@admiral-greyjoy Honestly... (realistically) the only way pirates were able to climb aboard a moving ship... was grappling hooks.

So when they add grappling hooks to the game.. they can also change the feature so you can raise/lower the ladder. its just risky for yourself since you cannot get back on your ship is all.

I can & do sail galleons by myself & no you may not board. This is a problem pertaining to your skill level & your crews teamwork/coordination abilities & has zero to do with game mechanics.

A) there is a loud audio cue when someone exits the water to board your ladder. Shoot them.

B) Do Not chase in a straight line as it makes boarding much easier

@nayfe-pacewell said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

Watch your ladders. Plain and simple.

A boarder is most vulnerable on the ladder. Getting on it is noisy, mermaids give them away and they cant do a thing till they've stood up right on the ladder.

You have ample opportunity to prevent a boarding and it's easy to know one is coming IF YOU PAY THE ADEQUATE ATTENTION. If you don't it's you and your crews fault..

What amazes me is how the real issue just flies over people’s heads. It’s not about the ease of ladder guarding, which I would agree with you on.

It’s about people being able to run and attempt to board the ladder 1000 times without any repercussion for dying, and if you simply miss you have a free mermaid teleporter waiting for you so that even if you crew made a bad turn and let the chasing ship catch up, your back in your ship via teleporter or a short trip on the ferry.

They can fix this in a lot of way by adding time for consecutive deaths before respawn, only allowing the mermaid every so often, or the ability to raise ladders, or by adding in all of the above, which given the lack of content and sandbox tools and elements in this sandbox game is what I would suggest.

On a forum for feedback to improve and continue development, giving advice on how to deal with current mechanics has no point, except to keep the game unchanged.

This post is to discuss how to improve the game with the suggested mechanic.

It’s funny to me that nobody has any real point as to why adding it would be bad, just that anyone who suggests this change must be bad at guarding ladders. No that’s just not ship combat and just draws out ship combat into a not very fun chase. Escaping a chase should be about your skill at the helm and positioning the ship, not being able to climb up a moving ships ladder and die over and over or take a mermaid over and over without penalty. And I say this from the perspective of the guy who has done this both offensively by cannon shooting and sword lunging and defensively since the first 1000 players were invited to the alpha and I was lucky enough to be one of them. I can guard ladders just fine, it’s just a bad design to give such an edge to ships that literally just want to run away without playing the game imo. I know that it’s fair game to run and people can do this but there should be something done about endless suicide boarding/mermaid teleporter use.

If we don’t value our players lives or that we have to stay on the ship then the game has no risk or meaning when you do accomplish things like board and kill a crew, etc.

Just cover the capstan with cages/seafarer chests. That's it. It solves all the problems. It works too well. Players who actually manage to get aboard fumble trying to get at the anchor through all the junk and they get killed.

Watch your ladders. Plain and simple.

A boarder is most vulnerable on the ladder. Getting on it is noisy, mermaids give them away and they cant do a thing till they've stood up right on the ladder.

You have ample opportunity to prevent a boarding and it's easy to know one is coming IF YOU PAY THE ADEQUATE ATTENTION. If you don't it's you and your crews fault..

@a-cranky-eskimo Apology accepted. Cheers mate. :o)
It's unfortunate that we can't show body language or tone in online text messages or comments and often mistake the intent of others.

Whilst I personally don't agree with this particular suggestion, it's all good. A healthy discussion such as this or any idea brings out some great alternatives or at least different perspectives that we, ourselves, may not have considered.

@admiral-rrrsole said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

@a-cranky-eskimo said

You know exactly what I mean but ok I’ll explain it just for the sake of my argument being relevant rather than falling into being trolled.

Excuse me but no, I didn't know your made up terminology for ship boarding, being "mermaid teleport ladder boarding". It's the first I've ever heard of it and I'm most likely not the only one.
I wasn't being a smart a**e, I wouldn't have asked politely if that were the case and I'd appreciate if you extended the same courtesy.

I’m fine with people attempting to board by ladder, but being able to use a mermaid teleporter to continually throw yourself at a ship with no consequences for death and you get right back on your ship.. to continue helping run away... yeah that’s great pirate combat and great design of a pirate game right there l**o.....

We all know having a timer for the mermaid would make crews think and weigh the decision of jumping overboard a second time when they know they don’t have mermaid backup for a few minutes and therefore can’t return to help sail immediately.

