Double Guns Meta

@axiomwizard the blunderbuss would would go extinct.

@boomtownboss No, the blunderbuss is a shotgun, a game mechanic that existed in all FPS games, a gun that oneshots you. That's the idea. Not using two weapons at the same time just to get the easy kill.

@axiomwizard who would carry a Cutlass and a blunderbuss? They're both short range weapons.

@d3adst1ck said in Double Guns Meta:

@axiomwizard said in Double Guns Meta:

Remove one gun and let one melee slot and one ranged slot. Simple and balanced, it doesn't remove any player free-play, instead it balances the game as I said, the only ones that don't want this is the people that like to camp and kill people just because they like to do that, even if people doesn't have anything in their ship.

Some people like to equip 2 guns for the Kraken fights, or when dealing with gold skeletons, or other scenarios where you may not need to be in melee range.

Removing the option to equip two guns just removes a loadout from an already limited set of possibilities.

Definitely. It's not a bad thing on Meg fights either (well, more so with the original Hungering Deep encounter, but still useful).

I like keeping all options open for situational use and personal choice. IF the only way they could fix the current double gun problem was by making this change, I'd accept it, but I highly doubt they'll need to do that.

@d3adst1ck If people are fighting the kraken they are on the ship, so they have unlimited ammo because the ammo chest and they can change whatever weapon they want too. With the golden skeletons I always carry the blunderbuss, not two guns at the same time. And if I ran out of ammo I just go to the ship and restock, is that really hard for some people to do? No, it is not. People is abusing the double gun, and everyone knows it.

I just can’t wait til the issue is addressed by the devs.

@katttruewalker
Awesome, thanks for sharing that tweet :)

The problem with the macro double gun thing is that you don't have to aim the second shot. That means that you aim + fire your sniper + macro and you instantly kill your opponent from full health.

It won't win you a battle. I've been double gunned as I sailed away with a players loot, having already sunk their ship.

It still sucks though. Having an "I win" button for 1:1 fights ruins the feel of combat on both sides. Takes the thrill out of encounters.

Double gunning without a macro is a choice with upsides and downsides, using a macro is without downsides at present (except for the downside of making combat about who presses the macro button first and it being a crutch that prevents some players from getting better at the actual combat mechanics)

@arecbalrin said in Double Guns Meta:

@sprungnickel427 said in Double Guns Meta:

@arecbalrin said in Double Guns Meta:

Does it work when they are out of ammo? Because anyone doing this(unless the inventory has changed) has to give up their melee weapon and those don't need to be reloaded or run out of shot.

It's a tactical decision, made in advance and which can't be changed on the fly. It had advantages and it has drawbacks. If it is working, it is because you are not paying mind to them. Is this why the game is going to Hell in a hand-cart? I have seen months of insane suggestions and complaints while lurking since I quit and the scary thing is they keep doing it because Rare keep giving in.

You know @ArecBalrin , you carry 10 shots with your double gun, and most boats have 4 or less players on them and consider most of the double gunners run galleons to dumpster on sloops and brigs, and perhaps less often on galleons, there is plenty of ammo to kill the whole crew with double blasts in miliseconds with macros to refill your ammo and spawn camp the boat to death. The Problem is that a sniper hits 80% and the pistol hits 50% so any other hit finishes you off. I don't think you are in a position to defend your OP position as a PC double gunner. Period

Well this makes some spectacular assumptions, that a 'double-gunner' hits almost all of the time, that macros are used to reload(it was my impression that reload is automatic on an empty weapon, that the interval to reload is now so short that the person can not be killed whilst reloading and then there's the HUGE assumption about me: a person who has not played the game in over 8 months because as you can clearly see I no longer own it. I successfully refunded because the game on release was not as it was promoted and it might not ever get there.

What exactly made you think your response would hold up to a few seconds of scrutiny?

you can't read.. Reload is not part of the macro. just fire switch and fire. Watch some top streamers, they macros their double gun with a single click. fires sniper first, then switches and pistols you to death. Sure you can miss, then pogo around during reload of each weapon and go for a second round of rapid fire double gun.

