Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?

Why? Because what you maybe saw as “cheat” could be confused with. “Just better than you”

Proof and report it by support.
Proof always needed.

Most average players aren't getting targeted by those kinds of players, at least so obviously. Average players aren't that great in combat and if they got steamrolled, there is a likely chance someone better than them just rolled up.

It's the experienced, streaming, above-average players that tend to have a better say regarding this because not only are they willing to usually record their incidents, but they're also better than most players in combat, and get falsely accused of cheating themselves because of their basic skill of climbing up on a ladder and slaying an entire ship's crew solo.

That's why most of us are writing off this situation, experienced players don't come to the forum to complain about the lack of an anti-cheat, they do their best to report any suspicious behavior to SoT Support, as OP absolutely should.

The Rare staff will always say there is an anti-cheat in place in the game, but will never specify what it is to prevent malicious players breaking through it (which doesn't make a difference because they're breaking through it anyways, and to mainly target Reapers, players at FotD, or streamers with a lot of viewers).

1). It does have an anti-cheat (albeit not the greatest) according to Rare

2). Even games using the gold-standard BattlEye anti-cheat still have cheaters

3). Cheaters create fresh accounts time and time again after they are banned

4). Unless Rare decides they're going to limit the number of users that can be created on a single purchased copy of the game, then there's no way to stop #3 from happening over and over again

5). Players are often accused of cheating just because they won...I got a slew of messages yesterday from a crew we sunk telling me how I cheated and I hacked the sword and modded it to do things it shouldn't do...I play Xbox + controller 🤣

Welcome to online gaming

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

Cheats are a problem in Sea of ​​Thieves, anyone who denies this possibly using these programs too. I can't understand how a community can be against something beneficial to the game, is it that hard to play without aimbot or playerlist?

While I agree cheating is here, I don't think it is on the levels of a game like Tarkov by far.

Therefore, I don't feel the need to hand over snapshots of all my hard disks connected to my PC, install a keylogger that is outside of my control to turn off, video recorder/screenshot tool that is outside of my control to turn off, all to combat ~0.1% or less of the player base that I may or may not meet and could easily record video of and report if I did. I tolerate it there because of the rampant level of ~10% of the player base between the straight cheaters and the RMT community.

Here's hoping that machine learning server sided AC starts getting more accurate over the next 1-2 years off of player reports and it's own catches.

Now if you feel it necessary to take such measures, if you won't mind zipping up an archive of all your PC's data and send it to me, install this "protective program" I will provide, and e-sign this document I will provide saying that "any information I collect will be kept confidential" that means nothing enforceable in international law, then sure let's throw Battley....some AC program on this game.

@targasbr Yea man this one time I headshot this guy with my sniper rifle and he didn't die, pretty sure he was cheating.

In all seriousness its hard to take these accusations seriously when so many players confuse hitreg, lag, and poor understanding of game mechanics with cheating. I saw on reddit that someone thought that people having a large amount of supplies must be cheating.

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

@kommodoreyenser said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

Cheats are a problem in Sea of ​​Thieves, anyone who denies this possibly using these programs too. I can't understand how a community can be against something beneficial to the game, is it that hard to play without aimbot or playerlist?

While I agree cheating is here, I don't think it is on the levels of a game like Tarkov by far.

Therefore, I don't feel the need to hand over snapshots of all my hard disks connected to my PC, install a keylogger that is outside of my control to turn off, video recorder/screenshot tool that is outside of my control to turn off, all to combat ~0.1% or less of the player base that I may or may not meet and could easily record video of and report if I did. I tolerate it there because of the rampant level of ~10% of the player base between the straight cheaters and the RMT community.

Here's hoping that machine learning server sided AC starts getting more accurate over the next 1-2 years off of player reports and it's own catches.

Now if you feel it necessary to take such measures, if you won't mind zipping up an archive of all your PC's data and send it to me, install this "protective program" I will provide, and e-sign this document I will provide saying that "any information I collect will be kept confidential" that means nothing enforceable in international law, then sure let's throw Battley....some AC program on this game.

I invite you to play on SA servers. Currently I've preferred playing on NA servers with 200+ ping than having to put up with cheaters, and let's face it, I usually sink them without too much trouble, but it's really annoying.

Record and report. I usually end up on EU servers with 180+ ping (somehow, with 1gb fiber and hardwired cat6 net/router) as most of my SoT friends are there and I am N/A.

SA servers and cheating are an issue with any game. They should just lock it for mainland Asia players as there really isn't a way to stop them from playing when you can just create a new XBL account for free and continue playing. I see Azure has Australia locations but unsure if they have SoT server support in that region.