I guess I should stop trying to make this game anything but a Vr chat with the depth a 5 year old would enjoy though, because I can write my thoughts and explain them and people still just make vague comments with no point instead of trying to motivate rare to do anything. It’s always good enough for the people on these forums. Well this forum is for feedback for continued development, so I’ll be here trying to actually do that instead of always shooting down ideas just because people don’t want to have to relearn anything.

If you actually go through my posts you'll find that I encourage more ideas than I shoot down. In fact I've suggested many new ideas on these forums and helped build other ideas with minor tweaks or alternatives.

We've had a similar suggestion to roll-up the ladders a few months ago.
Trust me when I say PvP is my weak suit. I play with a ping in excess of 300 and only 15 - 20 fps. Once anyone has boarded my ship I am almost certain to lose the fight.

So yes, rolling up or somehow blocking ladders would play in my favour. But as someone has pointed out, boarding a ship is a means to end hours of useless time wasting chases.
Without access to ladders you might as well take away any other form of PvP.
And until Rare makes changes to ladders (if ever) then I have already offered helpful advice. Not once was I being sarcastic or rude.

Ok well i apologize then but my opinion on the topic is still the same, but my bad for saying that you were trolling me, the other stuff was just general statements about the forum, have a good one.

@a-cranky-eskimo said

You know exactly what I mean but ok I’ll explain it just for the sake of my argument being relevant rather than falling into being trolled.

Excuse me but no, I didn't know your made up terminology for ship boarding, being "mermaid teleport ladder boarding". It's the first I've ever heard of it and I'm most likely not the only one.
I wasn't being a smart a**e, I wouldn't have asked politely if that were the case and I'd appreciate if you extended the same courtesy.

I’m fine with people attempting to board by ladder, but being able to use a mermaid teleporter to continually throw yourself at a ship with no consequences for death and you get right back on your ship.. to continue helping run away... yeah that’s great pirate combat and great design of a pirate game right there l**o.....

We all know having a timer for the mermaid would make crews think and weigh the decision of jumping overboard a second time when they know they don’t have mermaid backup for a few minutes and therefore can’t return to help sail immediately.

I guess I should stop trying to make this game anything but a Vr chat with the depth a 5 year old would enjoy though, because I can write my thoughts and explain them and people still just make vague comments with no point instead of trying to motivate rare to do anything. It’s always good enough for the people on these forums. Well this forum is for feedback for continued development, so I’ll be here trying to actually do that instead of always shooting down ideas just because people don’t want to have to relearn anything.

If you actually go through my posts you'll find that I encourage more ideas than I shoot down. In fact I've suggested many new ideas on these forums and helped build other ideas with minor tweaks or alternatives.

We've had a similar suggestion to roll-up the ladders a few months ago.
Trust me when I say PvP is my weak suit. I play with a ping in excess of 300 and only 15 - 20 fps. Once anyone has boarded my ship I am almost certain to lose the fight.

So yes, rolling up or somehow blocking ladders would play in my favour. But as someone has pointed out, boarding a ship is a means to end hours of useless time wasting chases.
Without access to ladders you might as well take away any other form of PvP.
And until Rare makes changes to ladders (if ever) then I have already offered helpful advice. Not once was I being sarcastic or rude.

@nofears-fun I hear what your saying too but I don’t suggest these things because I simply don’t like what happens to me when I interact with them, like I said on another thread, I pretty much invented both sides of ladder boarding when testing the game as one of the first 1000 alpha testers and 1st wave pioneer (not really invented but you get what I mean) I can guard a ladder and have sunk many a ship by boarding when being chased and by boarding using the sword lung when chased, and I agree that pvp is hampered by crossplay imbalance, but for me that just means avoiding CQC except when throwing a life away to drop anchors with those players and I can still win most of the time.

The game needs to evolve and our strategies along with it, and beyond that I think a pve server for people who hate the pvp but actually like the pve isn’t a bad idea.. just cap levels at 25 so you have to face pvp to become a legend, and have gold returns be less than the pvp servers.

As for the skelly ships I like them except for how the stupid cursed cannonballs stunlock people like that is fun. If they could design better ai they wouldn’t have to use bad mechanics like that to increase difficulty. And when I say bad Ai I mean the ships aswell as the SkelEtons. You can get them caught on rocks and the way they turn is unrealistic and looks like they are on some sort of track more than actually being turned.

