Stop people placing crates on their anchor

@conceitedox8550 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

Can you stack crates and such over your boat's built-in ammo crate? I don't actually know, but I don't think you can. The rules should be the same for the two.

Since no one answered this initial question. Yes, you can. I usually sit my storage crate on it on the sloop. Or extra ammo boxes I find on top of it. Not as a PvP tactic, but because that’s where I like to put them on my sloop. Brig and galleon I have different locations for the same items.

As for the original topic of the thread. I agree the anchor should be a longer interact like the length it takes to steal a map bundle. Always did find it odd that it was just a quick tap. I don’t care if people put loot on it though. Sometimes I put kegs on mine, or a stool. It’s fun sitting on top of the capstan with the stool. I do think it’s a tools, not rules thing though… if they didn’t want people to do it, they would have fixed it… just like they’ve fixed plenty of other things they didn’t want us doing. It isn’t like it’s new to the game, it’s been a thing you could do for years… so it’s not like it’s gone under the radar.

I feel like people not tampering with this strategy is probably for the better.

Think about it: The anchor is still hilariously easy to drop, but with some keen thinking and planning, you can force a board-happy crew to naval you/wipe your whole crew instead of stopping you in place at a moment's notice.

Some will triumph with this strategy, many will fail with this strategy. Different crew doing different things make these fights less samey, and force crews to develop better approaches to a fight.

@gtothefo said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@shadow20642 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@hxr141 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

clip

Please watch the clip to see why crates shouldn’t be stacked on the anchor.

Simply add a barrier above anchor like there is above map table.

Tools not rules

The thing is, that's not really an answer. The anchor needs to be either something you can balance things on or not, its not a rule is being applied where one doesn't need to exist, it being one or the other is arbitrary, its not a clean tools/rules thing. A rule has been chosen, a rule is in place. If anything, the idea of being able to balance an entire full treasure chest on what is essentially a horizontally held broom pole and have it stay there in high seas is kinda stupid. As is the breaking of immersion where you run up, clearly wanting to grab the still visible pole and have your pirate think you'd rather stand around looking through a wood crate.

Tools not rules is an answer its just one you arent willing to accept.

Placing stuff on anchor is a defense mechanism when being boarded. It only buys the defender a few seconds, less if outnumbered. I dont see the issur.

A good boarder should have no issue.

Nerfing to make your side of the pvp fight just waters down the experiencep

@schwammlgott said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@hxr141 just saw a picture with an anchor full of filled snake baskets...so that's EVIL

Just need a well placed anchor ball and watch the turntables do their thing

@alienmagi this isn’t a case of cheesing. It’s a valid strat, one that I hate even on my own ship as it makes it harder to catch the anchor and or raise it. That being said it’s a void way to play

@lordqulex said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

How about firing yourself out of the cannon? Is that realistic? Does it break your immersion? How about leaping off of a mountain top and hitting the water at terminal velocity and not breaking every bone in your body, is that realistic? Does it break your immersion?

This is a game and we're talking about the game rules, not things that break your verisimilitude.

Firstly, those are two totally separate issues. Secondly, no, because my immersion is of being a semi-mythical Saturday morning serial pirate of a Jack Sparrow or Captain Blood type, and so things which fit in with that, leaping from the walls of forts into the sea fit perfectly with the story being told, while blundering back and forth unable to touch something that I can clearly see and could clearly touch doesn't. I'm not sure what's confusing or inconsistent about that. Thirdly, again, being able to put a chest on the capstan is a game rule, why does it follow that that game rule is okay, but the opposite isn't?

@shadow20642 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

Tools not rules is an answer its just one you arent willing to accept.

No, its literally not an answer. Do you mean tools not rules as in, yes, remove the rule that allows you to place crates on a capstan so people need to develop the tools to defend it? Or do you mean tools not rules as in, no, don't add in a different rule that stops you being able to place crates and force people to develop the tools to attack without lowering the anchor? I'm perfectly willing to accept either to be honest, but you literally didn't actually put a point of view, you just dumped out a platitude that can mean totally opposite things depending on who says it when.

Placing stuff on anchor is a defense mechanism when being boarded. It only buys the defender a few seconds, less if outnumbered. I dont see the issur.

