Creative/Private Mode

@nofears-fun said in Creative/Private Mode:

@davidbarlow While I agree it could solve some issues, it would also create some. You invite three ships worth of friends onto a server and decide to dominate the server. You are now overpowering to anything else on that server. And would that then become a battle cry for griefing? I see the merits, but I would prefer private servers as I think it solves the issues without adding new ones to the general population.

Possibly. There would always be the option to start on another server though right? It has merits indeed. Like most things in game it could be abused in some circumstances. It will be left up to us with the game as it was intended for us to do, to make it right and the best experience for ourselves and the others we end up sailing with or against.

Private servers are coming... like it or not. So... what's the complaint again? I'm not a fan of this idea, but don't understand why people are still complaining about this when it's been stated that it will be coming?

@davidbarlow Because the people coming up with the ideas aren't considering the worst case scenarios or the potential exploits. It isn't the obligation of those opposed to ideas to come up with solutions to make them work.

@davidbarlow Wow, not sure why you are on the attack mate. I am merely pointing out the benefits I have seen talked about, some I even agree with. I don't necessarily agree with them all. And honestly, I have thought long and hard about this as this has been a topic of discussion for a very long time on these forums. I have seen both sides of the argument, and I was even against it for a long time. But as I said, I have changed my mind based on the many options it offers.

As for your suggest of adding one other crew, even that could be overpowering. Two galleons working together on a single server is pretty tough to go against. Especially for sloops and brigs. While it can still happen today with alliances, it is not nearly as common as it would be with an invite a friend to join server mode.

@davidbarlow I would also add, look up, I made a suggestion already on something that I feel would fix a big issue people have with private servers. I feel that loot rewards should be halved in a private server. Not completely gone, but halved. I also don't believe some events should be allowed in private servers like the current reapers flag event.

I guess I wasn't aware that I was supposed to detail the same arguments that have gone back and forth on this subject for many months now.

@davidbarlow Ummm... I know. But it's a free society and I'm allowed to express myself. If you don't like that... well... there are there are short docks and long walks.

Feedback works both ways.

Exactly my point. Thank you.

@bran-the-ent terrible idea in my opinion

@rokm-sokm-rabbi What is?

@bran-the-ent PVE servers lol. Ruins the point of the game, would be incredibly boring, and divided the server population. Big no for most pirates

@nofears-fun

A private server would be something separate from the game itself right? I am thinking like Conan Exiles and the like. There would be people hosting private instances of the game with settings configurable by the host. Could offer everything in the core game or many flavors of it right?

@davidbarlow Mate, again, private servers are not my idea. And it took me quite some time to get behind them. Invite friends would solve some of the issues mentioned, but not all. If you did limit it to one other ship as you suggest, then they would not solve community events. As you need the entire server for community events.

As for what I was trying to say, I already commented in this thread about some of the things you could do to solve issues that have been brought up, when someone is specific about their objections. So far you have not given specific reasons for being against it mate. So I have nothing to say other than reason for it.

@x-crowheart-x I guess, to be honest they are not my original idea, I simply got behind them after seeing back and forth feedback on it over time. So, I guess maybe I need to list some thoughts I have on private servers.

• Gold, rep, rewards for loot should be 50% of what they are in regular mode. My argument for this is that right now, you get double the reward in DR because the PvE is more difficult. In a private server you might have situations where it is used for PvE events or community events where the PvP threat just isn't there. And while PvP certainly is harder to overcome than most PvE content, you simply don't see it on the same frequency as you do the PvE threats. In fact, there are plenty of game sessions where no PvP occurs at all. But, because you remove that possible threat, the rewards should be reduced, but not removed completely. Why not removed completely, because there are still way more PvE threats than PvP threats and it would still be somewhat challenging.
• Most if not all special events like the current reapers event should not be added to private servers. Where is the fun in that?
• Not much should be customize-able on private servers. Why give someone the ability to turn off the kraken for example. If you did do that, then removing all rewards would certainly make sense.
• Private servers should be invite only. Invite the people you want to join you. Open crews would not be allowed in private servers either.
• I don't believe private servers should be allowed for a single solo player. I think that you need to have a minimum number of ships to be able to create a private server.

I think beyond this and other things I simply can't bring to mind right now, I don't think there should be much special about private servers. It would still be the core game, but you can chose the rules you want to have in place when you join as far as interactions with other crews go.

