What i think Rare did wrong recently

@zaannox this is something that would need sorting out for balance. Maybe if you sink a ship, the ship you sink should be able to see your location for a short time, there would be no bounty. As more ships get sunk the bounty system would come into play and you would become more visible.(4 square block radius?) If you continue sinking ships then the bounty would continue to increase and eventually the whole server would be able to see your location.

@heavyreaper102 sagte in What i think Rare did wrong recently:

What I think Bugaboo Bill did wrong recently:

1. You are starting from an improper position; from a confirmation bias. You cannot state from the beginning "rare isn't being fair to PVE players." then cherry-pick your complaints and nonsense to fit your position, because you are then giving a false argument from a privileged standpoint. A much better way to start this would simply have been "I don't think rare is fair to pve, here are reasons 1 2 and 3..."

Sounds like your own confirmation bias.
Can you show me were i talked about "Rare is not fair to pve'rs"?
My topic is about Rare is attracting PvPers to a game mainly about PvE.
To compete for PvE like Forts or to defend your stuff and to plunder others is one thing. Good to have, makes it more thrilling and without PvP beeing possible and an option to act or react it for sure becomes rather boring.
But to decide what is boring or not is a personal decision.
My point was Rare need to be cautios who they want to attract.
And that hardcore pvpers who anyway won't like Arena that much, because it's again about PvE and compete about PvE, often don't care for others fun but have fun on the cost of others.
They more they cry, the more fun they have. That's just the truth and you can even read in this topic when they agree and underline it.
That is not a confirmation bias, but 33 years of experience playing games.
I'm not against pvp, i'm against exagerating toxic hardcore gamers what get attracted by the Arena and come to mainly spoil the game for others with their attitude and quality of speech.

2. On your statement of "arena is just for those pvpers who only want to kill other players." No. that statement is horribly false, and you obviously decided you did not have to educate yourself on the update before complaining on forums. As stated in The Arena TRAILER, the arena gamemode is essentially a four crew rush mode to see who can dig up, and cash in the most chests as possible before the match ends. Does it have a lot of emphasis on competition? YES, pvp is encouraged, attacking other ships for their chests or just to slow them down, but it is not just a lobby for you to throw a ship in and go around murdering people.

Exactly, and recent observations of mine show, they attracted people who are only out for murder and ruin others game for ruining itself, because that's they way they have fun.
They dont pvp in a playful manner they pvp in a toxic way, throw insults at you and want you to ragequit.
That is what they have attracted with "The Arena" and open insiders.

3. As for you thinking rare is ignoring the PVE aspect, you obviously haven't heard of the Tall Tales. Again, someone hasn't decided to learn all the facts before, ironically, making a thread about toxic people that is in itself toxic.

I encourage you to present facts next time you don't like something, as it makes people a lot more keen to hear your argument.

I dont take advices presented that harsh and less empathic.
I also didn't in any way say Rare does not care for PvE.
The game is full of PvE, nearly all progress and commendations, except a handfull is about PvE.
PvP is until a fraction of gameplay and more of an option and freedom to act.
And thats good as long as the community is mainly playing a game for fun especially when pvp'ing in a playful way.
If exagerating hardcore pvpers with insults as normal way to communicate come in masses, this gamedesign wont work anymore, because then it becomes mainly griefing the carebears who pve only.
Those who always insist it's Sea of Thieves not Friends missed something completely.
It's a PvPvE game right?
We set sail for treasures (pve) and make Friends (ally), compete (pvp) and even rob each other right?
So it's not only or mandatory about Thieves, but about Thieves & Friends.
And this only works if the community is balanced.
And my point was Rare need to be cautios what sort of players they are attracting.

@nabberwar sagte in What i think Rare did wrong recently:

Try this: if next time you meet pvpers tell them you are either a pvp only player and you want them to fight you Endlessly all over, because you want to learn and adapt and you dont mind loosing, let's have a challenging fight i can learn and adapt from.

Guess what happens?

