Respawn Invulnerability

  • ThePesky
    Captain
    Insider
    Founder

    The other day I was on a sloop and kept getting spawn killed while my ship sank. While I understand and endorse this tactic, what I don't like is that my opponent was literally shooting me as my camera was cutting in from the black screen. This means that he was able to see my character and interact with it before I could do anything.

    Many, many, many people have experienced this issue, where their character is literally on the ship and other players can see and interact with it, but they're still stuck in the black screen.

    Why not make player models invulnerable off the respawn until they actually do something? And when I say anything, I mean the moment the game registers input. That means moving, looking around, pulling out equipment or weapons, literally any input. I think this would balance out the frustration and pure unfairness of getting spawn killed before you can see, and the inherent brokenness of being invulnerable.

    Thoughts?

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  • Strinder
    Master
    Insider

    There is already a solution, scuttle.your ship.

  • ColdSheep
    Vanguard
    Insider

    @strinder that's not a solution because it prevents you from taking back your ship.

  • Strinder
    Master
    Insider

    @coldsheep So does getting shot in the back. Don't mean to be glib but if you are caught in a respawning death cycle you have already lost your ship.

  • BloodyBil
    Legend
    Insider

    @strinder said in Respawn Invulnerability:

    @coldsheep So does getting shot in the back. Don't mean to be glib but if you are caught in a respawning death cycle you have already lost your ship.

    Why respawn at all then?

  • Gladwambaps
    Marauder
    Insider

    It's not a case of they can see the Player Character, its a case of the Character's shadow spawning in beforehand and enemy players can see them and anticipate where you spawn, thus killing you before you can react.

    A fix for this is to just have the shadows spawn in later rather than sooner so a victim can at least have a fighting chance.

  • Strinder
    Master
    Insider

    @bloodybil said in Respawn Invulnerability:

    @strinder said in Respawn Invulnerability:

    @coldsheep So does getting shot in the back. Don't mean to be glib but if you are caught in a respawning death cycle you have already lost your ship.

    Why respawn at all then?

    Because your playing the game? Just scuttle and move on.

  • OGCaptainTankU
    Insider

    I agree, a fix should be added to mitigate the re-spawn campers. I’ve had this happen to me numerous times and I’m new to SOT. Recently, a pirate just camped on the rear canopy of my sloop and shot me in the back successfully killing me twice, and on the third respawn I was able to jump out of the way before he fired anymore shots at me. Needless to say, I was not successful with regaining my sloop. It’s frustrating when your playing other FPS and you’re locked in a mega re-spawn killing spree causing players to only think the only option is to quit or on SOT, scuttle their ship. I do not want that in my SOT experience, let alone ruin the expierience of new pirates be the game play like those other games.

    Suggestions:
    Lock the commandeered ships ammo box, wheel, sails, and anchor. Ammo box, so the commandeering crew only have the munitions the have equipped upon leaving their ship thereby limiting and stopping the unlimited resources of bullets. Why lock wheel, anchor, and sails? Or at least have a lock while respawning. First, it’s the ONLY place you’re respawned and that’s VERY MINIMAL REAL ESTATE that feels like the those outposts that are just boulders in the sea. Secondly, it is absolutely outrageous that my ship has sailed islands away from the point of engagement and crashes into an island to cause leaks in the ship. There are other ways to sink a commandeered ship besides plotting a course to an island. The commandeering crew did leave their ship that had cannons or gunpowder they’ve acquired. Once respawned, all have equal access to control/regain control the ship. Let’s not forget during the respawn and locked access, they can THEIVE all that’s aboard, resources and treasure. It’s Sea of Theives NOT rack up a freaking campers killtastic!

  • Vin The Rat
    Marauder
    Insider

    @coldsheep said in Respawn Invulnerability:

    @strinder that's not a solution because it prevents you from taking back your ship.

    @strinder said in Respawn Invulnerability:

    @coldsheep So does getting shot in the back. Don't mean to be glib but if you are caught in a respawning death cycle you have already lost your ship.

    So much this^

    If the enemy has time to spawn camp you, then you have lost the engagement. Scuttle and move on.