I guess the issue is that some people think that the capstan was designed to be lowered at a certain rate in a certain fashion for a game balance reason and that messing with that might have questionable effects on the game balance. I imagine that those people think that crate stacking is an exploit that while harmless and possibly unnoticed by the designers up to now they feel might be growing to problematic levels, and they feel driven to raise it as an issue on an open forum, such as this, which seems like a reasonable thing to do. Also, it looks silly.

A good boarder should have no issue.

Then what would be the harm in removing it?

Nerfing to make your side of the pvp fight just waters down the experiencep

Could you explain how exactly you feel that the experience is significantly detracted from by not requiring crews to grub around for crates to plaster all over their capstan until it looks like a wooden box muffin? You seem to suggest that its not an issue and doesn't really make any difference, so how does it water things down precisely?

@shadow20642 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

Tools not rules is an answer its just one you arent willing to accept.

No, its literally not an answer. Do you mean tools not rules as in, yes, remove the rule that allows you to place crates on a capstan so people need to develop the tools to defend it? Or do you mean tools not rules as in, no, don't add in a different rule that stops you being able to place crates and force people to develop the tools to attack without lowering the anchor? I'm perfectly willing to accept either to be honest, but you literally didn't actually put a point of view, you just dumped out a platitude that can mean totally opposite things depending on who says it when.

Placing stuff on anchor is a defense mechanism when being boarded. It only buys the defender a few seconds, less if outnumbered. I dont see the issur.

I guess the issue is that some people think that the capstan was designed to be lowered at a certain rate in a certain fashion for a game balance reason and that messing with that might have questionable effects on the game balance. I imagine that those people think that crate stacking is an exploit that while harmless and possibly unnoticed by the designers up to now they feel might be growing to problematic levels, and they feel driven to raise it as an issue on an open forum, such as this, which seems like a reasonable thing to do. Also, it looks silly.

A good boarder should have no issue.

Then what would be the harm in removing it?

Nerfing to make your side of the pvp fight just waters down the experiencep

Could you explain how exactly you feel that the experience is significantly detracted from by not requiring crews to grub around for crates to plaster all over their capstan until it looks like a wooden box muffin? You seem to suggest that its not an issue and doesn't really make any difference, so how does it water things down precisely?

@gtothefo said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@shadow20642 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

Tools not rules is an answer its just one you arent willing to accept.

No, its literally not an answer. Do you mean tools not rules as in, yes, remove the rule that allows you to place crates on a capstan so people need to develop the tools to defend it? Or do you mean tools not rules as in, no, don't add in a different rule that stops you being able to place crates and force people to develop the tools to attack without lowering the anchor? I'm perfectly willing to accept either to be honest, but you literally didn't actually put a point of view, you just dumped out a platitude that can mean totally opposite things depending on who says it when.

I think its pretty self explanatory what i mean by using that statement.

Over-analyze that all you need to. The meaning is simple. The game is about adding tools instead of imposing rules.

There is no need to stop them placing stuff on the anchor. Its strategic.

You have the tools to repel them and anchor when they respawning.

Impose your will by skill, not a nerf wand.

Tools not rules.
Cant get any simpler than that.

@pumpa-cat said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

If the defender is one player defending against 3 or even 4 other players from boarding, then it's a good tactic to use. I don't care how good you are at repelling boarders, if four players board your ship at the same time, whether they use both ladders simultaneously or skillfully shoot themsleves onto your sloop from cannons, then you are going to struggle to defend yourself, your treasure and your anchor.

Therefore I feel this is a good tactic to use to prevent your anchor from being "attacked".

If all of the people jump off of a ship, they leave their ship vulnerable to anything that you do to it, making it fair and balanced. Also, the defenders still have the advantage because, although the numbers are even, the boarders have to climb up the ladder which is very easily guardable, and they will most likely die, leaving their ship unguarded (this is why you don't see anyone in NAL using this tactic). Also, even if the boarding crew does manage to drop the anchor, the crew of the ship can just catch it after killing the boarder if they are speedy enough with it.

While I do say that this obviously unintentional feature should be removed, I do also think that the anchor could be a little stronger, maybe take more time to lower so that a single quick semi-circle around it couldn't drop it. I think that 1.5x or 2x-ing the time to drop an anchor for everyone could be implemented, and might make boarding a bit more nuanced.

@shadow20642 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

The game is about adding tools instead of imposing rules.

