Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.

  • Let me be clear on what we are talking about here is the denial of an opt out option for people that enjoy playing with a controller just by the fact that they run the game on a different machine, that runs different software. We are talking about removing the xbox only tag from the controller servers. Please try to keep replies to factual information. That we have hackers, cheaters and toxic people in the community does not warrant a players preference or real life restrictons to limit the options the game should offer in the social interactive world known as the Sea of Thieves, Adventure mode. Bear in mind, some people cannot have or afford a machine dedicated to gaming, but do need a PC or Laptop for other aspects of life like school, college or work and have to use that for gaming.

    Rare has decided that in the controller versus mouse and keyboard in regards to balanced combat warrants the opt out option. This is what they stated when they first introduced it into the Arena mode and is the reason they are adding it to Adventure no doubt. Arena is a competitive mode and has to work towards being able to host tournaments. It is all about winning, so trying to even out every small aspect where possible is logical; keep it as purely possible based around player skill as possible. A xbox tag here is maybe to be explained in this type of competitive setting, they want to create a potential for an e-sport and maybe because of the tag larger on xbox than PC, in which more variety will always be a reality.

    Now the major question is why must this competitive attitude carry over to the Adventure mode. The seas that is meant to unite the community and have us interact, the social world! Where the signatures song of Legends is about we shall sail together! Now we have the opt out in this social interactive world, where meeting and playing with other people is central - it is not a competitive scene, even though some might approach it that way.

    My suggestion is to change the opt-out option to just be controller in the future. Have Rare stand by their No Compromise Crossplay design and have them place it on the roadmap. The development is going to take time, just acknowledge that a persons preference to play with a controller even on a PC does not warrant the design choice difference in treatment between the two platforms, especially when it is in regards to one of the major game-play centric experiences combat.

    My preference would have been not to have the opt-out at all, but to have Rare balance it out enough between input devices and I do hope they keep working towards that goal. If it really has to be in the game at this point in time, I do not think it is unreasonable to ask to not be classified by the machine we run the game on and then just denied the choice for a more balanced gameplay, the same choice that is being given to other people based on a different machine they bought. The question was always going to be: Why isn't this on PC or Xbox? according to their own interviews. What changed or why isn't it an issue between controller and mouse and keyboard on a PC if it is on a xbox? Some clarity at a minimum would be nice at this point in the community, there is a whole PC vs Xbox discussion going on, while lets be obvious about it: we are people not xbox or PC and yet people are flat out refusing to play with them based on a machine. At which point will Rare try to address the elephant in the room, their no compromise crossplay is no more. Is it still the goal to have a single community without VIP sections for Xbox or PC?

    I know this is going to be brought up so, lets address it now hardware differences were always going to be a reality, that is just how the world works. Games have minimum requirements and that is what can play the game. It is the level of entry: Welcome you can join us!

    Xboxes are stable, reliant and a good price to quality. This one is nearing its end, the next one is coming out because of it. That is how fast technology moves. The average PC player might be above xbox now in performance by a slight margin, there are people below and above both. Once the Scarlett hits the market, all of a sudden the average PC player isn't on par anymore with the latest xbox. Over time, because PC's are modular and you upgrade them bit by bit, based on what you can afford. The average PC will meet the xbox and surpass it by a little. Guess what the next version of the xbox comes out! Repeat. This has been going on for as long as consoles have been around, that has always been the case. If you want more in-game graphical options, performance aspects that you believe you are missing on xbox, please make a suggestion about what you want and you will have my support. The goal is still to balance the two sides and provide the best experience to everyone, not just some.

    Adventure mode should be about anyone that hits the bar of entry is welcome to be the pirate they want to be. No restrictions, all pirates are equal!

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  • @cotu42 The same was requested in Insider, and nothing happened, it's about input devices not platforms.
    It seems that parity and "one build" no longer exist. 🤷🏻‍♂️

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  • Frankly, their is absolutely no point in wasting breath here. They made it quite clear they don't care about their PC population. They remain absolutely silent to actually inform them if things will work out. If Arena opt out pref. failure wasn't enough to let Rare see how well things would work, what else would? Xbox players get decent ques to be honest meanwhile PC players still get horrible times.

    I hope things will work out, but I won't hold my breath for Rare to do something about it if things don't work out.

