@quixoticfolly That has not been my experience, and if you are on the island already it does not take much time to hide the chests. Plus, what happens if you are not on your ship, especially if you are not dead? Would a player about to turn in a chest while his ship sinks get ripped from the server? What if he was fighting someone on an entirely different part of the world?
The idea just goes to far, and is full of holes. It should sink and respawn in another game.
When ship is sank, you should be forced out of server
@erikinthebakery Die and respawn to other server or take mermaid to it. Don't see the problem? Same as it is now.
@quixoticfolly said in When ship is sank, you should be forced out of server:
@erikinthebakery If you had that much time before the fight, you should've just run to the outpost and sold before they caught up. Also, chests despawn unless active players are nearby or they're in a static spawn location.
Chests don't despawn that quickily. erikinthebakery points to a tactic I've used too. Hiding treasure during battles. It's actually pretty fun. And yes, they are still there when you come back.
@deadeye-nomadic said in When ship is sank, you should be forced out of server:
When you or your enemies ship has been sunk you should be kicked from the server and forced to join a new one. This stops grieving and spawn killing. Also ensures that the winner of a fight can loot there ship kill without that same crew constantly coming back to grieve. Also gives you a constant variety of people so nobody is killing the same crews over and over.
When you die, you should respawn at a outpost. If you're alone, you respawn with another ship. If you're with a crew, you spawn alone and wait for your crew mates to die or survive the fight and get back to you.
Again. You died. You leave the world. You don't get to come back for chests you hid, because you are dead. You get a new life, on a new world.
Edit to add: "But I survived my ship sinking and have hidden chests! Waaaah!" Great, you can wait several months for a new ship to be built or take the mermaid to the new world and suck up the loss. Or pay 30,000 gold or whatever an actual sailing ship costs to have it spawned to you.
@quixoticfolly said in When ship is sank, you should be forced out of server:
Again. You died. You leave the world. You don't get to come back for chests you hid, because you are dead. You get a new life, on a new world.
This doesn't make any more or less sense than coming back to life in the same world. And, what if the whole crew doesn't die? What if you die and your ship isn't sunk?
Like I said, I agree that respawns need to be farther away. But this idea doesn't fit.@erikinthebakery said in When ship is sank, you should be forced out of server:
And, what if the whole crew doesn't die? What if you die and your ship isn't sunk?
Like I said, I agree that respawns need to be farther away. But this idea doesn't fit.We're not talking about crew respawns here. Only ship respawns. Crew respawns would remain as they are.
@quixoticfolly said in When ship is sank, you should be forced out of server:
Again. You died. You leave the world. You don't get to come back for chests you hid, because you are dead. You get a new life, on a new world.
Edit to add: "But I survived my ship sinking and have hidden chests! Waaaah!" Great, you can wait several months for a new ship to be built or take the mermaid to the new world and suck up the loss. Or pay 30,000 gold or whatever an actual sailing ship costs to have it spawned to you.
I'm fine with changing respawn / spawn mechanics. But again my posts were about moving to a new server, which makes no sense. And again in response to the "you're dead now" logic, SoT isn't an elimination / permadeath game. It's a multiplayer shared adventure game. Say it was, you could always respawn in the same server with nothing. None of that has any bearing on this. You simply want to switch servers to avoid senseless revenge / coming back to troll others when they've won.
On that note, a lot of people agree, and to fix that, it's as simple as tweaking respawn mechanics. No need to go overboard and switch servers etc. That is my opinion at least. You are, of course welcome to yours. But, I think I've spent enough time here arguing my point :)
@erikinthebakery said in When ship is sank, you should be forced out of server:
@quixoticfolly Yes, but this negates your whole "You are dead" line of logic.
Wrong again. The average galleon had a crew over 250 men. Since we're crewing them with 4 I think a few respawns are in order. It's the ship that only has one soul! The nerves and muscle fibers (crew) that operate her are meaningless pieces of the whole!
@deadeye-nomadic I don't like this idea. I think you should be given a chance to take back your loot. I think the better solution to your problem is to force Outpost for successful returns of chests, and force stolen chests to be returned at some other location like the Thieves Hideout or a Fort. Forcing a team to shift servers will only p**s people off especially if the battle was close.
