Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?

I am honestly curious, if this was to happen, how long said players would dwell on Safer seas when there is no real threat or incentive apart from PVP to go on normal servers?

How many new players who hate pvp, would stick to this game and reach hundreds of hours.

I don't know how about you guys, but without threat the game is just a fetch simulator and the grind becomes so boring quick. You try everything once or twice and nothing will surprise you anymore.

At least this is why I don't play on alliance servers, the times I tried felt like I took sleeping pills, literally.

@cupobunnies said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

I do not see how adding a PVE side to the game would harm SoT/High Seas.

In my mind separating High Seas Gold/Reputation from Safer Seas would allow everyone to enjoy the game on their own terms.

So far in your post you only mentioned PVP being your problem, looks like safer seas fix what you don't like. i don't see what splitting progression would add more to what you described above.

Is there anything else perhaps that would drive you in wanting more than what Rare will be providing through that mode?

@zig-zag-ltu
Everyone is unique and enjoys different types of gameplay.
Its fair enough that yourself and others alike wouldn't find the fun in playing PVE because for you guys it would get boring. Other people do love the grind. Maybe new players will use it as a stepping stone to learn the game, improve their skills then move onto Higher Seas to battle it out with other players; but for others like myself I really do enjoy sailing, questing and exploring with my friends, maybe occasionally doing solo voyages listening to music or watching Youtube. I know that I would be more inclined to spend money on SoT if I was able to enjoy it fully.

@bloodybil
I personally really enjoy doing the commendations, seeing the circle go around for each level and the number go up is rewarding especially if you are someone who plays and enjoys grindy games. I dont see why Safer Seas shouldn't be a full PVE experience If it was separated from HighSeas. I understand the advantage that people who use Safer Seas would have over those on PVP and that is why I think it should be separated. There is no real reason to gatekeep this game from others just because they want to experience differently then you do.

@cupobunnies said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@bloodybil
I personally really enjoy doing the commendations, seeing the circle go around for each level and the number go up is rewarding especially if you are someone who plays and enjoys grindy games. I dont see why Safer Seas shouldn't be a full PVE experience If it was separated from HighSeas. I understand the advantage that people who use Safer Seas would have over those on PVP and that is why I think it should be separated. There is no real reason to gatekeep this game from others just because they want to experience differently then you do.

Even if the circle spins slower than PVEVPers, it still spins and numbers till go up though no?

I don't think that having multiple tiers of game difficulties and associated tiers of rewards is gatekeeping, you are closing that gate yourself.

@bloodybil said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@cupobunnies said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@bloodybil
I personally really enjoy doing the commendations, seeing the circle go around for each level and the number go up is rewarding especially if you are someone who plays and enjoys grindy games. I dont see why Safer Seas shouldn't be a full PVE experience If it was separated from HighSeas. I understand the advantage that people who use Safer Seas would have over those on PVP and that is why I think it should be separated. There is no real reason to gatekeep this game from others just because they want to experience differently then you do.

Even if the circle spins slower than PVEVPers, it still spins and numbers till go up though no?

I don't think that having multiple tiers of game difficulties and associated tiers of rewards is gatekeeping, you are closing that gate yourself.

As far as I personally know I was told that you will not be able to climb past 30 on Safer Seas which is quite low. I don't know if that's confirmed though.

When you talk about gatekeeping the amazing game. The devs vision (from what I've seen) is based on the player interaction adding the endless variety to your voyages
You speak of separating out pve and pvp, but your assumption is that default seas are pvp. They're not it's a pvpve environment, the whole game and the balance is designed around the premise that you encounter both. You're asking for 2 separate games and player demand fundamentally changing the game. I hope they never do this.