  • @nabberwar

    Pretty sure the Arena opt-out system is still broken, but it definitely was at the beginning of its implementation. Whether their third or so fix for it was successful, I don't know, I don't play Arena anyways. However, it's all but dead now anyways, due to the original glitches, so now its matchmaking system doesn't have the people to properly function.

  • should just have been by input device from the get-go.

  • If you are going to use a Controller on Pc, get a console and problem solved.

    Controller vs Mouse isn't the only suspect here, its Pc overall quick loading vs console slow loading times. That and more Console players have a Mic. Just Pc players scared they have to fight each other, or something like that.

    But Im just a simple gamer, what do I know?

  • @burnbacon

    Games have minimum requirements and that is what can play the game.

    Why should my preference in input device be only supported if I own a different machine? Should a game balance option really deny people access based on a machine classification?

    If you care about performance, shouldn't it be on you to address your own setup if you think it isn't good enough and not on me to adjust mine. Not everyone has the luxury of being able to buy a designated gaming machine, so why should that be a requirement within the game?

    What you are stating is that controller on a PC versus a mouse and keyboard is balanced while not on xbox? Wasn't that the reason for the opt out to begin with? Isn't that why xbox on mouse and keyboard are excluded from the option? They also experience performance differences and yet do not get to opt out.

    What you are saying is no different than when people state the following, want better performance... buy a PC solved! Therefore how is that argument valid as a determining factor to deny us access to a game combat balanced experience regarding preference of input? If spend money is the solution, you can solve all those performance differences and even be better by doing so, welcome to reality.

    Adventure mode is about interaction and not competition. Did you read the post at all or just responding to the headline?

  • @cotu42 There is no point in responding to him, who don't understand the new Xbox.

    We are simply asking for the same options in all SoT builds, It doesn't matter if you are playing on PC, console or mobile.
    Maybe @TEDDY-25 can explain it.

  • @quietrobot

    I am an old-school gamer, I have been playing games for 25 years and if one does not engage in debate how will either one ever learn and adapt or understand each other?

  • @cotu42 You're right, it's not about old school.
    Discuss I agree, in fact we did it in Insider, what we need is a response from Rare.

  • @usualbarley8154

    We cannot have a discussion if people just state; No! So, please clarify your statement and be a positive contributor to the discussion.

    This option is regarding game balance between input models, why should one player be denied the option while it is offered to others with the same preference?

  • @usualbarley8154 said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    No.
    No PC on Xbox only servers.

    Yup.. Exactly that!

  • @cotu42 I think it's best to just ignore that fella, his only goal seems to be creating unrest through poor baiting attempts.

  • @l4chsfps said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @cotu42 I think it's best to just ignore that fella, his only goal seems to be creating unrest through poor baiting attempts.

    I could say the same about the OP's post. Not hating on anyone but I'm tired of reading all of this.

  • @usualbarley8154 said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @cotu42

    No.
    Theres nothing to discuss. No PC on Xbox servers. if they want to split PC again I dont care though we already heard tons of "concern" about poor pc guys being left out in the cold by rare actually listening to the Xbox players so I'm not sure further splitting PC is smart.

    Why respond to a topic if you have no interest in a discussion about the topic.

    No PC on Xbox servers.

    What makes me a PC? I am a pirate, gamer human?

    You're not being denied anything that you're paying for.

    If it is about xbox, can you explain why xbox players using a mouse and keyboard are excluded? Are they not part of the xbox community and need to be forced into crossplay?

    If it is unfair between controller and mouse and keyboard how is this not be denying PC players the same balanced experience choices that are being given to xbox users based on their preference to play with a controller?

  • Unfortunately it not just about the controllers. The other day on Arena I had a crew kill the four of us on cannons with four cannon balls then cannon onto our ladder to double gun spawn kill us for the rest of the match. That sounds pretty impossible to me without some form of third party assistance. Its not a level playing field.

    Now I know that is not all pc players but it is some and unfortunately you are now left to wallow in the cess pool of their creation.

  • @phantaxus then how do you justify the controller aspect of the option. Why are xbox players that use a mouse and keyboard excluded to choose to play with the xbox opt out?

    Based on the dev update regarding it being introduced in Arena it most definitely was about controller, I haven't seen any information that controller vs mouse and keyboard is not the main reason for the option and is why it is a part of the option. Why should PC players not be given the same balanced experience?

  • @inboundbomb You're free to ignore these threads tho.

    @UsualBarley8154 Bait doesn't have anything to do with whether I like someone's opinion or not, but you come rushing into a thread without trying to participate in the thread's topic only to shove your opinion in other people's face.

