Winner's Guilt

  • TossedTides
    Marauder
    Insider

    Dunno if this is the right place ot post this, but I've wanted to post this for some time now and see if I could come across any advice.

    When I first started the game, I was one of those types that wanted to focus on only PVE and got upset at being sunk over and over. I didn't give up and got better, but now I have the problem of feeling extremely guilty when I come across players who were not interested in PVP and "ruining" their session. I remember how it felt to be in their shoes, and I don't want to be someone who discourages people from this amazing game.

    Is there any advice anyone has on handling a one sided win, or just re-contextualizing the event into a positive?

    I try to keep in mind that the game is what it is and it isn't for everybody, but it still feels bad sometimes.

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  • Ghostfire1981
    Vanguard
    Insider

    Role play! Just speak like a pirate, and generally play the jolly pirate role. Also if you see they are doing a Tall Tale, disengage the fight and help repair the ship if needed. (If no one is around a ship and there is a Tall Tale on the table... we usually fix up the ship, take some supplies and leave it alone.)

    Also of we win and fought a really nice crew (meaning no cursing and similar), we have sometimes told them to come back and get some loot back at some nearby island (we only take what we need nowadays.)

    However if we are playing reapers, we usually role play that faction as well and steal everything... just because its the role we play. (We are level 75 so we dont really need the gold, but flags are always nice to collect.) Also if we are just collecting flags, we usually say to the crew that is sinking... something like "Sorry, but we really needed your flag... GG by the way.)

    So saying nice things, and/or play a funny role helps a lot.

  • TossedTides
    Marauder
    Insider

    @ghostfire1981 I think that will help a lot, and sounds very fun to try out. Thank you much!

  • Oathpower
    Marauder

    Me and my crew have sort of a codex when it comes to engaging in PvP combat.

    If another ship appears to have a newbie-crew or is on a tall tale, we leave it alone or shoot someone over to poke around before we initiate any attacks (or repair them if we were a bit trigger-happy ;))

    Anyone flying an emissary, carrying loot (and I don't count a foul bounty skull and a castaway chest as loot ;)) is fair game.

    This works great for us, we get to be blood-thirsty pirates and we avoid ruining the experience for the newest players!

  • Ghostfire1981
    Vanguard
    Insider

    ... and anyone carrying any form of emissary flag is naturally free to kill on sight... as the emissary flags are PvP beacons.

  • WolfManbush
    Champion

    There is enough variety on the seas to be able to pillage while keeping your conscience clean

    Is a gem and a skull and an easy victory worth the bloodshed? not to me. Let them live another day.
    The way isn't to justify doing something that makes you feel gross it's to not do it and focus on the battles that bring competition and glory

    In this game it's alright to do whatever pirates want but that doesn't mean it's right for you. Follow your own moral compass and be willing to correct when you're not going where you want to go.

    alt text

    Mercy is for the weak
    but you're not weak for showing mercy

  • TossedTides
    Marauder
    Insider

    @wolfmanbush Thank you. I hadn't realized I was approaching this from a flawed perspective. Instead of wondering how to become desensitized to what goes against my morals, find a solution that lets me pillage against people who can handle themselves. This and the tips on gauging others before shooting has been extremely helpful. Thank you everyone.

  • Gundy the Shark
    Vanguard
    Insider
    Founder

    Personally I fee as though this guilt is good. It means you have a conscience (which I can’t say for everyone who plays this game).

    @WolfManbush is right though. Play fairly, show mercy when it’s called for and most people won’t have a problem with that. The key is honour.

  • Scorp2821
    Marauder
    Insider

    This is just something me and my crew do but i like it. If we find we easily sink a crew and they don't have a chance, we send them a message asking for a rematch and if they win they get their loot back, sure if they do a lot of pve it we might have the advantage but at least they cant say we didn't give them a chance.

  • Mrat13
    Marauder
    Insider

    I do my PvP in Arena. That way it's a fair fight.

  • CotU42
    Lord
    Insider

    @tossedtides

    The seas are a mysterious place, where those that thread the seas know that they are willing participants of engagement, whether or not they understand what that means.

    Be a good sport. Sea of Thieves is a pirate game, and stealth, stealing and battles are all part of the fun. All pirates on the seas accept that, but be a good sportsman in both victory and loss.

