Battles that go on and on

  • I love this new season. Best season by a long shot.

    The only downside is one that's always been part of this game: when crews are well-matched, PvP battles take way long. 1 - 2 hours for a single battle is crazy. A few ideas to finish battles more quickly:

    *** Shrink the battlefield.** Make the perimeters condense over time, ala PubG or Fortnite, until one or both boats are crushed.

    *** Add power up drops.** As battles wear on, add more powerful fodder. Floating gunpowder barrels. Barrels with cursed cannonballs. Barrels with wraithballs. Let both ships know when these show up on the map, so it becomes a race to get them.

    *** Give an alt objective.** You can sink your opponent to win... but you could be the first to collect three of five artifacts from nearby islands.

    *** Diminishing repairs.** The first time you repair a hole, it repairs to 100%. The second time you repair, the hole repairs to 95%, but there's still a little water getting in. The third time, it repairs to 90%, etc. Stay in the battle long enough and no amount of bailing will bring you back.

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  • I don't really like these suggestions as I feel it would make the game feel too much like Fortnite or Apex. Things like Shrinking battlefields and diminishing returns on basic game systems would only make the battles worse. If anything it would encourage players to maintain a distance and hug the edge of the map for as long as possible, which would further delay the fight, which you are specifically trying to avoid.

    Next time you're in a long battle, I would suggest trying to think of what you and your crew could do that would be unexpected or weird. Personally, if a fire-fight is too evenly matched and the fight is getting long, I resort to ramming and harpooning. Very few players I encounter seem to know how to deal with both of these strategies, especially a full on ram. Creativity in SoT combat is often rewarded!

  • @theonetruederp no... this is how you lose fights to time. Ramming especially in galleon is an absolute death sentence vs good crews.

    Games should have some sort of time limit w/ a victor winning a game because the other crew wanted to login for a short PVP session but could not stay in the same fight for an hour is not fun and ruins a large point of this expansion of having a fast paced PVP game mode to engage in.

  • Players beg for pvp and we got it. Now they hate it because. “Last too long”

    In the open world without the hourglass. This can still happen! Your still doing the same thing. It isn’t arena with set rules.

    Fight how you want. Win how you please.
    If it taking to long to finish off a ship, maybe you aren’t cut out for this “endless war”

  • Personally, I 100% agree with the OP. The battles being allowed to drag on for hours is really hurting the impact of this new activity. (And as a long time player of Sea of Thieves, I think this activity is hitting a lot of things right! Good action, lore, and on demand pvp is a good way to liven the game back up. There are just a few things diminishing the strength of Hourglass battles.)

    Here's why it's bad to let battles go on:

    1. It dilutes the matchmaking. If everybody in your skill range is constantly locked in never ending battles, then you get to sit in ridiculously long queue times until one of them ends their fight. Then there's a delay between the end of their fight and them resupplying and getting back into the fray. It slows the experience down for EVERYONE not just the people trapped in age-long fights. No queue should give you enough time to shower and make a sandwich before you find a match (and yes, I have literally done so).

    2. Most players don't want to be trapped in a single engagement of cat and mouse forever. If both crews go in with hundreds of cannonballs and planks, then the fight of attrition will be nigh inexhaustible. Sure you COULD use a crazy strategy and hope it pays off (i.e. ram keg) to try and end the fight, but the vast majority of crews aren't going to do something like that until their supplies are depleted and it becomes a necessary course of action. Something needs to be done to shorten these engagements to a reasonable time frame.

    The idea of shrinking the combat area is a good one. I'd even suggest shrinking the initial area by 25-30% already in the case of sloops. Too much area to run around and avoid combat when the purpose is to ENGAGE in combat is counterproductive to the flow of the gamemode.

    I like the idea of "powerup" barrels but I don't know if it's reasonable to add. It might be cool for a Phantom ship from each faction to join the fray every 10 minutes or so to bring said boosted supplies, but I won't put a lot of faith in that option until we hear how plausible it is.

    Putting a cap on supplies doesn't really seem fair either, because it removes any element if preparation from the mix. Especially since this is an open world engagement, time spent preparing in said space should be an important factor in the battle. So curtailing supplies doesn't really seem like an acceptable solution to the issue.