@nofears-fun

It looks like what you are thinking private servers are is more a mode like the Arena. To me a private server would be like Conan Exiles, Ark, etc. where we prop up a server, rent server or server space to host our own instance of the game. People would have a choice between playing on Rare's official server or a list of privately hosted servers. If it is privately hosted servers, then all the options in the game need to be there and configurable for what the host wants to offer. Potential to be PvP, PvE, RP, or a combo of them all in flavor.

If it is a mode, then yes it should be more of a PvE/Coop experience like the Arena would potentially do for PvP. In a mode it should not be all of the same game just like all of the same game should not exist in the Arena. It either needs to be more challenging or have restricted rewards. A PvE mode would only offer one part of the trinity to become a Pirate Legend like Rare intends to allow in the Arena.

In the end not sure it really matters. From the launch of the game Sea of Thieves has become more watered down. We have increasingly seen it in constant content changes like monster and ship fights. I still say Sea of Thieves has a major identity crisis. One that may never be solved or solved when it is too late.

@x-crowheart-x I guess I never envisioned it like that. I need to think about it a bit more before we can debate it. Though I do find it intriguing that you can post it similar to... say an LFG group posting. And I do agree, I don't think anything on the PvE side should be watered down in private servers as far as current threats. And I agree that some things should be limited or not available in them as well. Not sure about the faction thing though, as using private servers would already make getting to PL more difficult as it is now since the rewards (at least on my suggestion) would be half what they are now. But you do bring up a good point that I will toss around in that coconut on my neck.

@fakegnu-maycry Has nothing to do with losing PvP and has everything to do with losing that survivalist state of mind enforced by open world PvP with high risk high rewards.

It's how the devs intended it to be, akin to survival games that you mentioned, difference between those two and Sea of Thieves is that those games let you express yourself through your creations thus a creative mode seems to make sense, in Sea of Thieves you have none of that, and I'm even willing to risk being wrong here, but I assume that the devs have a higher focus on PvP rather than PvE given the shallowness of actual PvE content, and it might be a "fear" of making that shallowness even more obvious if you were able to cut out the PvP interactions out completly.

Should also be noted at the end of the day it's Rare's game, you experience it how they want you to experience it, and altough I have mixed feelings about that state of mind it is what it is.

@x-crowheart-x Quick question based on your menu tree of servers available, in your vision, would you be able to limit who could see that server as being available to your own friends list?

@x-crowheart-x I've said this before. We don't know (or those of us who aren't yet pioneers don't know) what Arena will be and if there will or won't be PvE elements to it. I hope that that there are. Then it can be said to be a condensed version of the game. If not, then, yes... it is a purely PvP mode and offering a branch that is PvE would be in keeping with that approach. If, however, there is a PvE aspect to Arena - then it retains the PvPvE concept, and the notion of a purely PvE mode wouldn't fit the concept of the game as a PvPvE experience.

@nofears-fun said in Creative/Private Mode:

@x-crowheart-x I guess I never envisioned it like that. I need to think about it a bit more before we can debate it. Though I do find it intriguing that you can post it similar to... say an LFG group posting. And I do agree, I don't think anything on the PvE side should be watered down in private servers as far as current threats. And I agree that some things should be limited or not available in them as well. Not sure about the faction thing though, as using private servers would already make getting to PL more difficult as it is now since the rewards (at least on my suggestion) would be half what they are now. But you do bring up a good point that I will toss around in that coconut on my neck.

The faction thing would only be if PvE was a mode like the Arena and selected from playing Sea of Thieves on Rare's server like we do now. Private hosted servers would maybe be a list off their site, but they would pretty much be the game we play now like with the ability to tweak it. Characters on private servers would stay there. Just like characters on the main server would stay there. Could have multiple characters on the main server and several private servers if that is the route Rare goes with private servers.

I think it would be a while for true private servers to come along if that is the vision. Would be too much a temptation and option for what players want and cannot find now.

@nofears-fun said in Creative/Private Mode:

@x-crowheart-x Quick question based on your menu tree of servers available, in your vision, would you be able to limit who could see that server as being available to your own friends list?

Well if we go with a join friends option and just group up on a server instance like we do now, than yes it would be restricted to friends and invites. If we go the private server route, it would be open to anyone joining and creating a character on that server like we do now with Sea of Thieves. Or could be locked to invites and passwords.

