Vertical pve progression

@zalavaaris if I had to guess is because that's still an advantage you'd have over everyone else. Your advantage should only be your own personal skills and wit. With a good crew and communication coming in a close second.

@crash4654 you're right but at a certain point the question needs to be asked. How long will it take for this vertical progression to provide a real benefit to one player vs another player that doesn't have the same benefit. I'm willing to bet in the time it takes for this progression to make a difference the player without said benefit will also aquire their own upgrades. We also need to ask ourselves if sea of thieves is the next huge esport game that requires 100% balance. I'm going to put my money on no and hope they implement this to provide more rewarding gameplay that keeps the players playing that aren't focused on pvp and griefing.

@zalavaaris it'll be in the instant that you have things doing better things than something else. Any small advantage is still a bigger advantage that you can use against somebody for whatever reason. A faster shovel makes it to where you get off islands faster so you don't have the suspense of another crew showing up. A better skeleton killer makes forts easier and thus less rewarding.

This entire games premise is based around you having all the tools at your disposal to be the best you can be and it's up to you to decide how to use them.

A game doesn't have to be the next big esport to take balance into consideration. A good game and developer will balance regardless of the condition of the game to make it fair and fun for everyone.

@zalavaaris said in Vertical pve progression:

Why not have vertical progression with regards to pve? Every complaint is about skill in a pvp environment. What if I want to work towards a blunderbuss that is better at killing sharks than the standard one but has no bonus affect in pvp? Or a cutlas that is better at killing skeletons? Why not let us kit out our pirate to explore the world in the way we choose and allow us to get better gear to play the pve content that won't affect the super cereal pvp content?

Yeah, I can’t really get on board with this. The minute vertical progression of any type opens up then all avenues will eventually open as well.

Definitely not for this idea or anything vertical.

@timidobserver said in Vertical pve progression:

I actually like this idea. The PvP purists are completely non-negotiable on the topic, but this idea has the least impact on PvP of any idea that I've read.

I am definitely not a PvP purist as most of my post defend pve people, but I would definitely vote no on this. I will set a precedent and the pve people won’t like it once vertical progression happens again but in the PvP aspect.

People need to be careful what they wish for. Once one thing gets changed for one side, the possibility of the other side getting it as well increases

@crash4654 I think that's a great thing to aspire to. The whole argument against vertical progression was due to pvp. Now that I've taken that out of the equation it just seems like counter comments are nitpicking. The idea is that vertical progression means that new players stand zero chance of being successful is just wrong. I'm envisioning a system of npcs wanting me to kill sharks. Maybe after so many shark kills with a specific weapon that weapon becomes better against sharks. Maybe at a crazy high number you get cosmetics that show you've killed hundreds and hundreds of sharks. Same for skeletons. It's just something that is little, provides minimal advantage over others, and adds more than just cosmetic progression. It appeals to many more players and would be a good business decision. Most of my friends refuse to play games they can't progress in with regards to character power so this would win them over without breaking the pvp component.

@zalavaaris this all only applies if PvP isn't also an aspect. ANY advantage, pve included, is an unfair one. If you can dig up a chest in one shovel where it takes another crew multiple, that's less time that you're on an island and in danger.

If you can kill sharks easier, than you have literally nothing to worry about in water whereas another person has to think about it.

With this current system every thing you do should be calculated and the environment is as much your enemy as is other players.

Skeleton forts are still big things and if you have the thing that makes them easier thats an unfair advantage.

This is a great idea.

I'm in the no camp on this idea.

I'll just say, any way to clear a Skull Fort faster (which a weapon that does more damage to Skeletons would do) is a huge boost to a player, potentially avoiding confrontation with other ships, or securing the key faster from the boss by ensuring you are easily able to last hit it.

Even a weapon that kills sharks faster can make you nigh impervious if you're knocked off your ship. I know I, for one, have gone island hopping via swimming to secure a valuable chest after I either had my ship sunk or disembarking my ship to attack another ship. The only real threat are sharks, so a weapon that can reliably kill sharks faster would, indeed, have an effect on PVP.

I would be much more willing to make otherwise stupid decisions to either enhance a conflict or avoid it altogether with a weapon that has a PvE boost to it.

The only question I have to this, is why? The PvE content in the game is already so easy I honestly don't feel like I need to have an advantage. I am playing on PC and am able to Solo the pirate fort (I did it 2 times during beta with no opposition.) which says something already. Blunderbuss already 1 hits skellies,I really don't need a more powerful sword. It is stronk already! I am just curious.

For me, the biggest satisfaction I get playing this game, is when I sink a 4 man galleon as a solo sloop by jumping off the front of my boat with a gunpowder keg. Just pu it in auto pilot against wind, climb up their ladder if they follow me, and sneak in to the hull unnoticed, blowing that sucker up and watching as they come down 1 by 1 to repair only to eat shotgun.

To each their own. Also, currently sharks take 2 hits to kill with a blunderbuss. So, in essence, you'd like to see a blunderbuss that 1 hits a shark? Hmm

This idea isn't too bad. If implemented correctly, it'll be cool beans. It doesn't have any effect on PvP. So there's no problem there, and it gives players a reason to focus on PvE as well. I do gotta say though, that progression like this should only be implemented towards "end game" I.E. After you've achieved Pirate Legend. Otherwise, players actually will have an advantage in their progression to Pirate Legend, which doesn't need to happen. That equality in working up to what Rare has stated as our current "end game" is a good aspect in my opinion.