    What I really think needs to happen is a strong time limit be enforced. If the invader can't defeat their target in 20-30 minutes, the game should strike a draw and return the invader to matchmaking/a new instance. You don't get a win or loss if that happens, which incentivizes both crews to be more aggressive if they want that kill credit. Sure, nobody wants to spend 20 minutes in a fight for no return. But when the other side of the coin is spending 2 hours in a fight to gain one notch on your streak or lose everything and quit playing the game then and there... I think most of us can agree the first option is better.

  • Sorry, but I feel these are terrible suggestions. If you’re in a battle and it appears to be a stalemate, then try to come to a truce. If your opponent doesn’t accept, which they have every right to refuse, then you have three choices: 1) make a run for it, 2) fight it out to the bitter end, or 3) leave the game. Suggesting game mechanics should be changed because you’re bored of a fight you’ve got yourself into is not the answer.

  • If limitations start being placed on this system, it will die just like arena did. Placing limitations will create linear encounters that will always follow the exact same meta each time. That'll drive your average user away, this mode needs the casual playerbase to take part in order to remain in the game. Let's try keep this mode organic so everyone feels they can take part. It's adventure, not arena.

  • I'm already seeing the same ships over and over in my matchmaking. Which tells me the matchmaking pools aren't that big, even at launch.

    If there aren't enough people in the matchmaking pools, PvP-on-demand dies.

    Reducing battle times makes for better matchmaking, and it makes for a better experience for players overall.

  • @prescafatty No it wouldn't. The main question you have to ask is why are people avoiding it. Most likely because the average user doesn't want to be involved in a animation cancelling sweatfest. Adding limitations such as time limits will only serve to aid those who are constantly pvp'ing on a regular basis, not your average user.

    The matchmaking is probably not functioning correctly and needs some work.

  • We have discussed this at some length as boatswain.
    It was suggested that a timer would help, where after a set time, if the battle is not drawing to a close, both ships submerge and the battle is counted as a draw.

  • @sshteeve That seems very reasonable.

  • @sshteeve That's not a terrible compromise to the issue of long battles. How would the system handle hourglass value and points given a draw?

  • @theonetruederp well of its 10,000 Gold value to the pot - split it in half.

    Give a half rank up instead of the quarter for a loss and a full for a win.

  • @sshteeve Also not a bad idea and I could dig it. I would be concerned someone would find some odd way to farm it though...

  • @theonetruederp it would be odd to waste 30 minutes trying to cheese a draw.
    We already have time-wasters who skirt the edge, or campers anchoring to steal supplies.

    This would add some urgency to the battle.

  • @sshteeve said in Battles that go on and on:

    We have discussed this at some length as boatswain.
    It was suggested that a timer would help, where after a set time, if the battle is not drawing to a close, both ships submerge and the battle is counted as a draw.

    I think it would be better when both crews after some time (20-30 minutes) would get a window of 1-2 minutes to vote for a draw. If both crews do that, they'll leave the fight by submerging.

  • @burnbacon We hated open world PvP since people ran away... If people start running again this is not a fix. I am not playing SoT to compete over which one of us cares the least about their life and is willing to spend the most time trying to win a battle of mental attrition.

  • @pumpa-cat What truce??? All your saying is if your opponent chooses to play the game of who cares the least about their life and is willing to waste the most time as possible you have no choice but to concede to them... I'm sorry I have a life and work and don't want to spend 1.5 hours per battle.

  • @nitroxien said in Battles that go on and on:

    @pumpa-cat What truce??? All your saying is if your opponent chooses to play the game of who cares the least about their life and is willing to waste the most time as possible you have no choice but to concede to them... I'm sorry I have a life and work and don't want to spend 1.5 hours per battle.

    Many other people work too. Myself included.

    What I meant by the truce is that if you and another player are fighting and it appears to be a stalemate, would a truce be an option in that scenario. Having never played hourglass, or whatever it’s called, I wouldn’t know if that was a viable option.

  • Supply limits (specifically planks) is the answer.

    Players have so many planks and defense has been made so easy that everyone can reset the fight 100 times over while putting out almost no offense.