I am thinking about private servers from the perspective of hosting many different games like Ark, Conan Exiles, and many others over the years.

@bran-the-ent said in Creative/Private Mode:

@x-crowheart-x I've said this before. We don't know (or those of us who aren't yet pioneers don't know) what Arena will be and if there will or won't be PvE elements to it. I hope that that there are. Then it can be said to be a condensed version of the game. If not, then, yes... it is a purely PvP mode and offering a branch that is PvE would be in keeping with that approach. If, however, there is a PvE aspect to Arena - then it retains the PvPvE concept, and the notion of a purely PvE mode wouldn't fit the concept of the game as a PvPvE experience.

I am sure that there will be some. They are just going to shrink down what we have now to put people more together like the Reaper's Mark. Will also add a few new things to dress it up and make it more a competitive arena/BR experience.

@x-crowheart-x Then Arena and a purely PvE mode are apples and oranges. I don't mind the apples, but the oranges don't fit the concept of the game. Again, it's not a pirate game if there is no piracy.

@xxmcm300xx, undoubtedly you have a good point but nonetheless the main answer you get back when introducing such major changes to SoT is: "PvP gonna die this way!". This game gives you the tools to create your own pirate story instead of a shelter and cakes (as for now, because there's people asking for cooking ability too), but at the same time delegates the difficulty level to a "pirate code", wich has to be respected even if mocked but never sees practical application. A story-driven mode, plot-wise, that explains things better and introduces the player base to the game can lead to actual multiplayer mode experience with more satisfaction then now, for a lot of people i think. Mild and chilled players can than opt for private servers and confront only with friends, and experienced players can go for the open crew/open servers for a full immersion and impredictable gameplay. It's a priority amongst other hotfixes and game issues? Only Rare knows! In time the game will evolve as the community will shape it; major flaw is just relaying on the community behaviour to merge opposite expectations of players that approach the game with traditional PvE or PvP only vision. So daunting only few recognise the game as a merged world where you can roam from an hedge (PvE) to the other (PvP), being your adventure a bit of everything. Hence, the need to a more structerd gameplay, with modes that can teach you this and to respect and appreciate each side and their mixture.

@bran-the-ent said in Creative/Private Mode:

@x-crowheart-x Then Arena and a purely PvE mode are apples and oranges. I don't mind the apples, but the oranges don't fit the concept of the game. Again, it's not a pirate game if there is no piracy.

It is a pirate game is a way over used excuse. Especially for all the wrong and worse things to be found in SoT.

@x-crowheart-x It is over-used because people to take it into consideration enough - it's sad that people need constant reminding of that fact. It is a pirate game, it is designed to be a pirate game. If there is no piracy, then the core concept of the game is gone.

@bran-the-ent said in Creative/Private Mode:

@x-crowheart-x It is over-used because people to take it into consideration enough - it's sad that people need constant reminding of that fact. It is a pirate game, it is designed to be a pirate game. If there is no piracy, then the core concept of the game is gone.

The core concept of the game has been fading for a long time. Will so even more with the Arrival of the Arena mode.

@x-crowheart-x Not, to repeat this yet-a-bloody-gain, if the mode has elements of PvE. The core concept of PvE gets loot into the world for it to be potentially stolen remains.

@bran-the-ent

Contrary. The Arena mode is an alias for PvP mode. When the core game and its very original idea did not work out to the satisfaction of whatever powers that be, the Arena mod was the fix. A poorly timed and conceived idea to bring in new players through the appearance of more opportunities of PvP. To satisfy the Fortnite and now Apex groupies. Rares answer to the Battle Royale fad SoT style. To bring in Twitch viewers even when good gameplay and sportsmanship is sacrificed. As witnessed during a recent sale on the game when certain streaming turned the game into an uglier place to sail on.

@x-crowheart-x And, it's weird that you say that since we just talked about how it is a condensed version of the PvPvE experience. My head is spinning discussing this with you. I say something, you agree with it - I, literally, repeat what I said, and you disagree with it.

@bran-the-ent

I am not going back and forth. :)

Yes, it is will be very condensed version of Sea of Thieves with the trimmings and framing to be more PvP with a more competitive slant. To be a very mini version of Sea of Thieves with a dash of this and that and a little bit of makeup in an attempt to be a full PvP mode and a condensed attempt of Battle Royale.