Look I think with how the sales have picked up since the announcement as have players returning it speaks for itself people just want PVE they don't care for the pvp because it's badly worked out, full of griefers, glitches, and exploits to death loop players onto being unable to defend themselves. In short the PvP in the game is just not fun. Pvp can be great look at dark souls. But even dark souls, a game built by a msochist for msochistic people, let's you opt out of pvp if you want. People need to just let go of forcing pvp and let people just adventure and have fun PvE where the game really shines. I've had more toxic unfun interactions with other players than any other game universally. And so few interactions that were fun or anything but annoying and griefers filled. The only people advocating for the forced pvp is bad people. Not a single good player who is a good part of the community is anything but happy about the PvE options. And most of them want a full PvE mode. Look at creators for twitch and stuff. So many of them have to turn off in game chat and stuff because of trolls and griefers even ship names aren't safe sometimes. I for one hope they just add a pve flag that makes other players outside of your alliance unable to interact with your ship as if your ship was a ghost. Or just add in PvE servers fully. If you want to force pvp then let's completely remove the exploits and bugs and refine the system so it's fun cause at this moment it just ain't. Never has been.
Safer Seas gold and rep.
@artixshadowbane at this point I don’t think full PvE servers will ever happen. They’ve made their compromise 5 years in, with heavy restrictions (which are right for the game). If you don’t like PvP, I’m sorry to say it but either adapt, play something else, or live on the Safer Seas with your penalty. I’m not trying to be mean, but they are the options.
@blazebeard2313 said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
I'm starting to think that are just mad because now they will encounter only competent people and they are scared of that.
This honestly seems to be the driving force behind people who are adamantly opposed to SS.
"Hey, where'd all the easy targets go?"@artixshadowbane I wouldn't go so far as to make the two completely separate. It removes the spark and the shine that the game has.
Is it ruined with exploiters, hackers, cheaters, and loons? Absolutely. But, eventually, they'll finish whatever they came for, and disappear in droves. Making proper people be doing what they will.
Remember, Rare is working on fixes for them. And the seas will be better than ever.
@osiricc so many " skilled " pirates got used to punching down they are afraid of being prey themselves I love the irony
@subject-18-jord said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
@osiricc so many " skilled " pirates got used to punching down they are afraid of being prey themselves I love the irony
Pvpers adapted to HG in season 8 quite well, interest in competition went up significantly when they were given the opportunity to consistently find some competitive fights.
There was quite a shift in gameplay/behavior at that point
People often add this accusatory tone to effects of the design but the reality of what existed is that players were playing the game (sometimes in extreme ways) and for a long time there was a lack of consistent competition.
Arena was cool but it existed outside of adventure and didn't have that random adventure treasure style to it, and a lot of pirates prefer to steal and all that.
Some player content was long based on messing with new players but overall it was always more about treasure hunting and boat sinking, often times there was far too much coordination happening.
The effect of the activity lead to safer seas but it wasn't as malicious as implied.
I personally think a lot of priorities were off target for a couple+ years with risk/reward/competition but overall they did the best they could with what existed.
I think this is more of something we were always gonna have to go through, even if they had done it differently it doesn't necessarily mean it would have changed much overall.
It should be better going forward, there have been and will be a lot of changes that should improve the environment, at least some of the areas that have been struggles for the game.
Almost seems like people are worried that the pvp servers will only having pvp players making it more difficult to harass players so there trying to find ways to force pve players back onto there servers by denying the a good part of the game if this isn't the reason then what's the problem with letting pve players have there servers as is
@guyrza I'd guess a lot of players enjoy casual chill sessions without the stress of being attacked constantly. Over-all I believe safe seas will increase the total # of players on-line
@subject-18-jord In the part months I've met only 1 crew in open world who actually managed to wipe the floor with me. And it was AMAZING. I want to have actual competent players on the seas and not reaper runners
@guyrza sagte in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
@blazebeard2313 my concern is that these players will reach lvl 40, earn some gold, tip their finger into higher seas and will get sunk. So they will wait for community day and rush to pirate legend, and after that will either leave the game, or try to do something in high seas. Issue is, nobody is going to prepare then for the actual game in pve servers. They wont know any viable strategies, and wont even pay attention to horizon during the first few sessions. There is nothing that prepares them for it. So what will happen is they will go back to safe seas, leaving the high seas emptier than ever.
yeah, well, but they will alrdy know how the PvE part works, so there is that. They will know about different voyages, islands, forts, cannon balls. About repairing ships, NPC encounters like skelly gally and kraken, about storms and sirens. Then, in the higher seas, they can experience the full game with PvPvE while alrdy having some basic knowledge about the game. What is wrong with that.
