I tend to re roll a lot of my voyages of late looking for the optimal time spent for xp/gold return and have noticed a lot more of the missions in question.

Do you notice the voyages get much much better (like back on par with what you are expecting at a higher level) if you do 1 of the not so great voyages? This is the case for me almost every time i'm affected by this poor RNG for Merchant missions.

This is indicative of a mechanical level deficiency in SoT. The game simply needs more to do. Instead the voyages (as they currently function) are glorified lottos for repetitive fetch quests.

One could easily imagine a better scenario in which the merchant voyages were not just selections between three animal types of different colors, and instead involved catching animals of various sizes/types and involving varying degrees of teamwork/skill. Alas, we have this system...

legendary merchant voyages don't look any different either. oce you hit lvl 30/35 they are all the same with the same payouts

I would like to know when they will add all the other crates

I would like to know when they will add all the other crates to missions

I would like to know when they will add all the other crates in missions

Athena voyages are rough but they do pay well and give lots of xp in all factions. You get about 20-30k per Athena voyage, if you decide to collect all the loot.

@dyornos

Are you buying the upgraded quest lines from the merchants?

@dyornos said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

Cancelling quests until you have one that's worth doing doesn't sound like good game design to me. Hope they tweak this..

it really only works for alliance quests. its the only one that tells you what you are getting before you start. it would be unlikely to remove the feature of cancelling an alliance voyage. say you lose your crates to being sunk the only way to continue is leave the game or be able to buy the crates back but then you would have to limit how much you could buy them back, otherwise just keep purchasing and collecting animals

your level 20 friend won't get 4 gold chickens, either.

just cancel it and move on. if you run out of quests, logoff, repeat.

@lefaux2 said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

@dyornos said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

I think the crates of tea and spices are very underused, because merchant alliance could have been much more than it is now.

I'd consider those the equivalent to chest of 1000 grogs and chest of sorrow.
Although you don't really dig up merchant chests.

I think MA doesn't have the "thrill" moments (like digging up a chest or killing a skelly captain) because you know in advance what you get.
That takes parts of the excitement away.

OTOH: if you are angry now, I will try to stay away from you once you start doing your 10th legendary trip :D

Yeah they have alot of things they could improve upon.

I'm a pirate, legend voyages bring in alot of gold so I dont mind :P Yesterday joined a galleon who was doing one, so many good stuff!

@dyornos said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

I think the crates of tea and spices are very underused, because merchant alliance could have been much more than it is now.

I'd consider those the equivalent to chest of 1000 grogs and chest of sorrow.
Although you don't really dig up merchant chests.

I think MA doesn't have the "thrill" moments (like digging up a chest or killing a skelly captain) because you know in advance what you get.
That takes parts of the excitement away.

OTOH: if you are angry now, I will try to stay away from you once you start doing your 10th legendary trip :D

@lefaux2 It's okay, discussions can get heated :)

Yes you are right in the fact that 6 trips without a golden would be a waste. The thing is that I think the problem lies in the whole system overal. Because we are doing the same thing from 1 to 50, the only way to give us some difference in voyages are different animals and tiers. I think the crates of tea and spices are very underused, because merchant alliance could have been much more than it is now.

Having said that, I think its also more of a disapointing factor of seeing those voyages at such high levels. We are used to other games giving us more value when we level up. This game has no clear increase, it's all numbers that go into a RNG formula. This is why I don't feel that happy when I reach 40 or 45, since it doesn't feel different in any way. I was hoping for more of a ''level 20, popup saying you unlocked mythical chest voyages!'', instead of having a chance of getting one.

In the end, I'm almost level 45 so should be a smooth ride from there on out (I hope), but still for others who reach the 40 mark, it can be very brutal or very smooth, its all a matter of RNG.

@austerflamme2 said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

But it is still frustrating to draw most of the time on lvl 47 quests like 1 keg; 1 black.

Wait until you pay 200g for a level50 with just one keg :D
But in the end to me this is like real life... win some, lose some.
If all level 50 trips were sure shots, leveling mates would be rather dull.
I love the Vegas-Style "c'mon, daddy needs goldens" moment :D

I didn't even knew that there quest exist with 6 GOLDEN animals. The most i hat for an quest was 4 and that ca 5 times up to my lvl?

We have that in our data at about 2%.
About half of those are ineffective setups, though, so meaning snakes, pigs and chickens.
Given travel times, doing 3-4 golden + 3-6 blacks with two kinds of goods is a lot more efficient because you eliminate the travel time between islands.

The best zone to be in is Golden Sands - Sanctuary because Cannon Cove is very close by, has a decent size (6 animal spawn points) and due to the good weather can be defended quite well (aka you can spot incoming vessels over a long distance).

@dyornos said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

@lefaux2 Than don't argue like one with all your ''dont argue math, you will lose :) keep whining ;) ;)'' comments. I'm trying to have a normal discussion

That's fair, I apologize.

I know the rules of the system, and I'm saying they are flawed.

That's a legit opinion to have.
I'd like to share why I disagree, maybe it changes your mind a bit, maybe not.
We know the RNG allows to proc "upwards".
So as a low level player you can have that lucky shot. I think this is in the game to motivate people.
The options available in terms of balance are to either increase leveling speed across the board by increasing the amount of higher-tier stuff or to demotivate people starting their journeys by not getting procs into the upper tiers.
Personally, I think neither is a valid option, because you can't satisfy both.

Last red chicken at 47? I don't care about reds or whites, as long as there are at least 2 or 3 goldens in there aswell. That's what I want, not having to spend 160 or 180 gold for a trash voyage so I can try again. I'm wasting gold this way.

