Doubloon change repeal

  • Ghutar
    Legend
    Insider
    Founder

    @mopwieldinghedgehog yeeesach. Nope.

    It's false choice fallacy you present there. Like we can only overpirce future - past items or underprice it. Nothing niuaced is allowed only extremes.

    It's not like they can price stuff according, no?
    Like normal priced stuff and pricy pricy stuff and super hillaiarus like I don't know overachiever sail's?

    For me it's still laziess possible try to fix economy and lack of stackes in game. No need to gaslight around it.

    Of course Rare cloud easily avoid that situation by regular updates of gold shop, new things to be bought for doubloon and additional gold sinks similar to DA sets. But here we are fixing economy with denomination and old items.

    Edit of edit: They cloud even eat cake and have cake just by announcing that folks who has above set threshold of doubloons can only before SE19 and voulontary reset their doubloons for some exclusive reward idk overachiever ship set. But again we are on Sea of Lazy.

  • MopWieldingHedgehog
    Champion
    Insider
    Moderator
    Boatswain

    @ghutar Add a shop with reasonably priced items and everyone who is sitting on a bunch of doubloons buys it all in one go with it barely making a dent then remains sitting on a bunch of doubloons they again have nothing to spend on. You do know that there are people sitting on tens of thousands of doubloons, yes?

    By doing a reset they're able to get doubloons back to the place they once had (and was meant to have) - a scarce event related currency with which you could only buy select items.

    I'd also appreciate you keeping the gaslight accusations out of it. It's a repulisve term to use to try and dismiss/devalue information and opinion provided.

  • Ghutar
    Legend
    Insider
    Founder

    @mopwieldinghedgehog yes I know.

    Now with all statsic that Rare have what stands in way of adding very expensive set to chip that away?

    Other that work needed to be done in that way not just throwing old or unused stuff.

    For me it's hard to see reset as not best or most rewarding solution to dead economy but as most time-cost efficient or plain lazy one.

    English is not my first language so I struggle to find better word for "presenting narration based on false choice falacy" and gaslighting don't have much weight in my first language.

    I hope you are not offended tho as it was not my intention.

  • Flashkannon5118
    Seafarer

    @mopwieldinghedgehog said in Doubloon change repeal:

    @thelostsentinel
    As for the rest - if you were to implement the black market without first balancing the currency you would have to make items in the black market insanely expensive in order to even make a dent in the hoards of doubloons some players are sitting on. Making the black market items insanely expensive would also mean that they would come across as completely unobtainable for new players straight off and for casual players after a rotation or two. To avoid that you'd have to make doubloons even more easily obtainable than they are now. Which in the end would mean absolutely nothing about the currency has been balanced/fixed. On top of that, all you'd get is the store - no monthly event. So less content - which players generally don't seem to be fans of.

    I don't think I subscribe to your chain of logic here. What's the goal, here? To make older players play more often? Assuming no doubloon reset, then newer players would need to work to get the new cosmetics, driving engagement, etc etc as normal. For older players, while you are right that you wouldn't be making a huge dent in the more massive collections, do these players need to be incentivized as much as the newer players? Anyone who's been playing the game this long doesn't need constant hooks, they're already hooked. All you need to do is not upset the applecart, and most of them will keep trundling along.

  • MopWieldingHedgehog
    Champion
    Insider
    Moderator
    Boatswain

    @flashkannon5118 I take it you haven't seen the constant argument that 'Rare only caters to new players' and 'Rare doesn't care about veterans'. Adapting it to be a new player incentive only wouldn't go over well in any way, shape or form. This way, it will hopefully provide an event that 'everyone' (regardless of previous playtime) may want to and can participate in.

  • BurnBacon
    Vanguard
    Insider

    What's the goal, here? To make older players play more often?

    Well, since I slowly running out of actual stuff to do. And maybe they will add new ways to gather up Doubloons? Yes.
    My hopes? Some Hard to complete voyages.

    Anyone who's been playing the game this long doesn't need constant hooks, they're already hooked.