They game got filled with so much stuff the last years, long time players seem to forget they could "grow" into it - while newbies today get thrown into so much different possibilities and things to take care of, all while being harrassed by sweatlords who have an advantage of 1000 hours in combat experience. It was not like this when I started, or you started (probably)
Like someone else alrdy said: Stop gatekeeping.
@guyrza sagte in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
@subject-18-jord In the part months I've met only 1 crew in open world who actually managed to wipe the floor with me. And it was AMAZING. I want to have actual competent players on the seas and not reaper runners
If that is your wish, you should be happy for SS, as the rookies will most likely go there now, leaving the higher seas to more skilled crews.
@parrotlord6426 I still fail to understand how the casual players leaving to play a single-player (essentially) mode will attract more competent crews to the seas. If they leave, they leave. The % of competent players does not change because of it
@guyrza said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
@parrotlord6426 I still fail to understand how the casual players leaving to play a single-player (essentially) mode will attract more competent crews to the seas. If they leave, they leave. The % of competent players does not change because of it
It's essentially changing from a design that brings in new players for updates and just let's them go get run outta here because it can be more intense/off-putting than people expect and are prepared for
it's giving new players and players giving the game another chance to get to the point where they want to stick around
a lot of the narratives have been "they still won't be prepared" when really it's more about getting them more attached to their story before they abandon it
people can get through it when they care and at least have some basics to work with, when the experience is unpleasant and there is no attachment it's much easier to leave the experience before people realize their potential and develop their personal styles.
@guyrza Well, as I see it: Let us say out of 100% players, there are probably 20-30% of newbies at any given time. Let us further assume maybe 50% intermediates, and 20-30 % pro players.
The numbers are not important so much, just the distribution generally: Players of different skill and experience level.
Now, this distribution should also reflect on the servers.
So we should expect the same distribution of newbies/intermediates/pros on any server - generally speaking. We should always - up to now - have a variety of different skill/experience on the servers.
Now: If we take the newbies and some intermediates away - because they chill on the saver seas in the future - then the distribution would change. Now we would have only intermediates and pro-players left on the high sea, if we assume the newbies and some intermediates leave. Kinda similar to season 8 that took a lot of hardcore sweats out of generic adventure, as they started going for combat exclusivly.
So, in conclusion we will experience more intermediate and Pro players on the high seas.@parrotlord6426 thats a valid explanation, but here's what concerns me. If we say that 15% of new players and 5% of intermediate players left for safer seas, we will notice the overall reduction in the higher seas by 20% or so. They still will be playing the game, but simply outside of other players reach. These changes will increase the competitiveness of higher seas, with more pros and intermediates left. And this increased competition, together with the new PVP voyage with the skull, will result in more pro players arriving into higher seas out of HG for that bounty. The increase in % of pro players outside the HG will increase drastically, resulting in more intermediate players leaving the game entirely or to safer seas.
In simpler terms, higher seas will become more competitive due to the higher % of skilled players, which may further discourage newer player to play this mode after safer seas.Your post hits on a BIG issue that experienced players really do dismiss. When you look at map silhouettes from Voyage clues and immediately know which ones they are and where they are in the world it's an enormous advantage. When a clue tells you to go to a landmark or look for something specific on an island and you already know about it and the quickest way to get there there is no comparison at all to someone searching the island, sometimes for a LONG time, just trying to puzzle out one step of a multi step clue. All of that time exposes them to attack, passersby getting in potshots, etc. - greatly expanding opportunity for disaster to strike.
The amount of time it takes for someone to simply complete a Voyage when they don't already know the map and everything in it reflexively and by heart is exponentially more challenging than for the people typically attacking them. This also has the cumulative effect of making the relatively small amount of loot they may have acquired up to that point substantially more valuable to them than even the face value of it to an experienced attacker.
Yeah, I disagree. I think where Rare has it is pretty good. Why should there be no commendation progression on Safer Seas? Was the point of lighting all the braziers with a flame of fortune or finding all of Umbra's stuff for tattoos to do it while at risk for being sunk by Reapers? I think not. There's no point in gatekeeping fishing commendations behind the threat of PvP.
@merlin-mav-k said:
The amount of time it takes for someone to simply complete a Voyage when they don't already know the map and everything in it reflexively and by heart is exponentially more challenging than for the people typically attacking them. This also has the cumulative effect of making the relatively small amount of loot they may have acquired up to that point substantially more valuable to them than even the face value of it to an experienced attacker.
yes agree 100%
Skills experienced players have:- being able to almost instantly find burrowed treasure with the first dig attempts due to high knowledge of the islands and how to read treasure maps
- knowing any island from just a part of the silluette, enabling you to finish GH vault with just the x-marked map piece
- knowing all of the main puzzles and being able to solve them quickly
- know how to deal with all the special chests like sorrow and rage
- knowing how to read maps, be it GH, be it Merchant, be it Athena
- knowing how to deal with NPC attacks like kraken, Meg, skelly, ghost fleet (eg.: any ghost ship takes 3 hits, never let them run through your ship, etc.)