@hiradc
From what I have experienced, there is no real accessibility to just enjoy the content of the game. I am wanting to be able to enjoy the puzzles and stories of the Tall Tales without getting sunk multiple times (regardless of whether or not we have an Emissary Flag up). There is so much more to SoT then the PVP and battling it out on the sea. The game has interesting characters with backstories, so much to do and explore. But we can't because we are new, inexperienced and in some cases simply just not interested in PVP, other players are not giving newbies the chance to learn and are overall making the game unenjoyable, causing more new players to quit before actually getting into the game.

I really do not see how adding a PVE mode would in any way negatively affect what SoT is currently now. Like I said in my original post, if anything it would make the PVP aspect of SoT more competitive. The only reason I can see this being an issue for some players is the loss of easy targets, however if you actually enjoy PVP and battling it out with other crews on the seas, I'd imagine that wouldn't be the case.

In all honesty I don't see how making a game more diverse and accessible would ever be a bad thing. Money is money and SoT would just be opening itself to a new audience by allowing more chill gameplay to those who want it without taking the PVP from the players who do enjoy it.

@cupobunnies your first paragraph is already completely achieved by safer seas.

Safer seas doesn't really affect me much, to be honest if I see someone is super new I tend to leave them or help them as it is as I know how easily people can be scared away, but it's always with a warning that not everyone will be nice and on a different day I might not have been.

I enjoy the mixture, I like pve, I like pvp. I wouldn't want to do either in isolation, pve wouldn't be challenging enough (there has already been a massive shift in making everything easier in the game so you can complete so much and sell before people have opportunity to contest you if efficient). Likewise pvp only would be monotonous. They took arena out because it doesn't work to have it as a separate mode. By designating one mode for pve you're likewise doing the other for pvp but there's no variety.

Safer seas will hopefully achieve exactly what it's meant to, get you enough experience and familiarity that when you move over to high seas you're not as easy a target, you can complete would events and voyages reasonably quickly thus reducing the window for contest

A lot of it comes down to mentality. Gold, loot and everything else only really has the value you place on it. Personally if I do a fof or fotd and I haven't had a single ship try to contest it, I don't really feel like I've 'earned' it, as with some experience there's no real way of losing to these events. That athena or chest of fortune feels so much greater selling if you've had to fend off several ships for it, or managed to pull off a last minute steal.

Likewise the perception of pvp, lots of people equate unwanted pvp as toxicity. That's really not the case, and this is objective based on the dev point of view. If you report someone for attacking you, no action will be taken. If you lash out and abuse someone because they attacked you (or do it whilst attacking someone) that is toxic and can be reported.

@hiradc
I love the community and it certainly would not be the same without PVP and the original servers. I just don't see how making the game more accessible to others would be a bad thing for SoT. I doubt it would affect the servers too much there is already a pretty massive playerbase in comparison to other games that have similarities with SoT.

I understand that Safer Seas may not really affect you at all but there is a number of players it would benefit. If players really want to be a prestigious Pirate Legend on the High Seas or for those who enjoy PVP, High Seas (OG Servers) will undoubtedly always be around and overall I cant see how adding a PVE option would really affect the gameplay at all. High Seas servers would still be filled and again, if anything, it would be more competitive and more fun as the players who are actually in that server are looking to tussle.

Unfortunately not everyone is like you, in my few weeks on this game I've met my fair share of unsavory characters, had many people troll, spawn kill, harass, and chase me around the map for what? They're most likely bored and looking to fight someone. I actually had a crew the other day chase my ship basically begging us to fight as we asked them to leave us - long story short they didn't. From my experience this is more commonly the case then not - it makes the game incredibly hard to enjoy for players like myself who do not necessarily enjoy PVP, especially when you have limited time to enjoy the game.

@cupobunnies you can't see how it would affect, or don't care because it's not your preferred playstyle? The game relies on player interaction and server activity to keep people interested.

Again, Safer seas already achieves a lot of what you're requesting for your pve mode.

I get you like the thought of experiencing the whole world in peace, it is a big risk to change the game that much though as it is the diversity in player interaction that makes every session different.

