent it from being totaly stopped too easily with chains shots. this would allow at least to slow it down.
    • Put a Brigantine anchor on it (if it is hard to put a dynamic anchor adapting to the crew size, wich would be ideal)
    • Make it so the "intermediary" holes on the back are bottom holes. This is absolutely necessary in my opinion to put any water in it in most situations where you are not just commiting suicide on the broad side.

    I feel like these changes would make the Burning Blade doable with a skilled duo sloop against inexperienced crews, and it would leave room for less experienced Brigandine and Galeon crews to try to take it down when it is crewed by an average duo sloop.
    In the current state of the event, I have to admit I'm a bit discouraged. A crewed Burning Blade is, most of the time, an almost insurmountable opponent for a duo sloop, or even for an average Brig/Galeon crew.

    We could argue we are supposed to ally with other ships to take it down. I don't think it is a reasonable thing to ask in most cases. Trusted allies are not really a common thing on the seas, even less so in the time window of a Burning Blade stacking around.
    Even worse, most of the time, when I saw a third party ship coming around, it just started to shoot the attacker's ship instead of the Burning Blade...

    I'll let BBs roam freely from this day, I might be biased, but I'm under the impression that this will become the case for more and more people as time goes by. The BB is great. A bit too great imo.

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  • @arias1101 the weak point is the crew. Kill the skeletons and it's an undermanned galleon with an inconvenient layout.

    It's about resource denial and control, that is the weak point. Restrict the blade from completing rituals and they don't get more obsidian boys.

    Beyond that, ironically the front is the best place to shoot it and scattershot works brilliantly!

  • @arias1101 also if you get about 3 rituals and your BB sinks you can turn in your own sword of souls for credit....

  • No case to make for weakening the BB when the turn in point was cut off.

    If that ever changes, sure, but not with this recent change.

    It's wild enough to prevent a turn in through code, it would be beyond ridiculous to cater to the same group again by weakening the ship.

  • @captain-fob4141 This has been our strategy, but the issue occurs when you need to apply pressure to it, while preventing it from running away. In a duo sloop, this is very hard to do.

    Taking a fire from the front is devastating in any ship, so I have to admit we avoided it until now and stayed in the back, from there, the BB is almost invincible, wich is one of my points.

    I don't think it is reasonable to takle it from the front given the power level of its special weapon honestly.

  • @captain-fob4141 said in Burning Blade needs some weak point:

    @arias1101 also if you get about 3 rituals and your BB sinks you can turn in your own sword of souls for credit....

    I don't think this is intended though.

  • It's supposed to be a difficult fight. And manning a Burning Blade as a duo sloop isn't particularly easy either because of how large it is and how easy it is for brigs or galleons to overwhelm you with boarders. I've lost a handful of times to pretty mediocre naval crews who just spam boarders and deplete the skelly crew -- as you also said.

    I don't think any changes are necessary until the new mechanics / tools are added to the game.

  • @arias1101 you can only sell it at reapers.

  • @arias1101 The Blade has weaknesses its on you to exploit them and put pressure on them.

    The masts need to be repaired by players and the forward mast is the hardest one to repair. Sloop and brigs are short and are harder to hit with the BB cannons. The Ashen roar is harder to land when you are further away and anyone cam activate it.

    It's not that the BB is invincible it's that you need to fight it differently from any other player ship because it is different.

    Again scattershot is the best.

  • @captain-fob4141 has right. If you have hard time sinking BB use more scatershots.

  • @ghutar I wouldn't say I'm having trouble.
    I'm quite an experienced player, I've sunk about 25 of them.

    This is not the point. I was making an argument for the power level of the encounter. Given the average lvl of my crews, I feel like we are puting a lot of work to sink people in BBs.
    This isn't even fun for them since they are just getting spawned camped for 30min straight sometimes.

    On the other hand, we were never worried or even pressured when we were in control of the event. Even when severely outnumbered.

    I don't really see how an average crew can do this though (in solo, it is impossible. In duo, the task is extremely difficult.)

  • To sink the Burning Blade, the best way I found is to spawn camp players (and skeletons), keeping it anchored, until no skeletons appear anymore. Then you can pressure it and kill it almost like a Galeon.

    So it a normal tactic everyone does. Childish but it works.

    With a solo Sloop, you have almost no chance to take down a crewed BB, whatever the size of the enemy crew.

    Players say the same when they face a Galleon, it easy to pull off it you prepare.

    Currently, you can apply canon pressure by shooting at it low on the sides, and... That's about it.

    Its World Event against the "Boss" of SoT so far. the best and highlight of the whole thing is, The Server groups together to take it down

  • @burnbacon You seriously expect "the server to team up" in a limited timeframe, 20 times in the lifespan of an average player for the swords (more than 20 in fact, since there is only one sword for multiple crews) ?
    I've seen it maybe once in all my encounters... In all other cases, ships just attack eachother for whatever reason.
    Besides, I'd say 80% of the player base in open world lack the skill to apply any pressure in these conditions.

    Sinking Galeons is no problem for us, even in sloop. I'd say sinking a BB takes about 10 times the effort.

    You are right though, if the whole server teams up, the event might be balanced (it would be fun to see some pressure from inside the BB for once). This is not the case in reality sadly.

  • @arias1101 yup it's a world event designed to be hard.

    If you could easily destroy it, it wouldn't be gratifying for an average crew to sail on, they would just become your loot pinata. Change your behavior and try new strategies before begging rare to change for you.

    That being said, it can be exceedingly easy to sink especially if it's mismanaged.

  • @captain-fob4141 What an agressive response.
    I'm merely giving my opinion after doing a lot of it... Who says anything about begging for a change ?

    If it unnerves you that bad, maybe read a section of the forum wich is not design for taking feedback from players ...?

  • @arias1101 if you take the comment as a personal attack, that's a framing issue on your part. You have the tools to complete the event and now the knowledge of how to do it.

    It can be sunk solo, it's hard

    It can be sunk duo, you just need to deplete their respawns.

    Instead of bashing your head against the wall analyze your behaviors to figure out what the weaknesses are and how you can take advantage of them.

  • @arias1101 my point was that [insert players] who struggle against BB should adjust their tactics.

    The ship from my (avrage skill player) point of view is fair enough as player vessel to be fought or crewed and need not eny more tweakeing around it balance. As rare it is for Rare ship is in right spot.

  • All valid points. In terms of crew difference I don't think it will ever be fully balanced. But then it's easy to forget that sloop vs gally it's not particularly balanced if the gslly has a half competent crew.
    The anchor, masts etc do need some balancing. I'm not sure the wheel takes damage either

    Just to add there are some weak points I.e extra ladders to board at rear, easy deckshot. I think the angle of ladders seems to make it harder to guard from above too but it does still feel rough. I guess other inherent weakness is their requirement to lose a crewmate to do rituals and now that they can't turn in with other ships present

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