All those skills make questing so much easier, and reduces the time a player is exposed to risk of being attacked. Your post just brought back old memories from when I first started: Man, everything took sooo looong :D. I was spending an hour maybe on 1 island alone, trying to find the treasure spots, trying to find the stupid scarecrow..
Ofc. we can say: "well, new players have to go through the hard school, like we did!" - But Imho: We did not. The game was not as complex with multiple quests, world events etc. when we started, and also the player skills develop over time, 3-5 years ago there simply was not so much skills on the player side.
And also: Why not give newbies a "safer" approach. I would have liked it, and my gf and my sister would probably still play the game if this mode had been out 4 years ago.
I do not understand that argument. It is like: "I had to suffer, so now you have to suffer too." xdI think Rare did pretty good on this approach with SS.
@guyrza you actually sound like the guy that goes around grieving players and just upset you will lose players to prey upon. Rare had their fun and allowed the shenanigans to continue for far too long!!!
They fail to realize there is a much larger grown folk player base out there of gamers that would pay money to this game if allowed private sessions to play with friends and family without the toxicity of the player base that has infested these seas!! Myself and my family included!! Some people don’t like working 50+ hours a week to come hop on a game to lose 2-3 hours worth of play.
This addition still is dumbed down in which I think the opposite!! Outside of the pvp aspects of the game like reapers chest, etc., the entire full game should be available and just giving the toggle to have “invite only” session!! Normal progression, gold, skull forts and all!!
In the end of off this, Rare studios is the only ones hurting from this by losing out on lost revenue cause they don’t want to add this option. Safer Seas will only bring a few of us back for a short time to just give up again due to the failed additions of private play or invite only to the original content!! Their loss!! Not mine. I’ll spend my money elsewhere!! It’s just sad to see a great game go to waste!!
When you look at it, PvE servers or safe areas have been a topic of discussion since the technical alpha.
I don't care about High Seas anymore, I'm not going back. I'm willing ot accept the current limitations to Safer Seas, as long as I don't have to meet another player because it only brings tragedy and stress to me.
PvE servers have been a topic of discussion, the infinite pirate generator has been a topic of discussion, and many more. Yeah, this game is different but being different not always means better. I remember that the maiden voyage didnt exist back in 2018, you were thrown into the world and before you understood anything you could be shot at the outpost.
Safer Seas was a needed addition, and I am glad that newer player and PvE focused players can now have a place to relax and have fun their own way.
Honestly after all this time, I think that despite 30% gold, lvl 40 reps and most commendations still being available is still a bit too generous for having the biggest difficulty of the game being removed, I think its an overall reasonable compromise that I can live with.
Ever since PVE servers were begged for, I've always believed that incentive to still play PVEVP servers would be the only way to still hold on to the spirit of the game with the shared world while having a separate safer world, and I think Rare achieved a great compromise here.
And you know what? I'll probably chill in safe seas myself once in a while too, watching movies and doing tall tales, and would've done it even with a 0% rewards rate because I enjoy the game for playing it and not for the virtual carrots dangled in my face.
@tak225 said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
Almost seems like people are worried that the pvp servers will only having pvp players making it more difficult to harass players so there trying to find ways to force pve players back onto there servers by denying the a good part of the game if this isn't the reason then what's the problem with letting pve players have there servers as is
I can't speak for anybody but myself, but I for one will be happy to share the high seas with like-minded people who accept and understand the risks and challenges proposed to them in that mode. Hopefully I don't get to hear people whine anymore, although this is a lot to ask haha. Shaming people and saying that people don't want a challenge is rather hypocrite when the same people ask for an easy mode.
Over the year you have brought this argument countless time, but nobody is forcing anybody to play any mode, nor denying any part of the game. Only you deny yourself of parts of the game by actively avoiding them, not the other way around. You have and still seem to campaign for full PVE servers, showing that some people will never be happy no matter how much Rare tries. "Give them an inch and they ask for a mile" takes all it's sense here.
I think all PVE servers advocates should rejoice and be grateful of what Rare is doing and accept that compromise.
@linowx said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
People really seem to forget someone playing on Safer Seas will have to work up to 9 times more when compared to someone on High Seas. I would say that's more than fair.
yeah and one boat/no captaincy. Personally I think it's more about a big change that just takes people some time to settle in with.
This mode is actually so taxed that I think it shows how serious Rare is about it actually working as intended. So I think the "Rare is just doing this for/because.."narratives are off imo. I think this is a serious attempt to do exactly what they are saying they are trying to do.
@linowx said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
People really seem to forget someone playing on Safer Seas will have to work up to 9 times more when compared to someone on High Seas. I would say that's more than fair.
