Now, that's enough!

@zeyrniyx

I just used a mugshot from someone to gain access. Not only that, but the new "improved" audio sounds to me like I have water trapped in my ears, it's too much...bass or something, it's hard to describe. I'd honestly love to know who campaigned for this to happen. I know Mike describes it like a shampoo commercial in the tropics under a waterfall, but I guess I was hoping he'd say something along the lines of, "Behold, I donned my headphones, closed my eyes, and I suddenly was taken aback as I heard the cries of our players frustrated with hit reg, food reg, cheaters, hourglass needing improvements, NPCs that still rob players, long blackscreens still happening, hourglass exploiters still able to park their ships to be unsinkable, a "Report a Player" feature that doesn't inform players they need video proof of their accusations (it's a pity the feature itself doesn't clip the last 5min of your gameplay so you submit that when you select the option), players wanting amazing cosmetics to earn in-game, Easy Anti-Cheat not up to the latest cheats, megs still flipping ships... . I removed the headphones and looked at the person who stared back at me with eager eyes, excited to implement this, thinking this is what our players have long been asking for... "improved audio" in-game, and I said no. We have too much on our table to focus on first. Our players have waited too long for bugs to be fixed in a game they love, and have passion for."

But forget all that, because in all seriousness, Mike thought the new improved audio was amazing and the 3rd party company probably can't wait for us to make accounts and take our money to enjoy a feature that's getting fine-tuned, in our game. I guess too many players complained about audio being subpar that they felt this was needed right away.

@europa4033 Couldn't have said it better myself. The audio is a mess and its a silly thing to do while the game is such a mess. I get that it's not necessarily the same people working on it all, but they might need to cut one team and expand another. The audio of this game is already very nice and the gameplay experience is degrading with each update. Hitreg is getting worse, foodreg is getting worse, server desync is getting worse. I would rather a season or two where they just try to tighten the game up rather than add literally anything new.

@potatosord

You know, you made a post here a short while ago, that I had to screenshot, because it was so perfectly worded, I wish they could pin this to the top of the forums:

I quote:
"When I walk up a flight of stairs and throw my bucket of water and it teleports me back to the bottom of the stairs and forces me to backsplash and I sink....
When I eat to try to survive a keg before the fire damage ends me and it decides I didn't actually eat...
When I hit a giga-keg, offer instantly, run to the ferry door instantly, run out the door instantly just to be forcibly black screened..
When I get hit by a continent-sized lava rock that instantly puts 3s all over my lower hull, offer instantly, leave the ferry instantly, and my boat still sinks because it spawned me on the helm...
This game, FULL TO THE GOD DAMNED BRIM with things like that...

These supposed "QoL improvements" not only won't help bring the game back, but will only help expedite its death. FIX WHAT MATTERS."

I wanted to stand up and clap reading your post. If they said tomorrow, "We've decided to hire a 3rd party to see about our hit reg/food reg/long black screens/hourglass exploits and improvements/bugs that have existed for years, I don't think players would be able to contain themselves. But no. Let's just ask our players to pay for better audio. You know, Blockbuster closed because they didn't listen to their customers' wants, or see any benefit to their competitor's model (some new company called Netflix). Since they didn't listen, and waited too late, their customers had no choice but to move on. I hope Rare does something soon, because your last statement in your post, has hit the nail on the head.

Will they listen?

@europa4033 I have had so many ideas about this, and really, I think they do need to hire a team of experienced game devs from other online experiences to help get these issues finally resolved. I do not care about some new audio. The new audio package, plus 110 FoV, plus faster weapon swap will not bring anywhere near as many players back as "We actually took the time to fix the fundamental issues that drive players away from this game."

I have a VERY VERY high tolerance for a game giving me BS, because one of my hobbies is glitch testing games, trying to break them as badly as possible. This game is as temperamental as some of the most precise glitches I've had to do, I'm sort of used to dragging my face against the broken glass of janky game design to get a result. I personally won't leave the game for a lot of these issues, but I have had times where I planned to play all day, but a series of issues that weren't my fault, that could not be in any way attributed to me or what I did, caused me to get too annoyed to want to continue playing.

This game has some of the best experiences I have ever had in a video game, and few games have ever compared to the true epicness of an adventure that doesn't necessarily go right, but you make it by the skin of your teeth at the end, the kind of thing you get all the time in SoT. It's just hard to want to come back sometimes when the game just keeps blocking every attempt you have to have fun in it. I have had days that were going well, then I had so many issues within the span of a single hourglass match (""""falling"""" off the boat, foodreg, fake cannon reload, fake bucket, invisible backsplash) that I just anchor, give them the win, and alt f4. I love this game, but the lack of audio features and quickswap isn't killing the game, lack of care for the basic gameplay features is. Until players stop teleporting off their boat, teleporting inside their boat, teleporting around their boat, fake eating, etc, this game is not going to keep a huge playerbase like they want. If Rare has ever said they want to listen to us, it's about damn time. I'm not saying I'm their corporate fricken messiah, but if they listened to even 1/10th of the things I personally have suggested the game would be massively improved, and I see good suggestions here every day

Paid feature that I choose. Not to purchase because. It silly to have.