That’s not to say I didn’t have fun for a couple hours with the ships, but this game needs additions and changes that just make the game fun to play even weeks after an update, that imo is the epitome of a true sandbox game. This game has yet to accomplish that in any definitive way.

@a-cranky-eskimo I get it, and respect your opinion as well. But I do like the content, not necessarily the three factions and athena quests, but I Love the skelly ships. I mean if you can't find fun in those battles, which are way more realistic and intense than any pvp, then I am not sure what to say. To often I have been forced to pvp, and generally I can win 50% of the time if I am not facing a PC player. But if facing someone on PC, and you can tell the difference, then I am more like 5% success rate. Sadly, this makes most of us none pc players want to avoid pvp.

I think that removing the ladder because it makes going after someone harder is about the same argument as saying I want a pve server only. The game was designed for both pvp and pve. So we should expect both and accept the fact that we won't like some of the tactics and tools others use against us if we feel they have an advantage over us because of it.

@nofears-fun this just speaks to the larger issues the game needs to deal with, like the fact that a crew can decide to keep coming back even when sunk.

I don’t really see how the pve content will keep you playing, this is a sandbox game so I expect hours of diverse gameplay, the pve is certainly not that, it’s as repetitive and as fetch quest esque as can be.

I respect your opinion that you like the pve but for me the pve is just a means to create reasons for the pvp to be more than an arena game. We certainly spawn back and can engage in fights like it’s an arena game. I know that it’s not but a better solution than buffing/defending tactics like running and dropping people’s anchors, there should be more finality to the combat rather than it being so defense oriented but people can still relentlessly attack, it just wastes time and is boring at a point. And when the pve is already boring there isn’t much game left to enjoy.

@a-cranky-eskimo I think that your point is valid, but also a bad idea. I did upvote your post, but have rethought that. On many occasions I have had people that wanted to pvp, and I simply didn't want to. I was there for the pve content that day. Well, the pvp player chases you around, endlessly. You have crates for merchants that you simply don't want to lose, or any other reason you just don't want to play pvp that day. The only defense you have to avoid actual naval combat is the ladder/anchor.

Yes, I know, get better at pvp, but fact is I don't have to if I don't want to. I love the pve content in this game. And while this game does have and allow pvp, despite popular opinion it is not just a pvp game. Pvp is just one element of this game, proven by the growing amount of pve content.

And yes, having the ladder open has also back fired on me when chasing over even running away from an encounter. But that doesn't change the fact that it is a viable option in a combat situation.

The boarding fiasco made pvp cheesy i agree, a timer on the mermaid no thanks but why not options to retract the ladder on the ship since you already get a mermaid port if your too far from the ship when overboard the game needs alot of fixes still I agree it still looks and feels like a technical alpha to me.

@mich2mars said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

@a-cranky-eskimo Sorry I felt like beeing patronizing if I gave you (obvious imo) examples,
let's say a sniper skellie or a canonball shoot you off the boat more than once during a skellie ship fight or a meg bite.
What would happen with a timer on mermaids?
Leaving you no choice but to die, which boarders successfull or not, do anyways.
Hence my question, do you really think putting a timer on mermaids would solve any problems more than it would create them?

That depends on what you think a problem is. I think getting knocked overboard by cannonballs should be nerfed too, I’m not saying this one change will fix everything but people being able to endlessly suicide board with a mermaid teleporter to back them up should they fail is stupid. Having a timer would force crews to try harder to stay aboard the ship, which now has no meaning. You can jump overboard and drop anchor or miss the ladder ten times and still be back in time to help bail and repair.

Rather than anyone winning we all just lose because it’s a waste of time, the game is supposed to be about the fun of playing and if ship combat is basically running and boarding or boarding to spawn kill to prevent repairs and bailing because the bucket is op.... the game needs a lot of fixes, and I’m sure if they did this I would sink more often than I have in my extensive amount of time playing this game, but that would be better than the gameplay being overly defense and escape oriented and therefore not very fun.

@skullmanbeard said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

Personally i dont mind boarding and being boarded. Its an exciting moment. Whatever they do its always going to be fun and the pirate game we know.

Me neither except that there is no penalty for throwing your life away repeatedly just to run away. It’s not fun after an hour..

