Why Some Do Not Like PvP (polite discussion)

As horrible as it sounds, if you don't like the game don't play.

I think this needs to be a valid comment, I don't like playing Stardew Valley, I certainly won't ask them to include PvP to cater to "that crowd"

If people have anxiety when meeting other people (which we all did/still do) then they shouldn't play, there's nothing wrong with that. This game cannot cater to all. I mean I wouldn't play WoW if I didn't want to interact with people.

What I don't understand is why people want to change the game by adding a "Solo" or "PvE" game, I honestly think it's to do with Games as a Service.

If the game had released with the Anniversary Update as a full game (with the dreaded DLCs) then I don't think people would be asking for it as much, as it would be the nature of the game.

But since it is GaaS everybody feels they know whats best

I think it stems from viewing this game as a single-player campaign, a commonality in other video games we are all aware of. An attitude of "I've got all this stuff to do in this game, like voyages and exploring, and there are environmental elements trying to kill me, so why should I also have to deal with other players?" It's a viewpoint I can empathize with, because it isn't often that a game like this (especially for those of us who enjoy all things nautical) sticks the landing so perfectly.

Admittedly, when I first started playing I really disliked the PvP aspect, but I've grown comfortable with it. Now I enjoy interactions, whether it's defending my ship, attacking another, or outsailing that foolish galleon that thinks it can catch me. And that's the advice I would give to the PvErs...just give yourself some time to get murdered by some crews and hone your skills. Before you know it you'll rarely be catching pink flames on the ferry.

@electricknights

Thanks for sharing your perspective without insisting that the game is broken or wrong for being what it is! I am personally someone who prefers theft, ship battling, and just strategizing the best ways to steal loot from others.

I always say in praise of this game, that there is literally no other game in existence that allows for as many different kinds of encounters in one single shared world as Sea of Thieves allows for. It's all happening in one place, no separate servers for PvE or PvP - that's what makes it special.

This makes me enjoy getting out of my box to embrace a myriad of different encounters that might happen, rather than just sinking all ships. I hope your partner can easily see the beauty in this game design as well!

P.S. A lot of players tend to get wrapped up in this feeling that they're entitled to a single player experience undisturbed by others, when this really is not the case as they have purchased a multiplayer shared world game - I certainly don't think any less of anyone who prefers not to be bothered, but I think those players need to understand and accept that they did buy a social shared world multiplayer game.

@electricknights said in Why Some Do Not Like PvP (polite discussion):

[I was going to post this as a thread of tweets, but decided not to go to social media with this right now and just share it with you fine pirate folk. Please excuse the abbreviations and such, as this was typed to fit into twitter character limits!!]

[I hope people can read this for the polite inspection of psychology and philosophy behind these ideas, and not get mired in defensiveness or divisive rhetoric!]

Why my partner dislikes PvP in open world games: She generally hates most people 😁(for being rude jerks) & dislikes uninvited interaction with such ppl (tho she understands she volunteers for it by playing).
Just thought this was a simple explanation worth sharing. #SeaOfThieves

I am in no way saying games are wrong for having open PvP or that it should be changed in SoT. And, from all our discussions neither does my partner wish that.
Some people just don't like it & most often people assume it is because of losing to others - which is often not true.

One example: She was playing & was being attacked by a few ships on her server. She completed the voyage successfully & lost zero treasure. However, she was annoyed with having to deal with the other people.
I know. Single player and co-ops are better for her. No argument! 😀

I just find it interesting. One often overlooked aspect of PvP is some people get a seriously negative reaction to the adrenaline PvP can bring. It can have something to do with existing anxiety, but I'm sure there are many reasons.
Just another thing to think about.

Why did I post any of this? Not to change any games. Not to change any minds. Just to share, pass on different perspectives, and promote polite discussion about this topic, instead of pure division and animosity.
In the end, games are just about fun. Nothing too serious. 😁

For the record, I LOVE the PvP combat in SoT. Although, I also LOVE the NonPvP content AND other types of player interactions that are possible in SoT.

