One thing that I would really like to see in this game in the future is a training area. These areas can be seen in games such as Paladins and it is simply a large open area where you can test out weapons on NPCs and - in Sea of Thieves' case - seeing how bullet travel works on a moving player, being able to track people who are running and strafing. This would be very useful for an introduction to newer players and also very useful for the people who are more on the PvP side of the game who want to inprove their skills.
Having a "training" area of the game
@max-kappa sagte in Having a "training" area of the game:
One thing that I would really like to see in this game in the future is a training area. These areas can be seen in games such as Paladins and it is simply a large open area where you can test out weapons on NPCs and - in Sea of Thieves' case - seeing how bullet travel works on a moving player, being able to track people who are running and strafing. This would be very useful for an introduction to newer players and also very useful for the people who are more on the PvP side of the game who want to inprove their skills.
I agree with you, as I had sort of the same idea floating around in my head. I thought about adding it to the outposts, though this might need some editing work on their layout.
This training ground would be really great to get the PvP mechanics and weapons feel going for newer and more casual players. Reducing the frustration coming from the first encounters against more experienced players. Making them more competitive faster and speeding up things. In my personal view the learning curve for this is to slow and too steep and fighting skellies doesn't really help, getting you some proper PvP feel.
And it could be simply fun to go there, too. You could even create lore around it, make it a quest area in addition, where you have to fight stronger opponents each time or create a server wide tournament...
Additional note: If changing the outposts layout is a bit heavy on the work schedule, another way would be to create one global area like the Athena's hideout, where you could freely teleport to from the outposts. Maybe create a new NPC like the Duel Master or a veteran pirate that's knows for his legendary skills with the blade.. and so on. Make speaking to him the gateway to that training ground.
This method would actually work better, if you'd want to create some sort of tournament as you could enter from any outpost and not just a specific one.
@sir-buildalot81 Certainly a way of battling other pirates of the skill level 1 v 1 would be incredible and I would love it, but I don't think it's going to be added any time soon. The Athena's fortune type hideout would be perfect, yes, as it would take strain off the servers. Anywhere where there could be running NPCs that have the same health as players would make me happy and help me practice a bit before a big TDM or arena fight.
@stundorn sagte in Having a "training" area of the game:
against it because it supports the PvE versus PvP debate and you showing and already come up with this "people ho are more on the PvP side of the game" bs.
there should be only pvevpirates - end of story.
nothing that supports this split will get my support.What you are writing here is untrue to what this features' use would be. Is in tonality completely off and let's you look like a stalker.
Well done!@stundorn I don't think you are a stalker, you have just raised a legitimate concern. Would something like this become another PVP Arena? I'm against splitting the player base also, but defending yourself is PVP too. While Max Kappa's idea is rough, it isn't totally without merit. A way for PVErs to improve their skills with practice might be helpful.
PVPrs get their practice out on the seas, so is that the best way? You want to improve your skills, get out there and attack people. Maybe, I don't know, right now that is the only choice.
Would NPC's be able to replicate what a real player can or would do? Probably not. We already have plenty of land fight practice with NPC's. Not very helpful improving skills with real players onboard ships.
Maybe a better option would be to allow dueling with crewmates... a menu option that once selected would allow you to take hits and die, but once dead you would not go to the ferry but be revived.
Anyway I think a way or an area to practice skills is an interesting idea which might be worth discussing.@pollyoliverperk The main reason I suggest it is so newer players can get to know the weapons and how much damage they all do and how they work in terms of bullet travel, bullet drop and combination of weapons. It wouldn't be made to encourage PvP and would be a singleplayer addon so it would be one player and multiple NPCs. Maybe some could be strafing, some could be stood still with heath bars above them etc.
@max-kappa So you are talking about an area separate from the game, maybe like the Maiden Voyage? Interesting, a lot could be done with a training camp. Would it be beneficial enough for Rare to go to the work and expense of creating it? Would players use it enough to be worthwhile? Maybe if it was a fun challenge that stood on it's own, an extra addition to the game which improved players understanding and abilities in the game, it might be worth investing in.