@hiradc said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@cupobunnies you can't see how it would affect, or don't care because it's not your preferred playstyle? The game relies on player interaction and server activity to keep people interested.

Again, Safer seas already achieves a lot of what you're requesting for your pve mode.

I get you like the thought of experiencing the whole world in peace, it is a big risk to change the game that much though as it is the diversity in player interaction that makes every session different.

I genuinely do not see how it would negatively impact the OG Servers. If you could give me some examples as to why you think it would I am open to the discussion.

Depending on how SoT integrates PVE focused servers into the game, I am sure they would never remove the ability to interact with other players regardless of the gamemode, especially if the player interactions are as vital as you say.

@cupobunnies A server of 5 ships with 1 PvE only player, 3 PvPvE players and 1 PvP only player is different than a server with 3 PvPvE players and 2 PvP only players and those are different than a server with 2 PvPvE players and 3 PvP only players.

Removing the PvE players from the servers makes them more aggressive overall.

Every player has a different threshold for when the servers become too aggressive for their taste. By making the servers more aggressive, some of the more passive PvPvE players will switch to PvE servers for their pve activities or leave. Which will make the servers even more aggressive, rinse and repeat until you've get yourself a PvE only mode and a PvP only mode and very few PvPvE players left.

I'm not interested in doing PvE without the threat of other players. I'm not interested in not having the ability to complete any PvE activities because I'd have to fight every minutes of gameplay either.

@grog-minto said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@cupobunnies A server of 5 ships with 1 PvE only player, 3 PvPvE players and 1 PvP only player is different than a server with 3 PvPvE players and 2 PvP only players and those are different than a server with 2 PvPvE players and 3 PvP only players.

Removing the PvE players from the servers makes them more aggressive overall.

Every player has a different threshold for when the servers become too aggressive for their taste. By making the servers more aggressive, some of the more passive PvPvE players will switch to PvE servers for their pve activities or leave. Which will make the servers even more aggressive, rinse and repeat until you've get yourself a PvE only mode and a PvP only mode and very few PvPvE players left.

I'm not interested in doing PvE without the threat of other players. I'm not interested in not having the ability to complete any PvE activities because I'd have to fight every minutes of gameplay either.

Just because something doesn't interest you doesn't mean others wouldn't benefit.

As for the servers and your statement that removing the PVE players would essentially make the High Seas servers more aggressive. Isn't that the main point? The only part that adding a PvE mode would do is remove the vulnerable or less experienced players who do not wish to partake in Player vs Player.

Again, I don't really see how it would actually negatively affect what High Seas is today.

@cupobunnies so it's not as clear cut as this but let's say you have pve population (and I would guess that it's a small % that only want pure pve and would never get tired or bored of this).
Likewise you have the pure pvp crowd, again a relatively small %
Then most players fall in between somewhere, they do both but may lean more to one side or another or even vary from time to time to keep things fresh.

So the game is currently designed on the latter.
The difficulty of ai is based off potentially having pvp threat alongside it.
The size of the map and player population (outside of server issues) is based off encouraging enough player encounters that the seas feel alive but you're not constantly bumping into players.

If you have designated pve servers and pvp, then those 2 small groups are catered for, but the latter is almost forced to choose between one or the other.

You also have to consider, that players aren't the best judge of what they actually want or whatis best for long term health of the game. If devs gave players what they demanded, every new piece of content would instantly be made easier and less of a grind to be finished quickly so they can go back to complaining about lack of content...

@cupobunnies a dit dans Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas? :

As for the servers and your statement that removing the PVE players would essentially make the High Seas servers more aggressive. Isn't that the main point? The only part that adding a PvE mode would do is remove the vulnerable or less experienced players who do not wish to partake in Player vs Player.

Having PvE servers is great for the PvE only crowd, having more aggressive servers is great for the PvP Only crowd. My point is that I'm neither. I want to keep playing the way I currently do : doing PvE activities while fending off attacker once or twice an hour.