@a-cranky-eskimo Sorry I felt like beeing patronizing if I gave you (obvious imo) examples,
let's say a sniper skellie or a canonball shoot you off the boat more than once during a skellie ship fight or a meg bite.
What would happen with a timer on mermaids?
Leaving you no choice but to die, which boarders successfull or not, do anyways.
Hence my question, do you really think putting a timer on mermaids would solve any problems more than it would create them -edit-"buddy"?

@skullmanbeard said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

@a-cranky-eskimo
Again i agree that pirates should have to think a little harder then just jumping. A mer timer could be work Make them consider not jumping. I just feel like blocking ladders is taking mechanics away when we instead can add mechanics that allow for more possibilities. They board GREAT lets brig em arrrr. Mer timer and brig enemy is just so much more game expanding and fun then blocking ladder which u can already do just fine.

My point is that I would like to see both the addition of ladder retraction, brig usage, mermaid teleporter limits, and much more.

Like I said just the barrel retrieval is a reason why ladders won’t always be up, and I bet some crews will prefer to just kill them on the ladder anyways so that they have a slightly better chance of catching up by sailing better.

The game needs more depth in all areas and ship utility and variety of possibility when it comes to ship combat is desperately needed to keep people like me playing the game.

@skullmanbeard said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

A mermaid timer could make for more thought out plans and ideas. Also a brigging enemy possibilty for coming on ur ship. Like a knock or 2 in head with shovel and u can put in brig for max of 5 minutes. Then respawns back to ship. Maybe a tough lock pick mini game or the crew can rescue them. A loud metal door sound if he escapes. There is much more thought that can go into other interesting mechanics then just raising blocking ladder that seems like a cop-out and if you don't think that well that's your problem. I can agree with mermaid timers and a brigging possibility for those boarders that always try to board.

The real issue I have with ladder boarding and not being able to raise them is because players can just throw their lives away to drop anchor and respawn on their ship right away, and if they fail they can take the mermaid right away every time. It’s terrible game design. Either make multiple deaths in a row add time to the ferry (there are supposed to be activities there according to Rare before launch) or make the mermaid have a timer, but beyond that I still don’t see the huge problem with people being able to raise ladders.

And no we won’t complain about getting bombed because that actually provides some decisions to be made. People don’t have unlimited powder kegs and it literally provides the same ship maneuvering gameplay to avoid barrels as it is for boarders, and you could even jump off the bowsprit and catch your own ladder after grabbing the barrel, which would provide a reason to not always have ladders raised.

I swear most people that shoot down ideas don’t even think about what a change would entail. Not you but most other replies. They just have it in their head that ladder raising is bad (likely because rare said they tested it and didn’t like it, and this forum is filled with people defending anything rare does) fact is that this game is sorely lacking in a lot of areas and the one thing they have that they should embrace improving upon is ship utility and combat depth. They don’t seem to want to do much but add in a bunch of random pve stuff, and leave the pvp playing field as it is, which imo is a huge mistake given the quality of the pve content and how it dosnt have much replayability beyond when pve mixes with pvp.

@m1sterpunch said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

So you're chasing a ship and they send boarders behind to drop your anchor and you're complaining that you're the one that's at the disadvantage?

You are the aggressor. This is literally their only means of defence besides stopping and engaging you which is a bad idea if they have anything of value as it's a no risk for you, high risk for them. Unless they had kegs aboard, their only options are maneuvering with the wind or around obstacles or to slow and hinder you the best they can until you sink or give up.

How terrible that would be in a pirate game to force players to engage to earn their treasure rather than the meta being running away and using unlimited lives and mermaid teleporters lol.... you said it yourself there are barrels and maneuvering, and I would say they should add the ability to trade cannon placements at the shipwright, the sloop could trade for an aft gun for when chased being the slowest ship, galleon could trade multiple cannons for one forward cannon, brig can trade for either. There now players have more defense when running, and could still ladder board if mermaids had a timer just not endlessly.

As a solo sloop I will aim into the wind, drop back and try and board, I will hit the anchor then kill you while you attempt to raise. If you do get it up and I still kill you I will reload, steal your supplies and steer your ship into the closest rock. Then drop your anchor again when you spawn. I'll either wait until you sink or you kill me and i'm back aboard my ship.

At no point does this game need retractable ladders. Boarding is necessary for sinking a ship as it should be. Learn to guard ladders or maybe stop chasing ships you can't catch?

