Alienating PC Players.

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    The recent decision to make playing with PC players from the Xbox perspective opt-in or opt-out is something that has made my decision final to uninstall and not play until there is a change. As a PC player that genuinely enjoys the Xbox community and open communications being brought into the PC world with games like SOT, I feel this decision is against what the game is meant to be. I am now put in a situation where in order to get the full community, sandbox, and emergent gameplay effect of the game, I will need to play on an Xbox. Making the game I purchased a waste of money because I do not own an Xbox One.

    Adding the opt-in or opt-out option instead of properly balancing the game to where it matters less, is something that I fully disagree with the design and balance team. This will fully alienate your PC playerbase with low population servers, and eventually die on PC.

    If Rare is committed to this game and the ideas set forth by Microsoft about crossplay, then this change would not happen.

    There is very little issue with PC aim vs controller aim. This idea that using a mouse and keyboard is such a large advantage is entirely based off of image of PC players by Xbox players because there are other balance approaches to solve these problems. I find it a little ironic that the update stream was started by saying you're going to find and ban people who marginalize others, and go right ahead and marginalize a minority of your current playerbase through an opt-in opt-out UI component.

    This idea is the main reason I'm completely giving up on the game, and only shows to me that Rare doesn't actually care about the health of the game, but instead only cares about the image of their game. So much so, they're willing to further marginalize and separate a small but significant portion of their players.

    It's sad to see this decision, and I hope that the developers read this to understand that this isn't what everyone wants, and those that are vocal about the separation are simply misinformed about crossplay. I've enjoyed the time I've played, and hope to enjoy more if this decision is changed.

    Thank you,

    Modern Inferno

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    @modern-inferno a bit of an overreaction. But this thread will be locked for the mega thread in about 10 minutes anyway. Bye.

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    @haydnsym45 Wait, what about my feedback is an overreaction? What rule did I break for the thread to be locked?

    I thought I wrote my feelings on the topic in the most professional way possible. Do you just disagree with me or is there something that's factually incorrect?

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    Rare seem to cater to the loud minority. Especially those that are brand new to the game.

    Us OGs are still here. I don't plan to leave SoT, but I get where you are coming from.

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    @modern-inferno they’re locking all the threads about crossplay that aren’t in the mega thread so nothing personal.

    Uninstalling before you actually see a difference - they don’t even have a firm date yet to impliment - and seems like your actual experience will likely not change significantly... that is the overreaction. Maybe give the new crossplay option a chance?

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    @dislex-fx I appreciate that, I just wanted my view on the topic to be visible in some way, since it does seem to be a vocal minority, at least with everyone I know that plays. Not really sure where the best place is to voice my opinion on the topic. :P

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    This decision has made me come back to the game when the update is out. So yay. It should've been there from the start.

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    @haydnsym45 The reason for uninstalling because of the announcement is meant to show an effect. There are metrics to show these things, and I will not reward this type of action so I want it to show in the metrics.

    On the impact on gameplay front, I already see very slow or empty servers. I want to be able to play with people on both systems because it's simply more fun. I love chatting with the xbox dudes and playing with them. They're a tad more casual and I love to show them cool things. I'm a pretty casual player too, but typically a little more in touch with cool tricks and fun things to do since I can just tab out and look something up.

    Once you put this sort of feature in the game, then it'll actually be harder to take out because people will rely on it. So, the 'try it out' argument is faulty and only rewards those that want to be separated.

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    @x1-two That's a fair perspective for sure. I understand it can be frustrating to be killed by someone who can aim better, etc. I just don't understand the argument because there will always be people who are better than you and me, no matter what peripherals they're using to play.

    It'll always be frustrating to die and lose your stuff, but you can always do your best to turn in between voyages instead of hoarding until you get killed and sunk. If you're getting grief'd and hunted you can just switch servers. Yes, you lose some stuff but the beauty of this game isn't just the loot and money you get, it's the experience with others. Whether they're Xbox or PC, I've pretty much only run into awesome people.

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    @modern-inferno this has all been debated in the mega. The sky isn’t falling... the servers will remain populated etc. Maybe go read all the news for yourself instead of buying into the hype.

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    @modern-inferno The main issue is that even if two players are completely equally skilled, the PC player will win because of the hardware. A console player can't select 60 fps. Or 120. I'd love to play at 1080p/60 on One X, but it's not possible. I play on PC and console, SoT is vastly better on PC. And it's not about mouse and keyboard, I use an Xbox One controller on both. But I am much better on PC. Clearly it's not a matter of skill, it's about unfair advantages.

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    @haydnsym45 I watched the update video, is there more to read on outside of misinformed people on both sides complaining to eachother?