    Hooked or not, from the amount of complaints this game gets from even New players, some dont even last a single week due to "reasons"
    For vets, it comes down to, what else can I drive myself to do while waiting around for some random event to spawn up.

    I wish they had a secret system, where if you do things ingame that isnt normal, you get rewarded. Similar to how the Seasons use to offer up "Deeds".....but you simply wouldnt know the requirements.

  • Flashkannon5118
    Seafarer

    @mopwieldinghedgehog said in Doubloon change repeal:

    @flashkannon5118 I take it you haven't seen the constant argument that 'Rare only caters to new players' and 'Rare doesn't care about veterans'. Adapting it to be a new player incentive only wouldn't go over well in any way, shape or form. This way, it will hopefully provide an event that 'everyone' (regardless of previous playtime) may want to and can participate in.

    I have seen that, but you're not planning on gating the new content from veterans, right? We can just play it, if we want to? I figure most veterans will engage in the new event because they like playing Sea of Thieves, not because the economics force them to. Why else would they have sunk thousands of hours into the game, if they didn't like playing it?

  • MopWieldingHedgehog
    Champion
    Insider
    Moderator
    Boatswain

    @flashkannon5118 You can flip that - why would they mind playing the game to participate in the event to earn doubloons to spend at will on the black market inventory if they enjoy playing it already? Cleary they do mind given the upset some are showing at the thought.

    I know, I know, it's mostly about the doubloon reset itself. But it's a secondary currency that most veterans have no use for the way it works today.

  • Flashkannon5118
    Seafarer

    @burnbacon said in Doubloon change repeal:

    For vets, it comes down to, what else can I drive myself to do while waiting around for some random event to spawn up.

    Get into speedrunning tall tales, perhaps? Work on personal goals? Go around teaching new players? Plenty of things to do in the Sea of Thieves, if you chart your own course. I had a grand old time when I decided to make my captaincy hunter rank higher than my voyager rank. It's a sandbox, you know? You make some sandcastles.

  • Flashkannon5118
    Seafarer

    @mopwieldinghedgehog said in Doubloon change repeal:

    @flashkannon5118 You can flip that - why would they mind playing the game to participate in the event to earn doubloons to spend at will on the black market inventory if they enjoy playing it already? Cleary they do mind given the upset some are showing at the thought.

    At least personally speaking, there's two reasons - the first being that I like having a hoard. Making that number go up is fun. Having that reset back to 0 would be the opposite of my goals, in that respect. The earning is fun but the having is part of it. To me, this would be as if you cleared out some of the old titles, or erased some old cosmetics - I don't use every cosmetic on a regular basis, but I earned them, you know?

    The second, that I enjoy playing the game, but not every bit of content in this game is up my alley, but the upcoming events seem to be for that sort of crowd - and they deserve fun events tailored to them too! But if there's something that's not up my alley, or I'm quite busy that month, and the currency is persistent, it'd be nice if my many years of acquisition let me dip my toes in the pool to have as much fun as I please.

  • MopWieldingHedgehog
    Champion
    Insider
    Moderator
    Boatswain

    @flashkannon5118 Things having been earned seem important to you, yet your upset is the reset of a secondary currency most veterans and/or very frequent players earn passively (no need to grind something you can't use) and not with an event related cosmetic such as bonecrusher coming back. Cosmetics that had to be earned and not just bought at will with currency. For me, that doesn't quite add up.

  • Flashkannon5118
    Seafarer

    @mopwieldinghedgehog said in Doubloon change repeal:

    @flashkannon5118 Things having been earned seem important to you, yet your upset is the reset of a secondary currency most veterans and/or very frequent players earn passively (no need to grind something you can't use) and not with an event related cosmetic such as bonecrusher coming back. Cosmetics that had to be earned and not just bought at will with currency. For me, that doesn't quite add up.