@tedimshy That's not entirely true. While you do have a bit of a point with the slight advantages it would give people. Rare doesn't want higher level pirates, or Pirate Legends, to only play with each other. The whole reason the Pirate Legend system works the way it does currently (as far as we've been told by Rare), is because they want the Legends to interact and help newer players experience the "higher level" content, and progress with the help of someone who's already made it. It's the whole point of Pirate legends. If they only played with each other it would be pointless. You don't lose or gain anything from limiting the people you play with, based on their own progression.

@tedimshy That makes more sense. I agree, there probably wont be any vertical progression added to the game. But I do still like this idea. In my opinion, if the bonuses are small enough, the newbies aren't going to slow down Legendary Pirates any more than a person who simply isn't very good with the game mechanics. Or a person who decides to just goof around (like I do sometimes lol).

Yes I agree there will be some benefits to the people who have earned them. It may have a small affect on battles in a pvp setting. That with me is just fine. These bonuses however would not make a veteran of the game crush new players though. Of COURSE there will be a benefit that other players won't have until they have earned it... That's the point... the benefits are negligible and would make your character just a little bit better (not just looking better) every time you log in and play. They won't receive business from a large portion of gamers because of this and if they want to alienate people that's their choice. I just want to see the game succeed and right now it's all about pvp it seems and that kind of sucks for a lot of people... myself included. The pve IS a joke as stated above. 2 mob types?!? Seriously?.... I want more pve content and vertical pve progression that will admittedly affect pvp but not nearly as drastically as the purists make it out to.

@zalavaaris you underestimate what a skilled player can do with a tiny advantage. And any step up in numbers is too much in my opinion. This method they have right now means that no matter when you log in, no matter how much time you have in the game, you're on the same level as everyone else and you have to be better on a personal level or get better yourself.

You can be the greatest gamer in the world but if you can't dedicate the time like little Timmy, who can play for hours on end without worry, who gets all the goodies and strong stuff just because of a time difference. That's unfair.

In this means you actually do progress on a personal level which is worth exponentially more than some stats, because only one of those types of progression is actually worth anything.

Imagine one becomes the legendary evasive pirate, who's never been hit due to his preservation sense. He never gave an enemy the chance to attack him, much less hit him and just like that he's gone.

Stats can't give you that sense of accomplishment. They give you a false high.

Because everyone is supposed to be equal.

Even if you have something that only affects, say, sharks. That still gives you an advantage because you can kill sharks quicker than someone else. And yes, that does affect PvP.

I do believe Rare are trying to break the mould here and it makes a refreshing change. Just look at the opposite end of the spectrum and what happened to Star Wars Battlefront 2.

Well gg everyone! I love the black dog pack and I love my starting ship! I also don't care for titles so I win and have accomplished the pinnacle of what this game has to offer in just preordering alone! I feel so proud and accomplished....

The problem with vertical progression of any sort is the feeling of obligation to get to the next level and the stress of inadequacy if you can still progress.
Even if the progression was PVE based the problem is still there."I shouldn't try skull forts till I get (insert weapon or buff here)" I dont want this mentality ever in this game, I'm sick of games where I don't feel like I'm getting 100% of the game unless I grind for a number of hours.
Obligations will always have negative feeling towards them. Let me play a game and not just have obligitory busywork.

Sounds good. To start off it doesn't need to be anything complicated. Some weapons are meant for pvp against pirates, but this other weapon is better at skeletons, then another helps with sea creatures like sharks. then for difficult missions you can be rewarded with a weapon meant for bosses.

@zalavaaris if you're not playing for the fun of the game then why are you playing? Do you know how many times I've played the various Marios, zeldas, and final fantasy games? Or how long I played destiny just to play with a group of friends and have fun. Or even the ungodly amount of time I have in ARK despite being on my own server. And im not going to even start on borderlands 2.

Several of these I 100 percented and went back and played again just because I enjoyed them. If you're playing to get the next big, powerful item, you're not doing it right.

@zalavaaris If people are basically gonna copy pasta this same argument just worded slightly different in 30 threads, then I will with the response.

Because you have been force fed this belief by the gaming industry since the beginning, and now a days it's still the progression method for leveling and then in pvp everyone is normalized into a stat template anyhow.

Heaven forbid that we cut out the middleman, you would think everyone would be tired of being a Pavlovian dog by now... The bell rung boys, you are already at max level with all your shiny purps/orange best in slot, full item level gear... just enjoy the game.

Funny how people hate questing because they want to be max level and skip half the gearing, but also get bored once they have gear at max level. Either that or you honestly don't like the games you play and get tired/bored once your character is max level and fully geared up, you just like to hear the bell ring.

@timidobserver then there are numerous games to do that, this just isnt one of them. If i want to play something like forza do i complain to Nintendo that Mario kart shouldn't have powerups and should have more realistic car physics? Or do I play forza?

If you're not having fun playing the game as it is, then why are you playing it? If you want this game to change from what it is then you're not wanting to play that particular game in general. Want a pirate game where you have vertical Progression? Go play assassins creed black flag.

I played Mario for Mario style platforming. Imagine if I played it and went up to the fan base and said "You know, they should add guns to this game to make it funner." And imagine the backlash I'd receive from the fan base.