    This is supposed to be SKILLS BASED MATCHMAKING...

    For the purposes of these battles, stocking up is NOT A SKILL...it's just a matter of who has more free time.

  • @sweetsandman said in Battles that go on and on:

    This is supposed to be SKILLS BASED MATCHMAKING...

    I best stay out of that part of the game then. If that server was filled with people at my pitiful skill level, we’d probably never hit each other with cannonballs, even if we were two feet away. 🤣

  • @pumpa-cat said in Battles that go on and on:

    @sweetsandman said in Battles that go on and on:

    This is supposed to be SKILLS BASED MATCHMAKING...

    I best stay out of that part of the game then. If that server was filled with people at my pitiful skill level, we’d probably never hit each other with cannonballs, even if we were two feet away. 🤣

    Haha! But you'd probably have a blast doing it!

    Equally low-skill battles can be a hoot as long as they don't go on forever.

    I think about my early days of Rocket League...just absolute rubbish play on both sides of the ball by both teams... absolutely hysterical stuff and honestly way more fun than later when things just turned into a sweat festival.

  • @pumpa-cat said in Battles that go on and on:

    What I meant by the truce is that if you and another player are fighting and it appears to be a stalemate, would a truce be an option in that scenario. Having never played hourglass, or whatever it’s called, I wouldn’t know if that was a viable option.

    WHY WOULD YOU CRITIQUE OPTIONS FOR A GAMEMODE YOU DON'T PLAY?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

  • @nitroxien said in Battles that go on and on:

    @pumpa-cat said in Battles that go on and on:

    What I meant by the truce is that if you and another player are fighting and it appears to be a stalemate, would a truce be an option in that scenario. Having never played hourglass, or whatever it’s called, I wouldn’t know if that was a viable option.

    WHY WOULD YOU CRITIQUE OPTIONS FOR A GAMEMODE YOU DON'T PLAY?!?!?!?!?!?!?!

    Oh my🤣

  • o xp esta totalmente quebrado, horas e horas para pegar apenas alguns niveis.

  • @sweetsandman said in Battles that go on and on:

    Supply limits (specifically planks) is the answer.

    Players have so many planks and defense has been made so easy that everyone can reset the fight 100 times over while putting out almost no offense.

    This is supposed to be SKILLS BASED MATCHMAKING...

    For the purposes of these battles, stocking up is NOT A SKILL...it's just a matter of who has more free time.

    This is actually a really good point. My crew and I have run into ships that have had, I kid you not, 5,000 planks/cannonballs onboard. Granted that was in open water and not in this Arena mode... but the possibility exists that a crew could indefinitely extend the duration of a round with even 1/5th of the supplies in my above example.

    Maybe then the real "balance patch" here is if you use the Warmap to hunt an opponent then your supplies get set to an "arena stock" when you submerge. Something reasonable but not super overstocked. In my experience, I'd say a good "PVP stock" is around 300 cannonballs (with anywhere from 5-20 chainshot mixed in), 20 firebombs and blunders, 100 planks, and about 30 pieces of good fruit (not bananas). If a crew can't sink a ship with that much supply, they're not really good at PVP in this game. Heck, the cannonballs could probably be brought down to 200.

    (EDIT) One other addition. If you're not using the battle map, then your supplies are untouched. To prevent defenders from making the match last forever also, we could use that mentioned timer system and say if neither opponent defeats the other then both ships hourglasses explode and no one wins. No points. Make the punishment for delaying the fight as harsh as possible and people won't even consider it an option anymore. Add some kind of visual effect to either the hourglasses or maybe the ship's lanterns that makes a very obvious flashing to warn when time is almost up. 5 minute warning maybe?

  • @prescafatty I like the idea of a time limit and points based on cannon hits and or actively engaging the enemy. I have had some REALLY good fights go on for a bit and it was insanely fun, but I’ve also had the 2+ hour solo sloop runner just telling me to scuttle if I don’t wanna chase. So there’s that too. I think the timer should start if the there are no cannons hitting after a preset time. The shrinking circle isn’t a terrible idea either but points and a timer I think may be the way

  • @pumpa-cat how do you propose a “truce” would work in the S8 pvp mode. There can be only 1….?

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