An idea that may keep more people on the high seas

  • ViridianBiscuit
    Master
    Insider
    Founder

    Hello everyone. I was watching a Youtube video with some discussions about safer seas and high seas, and a specific line resonated with me regarding the players who dislike the high seas because of other players being "toxic" or "greifing": It's not that these players don't like being sunk. It is that we do not like being unnecessarily sunk. If I am sailing and have a bunch of treasure or loot on my ship, I absolutely would not be surprised to get attacked or sunk by another ship. That comes with the territory. Higher rewards mean higher risk. However, just spawning on an outpost, or doing a tall tale or some fishing, players really have nothing to gain by attacking my ship other than some commendations, and I just want to be left alone. I understand the risks of having more treasure on my ship coming with the higher chances of being attacked.

    So to my idea. I think it would help balance a little bit if they introduced a game mechanic with the Captaincy. When you spot another captained ship with your spyglass (within a certain range) it already tells you the name of the ship and what captain/guild it belongs to. My suggestion is to add a section on that title card that says what the estimated value of that ship is based on the sell values of what loot they have on board. That way, if you spy a ship that has little to no value, it might not be worth your time to attack it. However, if there is a ship thats stacked with loot, and you spy it and it says approximate net value - 100-120k gold, you might be more motivated to try and sink that ship before they turn in so you can get the payout yourself.

    I am not saying that it will eliminate possibilities of getting attacked with nothing of value on your ship, but it might make players more willing to overlook a fight if they can see that there is really nothing in it for them other than the commendations for sinking player ships. This mechanic could also be added to skeleton ships too that are roaming around so a player can decide if they want to attack the skeleton ship for its loot. the smaller ships might say net value 5-10k and the skeleton galleons might say 20-25k. Doesn't have to be an exact number, but a rough estimate may help players in deciding strategies to attack or if they should attempt it or not.

    Again, just an idea, but I think it would make the game more interesting, and potentially save some players from being unnecessarily sunk.

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  • Guildar9194
    Master

    No.
    If people want to sink a ship; They are going to sink it, regardless of treasure aboard.
    Plus, all this does is reward PvPers by making it easier for them to find ships with valuable cargo.

    If PvP is meant to be 'risk versus reward', then they have to take the risk that they will be sunk while possibly fighting a ship with 0 treasure.

  • TheWatcher1307
    Ship Mate
    Insider

    The issue is that you're always going to have fresh spawns who ONLY want to PVP and have no loot on board attacking players with lots of loot. It's just the risk of the game. Setting aside the "should safer seas even exist" arguments, the high seas are meant to be risky, if people can't handle that, they will play safer seas or not play at all.

  • PithyRumble
    Rogue
    Insider

    @viridianbiscuit

    The players sinking everyone on sight will continue to do so.

    It's not toxic or greifing either.

  • LordQulex
    Captain

    Plus, if all you want to do is fish or TTs, just do it in safer seas. No risk of being spoiled there.

  • D3ADST1CK
    Vanguard
    Insider
    Founder

    I don't think this is a good idea. Not only does it make it even easier to hop servers, sail around and look for a jackpot but it also inhibits rowboat plays, burying treasure and other ways to hide loot because you'll see that the value has suddenly decreased.

  • BurnBacon
    Vanguard
    Insider

    That way, if you spy a ship that has little to no value, it might not be worth your time to attack it

    Got to get them resources they high value more than loot. Sink them

  • Merlin MAV K
    Ship Mate

    Not sure how anyone could perceive more or less people being on High Seas. When a server is created it is populated up to the max quantity of ships and you play or leave. Nothing about this has changed. There is a belief that because SS is an option that HS servers are less populated? No, they are fully populated by the people choosing to play HS.

    Broadcasting on board values of ships would actually MORE valuable to hunters. As it is, the only friction these players encounter (beyond whatever resistance the attacked can muster, if any) is whether or not as the aggressor they wasted their time. This has always been the biggest imbalance to the game. There is little to no risk or consequence to marauding.

  • ViridianBiscuit
    Master
    Insider
    Founder

    I am not arguing that people will want to attack ships less on sight. People are going to attack if they want to attack. However, some people who would normally attack on sight might use this function and determine that the ship they are chasing is not worth their time and decide to go do something else.

    I probably could have worded the title of this thread better as well. I don't mean keeping people on the high seas as if there are servers being less populated. I am just saying that the added function on the spyglass can be used as a tool to help players better make an informed decision about whether they want to fight or not.

    This is a 2 way street though. Yes, it will increase the odds of being left alone if you are doing other things or don't have much value on your ship, but it also encourages newer players to take their chances attacking ships with a higher potential reward value. I could see this enhancing the PVP that is already in place and making the dynamic more interesting.