I just thought it's an interesting subject that is often handled poorly in public discussions. And the divide is perpetuated by what is passed off as "cool" and what supposedly isn't.
It's cool to not be all about PvP. It's no less cool than being all about PvP.
⚖️

ok?

Ok, im known as seeking for genuine things, and I like to call things by their name, so:

Piracy: To attack ships and coasts to ROB what they have.

And, this is PvPvE, all simultaneously, if you think else, you are lying yourself.
Dont lie yourself saying "Im a strange kind of pirate who doesnt do piracy".
Teachers teach, runners run, fishermans fish, and miners mine; I dont think a pirate would have to be different on this aspect... Else, would be usefull to make some titles called: Archeologist, Merchant, and Mercenary. And NO way about being called a legend who no one remembers!!

Anyway, if you go to the square to play chess or ping-pong, you must respect your opponent, and same on any game.

This is supposed to be a ROLEPLAYING game... if you want to have the same real life personality inside this villain game, and to be a pirate... well, your ethic is twisted as a pirate, because you are as same on both places, I must say at that: good work!

If you quit robbery on the sea at this game... mean, making it PvE... well you are killing the game! Its a game of robbery! skeletons never rob, they just kill, and you cannot call steal if you take something from undead, since they doesnt have soul anymore, and if you dont posses a soul, you just cannot have anything.

@el-kape eh, I still think this is a sailor game and not a pirate game. It reminds me more of Sinbad the sailor stories than Treasure Island.

Nothing pirate about it.
Sailors sail. Sailors deliver loot. Sailors fight. Sailors have Kraken, mermaid, and skeleton lore.

Keep on sailing you salty sailor.

And why can't we court the governor's daughter. Sid Meier let us 10 years ago. That was a great pirate game.

@blatantwalk4260 said in Why Some Do Not Like PvP (polite discussion):

@saskeks I think that actually sums of the issues of pvp for people. You have hit registration issues, you have a combat system the caters to one system and puts people on another system at a disadvantage, and the many bugs that can turn a fight to favor another crew. You mix all these things with pvp can cost you progress and I think it does.agitate people.

The hit registration does need to be fixed, but declaring the combat favours one system is just false.

Console has access to exactly the same choices for input methods.

Instead the difference is between input, not platform.

The semantics of it are undeniable.

Bugs are universal, so I feel that's a bit of a moot subject to bring up.

For the thread OP, I can sympathize on the points with anxieties, but unfortunately the game is clear about what it is. Anxiety is a horrible thing to deal with, but I feel it sends a bad message out if the game caters on that basis.

@viperishemu2992 said in Why Some Do Not Like PvP (polite discussion):

I don't mind PvP. I'm not really in to it that much either. But it keeps the game exciting by keeping you on your toes.

I think that it's kind of pathetic when a crew of 4 (usually teenage men) goes around sneak attacking solo players just for the kicks. And then hiding their prepubescent sadistic tendencies behind the weak-sauce excuse that "they are just being pirates".

But I am also a well adjusted mature adult. So I can brush this off as normal, predictable, tragically frail human behaviour.

No real problems with PvP, just certain types of PvPers.

That righteousness 😂

In all seriousness though, as long as they don't break TOS, it's all good, People can dish out all the banter and PvP attack they want.

Its a simple answer I think, some people dislike PVP because it is a hindrance and annoyance to them, they would much prefer to play in a single player or PVE server because all they want to do is complete voyages level up and all the various other things the games offers other than participate in PVP and there's nothing wrong with that, even I understand that and i'm some one who does like to PVP but even so some times I really cant be bothered to PVP either.

also there are going to be people who are just unfortunately not very good at PVP or at the game in general, so naturally they wont want to participate in PVP if they don't have any confidence in their abilities and are likely to lose the battle, so again I understand why they don't want the hassle of PVP if they don't enjoy it.

I dont think its a bad idea if there was a PVE server but i dont think rare wants to go down that route.

