Pineapple Nerf

you can get 25+ pineapples in under 5 minutes if you are willing to spend the small amount of gold it costs to get it

"If" you are willing. Not many are.

So, what I see is your losing fights because people are eating a fruit, that you as well can eat. Seems balanced if everyone can do it, But what does eating those things if your on fire and taking gunshots/sword slashes :P
Even blunderbombs.

If you want the pineapple to be nerfed due to its sheer frequency now, i think rather than nerfing something entirely unrelated to the problem, it would be better to fix the problem that makes them so common.

Simple problems only require simple solutions.

@goldsmen I would be totally fine if they went back and made the pineapple as rare as it was before Seasons came to be. They'd have to nerf its rarity on the seas (especially Sea Forts), make it no longer an item in the purchasable fruit crate, remove it from Captaincy fruit purchases, and get rid of it in APLTT#3.

I'd kinda prefer a power nerf, though. It's ok to have a top tier item that is available with the regularity that the pineapple is today. It's just got OP healing mechanics with how easily it can be had.

Pineapples are fine, imo. The boarding meta has increased in frequency with the arrival of bone callers, and it looks set to increase even more with the arrival of the harpoon gun later this year.

In a situation where a crew is looking to eliminate boarders from their ship and all parties are pocketed with pineapples, the odds favor the crew.

Two additional points:

While they are more plentiful now, they're still the rarest fruit on the seas by far.

Everyone in the game has an equal opportunity to stock up on healing items when they login. If people are outlasting you because of their food, it's because they've been prioritizing supply runs. In this light, nerfing pineapples can essentially be seen as penalizing folks for their playstyle. I don't think this is a good route to travel down.

@savvystraw37257 said in Pineapple Nerf:

@habiki said in Pineapple Nerf:

Pineapples are fine, imo. The boarding meta has increased in frequency with the arrival of bone callers, and it looks set to increase even more with the arrival of the harpoon gun later this year.

In a situation where a crew is looking to eliminate boarders from their ship and all parties are pocketed with pineapples, the odds favor the crew.

Two additional points:

While they are more plentiful now, they're still the rarest fruit on the seas by far.

Everyone in the game has an equal opportunity to stock up on healing items when they login. If people are outlasting you because of their food, it's because they've been prioritizing supply runs. In this light, nerfing pineapples can essentially be seen as penalizing folks for their playstyle. I don't think this is a good route to travel down.

They are too good at healing and far too common for how good they are.

Because of this you are basically forced to have 5 naps on you if you want to be competitive in high level PvP.

So what’s the purpose of all the other food that doesn’t heal for 100 hp? Nothing!

This sounds a lot like the blunderbuss and how because it’s so good there’s no reason to use another close range weapon.

This response feels a bit hyperbolic to me. Saying they're too good and too plentiful is purely a matter of opinion. In some situations they're necessary and in others they're overkill.

There's plenty of room for the other mid to high range food in PvP of all levels. Asking for a nerf to the top tier fruit item based on how it's used in "high level PvP" is completely ignoring both the vast majority of the game and the overwhelming majority of the player base.

There's plenty of instances PvE-wise where coconuts and pomegranates are adequate, and the majority of PvP encounters in adventure mode can be handled just fine with cooked meat or mangos if necessary (in my own experience).

Asking for a sandbox wide balance change to a core system to accommodate high level PvP is missing the forest for the trees. And I'll reiterate, I don't believe penalizing players for properly stocking their ship at the outset is a good move.

@savvystraw37257 said in Pineapple Nerf:

@goldsmen said in Pineapple Nerf:

If you want the pineapple to be nerfed due to its sheer frequency now, i think rather than nerfing something entirely unrelated to the problem, it would be better to fix the problem that makes them so common.

Simple problems only require simple solutions.

Two bites @ 100 hp * 5 pineapples = sword doesn’t kill

So the problem isn’t just how easy it is to get a lot of pineapples but also how powerful they are.

They are supposed to be powerful due to frequency. But the sword can absolutely kill if you dont exclusively swing and walk at them as they eat. The sword is paired with other weapons, and if used well it offers 75 damage in a single attack.

@savvystraw37257 said in Pineapple Nerf:

@goldsmen

They are extremely common you can find 5+ pineapples @ every sea fort.

Our only hope is with the devs and perhaps a few level headed veterans otherwise the community just loves cheese.

So 10 x 100 hp for 1000hp recovery in your pockets seems totally normal and not OP whatsoever. Massive sarcasm.

They are indeed easily common, but this brings us back in a circle to my original comment. If the issue is the frequency of them in the game any more, then the simple solution is to make them less common again.

It does not make sense that if something has 1 problem, to balance it in a totally different way, if that other way was never an issue before the new problem. Thats like getting surgery to deal with a mild infection, its excessive when you have an easier solution available.

I think simply reducing each pineapple bite to half a health bar would solve the OP problem. They'd still be better than mangos if they kept the two bites per pineapple but it would at least reduce their effectiveness when spammed in combat.