How is boarding supposed to be a completely necessary part of ship combat im fine with it being a part of it especially if they added tow ropes or grappling ropes to board, or sail and mast damage, etc. it’s like you guys take the idea of raising ladders real personal because you have success ladder boarding...

Well guess what guys, I was one of the first 1000 alpha testers and I pretty much invented ladder boarding in both offensive and defensive scenarios, and I’m still here asking for rare to improve the game... adding in more variables like raisable ladders or having to remember how long to your next mermaid are unarguably improvements to the bland and repetitive ship combat we have now that is more like ship evasion or boarding and spawn killing than any sort of tactical ship combat.

Funny part is if they do change this I bet half of you guys post on the release notes licking their boots about it. Whatever they do is good enough and asking for more or better mechanics means your entitled on this forum, I’m used to the deluge of posts that seemingly only exist to keep the game unchanged and from making progress.

@admiral-rrrsole said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

I'm sorry @a-cranky-eskimo I don't have a clue of what you mean by....

I can’t possibly believe that you guys really think this mermaid teleport ladder boarding turtling is good design...

Maybe I'm too old but what the bloody hell is "mermaid teleport ladder boarding"?

You know exactly what I mean but ok I’ll explain it just for the sake of my argument being relevant rather than falling into being trolled.

I’m fine with people attempting to board by ladder, but being able to use a mermaid teleporter to continually throw yourself at a ship with no consequences for death and you get right back on your ship.. to continue helping run away... yeah that’s great pirate combat and great design of a pirate game right there l**o.....

We all know having a timer for the mermaid would make crews think and weigh the decision of jumping overboard a second time when they know they don’t have mermaid backup for a few minutes and therefore can’t return to help sail immediately.

I guess I should stop trying to make this game anything but a Vr chat with the depth a 5 year old would enjoy though, because I can write my thoughts and explain them and people still just make vague comments with no point instead of trying to motivate rare to do anything. It’s always good enough for the people on these forums. Well this forum is for feedback for continued development, so I’ll be here trying to actually do that instead of always shooting down ideas just because people don’t want to have to relearn anything.

I’ll say it again, if anyone thinks this endless ladder boarding mermaid teleporter running and turtling of ship combat is good design, they need to wake up.

@mich2mars said in Placing boards over ladders at the side of the ship:

@a-cranky-eskimo You talk about "flawed gameplay design" and the solution you come with is putting a "timer" on mermaids!?!
Have you really thought of the consequences of this?

Can you explain some negative ones lol??? No just trying to say I didn’t think? No that was rare who rarely thinks buddy...

So you're chasing a ship and they send boarders behind to drop your anchor and you're complaining that you're the one that's at the disadvantage?

You are the aggressor. This is literally their only means of defence besides stopping and engaging you which is a bad idea if they have anything of value as it's a no risk for you, high risk for them. Unless they had kegs aboard, their only options are maneuvering with the wind or around obstacles or to slow and hinder you the best they can until you sink or give up.

As a solo sloop I will aim into the wind, drop back and try and board, I will hit the anchor then kill you while you attempt to raise. If you do get it up and I still kill you I will reload, steal your supplies and steer your ship into the closest rock. Then drop your anchor again when you spawn. I'll either wait until you sink or you kill me and i'm back aboard my ship.

At no point does this game need retractable ladders. Boarding is necessary for sinking a ship as it should be. Learn to guard ladders or maybe stop chasing ships you can't catch?

Ohhh we SO needed "Dislike" function for topics like this.
10 guys telling 1 guy - man thats will not work, think about consequences, place yourself on oposite site.
Nope not gonna happen he just not listening.

@a-cranky-eskimo
Boarding is the only way for people who don't want to PvP or just want to get their loot safe, to actually stop people from chasing. Or atleast give them the time to finish what they are doing.

If you take the boarding out, chases will be endless. It will just be two ships sailing behind each other. One is sailing away and wants to lose the other ship, one is just endlessly chasing not caring that he doesn't gain distance.

Taking boarding out by giving people the option to sail with ladders up, which will always be up if this would be introduced because why leave it down, will not improve PvP. It will just become and endless cat and mouse game.

Understand that if somebody tries to board, they are down a crewmate. This is your time to catch up, you have a timeframe where one of their crewmates is in the water and you have an advantage. Use that advantage.

And me and others are not saying 'git gud', we're telling them about features in this game that can help them with their situation. Because apparently there are people, like OP, who have no idea about the sound clues etc.