[Mega Thread] - Death Cost

  • 5

    Almost every post says this is a bad idea and I agree. It punishes people for doing the crazy stuff that actually makes the game enjoyable and adds nothing of value to the game. It doesnt stop toxicity, it will make people more salty when they die and more likely to just rage quit and never pick back up the game. Unless the developers are deliberately trying to kill their own game after taking our money this is not a good plan of action. So many other good ideas on this thread I think would add to the game though. Increasing spawn timers on death would slow down brute forcing forts and make PVP more strategic. Slowing down progress also allows more opportunity for contesting forts. Adding the ability to bribe quicker(or just normal) spawn rates with money or mini games could allow for more player decisions in strategy and immersion. Ships that sink should have no supplies and spawn much farther away if they are going to stay on the same server instance. The ability to keep contesting your loot or a fort would still be there but you wont have the issues that turn forts into hours of sinking the same ship 10+ times and running out of supplies because they just show back up with a new ship every 2 min. Which is not even enough time to try and progress on the fort between attacks. If you get out played you should have to push your crew to the limits to even have the chance at redeeming yourself. This also allows people the ability to escape people who just want to harass them every time they spawn. The losing crew has no teeth to fight with but also is not right on top of someone they just fought giving them the ability to restock and chose what to do next. I really enjoy what this game has the potential to be but this is a game. Content should only be added if it makes the game more immersive or fun. The death tax does nothing for either of those points and actually hinders them. Almost no one on the forums even like the idea of the tax. I usually dont post of forums but this game is worth it for me and I dont want to see this game end before it even really gets off the ground.

  • 1

    @d00m-incarnate said in [Mega Thread] - Death Cost:

    @eljammos one of the things I fell in love with in this game was the ease of having a ship. I spent a lot of time playing gta5 recently and it is friggen annoying paying to get your vehicles back because you were goofing around.

    There's a big difference between incurring a penalty for losing a ship and paying to get them back. I don't think getting a new ship should cost anything, but I do think you should incur some penalty for losing it.

  • 1

    Hum... i don't mind lost money when i'm die.

    But i have somme trouble with it :

    -I play solo, and yesterday my sloope was aboarded, and i was killed. (for nothing since i just travel, drink for fun, or eventualy sell pigs or chicken)

    So ok, it's the game, they have well play. I just need to wait for respawn and delete the quest, and take another one since you can't have new cell for chinken or pigs when you sunk. Or simply make a new trip.

    When i respawn, i die again asap, because the guy know exactly where i respawn on the ship and OS me with Pump gun behind me frame 1, they never sunk my ship i die again and again and again... With no possibility to retaliate.

    If you add that lost of money... well it will definitly not fun at all, in the stat of case.

    So if you do, put a random spawn point on the ship ( and / or ) put an invulnérability respawn (3 sec is good i think).

    I give you another point of wiew probably somebody have already say it, i don't know :

    Other than lose money when die, why not make the ship rebuyable ? So the death don't become annoying but sunk the ship will make you need to rebuy it an lost a little money you can add another caracter and play the card of fee for the "insurance".

    Peace & Prosperity : Elgoroht.

  • 0

    @elgoroht said in [Mega Thread] - Death Cost:

    Hum... i don't mind lost money when i'm die.

    But i have somme trouble with it :

    -I play solo, and yesterday my sloope was aboarded, and i was killed. (for nothing since i just travel, drink for fun, or eventualy sell pigs or chicken)

    So ok, it's the game, they have well play. I just need to wait for respawn and delete the quest, and take another one since you can't have new cell for chinken or pigs when you sunk. Or simply make a new trip.

    When i respawn, i die again asap, because the guy know exactly where i respawn on the ship and OS me with Pump gun behind me frame 1, they never sunk my ship i die again and again and again... With no possibility to retaliate.

    If you add that lost of money... well it will definitly not fun at all, in the stat of case.

    So if you do, put a random spawn point on the ship ( and / or ) put an invulnérability respawn (3 sec is good i think).

    I give you another point of wiew probably somebody have already say it, i don't know :

    Other than lose money when die, why not make the ship rebuyable ? So the death don't become annoying but sunk the ship will make you need to rebuy it an lost a little money you can add another caracter and play the card of fee for the "insurance".

    Peace & Prosperity : Elgoroht.

    So this aspect is addressed by the death tax in that PvP deaths are supposed to not charge. The issue is in how the game will accurately track this and how it will negatively effect the fun of the game for most of the community.

  • 7

    I can't think of any benefit to this in the game at all.