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    @x1-two I actually responded to this type of argument in another thread to you. Please check your notifications.

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    Yea i've started to have a somekind of hatred towards the xboxusers now, this was the last poo-poo in the locker for me.
    They have called me cheating, modder pc bästard because i just play on PC and this crossplay disable ability will now make me feel the same about them.
    But i will feel that they are whiny uglyword, it's a shame...thank you RARE. Hope you're satisfied now.

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    its optional, the only reason people have to be mad about this is that it wont be as easy to win every fight, and they are affraid the seas will be empty, wich isnt true. unless your australian, who knows. us aussies already get put on us servers sometimes

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    @modern-inferno using keyboard and mouse does have a large advantage, have you ever tried using an xbox controller to aim without aim assist, its pretty bad, on pc you can controll your sensitivity by moving your wrist or arm slower or faster. pc is able to adapt to certain situations and it makes it easy to control.

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    @d4m0r3d What's the argument to not having aim assist? Is that frowned upon or something? Why is it not in the game?

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    I believe this post belongs in the mega thread, where it will be drowned out by the barrage of other posts.

    Also, server migration should still keep the seas populated regardless of which platform you play on, unless there are only 5 pc players left in the world.

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    @reapinglegion My brother and I have been accused of being cheaters, modders etc on many occasions. It’s not like pc players are angels, I’ve read a myriad of trash talking via quick chat from other boats. Something tells me they were pc players...

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    Im concerned but not entirely defeatist on the issue,they will be releasing numbers for the player pool.I am hoping they address the issue with server merges and empty crew slots sometime soon.

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    i agree with this fully @modern-inferno these "updates" seem to drop my hopes down more and more the fact that i loved what i saw b4 this game was out for the public and back when streamers/youtubers would play the beta and see those experiences they had was what drivin me to get it in the first place since day 1 but slowly the devs been stripping that away for "pc players" as if we are looked down upon..

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    @haydnsym45 although im one for giving chances this seems to much of a risk for us PC Players. Like you and many others i love the community this game has created and share the enjoyable experiences and having all that being wagered into someones hands to be gone from the game is a scary thought bc that was what mainly drivin me to get this game when it first launched in day 1. I dont own an xbox and it would be such a disappointment that if i want to still keep having those experiences id have to buy an xbox...

    think about it as if its you in that position instead is what im getting across, the "what if" this goes for the wrong turn of events the game will be ruined for PC players

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    @d4m0r3d You are remarkably naive on human behaviour if you think that making something optional, something that many of the Xbox players will believe will make their games easier, means that only a limited number of players will select it. They have nothing to lose (other than the ability to play with PC friends) in selecting to not play with PC players, i.e. the majority of Xbox players are incentivised to enable the option.

    Personally I think that Rare may in enabling this option have effectively killed the game (at least in my region) for PC players. Now I will stick around to see if that is how things actually play out, but I am deeply worried about it. For the last few months, at least for the time of day that I play, there has been an ever decreasing number of ships encountered - this could make that even worse.

    I don't want this game to die.

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    @d4m0r3d said in Alienating PC Players.:

    its optional, the only reason people have to be mad about this is that it wont be as easy to win every fight, and they are affraid the seas will be empty, wich isnt true. unless your australian, who knows. us aussies already get put on us servers sometimes

    Long queue time and lots of server migration is in store for PC users... That's the problem, not the hurrdurr ezpz win.

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    its not alienating if people who use mouse and keyboard on xbox are forced into crossplay. im 90% sure its controller based so pc players just have to use a controller instead

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    @they-sank It's assumptions like that, that is making this conversation toxic. It's your perceived image of PC players that the problem and you assumption that the toxic ones are PC, not some KBM issue.

    Re-think your assumptions.

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    @ajm123 That is the type of solution that would also alienate the players that play with KBM on Xbox as well. Not sure that your solution would help anything.

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    @modern-inferno oh I’ve received plenty of trash talking via xbox live messages as well. xbox players are also capable of trash talking, it just takes longer to type out lol

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    @squaz05 long que times nah i dont think so, maybe more server migration, but then again it could also be less. i feel like more pc players are adults who dont have bed times or time restrictions for playing the game ya know. feel like alot of xbox players get off cause they are told to

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    I'm an Xbox player with a controller, and even I think the direction that Rare is taking happens to be a strange one. While I don't necessarily have an alternative solution to the issue of balance, I certainly think they could have done better than what they are planning.

    It may be of little solace to those of you on PC, but I for 1 will NOT be disabling the crossplay.

    Q: If I enable crossplay, but a crewmate disables it, how does that work out?