What the problem?

Then don’t buy it and use Dolby Atmos which is already fully supported instead?…

It is incredibly naïve to get angry about a business monetising features to make the 7 year old game viable.

I saw similar toys thrown out of prams on the pirate profiles addition.

• There is no obligation to buy the new feature.

• It will not be that game changing that it provides any advantage. Some say it actively detracts from the audio experience.

@ghutar Pfft speak for yourself, pal.

I always thought, "I'd play this game more often if hit reg just sounded better."

Can we get a paid sound effects pack of tik tok meme noises when the game inevitably bugs out?

Purchase crates from the Merchant & they don't let you pick them up? Queue the price is right trombone🎵 bum-badum-bum... bwaaaahhh🎵

Folks are going to decide for themselves whether this is P2W. There is a free option but, as others have pointed out, that means going through a mandatory "trial" first. If that trial was optional, I don't think we'd be having this conversation and the general vibe would be more positive.

Personally, having tried it, I don't think it is P2W. I work in audio (20+ years full-time), and I have my own views on these features being mostly snake oil and a gimmick. It can sound good in some areas but mostly it's not doing a lot to acually improve the experience beyond the default. Really, this technology is better suited to static media like film and TV, where there is more control over the mix.

IMHO, the game as-is has an excellent audio balance with expert sound design and, with a decent pair of stereo headphones, you can already pin point where sound is coming from... just turn down the music to 20%, or less.

The game also already has surround sound options and this is just another version of that (albeit one that relies on pseudo surround sound effects that can cause phasing issues). It also simulates the pinna effect, which actually dulls sounds behind you like IRL, so in some PvP scenarios it could be a detriment. Imagine being on a cannon, and someone coming up behind you or climbing the ladder on the opposite side to where you're facing.

In the end, even if they sort out some issues, I don't see any real audiophiles actually using it due to the nature of these kinds of features and the negative impact they can have on audio quality. Some players may try it, thinking it will help with PvP, but will quickly realise that it's not all they hoped.

Just invest in a really good pair of stereo headphones and that will make much more of a positive impact.

And, I will be honest, if I do pay for this it will be for the headphones cosmetic only, because... audio guy. I have no plans to actually use this feature.

@ghutar said in Now, that's enough!:

@realstyli nice to have solid response from somebody that works in music!

I don't work in music. I have my own personal music projects, but my day job is in Post Production Sound (recording, mixing, sound design for broadcast).

Still having to pay or go trough free trial of third app to get maybe more immersive sound .. sounds like robbery.

It's a business tactic that's intended to get more folk to convert to paying for the feature. In this instance, I think it's ill-judged and is causing a negative sentiment that could have been entirely avoided.

Like seriously, "Little more immerisve sounds" DLC sounds (heh) offensive.

As I said, surround sound features already exist, so I don't view this as too different in that regard. The only real difference is the implementation of a mandatory trial and the fact they're making a big deal about it.

@worst-tdmer a dit dans Now, that's enough! :

@ghutar

Shoveling another paid feature is not fine when [insert litany of broken things] and we didint get bigger gold shop drop of cosmetic from pre-season times.

Any other time I would agree with this, but Rare has been very busy this year, and has been making really good, much needed improvements to the game. This might be the best year for SoT in a long time. They've completely changed the direction the game was moving in and have slowly been chipping away all year long at bugs/exploits that have been in the game for years.

And from what I've heard from people connected to devs, something massive is coming much later, that's gonna take a huge chunk of their manpower to pull off. If they have to do a low effort collab with an audio app to keep the suits happy until then, so be it.

So let me be clear. Because clearly, despite the number of messages I have posted on this forum since I saw the danger of paid features arriving, the question is not whether it is optional or not! And the majority of people who respond to me clearly do not understand this.
The real problem is that when a company introduces more and more paid features, in the end, yes, it will become Pay2win.
People tell me that I don't have to pay, which is true, but Pay2win doesn't force you to pay, it encourages you to.

Once again, I'll say it here: the only paid feature that is justified is custom servers. The rest is a NO!

And as many have said: Rare is rushing down the path of paid (optional) features, when the players' priority, the MAJOR demand from players, is for this game to be in good health!

Once again, I'll say it here: the only paid feature that is justified is custom servers; the rest is a NO!

And as many have said: Rare is rushing headlong down the path of paid (optional) features, when the players' priority, the players' MAJOR demand, is for this game to be in good health!

And as I said in another post, Rare is not being honest with us.