This is not how rare operates. I wish it was. The only situation that comes to mind for me of this occurring is how rare keeps in sword lunging into water allowing for fast travel.

I'm not saying that they take the wrong approach this way, as some things like quickswapping were obviously completely broken (which even I, as a certified two firearm wielding swabbie will admit), but these scenarios tend to demonstrate that this isn't really how rare does things. If they want to make it harder to lower anchors, they should make it harder to lower anchors, not leave in this mess of a system where people stack items to screw with the interact prompt for the anchor drop.

(thinking about it again, other good examples of rare implementing RULES not tools is the removing of animation canceling your bucketing and your shoveling, removing bunnyhopping after missing your sword lunge to keep mobility if you missed, removing silent boarding, removing rowboat boarding on sloops, and many many many more)

@pugawuga216 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@shadow20642 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

The game is about adding tools instead of imposing rules.

This is not how rare operates. I wish it was. The only situation that comes to mind for me of this occurring is how rare keeps in sword lunging into water allowing for fast travel.

I'm not saying that they take the wrong approach this way, as some things like quickswapping were obviously completely broken (which even I, as a certified two firearm wielding swabbie will admit), but these scenarios tend to demonstrate that this isn't really how rare does things. If they want to make it harder to lower anchors, they should make it harder to lower anchors, not leave in this mess of a system where people stack items to screw with the interact prompt for the anchor drop.

(thinking about it again, other good examples of rare implementing RULES not tools is the removing of animation canceling your bucketing and your shoveling, removing bunnyhopping after missing your sword lunge to keep mobility if you missed, removing silent boarding, removing rowboat boarding on sloops, and many many many more)

Those arent rules.
Those are balance ruining bugs.

With the bucketing glitch you could scuttle your ship and bucket fast enough to keep it afloat.

Its still a live service game so they have a duty to tackle such things.

But rare are not going to nerf something that does not need nerfing and the community here have already spoke as to why it is not needed.

Im afraid you are incorrect there.
It very much is tools instead of rules.

Its just rare does not waste its time with stuff that does not need fixing such as the anchor.

Many people here have stated it is not needed to be changed as its strategy.

Using strategy and experiencing bugs are completely different kettles of fish and quite frankly, rare does not care to nerf stuff that does not require a nerf and rightly so.

@pugawuga216 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@pumpa-cat said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

If the defender is one player defending against 3 or even 4 other players from boarding, then it's a good tactic to use. I don't care how good you are at repelling boarders, if four players board your ship at the same time, whether they use both ladders simultaneously or skillfully shoot themsleves onto your sloop from cannons, then you are going to struggle to defend yourself, your treasure and your anchor.

Therefore I feel this is a good tactic to use to prevent your anchor from being "attacked".

If all of the people jump off of a ship, they leave their ship vulnerable to anything that you do to it, making it fair and balanced. Also, the defenders still have the advantage because, although the numbers are even, the boarders have to climb up the ladder which is very easily guardable, and they will most likely die, leaving their ship unguarded (this is why you don't see anyone in NAL using this tactic). Also, even if the boarding crew does manage to drop the anchor, the crew of the ship can just catch it after killing the boarder if they are speedy enough with it.

While I do say that this obviously unintentional feature should be removed, I do also think that the anchor could be a little stronger, maybe take more time to lower so that a single quick semi-circle around it couldn't drop it. I think that 1.5x or 2x-ing the time to drop an anchor for everyone could be implemented, and might make boarding a bit more nuanced.

Yeah I think the answer to this should be similar to what Rare did for taking items from barrels with crates when it's not your ship. Just make it so you have to hold the interact for 4-5 seconds if it is not your ship and you are dropping the anchor.

Agreed.
You shouldn’t be able to place anything on anchor.

@shadow20642 what defines a bug? What you call "using strategy" could apply to literally anything I listed. In my opinion, this is very clearly a bug, as it wasn't intended, just like everything else I listed. While not quite as broken as other bugs that 100% should have been removed, it is still a bug, and nonetheless deserves to be removed and replaced with something less ridiculous and annoying to deal with.

It has never only been tools instead of rules, and in this case it shouldn't be either. I don't know why you're so insistent of keeping this buggy mess of a system in instead of replacing it with something that functions the same while making the over all experience much more smooth for both sides of the encounter, like making drop time just take a little longer.