    Doesn't add up? I'd hoped I'd conveyed my feelings on the matter, but it doesn't have to add up for you, I suppose, so long as they're not ignored, or written off. This is a feedback forum. An open channel for players like me and like everyone else in this thread to make our feelings known. So, I'm making my feelings known. To me at least, a thing doesn't need to need to be "of use" to be worth acquiring, or keeping, or admiring. I worked for a long time to get Legendary Hunter of the Sea of Thieves, but I don't use it that often - there are other titles I use as well. Do I regret spending the time to acquire it? I do not, I say. I enjoy that I have it, even if I do not display it. Those doubloons in my account are worth what they can be spent on, of course (I haven't cleared out all the items that can be purchased with doubloons), but they're also just nice to have.

  • PotatoSord
    Marauder
    Insider

    @potatosord To add on: The reaper voyage only needed 180 completions originally, and after the first week it was patched so that it required 270. The people who did it in the first week didn't need to do as much work as everyone else will need to do for the same commendation. They're actually DISRESPECTING more players time by NOT changing it because that means that everyone who wasn't one of the 15 people to do 180 reaper voyages in one week has to do 50% more work, and that's 99.9% of the playerbase. Less than 0.1% of the player base did all 180 reaper voyages in the first week. This is a game where 40 MILLION people have played it. We did not see 40,000 people do 180 reaper voyages in the first week. We did not see 4,000 people do 180 of them. I would be shocked if more than 400 players (0.001%) did all 180 of them in the first week. 99.99% of the playerbase AT MINIMUM will have to do 50% more work and spend at least 50% more time to do the same quest that they are "respecting (less than 0.01% of) players time commitment" on by not changing.

  • Europa4033
    Commander
    Insider

    Thing is, I purchased every Plunder Pass using real money, and many of those rewards included doubloons (whereas it would be zero if I hadn't purchased the Pass).

    Also, what's wrong with your most dedicated and passionate veterans, those who've purchased Plunder Passes with real money, purchased cosmetics from the emporium, earned achievs that can no longer earn those rewards again, what's wrong with these players being able to spend their doubloons right away as new cosmetics come out??

    New players not having the ability to buy things like a veteran, is okay. People don't join new games with the expectations of buying the same cosmetics as veterans. If anything, it becomes a motivation to grind what they see another player having. Back in the day I wanted those DA sails. To get 8.2 million seemed unfathomable. So I grinded, adventured, robbed, until the day came when I could buy them. I was thrilled. Yeah other players already had them, and it made me want them more. I wasn't upset that they had it and and I didn't. It made me motivated.

    This is seriously the wrong direction here that started from bad planning (people kept asking for things to buy too!) from the company, and now that bad planning is passed on to the players who've been with you for years.

  • TheLostSentinel
    Marauder
    Insider

    @mopwieldinghedgehog said in Doubloon change repeal:

    @thelostsentinel As Drew specifies in the update video - there will be time limited items up for sale for doubloons that those who have saved up can purchase before the reset. Which is in and of itself a compensation for time spent.

    As for the rest - if you were to implement the black market without first balancing the currency you would have to make items in the black market insanely expensive in order to even make a dent in the hoards of doubloons some players are sitting on. Making the black market items insanely expensive would also mean that they would come across as completely unobtainable for new players straight off and for casual players after a rotation or two. To avoid that you'd have to make doubloons even more easily obtainable than they are now. Which in the end would mean absolutely nothing about the currency has been balanced/fixed. On top of that, all you'd get is the store - no monthly event. So less content - which players generally don't seem to be fans of.

    Thank you for your response!

    I do think, from a PR perspective, the video should have been released with what you just told me, to better explain the "why", because I feel as though the video itself (upon another watch) did not get into the nitty grittier details of 'why' like you had very aptly put here vs. a more general explanation. I do think it would have also been better to explain the 'where' of what happens to player's doubloons once the reset has occurred. Do they just go away? Are they converted to gold? It wasn't stated, so I think players are assuming the worst in that, they'll just be gone with no compensation of some kind. Obviously, what's in the past is in the past, but more information available to players will prevent them from making assumptions.