    Additionally, If you are worried about people putting treasure on rowboats and burying them on islands, maybe they could set it up so it wouldn't change the value because the players still have the map bundle on their ship that you could grab after sinking it and you now have the locations of the buried loot to take for yourself.

  • D3ADST1CK
    Vanguard
    Insider
    Founder

    @viridianbiscuit said in An idea that may keep more people on the high seas:

    Additionally, If you are worried about people putting treasure on rowboats and burying them on islands, maybe they could set it up so it wouldn't change the value because the players still have the map bundle on their ship that you could grab after sinking it and you now have the locations of the buried loot to take for yourself.

    If you're trying to hide loot, you'll just remove the map bundle yourself and toss it. The buried stuff doesn't go away when you do this, and getting rid of the bundle makes it more likely that you're the only one who knows where it's buried.

    The point is that if someone is following you and they see Ship Value go from $1000 to $0 dollars, they instantly know you've unloaded the goods and are able to react faster than they normally would have, making it much more likely that they'll find you rowing in the open ocean or follow you to the nearest island before you even have a chance to bury it.

    It's introducing meta gameplay that doesn't need to exist.

  • ViridianBiscuit
    Master
    Insider
    Founder

    Another thought: Being able to see a potential value of what's on board the ship might open the door more for people parleying, or also introduce the idea of smugglers and cargo holds to maybe secure like a single chest of valuables that stays with your ship if it is sunk and respawns. This item could still be stolen from the ship though, just doesn't float to the top if the boat sinks.

  • Foambreaker
    Sailor

    @viridianbiscuit "...It is that we do not like being unnecessarily sunk...."

    There is no such thing.

  • Ghostfire1981
    Vanguard
    Insider

    Naah, i prefer to bait ships to attack us, so we do not need to chase them down. If they can see what we may or may not have its not as fun. :)

  • Selgewick
    Master

    Sorry lad, but I wouldn't recommend it. I find it more interesting to sail and don't know the ships value, than do. Since it brings the element of surprise and enchance the battle. Plus, if ye do have loot, ye can act like ye didn't and get away with it, with such mechanic it ris impossible. Also, since now we have Safer Seas, there is no need to do Tall Tales or Fishing in High Seas.

  • JimmyDSpuffy
    Sailor

    Basically anyone I've played with gets more upset when we sink with loot than when we sink without loot. It is upsetting to lose constantly no matter the cost and new player often make mistakes and be too tough on themselves. Being punched down on, feeling like you can't fight back, and then going on forum and being told to go away is what people get upset about.

    Now I suspect you actually just want an easier time marauding. I'm not here to chastise you. In fact, I want to give you a tip. Lie! Play the social game! There is an open game-chat for a reason. Get to know your victims and then you can learn what they're doing and how far along they are and how valuable they are. Or if you are itching for a fight and a reward this instant, HG is one of the most profitable activities you can do. Unless you exclusively are punching down on people and ambushing empty boats. In which case, I think you have already stacked the cards plenty in your favor. Let's not get too greedy.

  • Shadow XLII
    Castaway
    Insider

    @viridianbiscuit not really a good idea. Makes for lazy piracy by just spy glassing soneones boat. Best thing they should of done is bought in passive mode. Works in many games. Once passive you can't attack others or engage in specific commendations of missions or be attacked by others. Simple.

  • RiftenWatcher
    Captain
    Insider

    Im not sure they would need to do something like that. Honestly, Emissaries, Athena's Fortune, Reapers Bones, Captaincy and Guilds are all reasons people will continue to sail in High Seas.

  • L0cke547
    Ship Mate
    Insider

    i think on all of the posts that appear in this forum day-in and day-out, basically half of them are on safer seas since release, there is one critical point missing. and thats the saltyness of sailors beeing sunk. in my 2k hours ive done all sorts of things, mainly i hourglass nowadays but ive done a lot. ive gotten spawncamped by a gally and hotmics, ive PVE´d and stacked, ive been sunk by total sweats, ive sunk total sweats, ive sunk swabbies and ive been sunk by swabbies, ive taken swabbies loot and i donated loot to swabbies, ive sunk people and feld bad afterwards, ive done glitterbeard with crews after getting sunk by them. anyways you get the point.

    but there is one key ingredient that makes sinking some people so much fun, and its their saltyness. we all are in it together, when i do PVE and get sunk im frustrated aswell ofc, but still gotta give them a gg and let go. hearing people whine, shouting slurs, demanding PVE servers srsly is joyful to me and an underrated part of SOT.

  • Scr3amin CheEse
    Master
    Insider

    @shadow-xlii

    The only way passive mode would've worked is if all the loot on your ship falls off into the water the second you activate it. Otherwise someone steals your loot, becomes passive and indestructible and you have no chance to fight back. Terrible idea imo, and with currently 5 ships per server, i don't want to be sailing around with 4 other ships in passive mode otherwise we all might aswell be playing safer seas. Spirit of the games always been the risk reward, the complainers have got their separate mode leave the proper version as it is.