I like the health bars idea, I target practice but I don't really know the outcome, only if I've hit the target or not.@max-kappa said in Having a "training" area of the game:
@stundorn so wait what's arena for? xd
Arena is not the PvP server nor is it for PvP.
Arena is a condensed version of the game. Literally take the normal size of the game and shrink it to the size of an arena map and the same things will happen.
@jetorchidee97 said in Having a "training" area of the game:
@xultanis-dragon Arena is PvP and is far from being a condensed version of the game.
Arena is the condensed version of the game. If adventure was as small as the arena, then players would be fighting constantly too.
Arena is not the PvP server.
@xultanis-dragon Interesting, I hadn't really thought about the Arena in that way before. I see your point but I've come to the conclusion if it is a condensed version of Adventure mode, then everything has been condensed to the point where nothing is left except PVP.
A rose by any other name is still a rose.@pollyoliverperk said in Having a "training" area of the game:
@xultanis-dragon Interesting, I hadn't really thought about the Arena in that way before. I see your point but I've come to the conclusion if it is a condensed version of Adventure mode, then everything has been condensed to the point where nothing is left except PVP.
A rose by any other name is still a rose.I know what you tried to do there but the phrase actually hurts your argument and strengthens mine. Arena is a condensed version of Adventure and that would mean regardless of how you "view" it, its not the PvP mode.
A rose is a rose is derived from the context that no matter what anyone calls it, it is what it is.
The ones who created Arena say its a condensed version of Adventure and is not a PvP server or PvP mode.
As they were the ones who created it their intent is what decides what type of mode it is.
Is Arena a condensed version of Adventure?? Yes.
Did the Dev's create it so that players could PvP?? No.
Did the Dev's create it as a way for players to get some SoT in even if they only had 30mins to play?? Yes.
Is the objective to kill your opponents or even attack them?? No. You can win without doing that, albeit a lot harder since they changed it but I've done it. Not as often as original Arena.
Arena by any other mode is still Adventure.....just smaller :)
SIDE NOTE The issue is that players are calling Arena the PvP mode. If that is the case then Arena needs to be changed because when Arena first came out players were complaining about how you can win completely without firing a single shot.
By the same definition that everyone is using to call it the PvP mode that would mean that original Arena was the PvE mode since it was ridiculous PvE.
Since a LOT of the games could be won without fighting AT ALL. I can't remember how many games I won without firing a single cannon ball. After we turned in so many chests we just started fishing, didn't even care if someone came by and sank us, we had so many points we would win anyways.
Just because the state of the mode swung from HEAVY PvE to now Heavy PvP doesn't make it the PvP mode. Again, the creators have a plan for it.
If players have a problem with Arena, then stop calling it the PvP mode and instead start asking Rare to re-balance it better.
The flaw in your thought is, no so called pve player will improve his pvp skills!
The next flaw is every player in SoT is a PvEvP player.
If you login you accept pvp and the moment you watch the horizon for other ships you already start pvp because of the uncertainty about them. You are already reacting to a potential thread by other players = sandbox PvP!Arena was the biggest mistake Rare could have done to their adventerous PvEvPirates playerbase. It made up for the split and still is supporting all the gamer jerks tdm'ing and beeing loudmouth elitist gamers.
Last point: everyone who reduce the gameplay to either vE or vP has at first self inflicted problems he makes the other side guilty for or comes up with the super hilarious claim and rant against Rare they only cater to the other side.
True for both sides whining about how all is so pro pve when on the opposite all whine how pvp isnt fair or balanced etc....We had zero discussion about this bs in 2018 and we had nearly to no problems until some streamers started exploting and made it popular and until stomping and tucking little kids felt so "satisfying", not to forget showing others off call them noobs and swing your ePeen to your elitist vibe of uber gaming.
Therefore i say No!!! to anything that supports more split, more gamer elitism and i say no to meritocracy thinking about playing a fun comical pirate adventure game.
Including pvp!!!I feel only pity for exagerating sweats about their git gud stance in this game.
I dont say anyone of you is one of them, i only say that it is a problem and that i dont want to support it.