@dr-katman said in Why Some Do Not Like PvP (polite discussion):

Its a simple answer I think, some people dislike PVP because it is a hindrance and annoyance to them, they would much prefer to play in a single player or PVE server because all they want to do is complete voyages level up and all the various other things the games offers other than participate in PVP and there's nothing wrong with that, even I understand that and i'm some one who does like to PVP but even so some times I really cant be bothered to PVP either.

also there are going to be people who are just unfortunately not very good at PVP or at the game in general, so naturally they wont want to participate in PVP if they don't have any confidence in their abilities and are likely to lose the battle, so again I understand why they don't want the hassle of PVP if they don't enjoy it.

I dont think its a bad idea if there was a PVE server but i dont think rare wants to go down that route.

Thing is, if there was, it should have zero rewards & zero recognition of commendations, why should people in a no risk scenario be able to achieve the same things as those that risk it all.

The player base is already divided enough as well, so it's highly unlikely it will happen imo.

Hombre, amigo

Lucky? 😉

Sorry I didn't realise there was consequences for broadly speaking or to speculate & hypothesize in these parts 🤭

Hombre, amigo, compadre ...

Appreciate the apology..

I like it when you are "snippy" anyway, at least you spice the repetition here up a bit 👌

Not to go off topic though, I have anxiety to a degree myself, it can cripple some aspects of day to day life, for some reason though gaming with others is a coping mechanism, it kinda disappears while doing so, due to the escapism.

The worst thing would to be treated as a priority though because of it.

It actually amplifies the negativity, as all eyes are essentially on you so to speak.

Ooooooookey.

I think for a lot of people it's about control.

They want control over how they spend their time. They don't want to have to compromise what they are doing to accommodate the desires/goals/personalities of other people. It's not an unreasonable perspective, it's just incompatible with a game that is designed to be a shared adventure. To give Rare credit they've tried to strike a balance so that as far as possible people can control their experiences while still having the freedom to do what they want. You just can't have 100% of both because they're mutually exclusive.

I think a lot of it is down to the time it takes to do anything worthwhile in the game and if you only enjoy the reward of cashing-in and not the journey, then that feels like a waste of time if you lose it all at the end. Tall Tales especially falls into this category for many players.

The state of the game in terms of bugs, glitches, as well as perceived imbalances, uneven combat, annoying bunny hopping, spawn trapping, makes PvP encounters a chore for a lot of players who just can't deal with them, for whatever reason.

Personally, I just enjoy being in the world, and will frequently sail around aimlessly just to sail and explore. I do actively try to avoid PvP where I can (because of aforementioned bugs, etc,..), though I can usually hold my own when I'm forced to.

I think if you're not enjoying the game on that base level and see PvP as a hindrance then, yeah, a loss can seem a lot bigger than it otherwise would do.

@saskeks said in Why Some Do Not Like PvP (polite discussion):

we love to fight ship to ship and we are good at it,
but when it came to bunny hopping and wild spinning boarders we just hate pvp, it isn´t fun at all for us :(

aye

well I play a lot of solo, an some of the reasons are: Im only resposebel for myself, everything is in my control.
but as soon you are 2-4 players there are more reason to things go south an a battle break out, an that full control over a situation is gone.

Im one of the more friendly pirates, that will come over an talk, kinda putting myself in harms way.
But I always ask if I can come on board(manners)
make my pressent clear, an both use the megafon an chat wheel.

But as I said, as soon you add more players, things can go south quickly.
but when Im sailing a galleon, I sail the ship, give the orders, but I dont control what my crew mates do.
an when the fight has broken lose, you try helping your crew/ship.

when Im duo, we still play after my codex, but we are 2 very capable pirates, an cant count how many fort we have been "force" to take because one of crew mates decide to shoot me, instead of talking an let me take a mermaid back.

I never say no to an fight, so the ball is yours, if you know what i mean.
But many as you said, dont want the fight, an I as soon as they lose the fight, quit.

Im PlA10, without anything to do than grind out some commendations do the event stuff, an play how I like to play.
But I just need a little reason for revenge, an the thing I was up to, if I was even doing anything, would be out the window, an sinking you is first priority. sometimes saying "You F up big time there boys, Im PlA10 without anything to do than hunt you down"
sometimes I dont, If i sink, quickly shuttle, So they maybe think I rage quit, an then the hunt begins.

all the sessions/story start the same, In the Tarven, but how they end is up to the player.