    With all the things Rare SHOULD be working on, this is what they come up with as a update feature?

    Please, someone tell me this is a bad joke.

  • 2

    I don't think this discussion means they're not focusing on other content.

    I also think a ship tax would probably be better. (along with better respawn mechanics, of course, like spawning across the map)

    That being said, a properly done death tax -can- be a good thing, for most games. Fear of death is what gives PUBG its adrenaline fix, and what gives the mechanics life.

    An example might be a single player "stealth" game. What those games eventually devolve into is that everyone runs around the level full speed ramboing, discarding all stealth mechanics and subtlety for the faster run and gun rushthrough. It's only after they die and load their autosave do they "wake up" and start playing the way the game was meant to be played: sneaking around, listening for footsteps, etc. But the problem is they've already "spoiled" what's in the next room, and most of the game is spent not playing the mechanics and missing the mood by turning it into an action game on the easier parts.

    SoT is obviously way different of a game, but the same concept of devolving mechanics occurs. Why spend time aligning your ship to provide cannon support on a Order of Souls mission? Why prep up powder barrels and worry about proper placement so you get a big bang for your buck without suiciding? Why go together as a group that supports each other? You can just zerg, suicide run, and die repeatedly until things are dead. Having punishment makes people proactively think about the game and its mechanics and make plans, rather than just launching immediately and dying over and over until the poor enemies that can't respawn finally are chipped away.

    Death tax can obviously ruin a game, too, if not properly calibrated or protected from griefing mechanics, or being TOO absolutely punishing. I don't think it's a fundamental evil, though. Life is nothing without death.

  • 4

    @noggog1753 The difference in the games are that this game is not trying to be serious. It is not trying to push one game style or another. It is trying to be inclusive and allow for any and all play styles by setting up a few rules. If the game puts on a death tax then people who just want a world to goof off in will ultimately get punished for their choice in play style. Making the game less fun for them. Getting creative and trying to get the rules of the game to help you will make for a better experience. That is part of why people still would like some penalty for repeated deaths in a short span. Something like a reduction in supplies or increased time on the ship of the damned would act as that deterrent without imposing a play style.

  • 1

    What if The Flying Dutchman is constantly sailing across the map with all the players on board that died. There goal is it to kill pirate and sink ships to collect souls for Captain Jones. if they kill a pirate then they will be allowed to spawn back on there ship or they have to wait a certain amount of time until they can respawn. It would be cool to have some cured pirates on the map that only purpose is to kill and sink. imagine seeing there ship approach in the distance. SHOCKER!!!

  • 0

    @khaleesibot I think the cost should come from having your ship sunk, not from how you die during PVE.

    Who really cares how many times you died fighting a skeleton, you already pay with your time during your stint on the barge of the damned, and the sometimes just as long loading screen afterwards.

    There should be a cost to dying in PVP, though, so that wins feel like wins and not just an expenditure of resources. Making players wait to respawn is a small cost to the small battles that are character vs character interactions. The real cost should be in the sunken ship. If two ships are each battling such that they are keeping their own ships alive, then having a respawn location is a reward for playing the game well. Once your ship is sunk, you've lost and there should be a cost so that the winning team has a victory.

    How about this mechanic? You can't attack another ship unless you raise your Jolly Roger flag (maybe if you shoot a ship without the Jolly Roger raised your crew pays 500G and the flag gets raised automatically). You can freely attack a ship with the Jolly Roger raised without penalty. If you die with the Jolly Roger raised, it costs gold (each galleon crewmate 1000G, each sloop crewmate 500G) and you spawn at the farthest island from where you died. This way if the aggressors win they get the loot on the ship (reward) and the defenders lose the loot (penalty) and if the defenders win they get to keep the loot (reward) and the aggressors each lose a pile of gold (penalty).

  • 0

    @obeymasterkay nice idea but in the spirit of not imposing a play style that some people might not enjoy having the crew vote to join the fleet of the damned could give a similar experience and the crew could get paid for kills. Having an obvious affiliation with the way the ship and crew looks of course.

  • 2

    For the love of the pirate gods, dont add anymore content until the ship respawn is fixed. Sinking the same ships at a skull fort over and over is not fun.

  • 5

    This is not a great feature to add. This game already caters to crew play more than solo play, with a death tax, it penalizes a single player even more. The likelyhood of dying on certain voyages or fort raids is higher when you play solo. Not to mention that exploration and experimentation would also be punished.

    If death tax IS implemented, then payouts for all items should be increased accordingly; especially for solo players. That, or charge far less for all cosmetic items. They already are too expensive, . Anything over 50,000 is just rediculous, especially when they are just reskins.