@pugawuga216 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@shadow20642 what defines a bug? What you call "using strategy" could apply to literally anything I listed. In my opinion, this is very clearly a bug, as it wasn't intended, just like everything else I listed. While not quite as broken as other bugs that 100% should have been removed, it is still a bug, and nonetheless deserves to be removed and replaced with something less ridiculous and annoying to deal with.

It has never only been tools instead of rules, and in this case it shouldn't be either. I don't know why you're so insistent of keeping this buggy mess of a system in instead of replacing it with something that functions the same while making the over all experience much more smooth for both sides of the encounter, like making drop time just take a little longer.

You saying it is a "bug" over and over does not make it so, as you have no authority to make that determination (much less proof from Rare confirming that). That is your OPINION and only that, not a fact by any stretch. You stating that it is "ridiculous" as a justification is proof of that alone. So stop with the stating your OPINION as if it is fact as it most certainly is NOT.

For all you know, this IS an intended feature or one they are allowing to be a exist much like the sword lunge. It is a creative defense against one trick boarders that cannot think of more creative strategies.

@dlchief58 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

You saying it is a "bug" over and over does not make it so, as you have no authority to make that determination (much less proof from Rare confirming that). That is your OPINION and only that, not a fact by any stretch. You stating that it is "ridiculous" as a justification is proof of that alone. So stop with the stating your OPINION as if it is fact as it most certainly is NOT.

For all you know, this IS an intended feature or one they are allowing to be a exist much like the sword lunge. It is a creative defense against one trick boarders that cannot think of more creative strategies.

I did literally call it my opinion...
This is the Sea of Thieves forums, where you are supposed to share your own opinions to try to make the game better
Sorry for caring about the game enough to try to give my feedback to make it in my view a better game I guess?

@crowedhunter said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@dlchief58 Those cataracts must be acting up. They literally started out by saying this was their opinion. Maybe you meant to ask for them to stop saying their opinion because you don't like it.

He does say it is his opinion, yet goes on as if it is a fact in order to justify the removal of this strategy.

@pugawuga216 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@shadow20642 While not quite as broken as other bugs that 100% should have been removed, it is still a bug, and nonetheless deserves to be removed and replaced with something less ridiculous and annoying to deal with.

and here again

I don't know why you're so insistent of keeping this buggy mess of a system in instead of replacing it with something that functions the same while making the over all experience much more smooth for both sides of the encounter, like making drop time just take a little longer.

@crowedhunter said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@dlchief58 Yes, that's how thinking about things works. You build thoughts on top of other thoughts.

No that is how social manipulation works, stating opinions as if they are fact and repeating it continually in order to sway an argument to their side.

@crowedhunter said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@dlchief58 Which you are very familiar with, I'm sure. But I think you may be calling the goose a duck.

So you are also taking part in this disinformation scheme to discredit critics? You are failing by the way.

@dlCHIEF58 @CroweDHunter guys this is a forms about mushroom anchors, prob a good idea to keep it like that.

@pugawuga216 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@dlCHIEF58 @CroweDHunter guys this is a forms about mushroom anchors, prob a good idea to keep it like that.

Which I am doing by calling out false justifications (aka stating opinions as factual reasons) for its removal. I simply pointed out for all we know this IS an intended/allowed feature and not a bug as claimed with no proof to support (yet done so in a matter of fact manner).

Deal with it!

@dlchief58 Please, this forum is about stating your own opinion and then arguing with others about their opinions to try to make the game better in the process and give Rare the best feedback possible.
Argue with my opinion, don't just say "that's just your opinion it isn't fact so it doesn't count".

@crowedhunter said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@dlchief58 Thanks for keeping the streets clean from opinions, chief. I'll wait for Rare to tell me what to think about it like you suggested.

Way to twist things as I NEVER once said that, much less implied anything of the sort.

This is a public forum and ideas are not above being criticized and should be called out when bad faith arguments are made in order to bolster their viewpoint...which I have done. Don't want to be criticized, choose your words more wisely.

@dlchief58 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

This is a public forum and ideas are not above being criticized and should be called out when bad faith arguments are made in order to bolster their viewpoint...which I have done. Don't want to be criticized, choose your words more wisely.

TRUE this forum is about ideas being criticized, so criticize the idea, not the wording behind it.