9 out of 10 PvPers wont agree, you are no longer getting upset and you are no longer make them having fun.

You've created this box of what you think a PvP'er is, and you attached that thought across the entire community. Most of the Crews we faced who were just PvPing, were pretty chill, hell, we even got GG's out of them.

Theirs this idea that everything toxic about this game is only because of PvP, anyone who thinks that, needs to take a look at their own community. The amount of PvE crews (Run away as soon as possible) that sink gracefully are far between. I've been called more racist/homophobic slurs by these people then I have by other PvP'ers. God forbid I interrupt their Reapers Run Voyage, they don't seem to see the irony in that. When in reality, it doesn't even matter what they were doing. They would have complained no matter the voyage. Hell, I've been told I'm ruining the game cause I was in the process of stealing their Gilded Athena. Uploaded a video of it, some of the comments said I should be banned, when nothing remotely toxic was even said to the crew. When a game allows thievery, expect thieves.

No group is immune to toxic people, lets not attach them to just one.

I dont have created a Box of what a pvper is i also do pvp i sometimes even seek to plunder someone, i just talked about attracting toxic griefers.
Read more carefully.

And i agree on toxic loosers and people who cant stand it and become toxic therefore.

@zaannox sagte in What i think Rare did wrong recently:

thank you to @FreaKtmONLINE for letting me know that he repeatedly posts this every week. I'll flag it as a repeat post and hopefully moderators will take care of it.

Fun facts to both of you:
https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/user/bugaboo-bill/topics

Cant take you both serious, all i read is you got triggerd, didn't understand what i'm talking about, maybe even didn't read carefully but as the expected sort of players you are jump on me and do silly comments.
Most comments in this thread, not only yours are derailing and of topic, filled with assumptions about my pvp and whatnot.

Just for the record, I am also against your post. I don't think they are attracting toxic people by introducing Arena. I've said this once and I'll say it again; PvEers should be on their hands and knees thanking Rare for making this mode. Because now instead of having crews chase you for hours and sink your ship you guys can all play Sea of Friends while the PvPers kill each other in Arena. It's a win-win scenario and that fact that you even dared to complain about it shows me the type of player you are. You're mad that PvPers got something for once, just because Rare decided to focus on someone other than you.

rofl

@princes-lettuce sagte in What i think Rare did wrong recently:

I agree. If players attack you because they want your loot, then it's okay because that belongs in a pirate game. But many players sink you just to sink you and bully you until you leave the server. And they love it when you panic and feel sad. It ruins the experience of many players, especially those who like to focus on pve.

And we have this confirmed in this thread alone.
Killing for killing itself is the fun and if Rare attracts more people who come to kill other players only, dont care for any PvE in this game, but only killing players then this is also not what the game is about. And they will dislike the Arena because the Arena is again about competing over PvE.
Without PvE there is nothing.
But players who are out to only harass, ruin and spoil the game for others are the wrong players attracted.
There is nothing to say against playful pvp with people who like the pvpve aspect. I do very much like it.
People who do pve and pvp, people who dont exagerate and go for pvp because they are bored or do pvp too only harass others over and over treat it like a RTS pvp Match or a Deathmatch Ego Shooter.

If i or we attack, then only if the other has loot or attacked first.
I help repairing someones ship, if they have no loot and i attacked for nothing.
Let them play further, i maybe comeback later when you hopefully have loot.
To make it pure pvp like someone said before and find allways a cause to sink someone over and over is not playful, it's harassing and disencouraging and ignoring the PVE aspect of the game.
They dont come to PvPvE, they come for KoS and killing for killing itself to dominate.
In the end they dominate nobody, because nobody is left.

As i said, some childs play and admire butterflys, some ripp their wings of and laugh.
We not only dont need this sort of gamers, Rare should do everything to not attract this sort of gamers.
But Arena's all over the world are full of them, because they crave for recognition and are full of aggressiveness and toxicity.