  • 2

    B******t. How about you charge a fee to the people that kill other players. If they're stealing loot and getting the reward gold, they should be charged for killing. This might make others think twice about griefing others (namely solo players) over and over. Obviously increase the fee amount for every kill to the same player. Multiple player kills will stack as well.

  • 6

    I don't get why your first fix is going to be to tax the most active players. Honestly people brig people preemptively and that is peoples first interaction with the game upon sitting down to play, and i'm personally sick already sick of the way the broader community treats their own teammates. More often then not you get people who dont want to bother messing with the sails or fight, not helping at all and this tax actually rewards them. Lets say you do get a good team who is ready to play well guess what, you dont really have control over what kind of gold you are absolutely grinding for regardless of your level. Im sorry but you are making the active players flinch with this tax and they are already hard to come by.

  • 4

    @khaleesibot No this is the dumbest Idea, Look at all the replies from the gaming community almost all of them say no. Its already bad enough when you get killed you lose all of your stuff and chests you work so hard for. Now you want to charge us for dying. I call a mutiny taxes are too high, Fight the power!!!!

  • 3

    @ant-heuser-kush Agree here. If you want penalties for death, there are plenty of other games that offer that and weapon upgrade grinds, blah blah. It just ends up adding stress to a game whose number one draw is fun. If you lose an engagement and lose your loot, that is enough. Leave it be I says. Don't lose an ounce of the magic in this game.

  • 2

    How about your first fix implement some sort of "private group" setting or a "mic only" so people don't get brigged for 30 mins by the super understanding gamer community when your just looking to have a game.

  • 0

    Why not base it on a leveling system, with ship upgrades and some cosmetics already inflated. Pay two gold for death one for each eye. For mean level 10 and lower. Once over ten raise it, but please some deaths are already frustrating, punish stupidity not an already lengthy grind for gold.

  • 5

    adding a ship tax is also a terrible recommendation from community members because you could literally have your ship parked next to an island and then another crew who were literally just destroying other players ships just to make them pay for it and to grief would then sink it just because they want to cause you well, grief..

  • 4

    This is a terrible concept and will only hurt the solo players even more. Ideas like this will drive a big wedge between the 2 types of players (solo vs group) and eventually drive ppl away

  • 4

    Terrible idea! How about a penalty for griefers killing the same player/(s) over and over again?

  • 5

    I have one question: WHY?
    It adds nothing to the game.

  • 3

    You don't think that any death tax will have a negative impact on player experience? It will. This is a stupid idea and a poor attempt at increasing the time people spend. If you want people to spend more time on the game, make it more interesting and not more tedious. We don't need contrived time sinks.

  • 4

    Just don't include it please, its negative in general due to how poorly it will justify its costs by the many deaths everyone will make, and loadout bugs won't make it even easier to worry about either (regardless of its fixed or not),

    I understand its something you want to combat the gold inflation due to how popular Fort chasing has become, but it IS not the solution, make the voyages more inviting and rewarding on the long run for Reputation instead, so that players can remain within their servers to actually chase after various voyages and gain progression into their commendations to improve their rate in reaching Pirate Legend.

    You can add a mechanic that makes items players collects from their voyages give double reputation compared to ones you find at complete random, while "stolen" chests only give the same as the ones you find at forts, wrecks or even on the open shores, that way it would be more inviting and more lucrative in general to do voyages instead of server hoping as you would gain more reputation in addition to gain points into commendations as Forts would then mainly give a gold based profit instead of the current both.

    To solve the issue with the inflation itself you can introduce more color variations and new cosmetics into the shops that can add more variety then a basic variant and a recolor bound by Rank...

  • 4

    I don’t really like it that much. I feel like waiting 30 seconds is tax enough. Losing gold because of necessary deaths isn’t fun. Taxes aren’t fun. Add things that will make the game more fun.

  • 5

    There should not be any death cost. This game you can lose hours of work by just wrecking your ship. That is punishment enough.

  • 2

    @deadactionjones said in [Mega Thread] - Death Cost:

    adding a ship tax is also a terrible recommendation from community members because you could literally have your ship parked next to an island and then another crew who were literally just destroying other players ships just to make them pay for it and to grief would then sink it just because they want to cause you well, grief..

