Sword Nerf Proposal

@sot-player30 I too use double guns at times, and when killing a sword user, (if a good shot) they shoot me with their gun, then I quickly shoot them with both my guns as they reload. I guess a "counter" could just be some sort of way to avoid that second shot with your sword, either that be something like the sword deflects the bullet, or a simpler solution which could be a speed boost of some sort, in order to avoid getting hit.

I think that the Devs tried to make the sword a more popular weapon to use by buffing it, and not have pirates going around "360 MLG QUICKSCOPING" others in a "pirate game" (although some of the shots you can hit are quite cool). They just tried to bring back the combat to what it was at launch, with most players using the sword, but all they did was make the sword a no skill, no fun, spam weapon.

@sot-player30 Exactly, hopefully they add a little boost of some sort to the sword-block-jump.

Haha, not a tuck outfit actually, sure does look like one though!

See you on the seas mate!

@graphical24 said in Sword Nerf Proposal:

Dear Rare,

I am a huge fan of your game and have played it ever since launch, and have watched it grow into the (almost) great game that it is today.

Your profile says that you joined about a year ago. :D

There wasn't any sword complaints cos every doublegunner has easy mode vs sword users. Now when they need to pracitce their movement to prevent Sword wielders to reach them they're complaining cos they're used to stand still and shot you to death before you could actually do these 5-6 swings.

@avecrux I am not a double gunner. I use it on rare, rare occasions. I use the sword all the time, and with the buff, it requires no skill at all, like I said, its a "gamble". Remember, this is coming from a sword user, not a double gunner.

And I've been playing since launch but never logged into the SoT website with a profile until a year ago. Not really sure how it works, but at least I can get my opinion out to the community.

Edit: I do also think that when/if they nerf the sword they can add a certain counter to double gunning like I said before.

@graphical24 "no skill" argument isn't an argument. I don't need any skill in PvP to use any of these weapons. Explain what "no skill" means cos it's overused maxim.

I am using every weapon in game and have 0 problems in changing them to adapt to the situation.

@avecrux By no skill I mean no "dynamics", and no thought process.

Dynamics meaning the use of different strategies, such as sword lunge and sword-block-jump.

With the update, it seems that most players (that I have encountered) only run at you and swing their sword. I never get that sweet sword duel on the deck of a ship anymore. It's all in who can get their three hits in first (75% damage).

They just need to either nerf it back to what it was at launch, or add new, dynamic ways to counter/fight with the sword.

Also, good for you if you have mastered every weapon, I have too, just that a majority has not.

@graphical24 i had that duel 2 days ago. we were fighting for straight 2 minutes just using swords. It was fun and everything was ok. we had the same chances. We used a lunge, block. everything that could make one of us a winner.

How it would change with nerf to these fights sword vs sword if it still be 3 hits to do 60% of damage?

Only thing that would change is that the DG would be able to reload his missed shot and kill you before you do the swing.

@avecrux Before the buff, I got those battles daily, which was great. And I got even MORE back in the days of Shrouded Spoils. So if they nerfed it, we would see way more intense, and entertaining sword duels.

And I agree, if they nerfed it back to launch then double gun players would have a big advantage, but if you scroll up to my previous conversation with the other pirate, you would see that we propose a counter to double gun for sword players. Therefor balancing the weapon loadouts.

@graphical24 this isn't any solution to the problem cos you can do it all time. I am using it very rarely. It won't work at lower decks where most of combat have place cos any decent player would drop the anchor and wait on lower deck with aim on the stairs. Real solution with sword nerf would be that you can't reload while jumping but atm i don't see that we need any necessary changes.

@avecrux I mentioned that they should buff the "Jump Distance" for using the sword-block-jump. Giving sword users a GREAT counter to double gunning above deck and on islands. But for below deck encounters, they could buff the sword lunge, making the cooldown shorter. This would allow sword users to swiftly shoot their opponent, then sword lunge for the kill. This would be a balanced feature, as both sides have their fair share of advantages and disadvantages.

Another thing to mention is that each loadout (double-gun and sword-gun) will have their "strong-suits" and weaknesses. For example, in a long range water fight, a sniper-pistol player vs a sword-blunder player, the sniper-pistol player will have a SIGNIFICANT advantage, but in close quarters combat, the sword-blunder player will have a GREAT advantage.

@graphical24 I guess a "counter" could just be some sort of way to avoid that second shot with your sword, either that be something like the sword deflects the bullet, or a simpler solution which could be a speed boost of some sort, in order to avoid getting hit. i read that and thought you are talking about RMB+Spacebar+direction dodge.

sword lunge is easy to avoid. You can't turn your character more than for 10-15% while doing that. Enemy just need to run few meters away and after easily shot you cos you are stunned for a while.