And this sort of players i recently encountered way more often.
Therefore i made this post, because i think Rare attracted more toxic talking gamers who's fun is mainly to spoil your fun and not to pvp in a playful way.

@Zaannox

And i say attracting people who kill for killings sake are the wrong people to attract for a game mainly about PvE.
Edit: or a game concept we have what is about pvpve and not pvp alone aka killing for killings sake!

And people who kill for killings sake aren't all, but often less empathic and toxic jerks.
That's my opinion!

Have a nice day and expect me "daily" - lol insider joke - posting stuff like this, because i'm on a crusade versus pvpers.facepalm
attention this may contain sarcasm.
I'm still waiting for what your report did rofl

Just a thought comes to my mind...

Rare's idea and concept about PvP is not killing for killings sake!
Why i assume that, because all PvP incentives until were to compete for PvE content and Rewarda like Forts, Rum Runner Voyages where you need to expose yourself to PvP with the reapers flag while having tons of loot.
Arena is the same thing it's a rush mode competing for pve treasures to get asap and to defend it or to steal it, but guess what is more efficient and more giving to win a match?!

So, it's not Rare's fault people exploit the game, [mod edited] and exagerate about gaming 10+ hours get bored and therefore start harassing others for nothing else but harassing and boredom or people think it's their griefers heaven of unprotected pve carebears!

The idea of PvP in this game is as I understand it to compete over PvE and it's rewards and not to go out and KoS.
Yes nobody can stop that, jerks stay jerks.
Point is, don't attract them and don't reward their style of gameplay it adds nothing.
The thrill and tension coming from beeing attackable is good, pvpve is good, people coming for your booty and doing their pirate business is good.
But...
people having fun to spoil your game and kill you over and over for killing itself are just toxic jerks and don't fit into the initial idea of this game.
You cannot prevent them coming, but you need not invite them and attract them with an "Arena" mode what implies it's about fighting and killing each other only.
I bet some rule the place in no time to then come and harass adventure mode with camping hot spots and killing for killing itself.
Ruining others Tall Tales for their fun!

And that is not good for the community!

What many then answer is git guud it's sea of Thieves not Friends is less empathic and to some degree toxic too.
Well as said above it's about Thieves and Friends !
Refusing to see that and approach sea of Thieves like a
deathmatch fps is not healthy to the community.

If people start arguing now, loot is worthless and they don't care for pve or the rewards of it, they have it all allready and therefore they got bored and now harass other players they are truly jerks and not welcome on the playground!

My opinion!

@Zaannox right, if you do this comparison it's competing for a pve Goal. Significantly other mode than a deatmatch or a Team deatmatch.
And SoT's pve Goals are a little bit more complex and therefore even more pve'ish than standing in a circle or place/unarm the bomb or whatever.
What you do if you say kill for killings sake, not care for loot is you do a deatmatch.
You say you prevent them from armoring up, but others although they need to armor up dont play to do that, they mainly all play to do pve in this game and most of us, me included like if we here and there compete over the pve and need to be cautios about who is around and how they act.
If a lot of DM type players come attracted by Arena, to kos and kill for killings sake then i fear this will not correlate well with Adventure Mode.
I cannot and wont prevent or argue versus some KOS DM players, but it's wrong to attract them imho, because the game and mainly the community have another approach to play the game.
And recently there were more encounters with this type of player.
Last days i need to say were calm.
Easter maybe and even the last one has finished the Reaper's Runs.

We will see, the Arena to me is attracting players who dont fit well into community and game.
People who get bored and kill people are not that welcome than people who make and have fun while pvp with you and not on your costs.

And yes you can feel the difference if somones intention is to kill you for killings sake and make it a serious thing to him and someone who kills you while playing a game, need or want your stuff, but is doing it all in a playful way.

Just to remember

@freaktmonline sagte in What i think Rare did wrong recently:

i wish i could see what servers you >are on and join it, just to hunt you >every single day, all day until you >rage quit this game and go wherever it >is that wimps go to die... that way we >dont have to open a thread and see its >just the same bugaloo bill topic again >.... and again ... and again

That was the buddy you jumped on to "help" and reported me for making posts what imho are at least are critic about pvp, not against pvp in general.

