Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?

@madfrito99 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

@nex-stargaze there was nothing to win lol yay u sunk a boat that had nothing…i mean really? toxic pure and simple

Still not toxic. You can literally pvp for the sake of pvp. You can sink boats for no reason other than that you wanted to. I can tuck, banana bomb, keg, etc just for fun and its still not toxic.. You are very clearly lacking an understanding on how pvpve sandbox games work.

The only truely toxic thing in Sea of Thieves is comms. Either in game voice/text or messages after. Nothing else is toxic.

@madfrito99 You are very clearly playing the wrong game if thats what you believe. I would love to see the list of actions you percieve to be toxic It sounds like you are forgetting about the fact that its a sandbox game, that there are tools not rules, and that you do not get to control how the other pirates play.

@madfrito99 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

@captain-coel easy….following a ship for hrs, tucking on a ship with keg with no intention to get loot. harassing people on mic. attacking fresh spawns. attacking people doing tall tales. attacking ships that have not loot, flags, etc sending harassing messages. again when you do something to another pirate where u gain absolutely nothing is pure toxicity…if your going for loot, flag, payback your fine…but there is no reason to sink another ship when thry have nothing…at that point you are harassing players and harassing csn be reported. spawn camping is also toxic especially if your doing it while keeping their boat afloat just to torture them…u should not be forced to scuttle or change servers due to someone being to toxic…doing that just gives them more ammo to be more toxic without addressing the issue

Of all of that, the only toxic behavior is communication.

Following a ship is Not toxic, Just as running is Not toxic.

Tucking on a boat with or with out a keg is Not toxic, sometimes you just wanna blow people up.

Harassing people over a mic is Toxic.

Attacking a freah spawn is Not toxic.
If a boat is in your way, the easiest way to make it not in your way is to sink it. Fresh spawns are not exempt from that.

Attacking tall talers is Not toxic, this is a pvpve game and we can attack who we want.

Attacking a boat without loot is Not toxic, yhis is a pvpve game and we can attach who we want. This is not harrasment this is part of the designed gameplay loop.

Spawn camping is Not toxic, there is a reason the scuttle option exists. There is a reason there is a note next to the door on the ferry.

Hope I cleared some of that up for you.

Pvpve sandbox games do not have the same rules for toxicity other games do.

As a reminder, some players are pirates, some players are content.

@madfrito99 My opinion and yours do not matter here, the devs designed all of that as part of the game.

We do not have to play for loot or commendations. We can play to simply sink pirates. We can play to just take screenshots. We can play just sail around.

After all a wise and old pirate once said "It's not about the gold, it's about the glory."

@madfrito99 most would probably agree with @captain-coel. Toxic behaviours only include usage of racist or hatespeech and spawn camping for excessive periods with no intent to sink. Spawn camping to loot the ship of resources is not toxic.

Now there are some gentleman agreements "some" follow with regards to leaving tall talers, new ships etc but these are not official rules.

@hotklou9848 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

If you camp a zone where another player wants to do their quest and keep killing them as they respawn on a barebones ship and keep trying just to complete a simple quest... is that PvPvE?

If I know there is a crew there that is my better and / or do not want to fight with them, I'd be stupid to go back to that area and do my voyage. I just do something else for half an hour and then check again. I doubt a PvP determined crew would still be there.

The PvPers don't have anything to gain, as the guys who keep respawning have no loot and no chance to win, so there isn't any benefit or challenge for the aggressors. And if they decide to give up that quest and go somewhere else, then the same thing happens over there. […]

Since when are the servers regularly filled with PvP centered crews that end up in the same places a PvE players wants to be ? Unless it's a world event, I doubt this scenario happens often.

But as of late most players that attack me do so when I am clearly in no position to fight back and aren't even interested in my loot.

As of late? It been a thing since day 5. So it isnt anything new.
You are always in position to fight, I do not know what you have or dont have and last I checked, you do have access to a gun/sword. So you can still put up a fight, still my resources to restock your own or steal my ship and spawn trap me while you sink my ship.
Another thing about loot. Maybe...just maybe...we have commendations to do and they involve sinking player ships? Idk i cant recall them all.

@MadFrito99

I do not like your definition of toxic. It's way too soft.