I feel like anchor mushrooms are a dumb thing and should be taken out too. Its not a fun gameplay tactic.

Maybe rework how dropping the anchor works instead, but I do feel like this should be removed.

This coming from a person who deoes it too, as it gives you an advantage.

@pugawuga216 said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@dlchief58 Please, this forum is about stating your own opinion and then arguing with others about their opinions to try to make the game better in the process and give Rare the best feedback possible.
Argue with my opinion, don't just say "that's just your opinion it isn't fact so it doesn't count".

That isn't what I said, I was calling out your circular logic you used to justify it. Your whole argument is based on opinion yet you try to make it sound factual with your insistence that it is a "bug" and not a planned/allowed feature by Rare (ala Sword Lunge). For all we know, this IS the way Rare meant it or will allow the game to remain (because they may think it is a cool, emergent strategy developed by players using the "tools not rules" mantra of the game).

If it was a big issue, I think Rare would have done something about it already. Especially since you can't stack items on cannons, wheel or the map table, this leads one to conclude this is at the very least an ALLOWED strategy by Rare.

@dlchief58 First of all, I don't think it is a huge issue. I never said that.

Second of all, my argument isn't that it should be removed because it is a bug, but it is that the anchor mushroom thing is annoying and cluncky (in my opinion, oh god I know right) and should be replaced with a smoother system (this is why I refer to it as a bug, but interchange that with "feature" or "strategy" as you would like to).

Also, just because something is in the game and isn't taken out doesn't mean that it is intended by or encouraged by rare. Many other things are in the game that you will get banned for doing, like the ferry bug for hourglass matchmaking. Hell, look at rowboat boarding on sloops. If you looked at that before they made it impossible, you could make the exact same argument, and it had been in the game for years at that point.

Over all, in the state of the game currently, this is such a miniscule problem that it 100% shouldn't get changed before 1000 other things, but I'm just sharing my opinion man. No need to try to deconstruct it.

When boarding is such a common and viable tactic in the meta, I see no problem with crate stacking on the anchor. This is a big case of tools not rules. Anchoring your opponent isn't vital to winning a fight.

In addition, stacking crates on the anchor also prevents the players on the ship from easily using their own anchor. It's a trade-off. Just as there isn't always a reason to anchor the enemy ship in combat, there isn't always a reason to NOT use your own anchor in combat. I've used it numerous times to out-maneuver enemies. I pulled a perfect anchor turn during a fight/chase with a Galleon, and they went flying ahead of me at full speed into a volcano, while I was able to raise anchor and leave before they turned all the way around. Had I stacked crates on my anchor, I wouldn't have been able to do that.

Limiting one's own options in order to also limit the enemy's options is a valid tactic.

@malyartv said in Stop people placing crates on their anchor:

@goldsmen They dont sacrifice anything, there's still points where you can get to anchor but only crew know where they are, when boarder should figure out and sort a puzzle in matter of second which is often impossible and also unfair. Since new mode came in game i see this abuse at daily basis. Its obviously abuse and should be fixed.

Let's say I do know where the super special point is where I can use the anchor. That's only helpful outside of combat, when I have the time to maneuver to the sweet spot and aim just right. That's not going to be very helpful during a fight when I have to act fast. I don't have time to waste on finding that special spot. I have time to act and act NOW. Any second that I'm not spending maneuvering my ship or firing a cannon is a second the enemy has to gain an advantage. Add to that the fact that I'm often sailing solo during combat encounters (my buddy usually drops the rowboat with the loot when we see a ship definitely sailing toward us), I really can't afford to waste time searching through an anchor-muffin to anchor if I need to do so.

Making anchor muffins (as well as getting mad about anchor muffins) is a low-skill tactic. It doesn't win fights, especially against crews of equal or greater skill. A boarder could still just as easily cause chaos for the crew without lowering the anchor. Fighting is about preventing the crew from doing necessary things (cannoning, repairing, etc), not about immobilizing them. Immobilizing the enemy is merely a tactic. And it's easily replaceable with any form of distracting the crew from the important things they need to do.

I have one tool in my tool belt, and that's my ability to outmaneuver and outsail the enemy. I'm not gonna give that up to cover my anchor in loot. But I'm also not going to fault other crews (who may be less experienced) for doing so.

@burnbacon yup