    Allowing them to spawn camp you endlessly is as dumb and pig-headed as being a pirate who won't give up a chase that they've clearly lost for 45 minutes.

    People in this game need to learn when they have been beaten, and move on.

  • ColaresBR
    Castaway

    Hey guys, this has been a conversation a year ago and the problem persist. Respawn campers, it seems ok to have a pvp tactic, hold your position, invade the other ship and destroy it.
    Sea of thieves, not sea of friends.

    That said, I suggest that you could have 3 seconds invulnerability when you appear. So you don’t get damage right away and keep being busted without a fight chance.

  • Ghostpaw
    Legend

    @colaresbr said in Respawn Invulnerability:

    Hey guys, this has been a conversation a year ago and the problem persist. Respawn campers, it seems ok to have a pvp tactic, hold your position, invade the other ship and destroy it.
    Sea of thieves, not sea of friends.

    That said, I suggest that you could have 3 seconds invulnerability when you appear. So you don’t get damage right away and keep being busted without a fight chance.

    Your chance came and went when they took control of your deck. To address the “problem” we were given the option to scuttle our ship while on the Ferry of the Damned and spawn on a new boat at another island. If you refuse to scuttle then you are forcing the other crew to keep control of the situation by killing you when you respawn. They won the battle. Rare should not penalize them by giving more opportunities to strip them of their victory. Humble up, scuttle, and get back to sailing.

    Also, this thread is over a year old. It is against forum rules to necro old threads. So many things change over the months so things said in old threads may no longer be relevant. Start new threads instead.

  • BobbCane
    Master
    Insider

    I don't get how people can defend spawn camping as a legitimate strategy. It's absurd.
    Nowhere in the game is it stated that if you're killed once on your ship then you've already lost. It's so obvious, if you could respawn safely you'd still have a fighting chance before your ship sinks. Being unable to fight back because of the broken respawn mechanic isn't fair and certainly isn't fun.

  • Strinder
    Master
    Insider

    @bobbcane Just. Scuttle. Your. Ship.

  • BobbCane
    Master
    Insider

    Why should I scuttle my ship when I could have another shot at repelling my enemies? It's not like it can go on indefinitely, eventually either I manage to kill them off or they win and my ship sinks.
    Today I was actually able to repeatedly spawnkill a Sloop crew. It wasn't fun, it was pitiful, they couldn't defend themselves because they always spawned on the wrong side of my blunderbuss. They were two against one and if they had at least been able to avoid my shots they could have killed me, but they couldn't, not because of inexperience (I'm pretty bad at PVP so I think they had a good chance) but because of broken respawn mechanics.
    You shouldn't defend a broken mechanic only because you grew accustomed to it.

  • JollyOlsteamed
    Captain
    Insider

    @bobbcane said in Respawn Invulnerability:

    Why should I scuttle my ship when I could have another shot at repelling my enemies? It's not like it can go on indefinitely, eventually either I manage to kill them off or they win and my ship sinks.
    Today I was actually able to repeatedly spawnkill a Sloop crew. It wasn't fun, it was pitiful, they couldn't defend themselves because they always spawned on the wrong side of my blunderbuss. They were two against one and if they had at least been able to avoid my shots they could have killed me, but they couldn't, not because of inexperience (I'm pretty bad at PVP so I think they had a good chance) but because of broken respawn mechanics.
    You shouldn't defend a broken mechanic only because you grew accustomed to it.

    you get boarded and you die and can't fight them back you have lost and the fact you got boarded means someone wasn't paying attention and you are punished for it next time make sure you don't get boarded pay attention there are other means of losing than just sinking

  • Ghostpaw
    Legend

    @bobbcane said in Respawn Invulnerability:.

    You shouldn't defend a broken mechanic only because you grew accustomed to it.

    We aren’t defending it because we are accustomed to it. If you want to debate this, do it based on what we are actually saying.