  • @l4chsfps said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @inboundbomb You're free to ignore these threads tho.

    @UsualBarley8154 Bait doesn't have anything to do with whether I like someone's opinion or not, but you come rushing into a thread without trying to participate in the thread's topic only to shove your opinion in other people's face.

    True.... maybe I should stay off the forums this week. Going to be way to much drama from both sides. I just want to know the spawn rate of the Reaper's Bounty chest but nooooo one is talking about it. Lol. I picked up one last night and held on to it for 6 hours just for the PvP action. Not a single one popped up the entire time nor an hour later after delivering it.😔

  • @inboundbomb True, I think the next couple of days will be bad ones for the forum if you want to discuss anything but crossplay hahaha

  • That ship has sailed!

    I can also ask for Trackball servers.

    To me this is because they pay to Microsoft afaik.
    Dont know exactly, but to be able to play online on xbox seems to have some fee, or?

    Honestly, the Arena and e-sports and catering to several streamers caused this.
    The try to attract hardcore gamers.

    @L4chsFPS explain exactly what he think is impossible without 3rd Party Programm, but this is completely wrong.
    I am not overly skilled or hardcore, just an oldsql player like you and at best an ambitious casual.
    I did exactly that.
    Killed 2 of a crew with cannonshots, shoot myself onto their deck, not the ladder, throwing a firebomb before landing and killed the other two with the cutlass only.
    They were so slow moving, didnt se me coming from the air, were completely overwhelmed and sour about it.
    Not that i can do that if i want to or allways successfully, but it happened and i never hacked or anything else, i just play games for over 3 decades and SoT since Technical Alpha.
    It was luck and some skill tbh.
    But at best 50/50 luck/skill and not 1% more skill than 50.

    With a mouse you have always and forever an advantage aiming.

    Fun fact, i yesterday become aware of the ADS settings, no joke!!!
    I laughed raided it to 10 while at 800dpi since start and we sunk 3 ships yesterday and i killed a handfull of pirates with flintlock and cutlass.

    My aim is bad, my reactions are for what you'd expect for someone being 40+ and my eyes are bad, no glasses.
    But my experience and to stay calm in whatever situation, because the way i aproach SoT in general and especially PvP is maybe giving me some advantage.

    It's sad all this happened.
    Arena, opt out, the hate and toxicity, the catering to jerkish streamers and all.

    You know what will happen.
    These tryhards will use XIM and whatnot.
    A piratess' of my crew yesterday said this:
    I watch the streamers and as long as they own noobs they feel great, when they were matched in Apex to same skilled players they start whining, insulting, even insulting their own teammates for getting killed.
    It's ridiculous, these gamers are ridiculous.

    Lets hope they dont ruin the next game now. But there are perfectly on their way to do so.

    It's the gaming the system aproach and to not be able to play for playings sake and to have good sportsmanship and a for fun aproach.
    Only hate, exageration and cheesing everything what can be exploited.

    They are the ones who destroy SoT.
    It's a minority, racist are also a minority and they spoil ot for many.

    Yesterday we crossed a Brig, when we also were on a Brig.
    We did nothing - NOTHING!

    Textchat: I just try to do this ****** Journal stuff, dont want to be chased by you f.... a.....
    I reported with Screenshot.
    Again, we didnt even make an attempt to attack.
    He was grinding the ***** Journal stuff and i said, how limited. He doesnt need to if he doesnt want to, but cant let go and plays it sour like
    vinegar.

    I like the update very much, nice storys and reminder of old events etc...

    Gamers gaming the system is the problem.
    And i can see the xbox community is in the majority not that type of a gamer.

    I really think over to buy one, just because of that as you for sure recognized i'm a very friendly and playfull pirate. At least i try to be one.

    The problem i have is, i wouldnt even be able to hit a ship with the Pistol with a controller.
    I just cannot play with these things and my thumbs start to hurt very quick if i use one.

  • @inboundbomb said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @l4chsfps said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @cotu42 I think it's best to just ignore that fella, his only goal seems to be creating unrest through poor baiting attempts.

    I could say the same about the OP's post. Not hating on anyone but I'm tired of reading all of this.

    How am I baiting or trying to cause unrest?

    I laid out my concerns, in my opinion in a dignified manner regarding a concern, on how the PC version of the game is not being provided with the same gameplay impact choices as the xbox version of the game on the day the option became live.