I know the difference between someone fouls me while playing and someone fouls me to hurt me seriously.

And that is what makes people upset.
This approach and seriousness about pvp and not pvp'ing playful and "friendly", but toxic.
I dont say you do this, but it's a difference between
"Hi Bill, send you to the ferry thanks for the loot man, dont take it personal, next time it's you who plunder me or whatever laugh."
And
"owned you m....f... bi..., i will kill you over and over until you quit.

And i wouldn't say it if things in my experience wouldnt have changed to the bad.
Maybe timezone, maybe Region idk i only can say i feel they attracted the wrong people.
And i hope it flattens out over time.
Just a feedback of mine, not really worth to discuss it that much.

@sot-snorelonn sagte in What i think Rare did wrong recently:

To the person who made this thread... Sounds like you are just upset about ONE occurrence that happened to you.

Wrong, so i dont know what you ate talking about.
Completely offtopic and completely wrong about me.

@zaannox sagte in What i think Rare did wrong recently:

@bugaboo-bill I have not experienced many of the types of players you are describing. The worst I see is someone calling me a bad player as their ship is sinking, so like, how do you even respond to that? Lol. Maybe because I don’t lose often I don’t see this side of Sea of Thieves. I’m usually the aggressor not the victim. My crew and I also use discord, we rarely talk in-game; and when we do it’s to say, “Good fight” in the ferry. We very much are the, “We are going to kill you, but we’re not going to be jerks about it” because that takes all the fun out of it. IMO.

Just to say i mostly talk about attackers that got sunk by us :D

No joke, yesterday we were on a brigg and sunk twice to lazy aproaching a Kraken and a Ship Raid with plenty of loot (Athena, 2 Forts, Meg).
Saved all thanks to the rowboat, but we got also attacked by some another RoxxorBunnyhopper Brigg Crew who attacked.
They sank and cursed.
It's mostly the "i'm super cool hardcore Roxxor bunnyhoppers" who cant stand loosing versus carebears and casuals like me.

I think i got sunk 3 times this year by players and maybe sunk 30 or even more.
I'm not a salty looser, i'm not a solo slooper loosing stuff and gets outplayed.
Mostly i'm in the winning team too.
This thread was also based on lately insider and Arena experiences.

@tomboi123 sagte in What i think Rare did wrong recently:

@bugaboo-bill I like this game a lot but I hate pvp not just bc I’m bad at it but because that’s not what I load this game and want to do, I primarily like sailing, adventuring and doing the treasure quests but it’s so annoying doing all these long quests sailing across the map and have some guy and his friend who’s just logged on blow my ship apart and take everything yes I know this is sea of thieves but I personally wish there was a pve gamemode and wouldn’t even bother me if I only get 25% of the normal gold rate just don’t find pvp fun especially when there’s stuff like skeleton ships which I’ve had pop up next to me while I’m running away from a ship and had them continuously keep me in a cursed state

I understand that and although i prefer Adventure mode with having PvP as an option, just not that much a lot of toxic talking people what mostly is cause by pvp.
I would grant you and all who want a pve server a pve server, i wouldnt either want you to have less or no progress at all.
If you ask me you can have it all "easier" without beeing exposed to pvp.
It would'nt devalue my journey to PL and A10.
And sometimes i would also like to opt out and solo on my private pve Playground.

I recently played on a 5 Galleon Alliance Server, nice, much income, but i need to say it would be boring to me too if it were the inly way to play.
I'd appreciate options and to play to my likings and mood i have today, depending on the people around i can play with or if i just want to be alone because i had a bad day.
If you really "hate" pvp and all that, and i understand that and i dont say pve only is boring in general, this is very individual and mood dependent then search for a bigger community who organizes Alliance fleets.
This way you can "mod" the game to your likings more until Rare comes up with a Private Server thing or whatever.