    A ship tax is a terrible idea indeed. Also consider this. If losing and getting your ship back costs gold and you run out of gold and you can't get your ship back, how are you supposed to sail anywhere to earn more gold to buy your ship back? Well, I guess you could camp an outpost (if respawned there, which you aren't usually, as you respawn on a random island, which is another problem) and hope random people will turn up and try to hand in their loot so you can ask them for a chest (good luck with that!) or kill/grief them and steal it from them...

    On a side note, I believe there is one huge design flaw in this game, and that is that voyages cost gold and if you have spent more gold than your lowest tier of voyages cost, you are basicaly SOL (you can't purchase new voyages nor can you realistically make gold to be able to - yeah, you can set out on a random treasure hunt, but to find something decent by chance is way to rare to rely on it from a game design standpoint; otherwise there is waiting for prey on the outpost to ask or kill/grief somebody else for loot). To fix this, all voyages should be purchasable for free (or at least a couple of free voyages or even the starter voyages available at all times no matter the level you are with whichever trading company). Otherwise, if you're past the starter tier with all companies and run out of gold for whatever reason, there is no realistic way to earn it anymore. This is a big problem already now (and nobody is ever warned about it plus new players often think voyages will always free since the first tier is). If a death tax is truly added against the majority of the community's wishes (which will only prove the devs don't listen to the players, and I hope that won't be the case), this flaw in game design will be exposed even more as the problem will increase exponentially once people start losing gold when they die.

  • 0

    @il-yusuke-li So what if you can give the ferryman some gold and have to wait 20 sec instead of 30

  • 3

    Please do not implement a death tax on pve. This as a mechanic is anti-fun for all players. It is only an insentive to play safe and undercuts the light hearted exploration and risk taking players frequently engage in. The current issue currently is the spawn location of sunk and scuttled ships in PvP because of the way it negatively impacts player who win a battle.

  • 1

    @knifelife I'm totally with you on this. I was thinking that if I'm paying to get back on my ship I should get to decied where to spawn on it, maybe give like 10 seconds to look at your ship ( and where the enemy is) and decide your spawn, may it be on top where it's kinda safe or anywhere else so you can manually try to avoid spawn kill with a better spawn position that also alloaws a little skill gap to be broght in ^^
    may be a solution, may be a garbage idea.

    you'r thoughts ?

  • 0

    @sargent-sully I think there would be a lot less ships to spot if you're looking for PvP....it's already hard enough to find 1 ship, servers don't have that many people in them, might as well have an offline mode if you want a passive so you're not in a server at all filling up sapces that could be taken by players who actually want to interact with other players...just think wandering the sea looking for other pirates and find NO ONE even after one hour...that shoud not happen...maybe add more players to the servers if this passive sistem is to be even considered.

  • 2

    @cypherius-nl said in [Mega Thread] - Death Cost:

    @il-yusuke-li So what if you can give the ferryman some gold and have to wait 20 sec instead of 30

    that would give richer players an advantage in pvp battles. and is a bad idea.

  • 0

    I think that is a great update but more than it, I think that the respawn of the ship must be change.

    I mean, for now, when your ship is sunk, you will respawn in a nearby island. I think it is a bad thing in PvP zones. I mean, when you are fighting for a Skull Fort, it is interminable because you can always respawn. More than that, sometimes is good to respawn to take some materials as bananas or planks.

    I think that the respawn should be random in all the islands and also you must to lost the active missions that you already have in your table (you know, the mission and maps where in the ship, and it is already sunk!)

    It will help to player to concern about his ship and not take all the risky all time. It is because when you are fighting in a fort you waste more time fighting 1 vs 1 with the same crew than the skeletons and I think that it is not the primary objective; At least not if you have been defeated for three times and them comeback again and again.

    =)

  • 3

    I can't see how this will benefit any players at all. Plenty of people have stated that the suggestion of a tax was to curb griefers but this tax specifically does not target them. It's bad enough that everything costs too much (18 - 25 - 16 I haven't bought anything and I can just barely afford a basic sail) but it is discouraging me from having fun and discouraging friends on the fence from buying the game.

    I am grinding order of souls quests so I can get access to their hull and sail but if I keep losing money from dying to these undodgeable perfect-aim skeletons, odds are I won't have enough gold to buy them once I unlock them.

  • 1

    Rare Team.....

    We really need a update now. This week. I gave you guys at least 10 ideas for content on the day of launch and have seen several people saying the same ideas as me now. You guys really need to listen to your consumers. We have said the game is lacking content since launch. If i was a game developer, my consumer's needs and opinions would be valued. Unfortunately i am not seeing the potential this game should of had from launch. WE NEED AN UPDATE THIS WEEK. player base will drop this week otherwise i think.

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