EVERYONE WHO SIDE EYE'S YOU IS TOXIC.

in your definition I have VERY toxic traits.

I just needed to get that out there.

There can be toxic people in the game. There can be non toxic people who want to do bad things.

There are very much people who want to do toxic things for toxic reasons that may not fit someone else's definition of toxic.

I'm ALSO calling myself out for shooting down tools that would compromise my rules.

We need to get to a point of tools not rules that lets everyone be the legend they want to be. It might not be YOUR definition. But it is Legend...

Wait for it...

Ary...

@madfrito99 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

@pithyrumble ...maybe because the toxic types are leaving finally?

PvP'ers are here to stay. During the beginning of updates, double gold, and the beginning of events you will see seasoned players flood the game. Enjoy the PvP doldrums while they last.

@madfrito99 for me personally, I tend not to sink people who have nothing. I probably only sink people who emissary flags but that's becoming few and far between these days. PvP is an enjoyable part of the game and those who only want to do that will and that is not toxic. Also other players don't know if a ship has loot.

I do think sinking every ship on sight has been overall detrimental to the PvP experience recently, confirmed by the lack of emissaries but it certainly isn't toxic to sink a freshly spawned ship. If a ship keeps attacking you constantly and you sink, move server. You'll get a fresh ship just the same as if you were sunk.

@madfrito99 Sinking ships isn't "toxic"... Toxicity implies that it is not an intended part of the game.

The only means by which PvP is "toxic" is if they are being verbally abusive or if you are being spawn camped with no intent to sink. Both of those are reportable offenses if you can gather evidence. Unfortunately, I believe far too few people go through the effort of gathering evidence and reporting things that are actually toxic.

@madfrito99 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

sinking in itself is not toxic…sinking for no reason is toxic

But there's always a reason, and the crew being sunk doesn't get to decide what that reason is. It could be something as simple as "it's fun"...but that doesn't make it "toxic"

That's not my style, but that certainly is a style in which people can, and do, play this game. On top of that, it's a style that Rare has only further enabled with buyable supplies and chainshot RNG similar to that of coconuts.

@madfrito99 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

@a10dr750 this is your opinion. most would say that someone that does something for no reason but to harass someone is toxic no? same implies here…unless your doing something to gain something what your doing is toxic period

You do not have to know or like the reasons for being attacked for it to be okay. You already consented to being attacked. Attacking for no reason other than I can is acceptable and not toxic.

This has been an ongoing problem for a while now and the answer is simple: give better incentives to PVE!

My friends and I personally have nearly stopped to PVE entirely since there is nothing of merit to get from it. I have been posting for a long time now that old time-limited cosmetics are so much better than anything they have released in the game for the past year that quite literally we no longer feel it worth to PVE. The new events don't give rewards we ever feel worth getting, and knowing they will come back now we know that even if we change our minds we can get them later.

We are all wearing what we believe to be the best cosmetics without any new cosmetics having been added to the game that we find worth getting. Most of us prefer more simple-looking cosmetics with more sleek designs over what Rare has been releasing lately especially for the ship.

Overall this game lacks any incentive for us to PVE with lackluster rewards that we have never found to be worth. So the fix is easy: 1. Add better cosmetic rewards for doing PVE 2. Make better time-limited PVE rewards so that we feel compelled to do them! We want new awesome cosmetics but most of the new ones we felt did not hit the mark quite simply.

To give an example the last cosmetic I changed personally was the dawn hunter shirt my go-to cosmetics are as follows:

Character: BlackDog Hat, Dawn Hunter Shirt, Jacket of the Dammed, Ferry Man Gloves, Black dog pants, Black dog boots, Athena eye patch, PL curse, Ferry Man Blunderbuss, Obsidian Sniper, Glitterbeard.

Ship: Insider Hull, Insider Figurehead, DA sails, magpie cannons, obsidian wheel, admiral capstan (would switch to obsidian but don't have)

Most of the cosmetics are simple and sleek to really let the other ones stand out.