And an extra training ground will do this.@stundorn sagte in Having a "training" area of the game:
And an extra training ground will do this.
In what way?
@Xultanis Dragon and @Stundorn Thank you both for taking the time and effort to express your thoughts. I appreciate a discussion which allows me to see another side to the question. You both made some good points.
Arena by any other mode is still Adventure.....just smaller :)
I have to be honest I never have viewed Arena as anything but PVP mode. Maybe it was the name, Arena which denotes fighting to me, maybe it was the way it was introduced as an intense new game mode, an all new competitive mode where you and your crew battle against teams of other players, competing for glory. Cannon balls flying, gunpowder barrels exploding and shots being exchanged... I didn't see pvepvp, I saw a PVP Arena.
But yes, I think I see your point Xultanis Dragon, severely boiled down SOT: You go get something, you fight something, you try to turn it in, you may be attacked, you get rewarded or not... rinse repeat. In that sense Arena is a condensed version of Adventure, you are using the same tools and skills doing the same actions.If that is the case then Arena needs to be changed because when Arena first came out players were complaining about how you can win completely without firing a single shot.
Was that because, like me, they thought the Arena was PVP mode and expected to win by PVP? In the original Arena PVE skills did make a difference, not so much now. I'm not sure why the Arena was ever introduced. I thought it was a possible mistake from the beginning, but why I thought it was a mistake then and why I think it might be a mistake now has altered somewhat. I do hope it is as you say, "Again, the creators have a plan for it". I'm just glad I'm not the one having to come up with that plan.
As far as being a way to play SOT with limited time, why not spend your hour in Adventure and call it good unless "you have the spirit of competitiveness running in your veins" and just want to PVP?
The Arena is truly PVEPVP balanced because you are going to spend a great deal of your limited time in a PVE lobby. :-D (Only joking)At first I didn't get the reason for a distinction. Why did it matter what it was called? I struggled trying to understand why it was important, and why was the distinction important in this thread. But then I read Stundorn:
Arena was the biggest mistake Rare could have done to their adventerous PvEvPirates playerbase. It made up for the split and still is supporting all the gamer jerks tdm'ing and beeing loudmouth elitist gamers.
I realized if you call the Arena PVP mode, and Rare has created it in the game, it opens the door for arguments for PVE mode and servers. PVE and PVP are terms that divide the player base into opposing camps and then we forget we are all PVEVP'rs, and we forget that is what makes Adventure mode so special and rewarding.
Last point: everyone who reduce the gameplay to either vE or vP has at first self inflicted problems he makes the other side guilty for or comes up with the super hilarious claim and rant against Rare they only cater to the other side.
True for both sides whining about how all is so pro pve when on the opposite all whine how pvp isnt fair or balanced etc....This makes a good point against splitting the player base, because as Rare tries to respond fairly they won't be able do anything right in each and every player's eyes. Ultimately neither side would be satisfied, and this would only hurt SOT and warp Adventure mode.
The next flaw is every player in SoT is a PvEvP player.
If you login you accept pvp and the moment you watch the horizon for other ships you already start pvp because of the uncertainty about them. You are already reacting to a potential thread by other players = sandbox PvP!Excellent point but I don't think this is a flaw in my thought, because I agree with you and always have.
The flaw in your thought is, no so called pve player will improve his pvp skills!
You're right, I did believe PVE players would want to improve their PVP skills, as I said before, defending yourself is PVP. Why wouldn't you want to improve your abilities? Then I understood what you meant, true complete PVE'rs only want to sail in a safe environment, they want the seas to themselves with only like minded players to interact with. They find no value in PVP. I thought I was a PVE'r, I'm not, I'm actually a PvEvP player who appreciates all aspects of Adventure mode.
Again I want to thank both of you gentlemen for patiently explaining your viewpoints.
@stundorn so essentially nothing can be added if it's not in Adventure? Should they get rid of Arena as well?
As this thread has become a general discussion of PvP vs PvE playstyles, we're going to go ahead and lock it down. Please share your thoughts on this topic in the megathread created for that purpose: https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/topic/126843/mega-thread-pvp-and-pve-playstyle-discussion?page=1
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