@avecrux They could always buff the "turn radius" of the sword lunge. As well as the range.

They can do pretty much anything, there are hundreds of ideas out there waiting to be said.

@octopus-lime Agreed.

double gunning should be punished by sword users

naturally as you have no way to block the incoming slashes

ever heard of the term "glass cannon" this term is used for being able to dish out alot of damage fast but die quite easily i don't think you should be able to dish out alot of damage but still have a great chance of living as 2 shots is all you need to kill someone

when a sword needs 4 hits

what sea of thieves needs isn't a pvp change it needs hitreg fixing and i hope thats what rare decides to focus on next and not continue to flop around with pvp balancing that is really not needed anymore

i think of sea of thieves pvp as rock paper scissors you opted for paper twice and while the competitor uses scissors the sword is finally as it should be and does not need anymore changes to reward double gunners its a horrible meta

and all these "please nerf sword" posts just proves how many need to rely on double gunning and think it requires "skill" to use either that or they used double gunning for so long they have forgotten how to counter sword users

shooting someone whos literally inches away from you really isn't a challenge its easy

a sword buff has been what this game needed ever since the meta became popular can't remember how long but i know its been well over a year since that horrible meta became a thing it put the sword to shame and in the shadows

the sword is now a viable weapon just deal with it

blunder is your best friend against sword users if you still decide to stick with double gunning that knockback can save your life with the added bonus of being able to one shot a sword user as he is at great risk becuase he has to get close

@jollyolsteamed Here's the thing.

The sword does in fact need 4 hits to kill someone, as the guns need 2. But when using sword, your right on your target, but with guns, your usually at range, and have to ADS. Not to mention the rapid swing rate compared to a slow gun swap.

I think that most could agree its easier to get a hit up close with a sword than it is long range with a gun.

If you would take the time to read my previous conversations, I propose a counter to double gunning with swords.

And I am no double gunner, I am simply a swordsman, and I still believe that the sword needs to change, as sword fights are not enjoyable anymore.

And the Blunderbuss does barley anything to a sword, as I find it easy to just jump over their heads with the sword to kill them.

@graphical24 said in Sword Nerf Proposal:

@jollyolsteamed Here's the thing.

The sword does in fact need 4 hits to kill someone, as the guns need 2. But when using sword, your right on your target, but with guns, your usually at range, and have to ADS. Not to mention the rapid swing rate compared to a slow gun swap.

I think that most could agree its easier to get a hit up close with a sword than it is long range with a gun.

If you would take the time to read my previous conversations, I propose a counter to double gunning with swords.

And I am no double gunner, I am simply a swordsman, and I still believe that the sword needs to change, as sword fights are not enjoyable anymore.

And the Blunderbuss does barley anything to a sword, as I find it easy to just jump over their heads with the sword to kill them.

the blunder does wonders i've been running sword and blunder since dawn of time

the jump distance wont solve anything give it a week and double gunners can predict your landing its only a temporary solution and there ain't enough space to have this on sloops the cooldown on the sword lunge isn't the problem the charge up is gives double gunners a good amount of time to dish out those two easy to hit 2 taps

you also mentioned that sword and blunders have a great advantage at close range well DUH they're both close range weapons why is it such a predicament for you to lose at close range with long range weapons??? its how it should be

this whole meta about shooting running away and eating and repeating has been a huge thorn in the game's pvp side for a long time its about time the sword became a decent close range weapon that punishes long range users as it should be

close range should always have the advantage over long ranged in close quarter combat this needs no changes whatsoever before the buff the long ranged weapons always had the advantage no matter if it was far or close they always came out ontop

literally anyone could run double gun and do it really well too aiming isn't the hardest thing in the world please stop making it seem like it is you just point and click as if your clicking on an icon on your computer screen its not hard at all

you know looking at your opponent before you aim down the sights then shoot isn't so hard i hit 7/10 of my shots the two times i miss due to hitreg the other one i just plainly miss due to badly timed shot

@jollyolsteamed I completely agree that sword-blunder users will have an advantage in close range. I don't see why you had to even write that sentence because that was something that I agreed on.

I think your getting off topic on what I'm trying to get at here. I'm saying that the sword needs a change, because it is not fun to use, even coming from a sword user. I have also stated several potential sword changes that could be used to counter the double gunners, and remember, these ideas are just a fraction of what can actually be done. There are hundreds of different counters just waiting to be discovered. I just think the damage needs a change, to make the sword battles more intense and drawn out.