It does.

I refer you to previous discussions on this topic.

https://www.seaofthieves.com/community/forums/topic/143922/why-doesn-t-the-game-have-an-anti-cheat/15

https://www.seaofthieves.com/community/forums/topic/146614/current-state-of-the-game-perspective-from-your-core-community-we-need-an-anti-cheat-system/9

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

@kommodoreyenser said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

@kommodoreyenser said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

Cheats are a problem in Sea of ​​Thieves, anyone who denies this possibly using these programs too. I can't understand how a community can be against something beneficial to the game, is it that hard to play without aimbot or playerlist?

While I agree cheating is here, I don't think it is on the levels of a game like Tarkov by far.

Therefore, I don't feel the need to hand over snapshots of all my hard disks connected to my PC, install a keylogger that is outside of my control to turn off, video recorder/screenshot tool that is outside of my control to turn off, all to combat ~0.1% or less of the player base that I may or may not meet and could easily record video of and report if I did. I tolerate it there because of the rampant level of ~10% of the player base between the straight cheaters and the RMT community.

Here's hoping that machine learning server sided AC starts getting more accurate over the next 1-2 years off of player reports and it's own catches.

Now if you feel it necessary to take such measures, if you won't mind zipping up an archive of all your PC's data and send it to me, install this "protective program" I will provide, and e-sign this document I will provide saying that "any information I collect will be kept confidential" that means nothing enforceable in international law, then sure let's throw Battley....some AC program on this game.

I invite you to play on SA servers. Currently I've preferred playing on NA servers with 200+ ping than having to put up with cheaters, and let's face it, I usually sink them without too much trouble, but it's really annoying.

Record and report. I usually end up on EU servers with 180+ ping (somehow, with 1gb fiber and hardwired cat6 net/router) as most of my SoT friends are there and I am N/A.

SA servers and cheating are an issue with any game. They should just lock it for mainland Asia players as there really isn't a way to stop them from playing when you can just create a new XBL account for free and continue playing. I see Azure has Australia locations but unsure if they have SoT server support in that region.

I've lost count of how many players I reported and saw banned, but, maybe you don't know, there is already a method to circumvent the ban and they always come back with new accounts. I know cheats are an issue in many games, but it's ironic for an online gaming community to hate anti-cheats, everyone should be in favor of safer ways to play the game the right way.

Going the super aggressive kernel level software AC that I personally see as too invasive enough to not have those games on my main PC isn't going to change a thing though. That program will still ban, cheat sellers will find a way around it, and they will still create a new free XBL account. Battleye even got worked around lately if you keep up with the news and players resorted to hardware style cheats with faked firmware to hide them. They are literally Game Genie-ing Tarkov and not getting banned. The only true way around that is with machine learning AC which is what Microsoft is trying to develop to get ahead of the curve. Software or hardware cheats won't matter at that point because behavior is constantly monitored and cheating behavior might be subtle but can never be completely hidden when you have info other players don't. The downside is it needs data and time to adapt. That's what reports are for beyond initial bans.

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

I know cheats are an issue in many games, but it's ironic for an online gaming community to hate anti-cheats, everyone should be in favor of safer ways to play the game the right way.

It's not ironic when you realise the only way for them to be any way effective is to be active at a kernel level (as already mentioned). Kernel level access is not something you want to give software that you don't control. It gives the software access to 100% of your PC and isn't full proof. Plus there are bigger concerns over potential bugs in the software bricking your PC. Not to mention it can flag a lot of legit software (especially those used for accessibility) as cheats.

Machine learning and behavioral analysis is in its early days but DLSS has shown that AI tools can get better over time. For server side anti-cheat, it's always going to be reactive so it doesn't look as effective as client side software but it's a lot harder for cheat makers to find exploits. This is why even when games like Call of Duty: Warzone use Kernel level anticheat (Ricochet), they still use AI server side as well.

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

We use operating systems that monitor us all the time, and well, this is a "windows-only" game community. Chrome, Facebook, Instagram, several other programs monitor everything we do. Your phone and/or Alexa is listening to everything you say. I don't understand the fear of an anticheat.

It's not always about legitimate uses. I'm not overly fussy with privacy concerns in general, beyond the obvious. But when you give kernel access to third-party software you have to be able to trust 100% that the software will never be compromised. Which videogame companies will never promise. There is no guarantee that malware and ransomware makers won't target it and use that access as a backdoor exploit.