@savvystraw37257 said in Pineapple Nerf:

This could only not be considered crazy OP if pineapples were as rare as meg and kraken meat.

They used to be. Back before Season 3ish.

I can remember it feeling wild having more than one for your entire crew back in the day.

I just don't see them going backwards with availability. Maybe... They did it with blunderbombs/chainshots

@savvystraw37257 said in Pineapple Nerf:

@habiki

Nobody is penalizing players for anything that’s such a weird take.

We are discussing why pineapples being common and extremely powerful render lower damage weapons useless.

You can still acquire pineapples and they will still be really good at one bite and 80 hp.

Why do you think 10 bites of 100 hp isn’t extremely overpowered? Especially when pineapples are now common.

Admit it you just like being able to mitigate sword users low damage output and slower ttk to a point where they have almost no chance of killing you.

That’s bad game design.

I've used sword the majority of my (extensive) times on the sea. Saying "Admit it you just like being able to mitigate sword users low damage output and slower ttk to a point where they have almost no chance of killing you in some weird attempt to make my thoughts on the matter seem less credible is bad form.

You act like eating food is instant health restoration and has no drawbacks. It takes a few seconds for the healing to kick in. You also have limited movement when you eat, can't sprint. You also have no offensive or defensive capabilities when you eat, can only attempt to evade.

Getting a flintlock shot on someone forces them into a situation when they have to make a choice........either back off and heal or commit and go for a kill. Either choice puts them at a disadvantage in a high risk situation. It's up to you to turn their disadvantage into your win.

It's the natural flow of combat, and I'd rather not see it disrupted in the way you're suggesting. You don't actually need the same level food to win an encounter anyway, it's just a nice to have.

@savvystraw37257 they aren't as easy to find as mangos, that's a false statement.

And you keep repeating this idea that you have to use the exact same food to be competitive.......which is simply not the case. If someone is killing you using pineapples while you had mangos or cooked meat, they'd kill you if you had a pocket full of pineapples too.

Listen, I understand the underlying point you're trying to make. If everyone on the seas has pineapples (which they don't) then you believe that a pirate needs to have them as well to be competitive. I'm simply disagreeing and pointing out there's more nuance to SoT combat than mindlessly tanking through damage on a citrus based chomp fest.

You don't need to repeat your original positions back at me.

@savvystraw37257 funny, I feel the same way about you.......a tall, thick wall without much new to say.

I've at least been making counterpoints to your original positions. You simply parrot back your original statements to me.

@savvystraw37257 no amount of pineapples make me better at pvp.

@savvystraw37257 not from a double gun...

@savvystraw37257 said in Pineapple Nerf:

@habiki

Because I don’t believe by nerfing a fruit type that you are penalizing players that’s crazy talk. It’s called balancing the game.

You also don’t think abundant pineapples has any effect on weapon balance which it absolutely does.

It’s OP it’s that simple. Why not just tell it like it is?

Well, food doesn't have any effect on weapon balance.......the weapons themselves determine weapon balance. Food has an effect on the flow of combat in general, a flow which consists of much more than the six weapons in the armory.

You seem to continue narrowly focusing on just food as the largest determining factor in a combat scenario. You neglect crucial things like player skill, positioning, throwables, configuration of the encounter, etc.

Consider a scenario where I run onto a duo sloop as a solo player with a blunderbomb and 5 pineapples, double-gunning blunderbuss and the EoR, and I successfully board the boat........

If the duo has a few pomegranates each but they blunderbomb me away from them to create distance, throw down a bonecaller to take advantage of the fact that I'm double-gunning, and rush in after forcing me to take some ill-advised shots, my pineapples aren't going to save me.

There are soooooo many more factors to combat beyond 5 pineapples OP that you're willfully neglecting at this point. I'm trying to call attention to those factors.

Honestly, you don't seem open to an actual discussion; it seems like you're just waiting for your turn to talk instead of listening, especially after seeing that you regressed to some ad-hominem attacks with your "talking to a wall" comment. Responding in kind was bad form on my part, but it truly annoyed me that you chose to try and discredit my points in that way.

I'll say this is my last comment on the subject and leave you to it. I won't post on this thread anymore. Enjoy the last word.

@savvystraw37257 said in Pineapple Nerf:

Go watch any hourglass streamer and you will see three things guaranteed: Eye of Reach paired with Blunderbuss and lots and lots of pineapples.

This is abundantly accurate in hourglass. Spend an hour watching iDBz and count the sheer number of pineapples he scarfs. It'll be eye opening how tanky a player can be when you can outheal everything (except a one-ball or one-blunder) with one single bite.

@habiki said in Pineapple Nerf:

@savvystraw37257 they aren't as easy to find as mangos, that's a false statement.

I think what is maybe meant is that they're as common as mangos used to be before roughly Season 6 (for non-exploiters). That is 100% accurate if not maybe even more common than mangos used to be.