@graphical24 said in Sword Nerf Proposal:

@jollyolsteamed I completely agree that sword-blunder users will have an advantage in close range. I don't see why you had to even write that sentence because that was something that I agreed on.

I think your getting off topic on what I'm trying to get at here. I'm saying that the sword needs a change, because it is not fun to use, even coming from a sword user. I have also stated several potential sword changes that could be used to counter the double gunners, and remember, these ideas are just a fraction of what can actually be done. There are hundreds of different counters just waiting to be discovered. I just think the damage needs a change, to make the sword battles more intense and drawn out.

thats the thing that you do not understand you remove the damage buff and the battles won't be drawn out they'll quickly be dispatched by two bullets before they get the third hit in then we'll be back at square one with double gunners being op

have you actually ran the sword before the changes? the way your going about these changes just makes it seem like you haven't

it certainly don't seem like you understand what a scourge the meta has been until now

im not trying to be offensive or trigger you even tho my poor english skills might make it seem that way

but the sword is fine as it is now double gunners has to learn to counter i don't understand why sword users has to be the ones to always adapt

@jollyolsteamed Your not seeing my point about adding a new way to counter double gunners. Maybe take a look at that.

I have ran the sword for my entire time on the seas, and I have found ways and tactics to counter double gunners. But I still think they should add a new combo/feature to combat double gunners.

The reason sword users have to "adapt" is because guns are a general tool in a lot of games, therefor many people have an idea on how to use it. Swords on the other hand are a new thing to most gamers, and they are something that they have to practice and get good at.

I strongly think that being good with a sword should require skill, as I said in my main post.

Another thing I would like to add is that I would love it if there were a way to make it so the sword would be the basic weapon, I would even suggest that they make you use sword, and remove double gun, but many, many people would hate that idea. Of course still nerfing the current sword.

@graphical24 im all for a skill gap in sword use but im not on the train about nerfing it's stats i can agree that running around hitting a button to get kills doesn't require much skill

im all for a way that will keep swords at a huge advantage over the flint and eye in close combat the blunder being the direct counter to swords

@jollyolsteamed I agree. As of right now, there is no skill gap with the sword, as "It's a gamble". All I want is a way to make the sword a skilled weapon to use, to where someone who has used the sword for a year, will likely beat someone who has used it for a day. Right now, It's "luck based".

@d3adst1ck I agree that sword combat is much faster. But even before the buff the sword fights were fast. There was so much to the fights, so many dynamic moves that people performed. Now, I've only seen people run at you and swing, no block, no sword-block-jump, no lunges, just running at your target swinging.

Now, if they were to nerf the sword back to what it was (an idea that I strongly support), I would also want them to implement a counter to double gunners for sword users (as I am a sword user). If you don't mind, please scroll up to see my previous conversations, where I talk about a new counter/move to combat double gunners with a sword.

@bugaboo-bill A double gunner takes a little more than a second to land both shots on a player. That gives experienced sword users just enough time to get to cover, and eat.

Blunders are not a good counter to the average sword user, as I have found it easy to kill Blunder players with a sword, just by jumping over their heads.

And I guarantee you the Devs will not make the sword 100% damage one swing, not even going to argue that.

@galactic-geek That is an exploit. Not a mechanic.

If it were an in game mechanic, then I do believe that it would be unfair to sword users.

In that case, they could always attempt to fix the exploit.

But not always does the shot through cover actually register, so there is still a good chance to escape currently.

Lets try to not bring exploits into the conversation, as those can be fixed by the Devs.

@graphical24 It isn't an exploit it's been in the game since launch. Wallbanging with guns and cutlasses is a thing. I've been sworded off a ladder while boarding. I've been shot through the decks of ships. This has been going on for ages.

@mferr11 Well its not really something the Devs purposely added. Due to the main fact that not 100% of the time your "Wallbangs" actually register.

I think that they should make "Wallbangs" an actual mechanic, or remove them.

I don't have a problem with "Wallbangs", but I think that they should either make them consistent, or remove them all together.

As the other pirate above said, that these "Wallbangs" make it hard for sword users to counter double gunners.

My main point with all these arguments is that they need to make the sword have a skill gap like it once did, while also not being useless while fighting double gun users.

@graphical24 listen, wall banging is never gonna be consistent because hit reg is never consistent is this game. Also, breaking news!!! Double gunning does not leave sword players at a disadvantage because sword players don’t only have a sword, they have a gun equipped as well!