When it comes to phones and such, the OS is built in tandem with the hardware. Third-party apps are limited in what they can do unless you use jailbreaks or other hacks. Again though, that brings up why Kernel level anticheat won't be fullproof and there are ways around it for those determined enough.

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

@realstyli said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

We use operating systems that monitor us all the time, and well, this is a "windows-only" game community. Chrome, Facebook, Instagram, several other programs monitor everything we do. Your phone and/or Alexa is listening to everything you say. I don't understand the fear of an anticheat.

It's not always about legitimate uses. I'm not overly fussy with privacy concerns in general, beyond the obvious. But when you give kernel access to third-party software you have to be able to trust 100% that the software will never be compromised. Which videogame companies will never promise. There is no guarantee that malware and ransomware makers won't target it and use that access as a backdoor exploit.

When it comes to phones and such, the OS is built in tandem with the hardware. Third-party apps are limited in what they can do unless you use jailbreaks or other hacks. Again though, that brings up why Kernel level anticheat won't be fullproof and there are ways around it for those determined enough.

So I think everyone here should just remove the wifi card and cables from their computers, as no system is 100% secure.
The excuses for not having anti-cheating (and using cheats) are getting more and more elaborate, keep it up.

So I never said giving up is the way to go, quite the opposite with what I stated. Might be a language barrier here IDK. They also have AC, as was repeatedly stated and with links. So the excuse and false information about them not having AC is getting more and more hilarious.

Also, reducing risk is the name of the game with cyber security and personal identifying information/data. Condoms are only 99.9% effective but they don't stop pregnancy. Combined with birth control, it is only 99.999% effective. "Well, might as well not bother with all that since it's not 100%" is what you are stating when you talk about IT security in such ways.

Throwing out your profession does nothing for a logical discussion btw. I rarely bring it into these forums but I work for one of the World's largest cloud computing companies designing and deploying cloud solutions, my wife has a Masters in Cyber Security, I think we know a little something about data security 😉

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

So I think everyone here should just remove the wifi card and cables from their computers, as no system is 100% secure.

Strawman argument. You can't compare having internet access to giving a video game full access to your computer to do whatever it wants.

The excuses for not having anti-cheating (and using cheats) are getting more and more elaborate, keep it up.

They're not excuses, they are concerns. If Rare came out and said they are adding client side anti-cheat, I wouldn't object, as long as it's not kernel level - but then it would only be a placebo, at best.

If they added kernel level anti-cheat, I would stop playing unless they could guarantee my PC and my private information are not at risk - which they can't.

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

It's a total waste of time trying to talk here, the community deserves the neglect, I don't even know why I tried.

We are having a discussion about the pros and cons of adding client side solutions to detect cheating.

There's no neglect.

As already established, the game has anti-cheat. The debate is whether that is enough or if more drastic additional steps are necessary or more effective in the long run.

The cheat makers are already ahead of anything that can be done at a local level, so the future has to be server-side and AI/machine learning is the best way to do it efficiently.

If you're a general going into war, do you throw more troops as cannon fodder at an unwinnable battle, or do you develop better long-range weapons?

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

Oh, and even banned, they can create new accounts. So it's okay, right?

That's not the debate I was having. I was solely discussing the detection side.

Of course I want to see more measures in place on the enforcement side. I don't believe more than a handful of accounts should be able to be tied to a single purchase of the game. But I don't know the solution to that problem when the game is practically free to play (Game Pass trial) anyway.

@d3adst1ck said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

I think the current unlimited account system is fine. What should be happening is that if any shared account gets a ban, it should apply to all accounts in that family group.

That's certainly one way they could do it, for sure. I'd have no problem with that.

The only good thing about client side anti-cheat is that it makes some people feel good. In terms of effectiveness, there are always still blatant cheats in games that have client side anti-cheat.

That's kind of what I meant by "placebo". And I'd have no objections to non-kernel level anti-cheat if that's the intent, but that's all it would be. I'm not sure anything they do client side would be enough for a lot of folks.

@targasbr said in Why Sea of Thieves haven`t a Anti-Cheat?:

... but it's sad to know that there are people who are against anti-cheats in online games, and worse, for no real reason.
Either you are in favor of anti-cheating, or you are a cheater.

I don't think anyone has spoken against anti-cheat here in this thread, only certain implementations.

We have given multiple actual reasons why client-side solutions are not the answer, and we have lauded server-side AI/machine learning as the way forward... and that is already a thing.

@targasbr my brother in christt no one says that they are against anti cheat here holy hell.

@targasbr *better anticheat