@deadeye-nomadic I 100% agree with this, my crew and I had the exact same problem. We defeated an enemy crew and even sunk their ship and they kept spawning right next to our boat for some reason. My question is why should you be able to lock a team mate in the brigg for 5 minutes but then when you kill an enemy player they can spawn in 10 seconds?
@tyger-warrior I totally agree with this. There is no way that a crew you just killed should be able to spawn right there and climb aboard your ship when you are looting their chests. I have been comparing it to the brigg, why can you lock a team mate up in the brigg for 5 minutes but kill an enemy and they are back to fighting within 10 seconds? This definitely needs to be adjusted upon release.
That's wildly extreme lol.
Only thing I'd like to stop seeing is players spawning at mermaid when sunk. If your ship goes down and you die, spawn at ship. I'm a little over the war of attrition between people on ship, and people spawning at mermaid still trying to get on your ship. Sink and death should mean ya lost the battle.
Yeh nah.... Because you would lose your voyage and all the fun stuff that can still happen after u get sunk.
Yesterday I was sunk but managed to hang on to the side ladder of the enemy galley and hitch a ride to their next destination without them knowing. It was fun gameplay. Getting kicked just breaks up the fun. If u at getting hacked then leave yourself.
Don't get me wrong, the infinite redrawn on boat or nearby needs to be fixed.... But not like this
Just to add, I haven't read all replies yet but I'm not saying you should respawn in a new server when you die. Only when your ship is sank, not every time you die. Once your ship and mates have died though, constant respawning on your sunk ship on or near, or even near the same island is a issue. Revenge is one thing, but kinda hard to when all is lost. It just causes grieving on both sides and hinders the winners.
@deadeye-nomadic , I Imagine that would give 4 man crews an even easier time taking out smaller crews, they could just sink your sloop while your digging on the x and then white screen to another server to start all over. I'm probably not alone in thinking that would ruin the smaller crew game play
No To Server-Kicking.
I've played the Beta over 90+ hrs, and this is not an issue.
If you're worried about being spawn camped after being boarded, send her down to Davie Jones and abandon ship! Your ship can be scuttled if it has not been sunk.
If you're worried about getting spawn camped after being sunk, just swim down (to avoid gun-fire) and away from the merman that you respawn at; another one will spawn once you cross a certain distance.
If you're worried about losing your treasure, swim to your ships grave-site, find the treasure (floating or sunk) and bring it ashore. Hide it. Go back to a Merman to return to ship. Return to said Island, bring treasure back aboard. Nothing lost.
"Oh no Matey, this seems too tedious."
Well, this game isn't about min/maxing, or grinding. It's about the experiences and choices you make. If you choose to stake your treasure as precious cargo, then there is a way to save that. If you value your lives and time spent more, respawn a new ship with your crew and be on your merry way.
I think I disagree with this idea.
You are on an island, looking for the treasure chest. Your ship is sank... You get kicked? That doesn't make sense.
How about stealing enemies ships? Your ship sank but you killed all the enemies on their ship and all your crew is alive, still they win the fight? Absurd!And last but not least, you go on an outpost, all your crew has a chest in hands, you are about to deliver, but your ship is sank, you don't have the time to deliver and you get kicked? Again, in my opinion it does not make sense.
Even more when you add the options to build up teams with several ships (because we want that in the game don't we? :P)
Staf'
@deadeye-nomadic and if the winner was the red sea, a bad parking of the boat, an skeleton with a cannon or a chest of sorrows ?
or maybe someone sunk your boat but you are playing alone, and you are alive in the island finding the chest?think about it.
sorry for my english but i speak spanish.
@aviindr Active voyages already carry over between server merges. You would not lose them.
@ch3wiie It's an issue with the loser returning to attack over and over and over until you finally run out of supplies. It's ridiculous. Fighting the same fools repeatedly until they simply run you out of cannonballs is asinine.
@StafyLocok You don't get kicked. You get merged seamlessly to a new server and only after you die or choose to take the mermaid. Please read the whole thread.