For example:
Lost shipments with Grade V - 70.000
Lost shipments without emmisary - 28.000
Lost shipments at 30% without emmisary - 8.400@dragotech123 said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
@linowx said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
People really seem to forget someone playing on Safer Seas will have to work up to 9 times more when compared to someone on High Seas. I would say that's more than fair.
For example:
Lost shipments with Grade V - 70.000
Lost shipments without emmisary - 28.000
Lost shipments at 30% without emmisary - 8.400Personally I think it'll settle in for a lot of people as a hybrid experience.
Some days are safer seas days and some are high seas days which is good for 2 reasons. 1. I think it'll retain more players and 2. it'll help players maintain a more compatible and manageable SoT experience which is better morale overall.
More players taking breaks while still staying attached to the environment is overall better than less players that grind high seas until early burnout/resentment
This is going to be a very interesting change imo. I don't think it's going to be for the worse I think that there is going to be a more content player base while still offering some intensity in high seas.
I don't think this effect will only be positive for new/inexperienced/non-fighter players, I've seen in shift in quite a bit of veteran play as well, my personal opinion is that the intensity of how some of us have played has overall mellowed a lot of us imo.
Quite a few veteran players got more into fishing since season 7, players doing veils to chill, more random adventure stuff. I think that played a big part in why the reaction to it really hasn't been that bad overall.
Lots to be optimistic/hopeful about imo.
@guyrza I missed the part where that's my problem catch your runners GET GUD I sunk 5 ships last night 3 of them sweats 1 one them ran to the red sea we we cut him off from selling I have zero sympathy for players that act bug then take as you would put it the cowards way out game should have striped them of there gold skelly and ghost the sec they did that
@merlin-mav-k exactly when you first start out don't know what your doing that small treasure you managed to get is worth a lot more to you cause to you it took HOURS what takes skilled pros mins
@linowx said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
People really seem to forget someone playing on Safer Seas will have to work up to 9 times more when compared to someone on High Seas. I would say that's more than fair.
Up to, yes - if your loot is 100% of the correct Emissary. We end up with loads of items that sell for just 100% and not 250%.
Lots of people who avoid PvP also avoid putting an emissary up - especially Reapers; saying they will earn 9 times less is playing with the numbers a bit.
The loot without any risk is 30%, root with risk is 100% and loot with more risk (emissary) is above 100% (and almost never 250% for everything).
@guyrza said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
Since this is supposed to be a tutorial mode for new players to prepare to the actual game, I suggest that:
- No commedations whatsoever are acheived in safer seas
Commendations are part of it, alot of them will be locked away anyway due to the current limitations in place
- Gold earned from loot is only 10% of the original value
30% is already a big hit, especially since emissaries are not a thing which means that any gold/rep gain with no emmisaries in mind is already highly limited. (Higher seas means an instant 333% increase not to mention the 2.5 x multiplier emmisaries bring)
- Reputation earned is 50% of the original value
So you want to lessen gold but increase rep ?
- Reputation cap for the three factions is lvl 30 instead of 40
40 is not even halfway to 50 rep wise not to mention 75 or higher
- Plunder Pass progression is turned off in the safer seas
Why? If they pay for plunder pass they should not be limited to a certain mode, the legality alone would probably be an issue
I believe these changes to be more effective in making safer seas seen as the "tutorial mode", rather than the alternative to the actual game. Players should be encouraged to play the main game, rather than being too comfortable in safer seas.
It is a starter mode first and formost but also a place where veterans can go and chill if they so please
I have always been against full on pve servers and actually didn’t like the introduction of safer seas but the limitations in place are good
@subject-18-jord u should start putting dots and comas in ur posts, I genuinely stopped seeing your point on the second line
- "So you want to lessen gold but increase rep ?" As far as I know, there is no nerf to reputation in safer seas as of now. If there is, and its below 50%, then its my bad.
- "40 is not even halfway to 50 rep wise not to mention 75 or higher" True, but its very close to 50, which is what you need to become pirate legend. My concern is players would reach this level, then speedrun the last 10 lvls during community day and wont touch higher seas again
@guyrza said in Safer Seas gold and rep.:
- "So you want to lessen gold but increase rep ?" As far as I know, there is no nerf to reputation in safer seas as of now. If there is, and its below 50%, then its my bad.
All rewards are 30%
- "40 is not even halfway to 50 rep wise not to mention 75 or higher" True, but its very close to 50, which is what you need to become pirate legend. My concern is players would reach this level, then speedrun the last 10 lvls during community day and wont touch higher seas again
Well yes that is an option, and then what ? You cant do athena on safer seas, athenas fortune is not there, no athena voyages, no legend of the veil. So yeey you have become pirate legend, with a huge grind from 0 to 40 (i remember the year grind to PL and the 30% limiter is HUGE) on safer seas, somewhat easier for the last 10 levels, but no way to safely gain athena rep