I always thought that this game is a giant social experiment. You see different situations and different kind of behaviours when player interact each other. But I too have to acknoledge that some people are just bullies who want to fell superior to others because they are nothing / they have nothing irl. Yesterday for example i was browsing on youtube and I saw a video of a streamer who tried to tuck on a docked athena sloop. After some minutes of nothing happening, he went in the tavern an saw a girl. She asked her what she was doing. The girl was crearly embarassed and shy, and she told him that he was waiting for her boyfriend to join. In the exact moment she mentioned she had a boyfriend, the guy just went to the armoury, grab a blunder, shot her for absolutely no reason while laughing. The girl was not angry, just shocked. And I was shocked too. What was the point of that? He didn't even sunk the boat to take the flag or the supplies. He was just rude, and a streamer with lots of people encouraging that behaviour.
Other times you meeting nice people who want to cooperate or just fight you without slurs and respecting you with a GG at the end of the fight.

@ghostfire1981 you forgot if they have materials we want on your list ;)

@silentkiller646 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

@madfrito99 The game feels like it's "shifting to a PVE focus" because new players come in and the learning curve for naval and PVP is not instantaneous....

Maybe it's just me, but I personally do not see many actual naval battles anymore.

The closest I see is a player from another ship shooting themselves over to anchor and spawn-camp you until their ship can come in for the easiest of shots.

As someone who still appreciates the game's ability for brilliant (i.e. strategic) naval battles, it's sad you can only get this experience consistently from the game's NPCs (i.e. skelly and ghost ships).

@hotklou9848 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

Player spawns, starts setting up their cosmetics and loading the ship in preparations for going on an adventure/hunt. Another random player comes along and sinks them. How is the player who just spawned supposed to get ready for doing PvE (by loading supplies and getting quests and maps) or PvP (loading supplies)? How are they supposed to retaliate or escape? How are they supposed to have fun? How can this not be classified as PvP? This is griefing, this is "Player versus Object", this is not PvP.

In all the time I've been playing this (spawning on an outpost with another ship close) happened to me three or four times. So about once a year.
You're on a server with several other crews that need to go to outposts as well. Don't linger there too long !!
BTW, how are other ships to know that you're a fresh spawn - I've met (and fought) other ships at outposts that turned out to be likely fresh spawns, but considering the time they spent there on the dock they either had a lot to turn in or had gone emptied the island two times over. If the former, there still might be more to steal, the latter - great: their ship is full of supplies.

Let's go again. Player goes to Hunter's Call seapost and starts fishing. Player sees another ship on the horizon and scuttles their ship (they used it to cook food and it was otherwise empty of any loot). New arrival pulls up and docks. Player says hello and continues fishing. New arrivals, sour about not being able to shoot an unmanned ship, kills the defenseless, peaceful player. Again, how is this PvP? The player put up no fight and had no loot to give.

How where they to know ?
Tip: if you want to fish undisturbed on a Sea post: use a row boat or scuttle your vessel before someone spots you.

How are yo defenseless ? The fisherman may be great at disabling a crew by him- or herself, have a keg hidden, put your ship on fire or have it collide with the sea post. You had a ship juts 5 minutes before. May have had loot on it, may have some good fish around hidden by you to cook later.
No ship doesn't mean - "I won't fight", too many tuck plays on forts for that excuse.

PvP implies two players fighting against each other - it takes two to tango. A bully who shoots up another player who is defenseless and worthless is not engaging in PvP, as it is a one-sided engagement that offers absolutely zero challenge or reward.

I wouldn't call a person who only likes to PvE worthless.

It's a PvPvE game - during your PvE adventures you might get in a fight, during fights there might be PvE to deal with. Don't like it ? Have fun playing a PvE or PvP game. In a shared world PvPvE game you don't get to decide what the other players do by deciding on some arbitrary rules of being defenseless &c.

You joined the server - you better be prepared to fight other crews or be hassled by Meg or Kraken just as you're about to sink a galleon on a sloop.

@hotklou9848 said in Sea of Thieves or Sea of Bloodshed?:

PvE players are regularly forced to come into contact with the PvP part of the game. PvP players are not forced to come into contact with any challenging PvE content. I have a problem with that. Perhaps if there were things a PvP player could gather in PvE which they could then use to aid them in PvP? Things that require they do the challenging bits of PvE to empower themselves?

It's a PvPvE game - stop looking at every player to be either PvP or PvE. Most people are in between. People at either extreme side of this spectrum get disappointed.