And finally, the more people say, ‘If you don't want this or that feature, you don't have to buy it,’ the more Rare will feel entitled to release other paid features, and yes, in the end, Sea of Thieves will become pure pay-to-win! And Sea of Thieves will no longer be Sea of Thieves!
The Steam figures, as I said, show that this is not the way to go! There have never been so few players, and that should give us pause for thought! Burying our heads in the sand and defending everything and anything is not going to help!

I would like to point out one thing, however:
Sea of Thieves is mainly played on consoles. To play on a console, you need:

• Either a monthly subscription

• Or to pay for the full game + a monthly subscription.

• If you want to change characters, you have to buy them.

• If you want to change the name of your ship, you have to buy it.

• If you want to change the name of your guild, you have to buy it.

• If you want a second pirate profile, you have to buy it.

• If you want to play multiplayer on console, you have to buy it.

• If you want better sound, you have to buy it.

How far will this go?

@worst-tdmer a dit dans Now, that's enough! :

@zeyrniyx

The Steam figures, as I said, show that this is not the way to go! There have never been so few players, and that should give us pause for thought!

This is a reason for why they should do this type of stuff.

Rare has been trying for the past 5 years to focus on attracting new players so they can keep selling emporium cosmetics. This has been disastrous for their player count.

Their core player base sees no value in emporium cosmetics and I imagine rarely buys stuff on there. This is disastrous for their finances.

So if focusing on new players kills the game, and focusing on old players kills their wallet, what can they do? It's pretty clear Rare has tried to be really generous with their microtransactions and what they add as paid content. All the paid content you listed is supplementary and can even be bought with coins gathered from ancient skellies/free coins on the battle pass.

At the end of the day they have to keep the lights on somehow, and this is a relatively painless way to do that. There isn't an advantage to the audio, there are free alternatives if you want better audio, and it's a quick check for Rare for advertising an app/a way to please the Microsoft overlords.

It's a live service game that has released constant free content updates for 7 years now with the only microtransactions being for unnecessary add ons that can also be bought with free ancient coins. I like the pirate game and would rather them do this than let the game die a slow death or completely sell out and start charging for normal in game content.

You see, the problem is that instead of attracting new players, they should first focus on keeping the ones they already have.
There's a good reason why player retention is important, and that's the goal of the new season system.

And once again, if you think new players will be attracted by paid features, yes, maybe at first, but it won't last!

You tell me that this is the solution, but I'm sorry: Sea of Thieves has survived for seven years with just cosmetics, and it can continue to do so for a long time to come!
And the problem, as I've ‘also’ said, is that Rare isn't being honest with us!
If Rare's management would explain the REAL reason for these paid additions, then maybe we could be more understanding towards them, but no, they're not saying anything!

So keep thinking that releasing paid features is the right solution, and you'll see that Sea of Thieves won't survive another five years!

Other games have tried it, and they've failed miserably!

You can't attract players or keep them unless you make sure the game is in good shape! And as we've seen, that's not easy: developers prefer to give in on FOV and now weapon changes because they're unable to fix the problems!

Just gonna say. Grown adults know when to not spend money on video games. Kids? Better hope parents don’t find out you wasted money on “pay2win” as claimed content for a 7+ year old game. That has been said….is dying XD

@zeyrniyx said in Now, that's enough!:

What's more, I consider the addition of the immersive sound feature to be pay-to-win (and there we are: we've finally arrived!).

It would be pay-to-win, if and only if it allows you to better pinpoint the location of an opponent or a shot from out of your FoV coming into your direction, wouldn't it ?
And then only if the paid personal set-up does it better than the non-paid option.

So far, I've not seen any feedback on Insiders that would confirm this.

You tell me that this is the solution, but I'm sorry: Sea of Thieves has survived for seven years with just cosmetics, and it can continue to do so for a long time to come!

How would you (or we) know that it does, we don't have any insight in the money the emporium generates, it may be declining.
How many costumes or ship shets will people buy if they already have several ?
How many new emotes will people buy while there is room for 80 that are a pain to select to actually use them ?

I'm seeing 2 main takes in this thread and I don't disagree with either of them.

Yes, Rare has to keep the lights on (revenue arguments).

Yes, this particular feature seems weird to prioritize as high as they did, when the game is as broken as it is (player retention arguments).

Revenue is important. Diversifying revenue streams can also be helpful. But if there are no customers to buy the products/services, it doesn't matter how many products/services the company offers.

If emporium sales are low, why are they low? Either the dumpy Fortnight skins aren't worth buying, or there aren't enough people left to buy them, or both.

Even with this paid audio feature, how many players are they expecting to invest in this? Especially if the audio quality isn't that great (based on insider feedback, seems to be the case). Would it have been a waste of their dev time to make one more thing, that almost no one in their dwindling playerbase wants to buy?

Had they focused on custom servers years ago (when the game was more relevant) and sold them (with option to spin up Arena & other fun features), maybe they would've been able to retain more players and stay afloat.

But oh well. Here we are. Pay-to-lose audio.