The problem I have when people are asking for this an that, is that you are asking the dev team to divide ressources to things that in my mind, are a totally different game.

A friend of mine put it well.
Why he likes pvp orientated and i don't.
Endorfine, the rush of winning and loosing it all. the risk factor.
He plays for that feeling in open loot games like SoT (well he doesn't play SoT but similar games), and the risk of dying and difficulty in others like WoW Classic currently, with that also the social aspect of meeting new people.

Me, I hate loosing, challenges and difficulty in games.
But it doesn't mean i'd call myself a casual gamer, i have 30+ years of pc gaming behind me, most of it as full time gamer, i don't do mobile games, i've done competitive and serious ranked gaming in the past, but last time that happened was over 10 years ago.
Doesn't mean i don't like what Sea of Thieves still offers even for the solo player. And completionists who just enjoy, well completing games and getting achievements and such. I stick to BfA with WoW cause it's easy and i enjoy that, counter to my friend. It's an MMO, but i've played it as a single player game for 10+ years, cause i don't do the social aspect, it's been 12-13 years since i was last in a guild, cause i don't like other people, outside my trusted friends who have taken me almost 40 years to gather around me. And I haven't done pvp in an mmorpg in like 10+ years cause it offers me nothing, i don't chase that endorfine rush, yet i manage just fine by myself in an mmorpg. Perfectly happy without pvp or other people.

Same goes for SoT, i managed pirate legend and full athena in the first year. I mostly solo sloop still today, with 1000+ hours in to the game.
And get as much out of the game as the next guy, skellies is all the difficulty i need, sometimes even that's too much, but what can you do but keep going.

In a pvpve game the pvp is still optional if choose so.
There are multiple ways to go about it, specially if you want to solo sloop.

Some things are still easier in a group.
My guide:

1. Never gold hoard solo, in the long run gold is meaningless in the game, you'll come by more than you'll need the longer you play, if you go for forts or other pvp objectives always go galleon, even with randoms. Just server hop until you find a galleon crew doing a fort. Don't want to hop, use the lfg to find a crew.
   You don't need a mic, they don't need to be pros at the game, but it's going to be easier and galleons are less likely to be challenged at a fort, cause the enemy doesn't know what they are up against. If you can almost 1v2 1v3 1v4 as solo, use the galleon and other crew mates as cannon fodder to make your way, let them take the heat as you sink the enemy.
2. If do go solo and want the treasure. Take one thing at a time, never dig up more than you can carry. Dig 1 and sell and then go dig more, it is more time consuming but such is the solo way. Unless you manage find an empty chest to fit 3 smaller things you can solo carry.
3. Always get a rowboat, first thing joining a server, get a rowboat. You can use your sloop as bate, if you see that brig heading towards the island you're digging or killing skellies at. Unleash your empty sloop for them to chase and eventually scuttle it when it's far enough. Rowboat haul the loot to outpost, as it is much harder to detect in the open sea than a sloop. If being chased, dropping the rowboat is usually noticed, but you can use the fog and the storm to drop a rowboat of loot undetected and row away as your sloop is being chased.
4. If possible never let other crews see your voyage table. Scuttle before that is possible, no matter what you hold on board. Specifically if on Athenas, Sacrifice the loot you have.
5. Don't stock too much supplies, only what you think you're going to need.
6. Be aware of your surroundings, as much as possible. Going to an island, before going take high point and scan the horizon. If you see ships heading at you, do not continue to dig up or kill.
7. Optioning out of pvp. If you're caught red handed. Take the hit and just die. Don't respawn. Scuttle or change server if not on voyage. I almost never hit back. It is just faster for yourself to get back into doing things and saves you a headache, unless you're in to pvp, by all means defend yourself.
8. If you're being chased, you only should be having one thing on board. Full sails ahead, pick up treasure you have and jump off the ship from the other side where the people chasing can't see you jumped off. Dive as deep as you can with the treasure and drown denying them access to loot. Then scuttle your ship, Preferably before they reach it so they don't know what happened really and will have a very hard time tracking down the treasure as it surfaces up far from where you jumped off. It is as fine to deny loot as it's to pvp. The game is still called Sea of Thieves, you don't owe your loot to anyone.
9. If you have multiple things on board for whatever reason, prioritize. Drop lesser loot of the ship, chasers may start to prioritize to gather them up from the ocean, slowing them down. If not go to step 8.
10. If possible choose your play time. Avoid peak hours. Best times i've found to play solo are around 03.00am-06.00am and 09.00am-13.00pm, and i usually use those as my SoT time. But this requires usually you to not have a job or school. If you don't care about those, enjoy the games, but that's a personal choice.
11. Inspect your ship every time you've been away. If you don't know how, you can go to Twitch and open up SoT streamer flagged pvp. In an hour of watching or something they are more than likely to use hiding spots on different ships to infiltrate them. Revealing to you what to look for and how to find them on your ship if you suspect that. Still it's a good idea to check your ship if you've been away on an island regardless, sloop doesn't take that long to go through.
12. Use the edges of the map to move around, it doesn't always work, but there's less traffic on the edges than the middle. Specifically applies to Athena chests etc. Scope out outposts before going in. If you see another ship close or docked, do not tempt your luck. Sail to the next outpost. There's is that 1% chance that someone is camping the inn with a scuttled ship, but if that happens. Well as solo there's not really much to do against that, that loss you just have to take. Oh and if you have access to the last tall tale, you can use 1st stage, the Shroudbreaker to go in to the Shroud to avoid crews without it.
13. Trust no one. Don't accept alliances or expect them. It sounds tempting and might lead to friendships, but when you're solo, you're solo.
    Most likely they will only reveal your location to the other ship. In the case of Athenas and merc voyages the alliance can even reveal your voyage or quest stage and what loot you'll be carrying, cause some of those are not random or have very few random island options. At this point there are known Athena islands that Athena thiefs are very well aware off and camp just for that purpose.
14. In the case of Athenas and other rare items. When digging up. Do not go directly back to your ship with the item, when on medium large islands and you have no visual of your ship. Hide the item or better just break the first shovel only, usually doens't reveal the entire item that well. Check your ship and horizon, clear skelly waves (cause sometimes that can even take enough time for further away ships to reach you when not paying attention) and if clear then bring the item. Or find a random crate or chest of non value or cheap, usually islands have random loot. Bring it back first to throw off anyone waiting. Loose it intentionally and respawn elsewhere and come back later for the actual thing.
15. I prefer to deliver Athenas and other rarities by rowboat only, cause it's much more subtle. Scuttle ship or let it roam around empty. Use external maps or sky and big landmarks if you're not completely familiar with the world and outposts to navigate with the rowboat and use islands, storms and things as cover. Sometimes just big waves are enough. Reapers flag when not on board is also a good tool to distract other crews to chase ghosts as you row yourself in the opposite direction. Reaper's chest doesn't work like that, but if you want them. Finding a server with 3 up is usually a good sign of safer passage with one, doesn't guarantee it, but does show less interest in them. Although sometimes people will only come after one if someone else has gotten it. Then the best way is usually the step 8. Run away and drown yourself with it and despawn the chest, denying thieves access. Then just finding another server.

The thing about pvp is that it causes all of us to release hormones into both the medulla and cortex regions of the brain which helps to keep our long term memories sharp! That's right, being chased by a loaded galleon while solo slooping will actually help to prevent senility, Alzheimer's, and in some case studies reverse the effects of amnesia! This being the case I think Microsoft and RARE should team together and donate systems and games to assisted living facilities to help promote stable mental health to the patrons of such facilities! 😂😂😂 I'd love to hear the conversations of an elderly crew as they we're getting decimated in battle!😂😂😂😂 Wait!I didn't mean that last statement did I? 👀 It's a little true😀😀😀

@badassfro I believe that the point this guy is trying to make to make about pvp, is some people prefer pve over pvp, that would be the only thing they dislike about the game is the pvp aspect of it, to say to stop playing the game for one dislike is not a real valid reason to just stop playing a game that is enjoyable on a pve aspect.