  • Valhalla Sky
    Seafarer
    Insider

    @pithyrumble said in An idea that may keep more people on the high seas:

    @viridianbiscuit

    The players sinking everyone on sight will continue to do so.

    It's not toxic or greifing either.

    Well, yes and no. You are a veteran pirate obviously, so you must be aware of actual mean spirited and repeated gangking of the same hapless noob by a large crew of experienced 'sailors' that does in fact happen? Combat is to be expected, but to say there are not honorless, cowardly, and toxic greifers can be disproven with a casual youtube search. I'll go as far as to agree that disproportionately ugly behavior is rare. Any battles ending with 'gg' should be celebrated. Battles ending with a noob never returning, and telling their friends how not fun SoT is should be called out. Good hunting in the new year 🎄🎆🍺💀

  • Valhalla Sky
    Seafarer
    Insider

    @scr3amin-cheese said in An idea that may keep more people on the high seas:

    @shadow-xlii

    The only way passive mode would've worked is if all the loot on your ship falls off into the water the second you activate it. Otherwise someone steals your loot, becomes passive and indestructible and you have no chance to fight back.

    If passive could only be activated at the bartender at an outpost, and deactivated the same way, then the entire voyage of that crew would be restricted. Can't shoot ram take any other crews stuff, and can only sell loot for half value. Deactivating before selling voids gains for the entire voyage, 😁

  • PithyRumble
    Rogue
    Insider

    @valhalla-sky

    You lost your point when you sank to their level (cowardly/dishonorable baits)

    It's not toxic to sink someone.
    It's not griefing to camp them to siphon supplies.
    It's not toxic to attack an opportunistic sink.

    Sometimes it's just like that.

    And before your inevitable comeback of accusing me of it, solo slooper pve focused.

  • Valhalla Sky
    Seafarer
    Insider

    @scr3amin-cheese said in An idea that may keep more people on the high seas:

    @shadow-xlii

    the complainers have got their separate mode leave the proper version as it is.

    I've owned SoT a long time and have barely touched it over other mmo options mostly because when I tell family and friend's about it being exclusively pvp they talk me into playing something else. Call this a complaint if you want.

    I've pvp'd in games where we destroyed several months work of a rival clan in a few short hours. "Alpha" was part of our clan name. Not everyone wants to play that way, whether it months of effort or only hours that is lost. You have soft pvp here, not like losing multiple clan bases, all your tames (espcially your favorites) all your ascended gear, and having half your people quit forever.

    Here I lose(?) a ship that cost me nothing and click my heels 3 times and it was all just a dream. Do you crave hard pvp with real consequences? That isn't here. You are already on Safer Seas, and always have been. Don't dismiss people who wish to experience the beauty of this games artistic side as mere complainers. They will probably add years to the life of this game. Sorry if I came off as a bit triggered. I work it all out by playing games. 😉🎄🎆

  • Valhalla Sky
    Seafarer
    Insider

    @pithyrumble Killing the same helpless noob over and over again is unworthy no matter the labels I choose. Like pulling the legs off a grasshopper. I stand by my words. Still, happy holidays, however you enjoy them.

  • Valhalla Sky
    Seafarer
    Insider

    @pithyrumble I am NOT saying you do it. I'm saying I won't. Someone so helpless would need a teacher. Am I wrong?

  • SomberMako
    Castaway

    Absolutely under no circumstances should one be freely granted a value of the treasure onboard a ship.

    Risk vs Reward.

    You want their treasure or want to know what's up before you waste time committing to a possible nothing sandwich, then you should be forced to board their ship, scout their loot and make that decision at the cost of your player and ship's survivability.

    Ridiculous idea....

  • Valhalla Sky
    Seafarer
    Insider

    @pithyrumble said in An idea that may keep more people on the high seas:

    @valhalla-sky

    It's not toxic to sink someone.
    It's not griefing to camp them to siphon supplies.
    It's not toxic to attack an opportunistic sink.

    Sometimes it's just like that.

    It is toxic to actively stalk a respawning noob otherwise you are correct on the first point.
    Camping noobs is farming babies, and they didn't buy the game to be your food bank and I'm sure they feel very very griefed. Maybe enough to play a different game next time? How is that good?
    I take advantage of opportunities as well. By all means sink me. I'm very much a noob to THIS game, but I'll get better as I spend more time. Maybe I'll sink you. Maybe we will team up. Who can say? I do have a real problem with bullies (no accusations) I think you must understand what I'm getting at.

    I'm specifically calling out behavior that goes past pvp. It happens, and it is toxic. I have defended noobs elsewhere, in other games, and helped them get a foothold. Hero or tyrant.

    Thanks for the conversation. ✌️

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