    While I do agree with your point that the black market items could be insanely expensive with limited inventory and make it tougher for newer players to engage with that store, I think making it limited inventory in the first place is in fact causing that problem. There is a lot of items from prior seasons that are just outright gone that could have made up that inventory with more than enough. I do understand that, while the battle pass system is in fact designed to bring players into the game, and there is a business need to keep a certain few passes worth unavailable for at least awhile to keep players engaging with that system, there is significantly older passes collecting dust that could very well be used for that shop by now. And of course, once that 'time' has come, that shop can add another season's worth of cosmetics as time goes on, to create more sinks.

    EDIT: If players do have that much doubloons, I still think the above is a valid strategy, but maybe convert three fourths of their doubloons to gold, and then leave them the amount they have to spend on said store.

  • D3ADST1CK
    Vanguard
    Insider
    Founder

    @europa4033 said in Doubloon change repeal:

    Thing is, I purchased every Plunder Pass using real money, and many of those rewards included doubloons (whereas it would be zero if I hadn't purchased the Pass).

    There aren't any doubloons in the paid track. They are all in the free track. I had to check because I thought I was misremembering as you're the second person who has said this on the forums today, but the paid track has always been Ancient Coin and Future Emporium items as far as I can tell.

  • Seethepoet
    Ship Mate
    Insider

    If you don't want to see this happen, you need to stop buying ancient coin. I am. It's the only thing that'll get Rare to listen.

  • BurnBacon
    Vanguard
    Insider

    you need to stop buying ancient coin. I am. It's the only thing that'll get Rare to listen.

    Good luck holding back from buying anything. :p

  • Ethereal3mbr
    Sailor

    Personally, I don’t think this change is a healthy one across the board. Unless they convert our doubloons to ancient coins instead. Another thing that I think could be a better solution to people with tons of doubloons and nothing to spend on. Giving the players a choice if they want to spend ancient coins or doubloons on emporium items. Another game I like to play Dead by Daylight has most of their cosmetics be bought with iridescent shards and have the option to buy them with the premium currency you have to pay irl money for. Even just a seasonal rotation store of previous season exclusive items. But change out the random rotation either each day or week. Giving people the chance to still earn those items if they so wish as well as giving players a reason to log in each day and play. To see what the new rotation is. Those are just a couple ideas that could be infinitely healthier options.

  • Flashkannon5118
    Seafarer

    @mopwieldinghedgehog said in Doubloon change repeal:

    @flashkannon5118 Things having been earned seem important to you, yet your upset is the reset of a secondary currency most veterans and/or very frequent players earn passively (no need to grind something you can't use) and not with an event related cosmetic such as bonecrusher coming back. Cosmetics that had to be earned and not just bought at will with currency. For me, that doesn't quite add up.

    Oh hang on, I see what you mean - you're saying that by being upset about the doubloons and not the cosmetics, I'm not consistent. Okay. If that's your angle, I can say this: it really doesn't bother me that much, losing exclusivity of old cosmetics. They're mostly valuable for the memories they bring and the actual cosmetic of them, not entirely the exclusivity. I would be lying if I didn't have any feelings about it whatsoever, but not enough that I'd make a post about it, or complain, unless it was one of those "We're changing the game in a way that makes it easier, here'sa fun cosmetic to say you did it when it was hard" ones. I didn't complain when the pirate legend curse got made into a PvP reward, y'know? It matters, just not really that much. Not as much as a doubloon reset.

  • MopWieldingHedgehog
    Champion
    Insider
    Moderator
    Boatswain

    @flashkannon5118 I'm glad you didn't complain when the legend curse was made into a PvP reward as it was announced to be returning to the game in some shape or form before the season pass and plunder pass was even released.

  • Flashkannon5118
    Seafarer

    @mopwieldinghedgehog said in Doubloon change repeal:

    @flashkannon5118 I'm glad you didn't complain when the legend curse was made into a PvP reward as it was announced to be returning to the game in some shape or form before the season pass and plunder pass was even released.

    Oh, was it? News to me, but then, I only managed to make it to Pirate Legend by the end of that season. Fair enough!

Login To Reply
59
Posts
29.6k
Views
community
47 out of 59