    Be courteous. Don’t insult players you don’t know. If humour is the intent, remember that this can be lost or misinterpreted online, and words can very easily offend. Be mindful of what you’re saying and if someone asks a question, see if you can help them out as you’d appreciate being helped out yourself if the roles were reversed.

    In cases of pure domination, if you have the time have a glance on their voyage table to get a feeling for their experience upon the waves. Yet unless their entire crew is truly brand new, for me the rule of thumb is pretty simple, if someone wants to plead out a parley or a deal... I am always open for negotiations if the stack of gold isn't to high. There is no malicious intent in my actions and if they see it as me ruining their day, then that means they took risks that they shouldn't have. If people play a game and expect never to lose, then they aren't really playing a game.

    Just handling everyone you catch out in surprise or out play with kid gloves is not necessarily doing them any favors either. Once they reach a certain level they need to learn to defend themselves, else it will just inflate peoples egos and sense of entitlement. I have met enough of the 'legendary' PvE crews that believe that a solo sloop should cower in fear of their almighty galleon ships and what not. Those that believe they can pile hours of treasure and be left alone, because that is what they learned. To then come to the forums and complain how X amount of hours of uninterrupted play was 'ruined' by some pvp crew. They don't need to sell or watch the horizon, their 'plan' is sacred and should be respected. Like people with a pile of treasure literally asking: Why are you attacking us? Euhm... you have treasure!

    On the other hand I have met solo sloopers that just ask me kindly after the battle or even by just being prepared for it which get to go along their merry way with their things and after a defeat with some tips on what they can improve. They learned that with negotiations, playing smart and being prepared they are better at putting up a fight and able to avoid a total loss or even avoid it all together.

    People that like the game and are willing to learn the game will stick with the game. Stealing, killing, sinking, betraying are all parts of being a pirate. Just don't be rude... and there isn't anything wrong with it. I have been back stabbed at times when entering a truce. Yet for me being the 'bad guy' is not that big of a deal. Sore losers are just that...

  • Psyche Titan
    Seafarer
    Insider

    Me and the friend I play with have a rule to check their ship before a fight to see if its worth it. If it isn't we leave 'em be, unless they fire the first shot. If they are willing to surrender or want to negotiate terms with us, we are always open to strike a deal. If they are merchants though we typically just leave them without having to scout. And we are always willing to offer help if a crew needs it.

  • Psyche Titan
    Seafarer
    Insider

    @cotu42 Same. If someone doesn't wish to fight or tries to run, I usually leave them be. Depending on the loot they have. No one on the seas is entitled to the loot they found. They found it and it is their responsibly to keep it safe aboard. Its also good to remember that you started at the bottom too and to be open minded if some crew asks for help.

  • Xultanis Dragon
    Sailor

    @tossedtides said in Winner's Guilt:

    Dunno if this is the right place ot post this, but I've wanted to post this for some time now and see if I could come across any advice.

    When I first started the game, I was one of those types that wanted to focus on only PVE and got upset at being sunk over and over. I didn't give up and got better, but now I have the problem of feeling extremely guilty when I come across players who were not interested in PVP and "ruining" their session. I remember how it felt to be in their shoes, and I don't want to be someone who discourages people from this amazing game.

    Is there any advice anyone has on handling a one sided win, or just re-contextualizing the event into a positive?

    I try to keep in mind that the game is what it is and it isn't for everybody, but it still feels bad sometimes.

    Here is the problem we face a lot with this game. Players refuse to learn to PvP. You were one of the ones who got tired of being sunk and worked towards getting better because it was literally beat into you to get better.

    Would you have actually wanted to get better if no one forced you too?? Chances were likely no. I know this because I've experienced it with rando crews.

    Its a double edged sword really. If we coddle them, then they will never bother learning and will just cry more about how unfair everything is. If we just attack them and say "pirate game" some might leave, others like you will stay and get better.

    So here is the deal you might want to ask yourself. Is the game more fun for you after you learned how to PvP?? Are you enjoying the rush of PvP sometimes when something is on the line and you pull out a win?? Congrats welcome to the game.

    Do you think the game is better off with players who refuse to learn PvP and who repeatedly call it greifing??