Imo, the reason you don't see how that would negatively impact regular servers is because you don't think PvPvE players actually exists and that everyone should be happy to do only PvE or only PvP.

@cupobunnies Rare's vision for Safer Seas is that it's more of a way to get your feet wet per se. It's not intended to be anything more than that. It's not supposed to be a new way to experience the game. If you add seperate rep/gold accounts, you are turning it from learning into playing and as it stands right now, that's just not Rare's vision.

Happy Sailing!

@cupobunnies said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

High Seas servers would still be filled and again, if anything, it would be more competitive and more fun as the players who are actually in that server are looking to tussle.

As for the servers and your statement that removing the PVE players would essentially make the High Seas servers more aggressive. Isn't that the main point?

Nope, this is the point that you don't understand and it's fine, you are new and will learn with experience, the majority of players don't seek to only do one type of activity, they embrace both. PVE, with a risk of PVP. An unpredictable experience. It's not black and white, there is a ecosystem and a balance of types of players within.

Being willing to expose oneself doesn't make one automatically a seal clubber or bloodthirsty maniac. Simply someone that welcomes the potential exposure to risk, and the rewards that comes with it. The game is not about polarizing and segregating gameplays in silos, it's to sail together.

In the same vein as your point of view, I could say that I don't really understand what the restrictions on rep are taking away from a chill PVE experience, it's even more chill if you don't have to worry about requirements and payoff, isn't that the point? Why not have circles spinning and numbers rising but they don't add to the cap at that point?

Honestly, I wouldn't even care about a separate progression, as long as the same restriction apply. What would be the point? Well, what would be the point to play a harder version of the game through HS and have just as much loot as those who play in godmode?

Nobody answered this one yet in any of the full PVE server request threads.

@grog-minto I'm the same, unless I'm on specifically for hg I start most sessions doing some pve, then once I've accumulated some resources I might seek out some pvp if none has come to me.

@hiradc I mostly do World events. That way I'm sure that people gravitating around are up for PvP and it is often a bit chaotic / surprising. :D

I wish you good luck on the seas :)

@cupobunnies You said you want to be able to explore and enjoy the lore/Tall Tales without the constant threat of being attacked. Therefore, 'Safer Seas' is going to be perfect for you. If you are looking for a chill experience to enjoy at your own pace, then what's the problem? You are getting what you want - a seperate server that fulfills your request.

You also said you like this progression and levelling up aspect. You get that from Safer Seas too! Even if it is at a reduced rate/capped at lvl 40.

I'm failing to see how 'Safer Seas' is not meeting your needs based on your posts?

@dragotech123 Don't get me wrong, I was just curious about your perspective. The way I enjoy playing SoT solo, is doing voyages and having a quiet session, but that unkown threat on the horizon is what makes the game exciting for me. I played for a few days on alliance servers to boost my gold and wanted to try it out as well...Man it was boring. You know nothing will attack you, so you just kill the boss in the fastest way possible, over and over and over again, run around collecting loot and running around selling it...If that was the whole game, I probably would stop playing after a month.

@dragotech123 said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

@zig-zag-ltu said in Why not separate High Seas Gold and Rep from Safer Seas?:

I am honestly curious, if this was to happen, how long said players would dwell on Safer seas when there is no real threat or incentive apart from PVP to go on normal servers?

How many new players who hate pvp, would stick to this game and reach hundreds of hours.

I don't know how about you guys, but without threat the game is just a fetch simulator and the grind becomes so boring quick. You try everything once or twice and nothing will surprise you anymore.

At least this is why I don't play on alliance servers, the times I tried felt like I took sleeping pills, literally.