@crungi said in Double Guns Meta:

@approvedjoey Being a PC player an having a macro setup for the exact thing, I can say it is over powered, also it is broken, and un-fun there are also times at which the macro shoots so fast it will only use 1 bullet from 1 gun but it will shoot both guns. At times I can double shoot 7-8 times before having to reload both weapons.

I still highly prefer the sword and gun it is much more fun, less toxic, and won't lead to the game being a ghost town in the next few months. If everyone or at least 1 person on each galleon keeps running double guns there honestly won't be anyone left on the Seas to play with because even I as a PC player will just move onto the next big thing that comes out in Feb and wait for RARE to wake up and fix the PvP experience here.

This is all coming from a Alpha tester that joined in Late 2016, and this is honestly the worst PvP experience I've ever had in SoT's as of late

Using Macros is actually considered cheating per SoT devs. However to double gun you don't even need macros, when I used to double gun I just used the CTRL key to switch weapons, and yes, I have to press the fire button twice. So not all double gunners are using macros which is definitely considered cheating.

@arecbalrin said in Double Guns Meta:

@sprungnickel427 I did read and your post said "there is plenty of ammo to kill the whole screw ith double blasts in miliseconds with macros to refill your ammo and spawn camp the boat to death", which depending on where you insert the missing comma is you saying the macro is used to shoot rapidly or to refill the ammo. Now we are on the same page as to the idea of what the macros are doing.

Can you clarify something for me; does the second shot happen before the switching animation finishes? Specifically, does the use of a macro enable as has been stated for two shots to be literally fired for all practical purpose, simultaneously?

People had tried double-gunning on release, but quickly realised losing the ability to attack and defend in melee made it not worth it. If a macro can enable two shots within an interval of miliseconds, that could change things in PvP.

However, this still leaves the big elephant in the room: the reload time for each weapon. What is everybody else doing whilst a double-gunner is slowly reloading not one but two guns? There is enough time for a single person to get three or four charged lunges in within that time, two of which are fatal. If you are able to argue that they can 'pogo around' to avoid dying whilst they reload, why can't anyone else do the same to avoid being shot before attacking during the long reload? In the time it takes the double-gunner to fully reload, an opposing player can similarly shoot a blunderbuss that is much harder to dodge and have it reloaded first for a second and even a third shot.

Macros are cheating but double gunning legitimately is NOT an exploit. People are mistaking double gunning for people cheating using macros. You can switch extremely fast with the flick of a mouse wheel or press of a key LEGITIMATELY, I have console crew mates that do it with their controllers. There is absolutely nothing unbalanced about it. Everyone can do it, just because you suck at it doesn't mean the others should have to suffer. Plus you cannot defend yourself from sword attacks and once you have to reload you're screwed if playing against someone who half way knows what they are doing. The complaining about this really is unreal as using double guns has been in the game since launch, and even before launch. This is the equivalent of people being offended now by confederate statues.

-from a non-double gunner.

@arecbalrin said in Double Guns Meta:

Can you clarify something for me; does the second shot happen before the switching animation finishes? Specifically, does the use of a macro enable as has been stated for two shots to be literally fired for all practical purpose, simultaneously?

Yes. This exactly. When using a macro the second gun equips and fires before the animation of taking the gun out plays. Dunno if it's instant but on the receiving end it may as well be, we're talking fractions of a second, literally less time than the animation takes.

That is the issue. There needs to be a hardcoded delay before a gun can shoot after being equipped. As it currently stands the macro lets you fire two guns at the same time more or less.

It leaves you in a bad spot if you miss but so long as you hit you'll have enough time to reload both guns while bouncing around the boat like Tigger's been on the crack again.

@needsmokes said in Double Guns Meta:

I seem to be getting killed more and more by pirates whilst i have full health and they are quite far away and often not even facing the same direction as me.

I wouldn't have this issue if i only played with Xbox console gamers would i?

Can I say this is probably an issue with the LOD as it might appear at further distance that they are looking the other way. Do you see a flash from the scope? If not then it's either they didn't use it or it is the LOD as it doesn't display such details far out.

Also just like to point out that with an elite controller you are able to macro buttons together/map them to the paddles. If you were to get xplay "optional" are you then going to start complaining elite controllers have an unfair advantage, or the Xbox users that use KD+M?

Making xplay optional will not fix these issues.

Double Gunning against pirate legends in the pirate hideout is fun :)