    This was supposed to be a no compromise crossplay title and all pirates would be treated fairly and equally. Which clearly is no longer the case, why is it wrong to ask for clarity or to be treated equally to others and ask not to be defined by my machine.

  • Buy a Xbox when you buy a pc you except the various inputs that come with that of you wanna play games with other controller users you probably should not have gone pc and got a PS4 or Xbox one o soon realised that and sold my pc this is one of the reasons people choose consoles over pc hardware and alot of us don't want this to change

  • @cotu42 because putting PC players with a controller on Xbox only servers is not a level playing field, buy an Xbox if you like playing with Xbox players so much.

  • Omg triggered at people saying to buy a 200-500$ console when these same people said they shouldn't have to buy a m&kb for maybe $50 to compete with pc back when that was the excuse actually dead right now

  • @cotu42 said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @inboundbomb said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @l4chsfps said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @cotu42 I think it's best to just ignore that fella, his only goal seems to be creating unrest through poor baiting attempts.

    I could say the same about the OP's post. Not hating on anyone but I'm tired of reading all of this.

    How am I baiting or trying to cause unrest?

    I laid out my concerns, in my opinion in a dignified manner regarding a concern, on how the PC version of the game is not being provided with the same gameplay impact choices as the xbox version of the game on the day the option became live.

    This was supposed to be a no compromise crossplay title and all pirates would be treated fairly and equally. Which clearly is no longer the case, why is it wrong to ask for clarity or to be treated equally to others and ask not to be defined by my machine.

    I've read your countless posts as well has others on your standing on how you should be treated. I understand what you are asking for.... have been this entire time. Yes, your concerns are in a dignified manner but so can those that have protested on their opt out and got backlashed just as you are by others. I'm just truly tired of read posts like these that are clogging up the forum ( all groups not singling you out) and I can click that icon all day long to ignore those posts but they keep coming back to the front of the line for me.
    Finally no one in the past 2 1/2 years have been treated equally on either platform reguardless on how people think. It wasn't equal at the start and will never be as long as the words console and PC exist. It's life and I've moved on to better things than the tired arguments that spawn hatred in others.

  • @tak225 @Phantaxus

    The PC comes with various inputs. In a game that advertised to treat preferences based on the premise of the option and not on the platform, how is it odd to request that they stick to their vision or explain why it changed?

    The answer is just buy a xbox if you want to play with the controller, why? The game supports, officially, controller input for my platform. How is a balance option being denied to be rolled out for a supported aspect or my game based on the machine?

    There are differences in the hardware scene, both in xbox and PC. Different types, versions of xbox with a brand new generation coming up, extensions of SSDs, elite controllers and such. If we hit the minimum requirement for the game, we should be granted the same options in regard to balance.

    If the performance of your setup is not cutting it for you, why should that imply a restriction to others? Spend money is your solution for the issue, than why does this not apply to you? If you want a performance that is better and you are bothered by it, why should you not spend the money and are you forcing it on me to invest? The minimum requirement for joining is less powerful than a xbox one. Not every PC player has a top end device. Your solution is spend money for PC players, so why don't you apply it to yourself?

    PC gets used for more than just gaming and entertainment, it might be that it is the only way to play for people and the just buy a xbox is not an option. Why should they not be given the same options to experience a balanced approach to combat based on input device? You both seem adamant that controller is a disadvantage to use after all?

  • @cotu42 Once the Series X comes out there will be another console more powerful than the previous consoles in the same pool of opt-out players so I'm not sure how "differing performances" is an excuse for not allowing pc players to opt-out with controllers, I don't even use controller on this game and say it should be an option.

  • @navillicious
    The opt out players want to grandstand with their "equal playing field," yet they ignore their own disparity within their own community. External SSD's, Xbox hardware versions (One, One X, and soon to be series X), and Elite controllers with additional buttons. So many times was I told that PC has advantages for the following, Additional buttons on Keyboard (Elite controller has more than standard, Loading times (Purchasable External SSD is faster than standard), better hardware (Xbox versions range in better hardware). This is a clear case of its only ok when we do it.

    This was never about an equal playing field, its to get rid of their big bad Boogie Man. Also to morally grandstand to make people not realize what they truly are, Giant Sore Losers.

  • OK, So skipping the garbage that usually seems to follow most of these types of posts I will go straight to my thoughts on the OP's question.