Allow me to share my perspective. You enjoy the threat of other players, you get bored of killing NPCs. On tye other hand I hate meeting other players because it always end poorly for me, and I enjoy fighting NPCs because that feels less chaotic for me. What you may find fun and thrilling I find stress inducing, what you may find boring I find relaxing. That's why I also enjoyed tons of Single Player games.
Everyone has their own opinion om what is fun for the game. Fun is subjective and different for each individual. Just hope you have fun in High Seas. I will relax and chill im Safer Seas when the time comes.
The purpose of a videogame is to be fun, and a player doesn't find it fun them they will move to a other one.

That's a totally valid point and you are entitled to partake in whatever activity you prefer amongst the ones at your disposal.

Having potential aggressive players added in the mix being considered an additional level of difficulty to the game, why are the players choosing a harder way to play not deserving scaling rewards to that effort though?

I play WoW from time to time. I don't like serious raiding because of time issues and I don't want the stress that goes with it either. The casual raid mode fits me plenty, but I understand and accept I will not get as good loot or extra goodies like rare mounts and such as the players who puts more time and choose to play harder difficulties. And in the end that's my choice and decision alone.

The should just give the option to turn friendly fire on in safer seas. That's for learning the game anyway so it makes sense there.

"Scaling" refers to the adjustment or adaptation of difficulty levels and corresponding rewards based on your players’ progress and skill levels. Scaling rewards may also involve providing more valuable rewards as players tackle more difficult challenges.

Players should be rewarded with a sense of accomplishment, but in a consistent way that reflects their current skill level. In other words, the more powerful a player gets, the more challenging rewards should be to attain.

By offering scaled challenges and corresponding rewards, players are incentivized to push their limits and strive for higher achievements relative to their skill level, boosting their long-term engagement with the game.

Personally I think a separate progression doesn't matter, make separate pirates and lock them to a specific sea all you want, as long as the scaling fits the difficulty chosen.

@grog-minto
Again, removing players who do not wish to partake in PvP literally only removes the easy targets. From the thread and from the people I know who play, I know for a fact that many people do want the PvP aspect, even if they are new. My partner for example, he has maybe 20-30 hours on the game? He doesn't usually play with my sister and I because we are more interested in the story and voyages then he is. He wants to roll up on people and have a good old fight. People like my partner are not going anywhere and will still seek the thrill of PvPvE on the seas.

I think that by adding PvE server with potentially a slower rep system, possibly a higher quantity "mobs" on adventures etc, wouldn't necessarily take away from what High Seas is. Other then buying ships and cosmetics I don't think gold has any real affect on the actual gameplay but; by separating the gold, renown, doubloons etc between the two modes as well as possibly increasing how much exp is needed to level up in PvE, I can't imagine how this would be harmful to High Seas. There will still be players who want PvPvE like yourself and they will seek out High Seas if that is what they perceive as fun.

@hiradc
I don't understand how PvPvE isn't being catered for in this situation? SoT wouldn't be removing PvPvE from the game in any way? Adding a PvE server is only removing the players who do not wish to PvP.

Allowing a game to become more accessible in pretty much all scenarios is a good thing for the health of the game. Like I said before, to Rare and Xbox, money is money and I highly doubt that remove PvE players from High Seas would cause chaos to the degree that some have insinuated here.

As for your comment: "You also have to consider, that players aren't the best judge of what they actually want or whatis best for long term health of the game. If devs gave players what they demanded, every new piece of content would instantly be made easier and less of a grind to be finished quickly so they can go back to complaining about lack of content..."
There are always solutions, in many games servers/gamemodes that are "peaceful" Devs will increase the exp needed to level up making it more of a grind and giving players who are not into just PvE more of an incentive to play High Seas. I know that even if it took my twice as long to level up I would still choose to play PvE over PvPvE.

Have we considered that it’s the devs game and they decide what goes into it? If they don’t feel splitting the player base is good for the game, then they won’t do it. They have a clear vision for their game and Safer Seas is a clear indication they won’t compromise the main feeling of Sea of Thieves. It’s time for players to stop crying that the game isn’t the exact way they want it to be and either play what’s available or find another game.