Goldens give you about 5-7% of a level (that one is a bit hard to tell exactly, I just measured pixels in the reputation screen).
So handing in 20 goldens will give you a full level (which is too fast IMO, if you'd add a... let's call it "safe bet" onto a couple of goldens).

In regards to wasting gold, the numbers are not that bad.
Goldens proc between 1000 and 2000g.
So you only really lose gold if you have 6 trips without any golden - which we never came across in our tests.

What I found interesting (and this is what you kind of support) is that I am under the impression that getting from 40+ to 45+ felt the longest.
45 to 50 felt blazingly fast, a little too fast for my taste.
But that could be because by level 46 or so we got a grasp on the system and started to fully use it to our advantage.

@lefaux2
thx for your informations, especially about that with the overall crew lvl count. Interesting i never understood wat kind of logic is behind it.

But it is still frustrating to draw most of the time on lvl 47 quests like 1 keg; 1 black. I didn't even knew that there quest exist with 6 GOLDEN animals. The most i hat for an quest was 4 and that ca 5 times up to my lvl?

@lefaux2 Than don't argue like one with all your ''dont argue math, you will lose :) keep whining ;) ;)'' comments. I'm trying to have a normal discussion, if your going to begin with stuff like that than I'm not going to take you to seriously anymore.

I know the rules of the system, and I'm saying they are flawed. Last red chicken at 47? I don't care about reds or whites, as long as there are at least 2 or 3 goldens in there aswell. That's what I want, not having to spend 160 or 180 gold for a trash voyage so I can try again. I'm wasting gold this way.

Lastly, don't feel attacked or anything. It's my opinion and I'm angry about it, but that anger is not meant towards you. So if you feel like I'm attacking you, I'm not. I'm defending my case which I want fixed.

@dyornos said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

You claim to have this data, and even if you have it, still doesn't change the fact that there are people who experience different outcomes.

Of course people experience a different outcome.
That's all I'm trying to explain to you.
Yes, voyages are to a degree random.
I'm trying to explain the rules of the system to you so you can utilize those rules to your advantage.
As you level up you will see the red chickens go away eventually.
I had the last red chicken with level 47.
Another hint which might be useful is that if you apply the "drop voyages and cancel if not profitable" strategy:
Keep your crew on the ship and log into your own game to avoid the "no new voyages until 6am" content-block.
Buy new voyages and log back into your old crew.

kid.

The issue with that claim is that the "kid" is 39 years old with a major in statistical data analysis :D
It's literally my job to analyse black-boxed systems (which is we are talking about here) by testing for patterns and finding evidence for certain behaviours :)

@glannigan said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

I can’t believe your level 40. You always grab 3 at a time and just keep dropping and deleting til you get what you want!

OR! Rare could scale their game properly and cut out the middleman workarounds. As it stands, there is ZERO incentive to complete a single voyage. Ever.
That is a definite design flaw.

@dyornos said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

Any idea how long it takes to get to 50 if you only turn in blacks? Even with golds the grind is real :p

45-50 was about 10 hours if you play it smart.
See tipps here: https://www.seaofthieves.com/forum/topic/62988/merchants-quests-take-to-long-to-complete/11

@lefaux2

oh, chickening out?
I expected that.

No, you just can't believe other data as the one you claim to have. And you telling me to add you, I don't respond to people trying to give commands. Your mom never taught you to ask?

yeah. A dataset of two. That's reliable, empiric evidence lol

Yes its how my personal experience is. Get that through your thick skull :)

ok, so why don't you just say what you really mean:
I want the game to hand me free stuff so I can level faster.

Not at all, that would make the game boring. I just want there to be a increasing amount of rewards, not feeling like a level 1 merchant when I set sail as a level 50.

ok, so your 2 images overrule my data of more than 1000 voyages.
Good luck with your claim.
Spoiler: it's not going to change, so you can keep whining up until level 50 :D

You claim to have this data, and even if you have it, still doesn't change the fact that there are people who experience different outcomes. I'm not whining about the issue, I'm bringing it up in the hope they will fix it. If you're fine with the system how it is, than leave this thread and play the game kid.

@dyornos said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

@lefaux2 Yeah we are not going to do that.

oh, chickening out?
I expected that.

I already provided pictures,

yeah. A dataset of two. That's reliable, empiric evidence lol

and what you seem to miss is the fact that the minimum should be increased overal, as well as the average quality of high level voyages.

ok, so why don't you just say what you really mean:
I want the game to hand me free stuff so I can level faster.

You can have stats all you want, this is how it went for me yesterday and at other random days.

ok, so your 2 images overrule my data of more than 1000 voyages.
Good luck with your claim.
Spoiler: it's not going to change, so you can keep whining up until level 50 :D

@dyornos
From what I heard from legendaries in my clan the difference between levels voyage wise is largest with OoS, then hoarders and then merchants. Merchants wise it doesn't matter, just drop the voyage, see what happens. I did some on a galleon and we went through 6 lev 50 and 3 lev 45. Then I dropped my 25 and it was something like 2 or 3 golds. Doesn't seem right to me at all.

@kalantris said in Level 40 merchant and I get this..:

I remember when I hit 35 with gold hoarders, bought my first voyage, placed it aaaaand... one riddle. OK, let's go again. Aaaaand... one riddle. OK, again. Aaaaaand, two riddles. Tough luck ;).

Finally level up! Can't wait for my improved voyages! Oh wait.. (Got that same feeling)