    @CotU42 I too am a long time, long in the tooth gamer.

    The days of cross play are here. The problems that either were ignored or not given the right amount of attention really became apparent when Rare wanted to release Arena. Rare thought Arena would be the answer to getting streamers to play the game again (having seen their share of streamers leave the game to move on to more exciting, battle royal type of games). But, when they did decide to start moving towards the Arena, the voices that were out there screaming about the disparages between Xbox and PC got even louder and spoke up much more about it than before. And when they got louder, others, more casual players started to chime in.

    Here is where things go really sideways. Rather than actually try to work on a true fix to the issue, something that would have been better for long term cross play, Rare's answer was to punt.

    During this time of upheaval over cross play, you also had DGE become a hot topic as well. A certain streamer was out there promoting its use and causing all sorts of turmoil. So, in another blunder, Rare decided to start "balancing" combat, ruining it completely.

    Now to your original question about Console vs PC on OPT Out. I do not pretend to know how the mechanics work. Is there a way for Rare to know if you are on PC that you are using the controller only? Is there a way for them to block you from switch between the two once a session starts? If so, then I believe you have a fair question. Yes, there are other advantages that PC has over Xbox. But as you pointed out, Adventure mode is not truly a competitive mode. Though, when you are trying to fend off would be thieves, it sure feels competitive, LOL.

    So I am not against the idea of the Opt Out being more input based than it is about platform, for Adventure mode only. And only with the caveat that there is a way to either block you from switching between input devices for game input. I would not be in favor of this in Arena though, because the other biggest advantage PC has over Xbox that is bigger than most PC players want to admit is FPS. Xbox is locked at a max FPS that is usually the lowest end FPS you will get on a very average or even below average PC. Why Rare does this is beyond me. I have an Xbox One X with external SSD. My load times are nearly as good as a PC. My biggest issue is the frame rate sucks. Xbox One X should do double the frames than what Rare has them locked at.

    I like cross play, and quite frankly, I wish Rare and Microsoft would have come up with a better solution to fix the disparage's between the two platforms. They could easily set max limitations that are the same across all platforms. There would still be some advantages that are harder to overcome such as accuracy on Mouse over Controller. But even that they could overcome by adding aim assist of some sort. They could have really knocked cross play out of the park, but instead punted.

    I remember cross play being a hot topic way back when I first joined the forums. Back then, after playing both platforms, and having many great conversations with people that wanted real solutions, not just slam their fist and say my way or no way, I became a big fan of fixing cross play through maximum set limitations. But, I got a lot of negative feedback from PC people that did not want to give up their FPS, even saying it was not that much of an advantage. I believe that Rare saw this feedback themselves and came to a conclusion to simply punt. Give opt out as an option. Why not, other games do it. I believe that they thought by doing an Opt Out it would quiet the xbox users complaining and while knowing they would upset PC players, I believe they thought that PC players would be less upset about this than any limitations set on them that would truly balance the game across the platforms. At least I believe that was their rationale.

  • @nofears-fun Just gonna chime in and say that MW has it so you can't change input once a match starts so it definitely is possible to lock your input

  • @phantaxus said in Controller Servers: Make it available to PC players. All pirates should be given the same options, we are all equals.:

    @cotu42 because putting PC players with a controller on Xbox only servers is not a level playing field, buy an Xbox if you like playing with Xbox players so much.

    The same thing could have been said to you prior to the opt-out - if you were so afraid of these perceived advantages that PC players had you could have bought a better hard drive or SSD and a keyboard and mouse (which you already own) - the only two things that actually make a difference in terms of playing with PC users. Yet people like you would throw a hissy fit complaining that you shouldn't have to buy extra equipment to play the game "fairly" - yet here you are saying he must buy an Xbox. Anyone else notice the hypocrisy?

    Full disclosure - I play exclusively on my Day One Xbox One console and do not own a Windows base PC so don't even try to call me a PC user. I also have not had one bit of issue with the crossplay servers since day 1.

  • Ahoy maties!

    Since crossplay is a very hot topic in the forum at the moment we have created a Megathread to discuss the recent changes and to gather your feedback.

    If you do have any feedback or would like to discuss the recent changes, please visit the thread below and get involved!

    https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/topic/106880/mega-thread-update-2-0-11-adventure-cross-play-opt-out-discussion-feedback

    For now, I am going to drop anchor here to keep the forum ship-shape and organised!

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