    The last part is this, what rules do you set for yourself because now that you are strong enough to be a predator and not the prey you get to set the rules.

    I spawn camp and trash talk any player that is a salty and sore loser. I don't care how new they are. I will punish the hell out of them and laugh at them while they get even more mad. If you are a sore loser and just start yelling profanities right off the bat for being attacked, I'm going to rekt your day. Sad thing is I hear the hate from PvE'ers almost exclusively.

    I will be cordial with anyone who gives a GG or good fight at the end of a battle or even just "hey I'm coming back for you!!". There was one time I ran into a father and kid playing the game. I sunk them and the dad said "hey guys, good going. It was our fault for not keeping and eye out. GG guys." - Its rare to have a parent like that be cordial after sinking them with their kid playing, so I ran protection for them the rest of their session. I sunk every and any ship that tried to get near them. The kid had a blast and the dad was cool about it. Sometimes I'll even give the person back their loot and some supplies then leave the server.

    I got to make those decisions because I was at the top of the food chain.

    The predator gets to make all the decisions, the prey is basically at our mercy.

    So whatever you do, decide how you want to play. You want to be bloodthirsty then so be it. You want to show mercy, then show be it.

    Lay out some ground rules for yourself and play like a Pirate. Pirates lived by their own code of conduct while others just lived at the whim of how they were feeling.

  • Shadow20642
    Marauder
    Insider

    You shouldn't feel guilty.
    You are a pirate.

    It's like being guilty for raiding in rust.

    Everybody has the tools to avoid and escape each other. Their loss proves a valuable lesson that ultimately makes them better.... Unless they are immature.

  • ClownPoison
    Marauder

    @tossedtides It still feels bad for me sometimes, I have called off attacks when I noticed that the players were total newbies ( but I have also be mugged by newbies many times when soloing and parked) , but dont stress about it its what makes you you..human nature. Remember it is only a game, everyone sunk will rage abit , or be disappointed and then get over it.. Im more concerned about driving folks away from the game and that is about how you communicate and make judgements as mentioned in the other posts. There are some absolute nasty (not toxic because they think that name is a badge ) people online generally and in the game. I was called a MxxxFxxx by some sweaty kid in my first week and I considered playing something else. These people are the problem not the likes of you.

  • Grog Minto
    Master
    Insider

    This game lets you play however you want to play it. Simply do it in a way that you feel comfortable with.

    I don't engage in fight, I only fight back since I personally don't feel comfortable forcing players to fight if they didn't want to. But that's just me and everyone is entitle to their playstyle. Just find yours and stick to it. ;)

  • RevRanDoM
    Marauder
    Insider

    I was playing solo last night and got jumped by 2 or 3 guys (1 guy killed me like 3 times, so maybe I just got jumped by 1 guy, lol).

    Anyway, sure they attacked first, killed me, and stole my stuff, but they also were cool, too. They tried to communicate with me by voice and text (and I couldn't figure out how to reply in time because I don't use the game's comms features). And at the end of it, they all said "gg", so for me, getting killed and robbed wasn't a bad experience.

    So I think as long as you're a good sport about ganking someone, it'll all be good.

  • Aliquem
    Ship Mate
    Insider
    Founder

    At least you have a conscience I'm more or less the same way.
    If I end up sinking someone new, I at least offer to help them in some way teach them some stuff and give them tips instead of just provoking them like a child regardless of their attitude. Thats how I functioned in Dark Souls invasions, if I invade someone a second time I'll give them some tips and drop a useful item. That's just the kind of person I am, sure in Sea of Thieves being a nice person to people often does get you killed because "Pirate Game".
    I think the folks that are going the extra mile to dig salt into peoples wounds are a bit excessive, nothing fun about stalking a crew for hours yelling gamer words like 5 year old child on Modern Warfare 2 on Xbox 360. But the game allows it, Pirates are unpredictable and live their own lives behaving the way they do, it makes the game interesting despite how negative it looks on them.
    The game needs the balance of all types of players to make every adventure worth your while whether you make it out with your treasure or send folks to Davy Jones.
    I think what ultimately matters is being a good sport like Rev said, I've come across too many people who literally have cried on open mics out of frustration, I want people to keep coming back not to give up or get so frustrated they'd just end up refunding or uninstalling the game.

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