@FuFiNio I addressed all of these points in my earlier replies. Any chests you lose would be by choice or by being killed.
@quixoticfolly I did read the thread =) What's the difference between "merging a new server" and getting kicked from the server you are in? It's the same results though the words you chose are indeed more appropriate.
I disagree with your idea. I understand why you had it in the first place, I even created a topic to ask for a megathread for the respawn system.
I think your answer to this matter isn't the most appropriate and I wouldn't be pleased to play if it was the system Rare decides to put in place.
Mostly because I want guilds and crew with several ships to happen, but also because I want revenge to be a thing, though not as biased as it is right now with the respawn system.
Staf'
@burtmacklin410 said in When ship is sank, you should be forced out of server:
@deadeye-nomadic I think that is a bit much. It should simply be if you die when your ship has sunk then you spawn somewhere else with your new ship. You shouldnt just keep spawning in the water where your ship sunk.
I agree with you, i guess the best choice will be that you respawn at a random outpost on the map and then if you remember where the battle was, and you want, you can go back there and try seek "revenge" if the enemy ship is still around.
@stafylocok You do make one point that suggests a good change to me.
Currently the idea in this thread is: When your ship is sunk, it goes to a new server. When you die or take the mermaid, you go to the new server.
Idea for amendment: If after your ship is sunk, the entire enemy crew is killed concurrently, you take ownership of their ship and they are sent to the new server instead.
This allows the possibility for immediate revenge and continuation on the same server while removing the endless respawn and attack again mechanic.
@quixoticfolly This is an idea I mentioned in the other post I mentioned (here), and the possibility to "hoist your colours".
Staf'
So after reading through this obscenely long back-and-forth thread, here are my conclusions:
1- Server shift because of your ship being sunk WOULD RUIN THE GAME.
Kicking a crew out of a server when their ship goes down is a terrible idea!! Why? Because it would give a significant advantage to 4-man galleons and players who prey on those doing voyages. If I know that by sinking your ship at anchor it will instantly leave your acquired chests lying there with no threat of consequence, why would I do anything else?
That leads to NOBODY actually doing voyages because it's too risky and dangerous, which means NOBODY has chests except for new players who don't deserve to be preyed upon for that reason.
I don't like being spawn camped at a merman or have people I just killed climb aboard when we won, but it's a danger you accept when you move aggressively against another crew. In my opinion, the writer of this thread is simply SALTY that he got the jump on a crew but can't seem to be clever enough to bring in the goods to Port!
2-There is a way to fix the griefing without changing too much.
A problem I encountered is that when I'd be sunk, a 4-man crew would have adequate time to bring the treasure aboard, but they WOULDN'T. Instead they would spawn camp to demoralize the other crew.
If after your time on the Ferry of the Damned you had a invulnerable timer after respawn, ...like say, if you were a ghost for 5 seconds... it would be an incentive for the crew that killed you to grab the loot and set sail to the nearest Port.
That way the player that spawned in the water can try and go after their treasure where they died, OR go back to their ship and give chase without threat of being at nearly dead by the time they can actually see where they are and what's going on. When you're being merman spawn killed, I would already be down to low health because other players could shoot me before I could even see anything!I honestly don't think Rare needs to change much, if anything. If ships spawn too far away there is no chance for that crew to get their loot back, which there NEEDS TO BE in order to balance the amount of aggressive crews.
However, I think there should be an OPTION to change servers for a short time after your ship has been sunk. That way if a crew is continuously attacking you, you can get away from them without having to completely restart your session. Call the option "FIND CALMER SEAS" or something like that.
Can't wait until launch! Keep up the good work, Rare!
Captain Silver
As I see it, something should be done to remedy this gameplay issue. Frankly, dying in battle is no problem... however spawning right back into a battle/battle area is not only redundant but also opening up the FPS game "pandora's box" by promoting spawn camping.
Spawn camping is the BANE of every FPS game. Plain and simple. Worse yet, most games rarely address this issue.
To address this issue, 'twere we to lose our ship (due to battle damage), then have us spawn ship-in-hand elsewhere in the same region (perhaps a couple/few map blocks away sans any stolen treasure/supplies). Do not spawn us right back where we previously died.
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