    Stop for just a second. Clear your mind of pirates with wickedness in their hearts or whatever scenario you are imagining. We are going to back up and examine this from a little more abstract perspective. Imagine a boat is just a spawn beacon in a FPS. If you are unfamiliar with the concept, it is something you can place somewhere so that if you die, you can spawn at the beacon rather than some distance away from your objective. Team One (T1)is working towards securing an objective and have their spawn beacon nearby. Team Two (T2) come by to stop T1. They kill the members of T1 and see the spawn beacon. Now T1 has a choice to make. They can either take their chance that their beacon was not discovered, or accept that the other team have secured the area and select a more distant spawn location to regroup. They decide to give it a try and find out their beacon was not safe after all. Now before your mind shuts down with “but they never had a chance.... 3 second invulnerability.... broken mechanic...” or wherever you go. Stay with me. T2 has secured the area. T1 has no right to infinite attempts to reclaim the area. They lost the battle, but maybe not the war. They can either keep selecting the spawn beacon until the other team can destroy it, or accept the loss and plot their next move. I cannot understand the argument that you deserve infinite chances to take back control once you lose.

    In SoT, there are reasons they may not be able to quickly sink the other team’s ship, or they are grabbing resources. With that said, I do not condone players who keep another team’s ship floating just to keep spawn killing them. That’s scummy.

    Personally, I think the right solution is that if you are killed by another player, you just respawn at another island. If your ship sinks, you are moved to a new server. That would shut down a lot of these threads. If you lost your life, you should not be easily returning to be an annoyance. If you die and lose your boat, then that’s it. Your life in that server ended and you have a new world to try again in. But the current system is a compromise, and probably avoids issues that would be caused by my plan. Either way, the idea that you are entitled to a chance to take your boat back from a crew that killed you and are in control of your deck is absurd to me.

  • BobbCane
    Master
    Insider

    That doesn't seem a smart reasoning to me. I don't really understand you, I get that I'm in the minority here, but what I'm saying feels so obvious to me.
    Scuttling your ship is a way to admit defeat, and you admit defeat when you realize your opponent is stronger than you. Being able to spawnkill doesn't make you stronger, or more skillful, or smarter. It's just an exploit.
    Nowhere it is stated that you must lose once you get boarded, this is an implicit rule that the community has concocted, as far as I can tell.
    Judging from my perspective on game design, encouraging spawnkilling, or even justifying it, in such a game is just poor game design, a flaw.
    Edit: @Ghostpaw this wasn't an answer to your post, but to the previous one. I'll now read yours, it seems more fleshed out and well thought
    2nd edit: I've read your point of view and I kind of get it, I can respect that. In my opinion, your solution would be too extreme, after all you said yourself that "you lost the battle, not the war" and you can try to win back what you lost. But as my boat is the only thing I could call mine when playing, I should very well feel entitled to defend it. It's not an infinite cycle anyway, since there are now ways to sink boats without even shooting at them with cannons. The attacker is at no disadvantage if I have some protection when I respawn, he can easily steal my supplies and survive on them in the meantime, burn everything down, and still mantain a positional advantage since he can guess where the defender may spawn. Your simile with control points works, but I think Sea of Thieves is different enough to complicate the matter.
    I'm not advocating against PVP, I don't want friendly servers or such things. I just really, heavily dislike spawkilling as a concept. At this point, it really makes more sense to just not being able to respawn. Maybe after being killed 2-3 times by the same guy on your own ship, you should really just be forced by the game to give up/lose and respawn elsewhere.

  • Ghostpaw
    Legend

    @bobbcane said in Respawn Invulnerability:

    Edit: @Ghostpaw this wasn't an answer to your post, but to the previous one. I'll now read yours, it seems more fleshed out and well thought

    I assumed so since it was so quick. And I do empathize with what you are saying. It feels like, if I am granted a choice of respawning on my boat that I should have the ability to defend myself. I really do get it. It is really hard sometimes for me to select scuttle.

  • BobbCane
    Master
    Insider

    @ghostpaw edit one last time my previous post. I don't really have much to add on the topic, one last thing I wanted to say is that maybe the upcoming revive feature will make this kind of situation more dynamic, shake things up.

  • Ghostpaw
    Legend

    @bobbcane You make some good points. Thanks for a reasonable discussion. We will see what the near future holds.

  • Look Behind You
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    Deckhand

    As this thread was over a year old and revived today, it will now be locked.

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