Boo hoo. You want a hardcore PvP, then go buy one instead of whining about a game not meant to be one. Not to mention the fact that if you did get to play, it was free. Also I'm sure that on full release there will be a bunch of changes in game dynamics. Once again if you don't like the games setup b****r off and find another.

@avirex-idyll Lol this gets my upvote. But at the same time not trying to sound rude or anything. These post are getting to be annoying. All i constantly seem to see when going through forum post is,Oh boohoo the games gonna die on release. Boohoo not enough content cause im basing all my view on the beta and not whats been teased or shown. Boohoo its not hard or punishing enough. Like i get it everyone has an opinion and i respect that but stop beating these horses they died weeks ago. And if your so hardcore really guys go play cuphead if you want punishment. Sea of Thieves is a game as rare has said themselves "For those of any age. All are welcome." Personally these post have gotten so stale at this point im legit just gonna end it here and ignore these for now on. Pretty pointless. :\ (No srsly ive probably seen like almost 20 of these post all over. As a meme lord once said. "ITS TIME TO STOP!" ) Peace.

@lucid-stew said in More punishment for losing ship?:

@inflickked said in More punishment for losing ship?:

Ships in general should be more of a resource, and everyone should be able to have their own without being forced into solo matchmaking, instead of disposable vessels that nobody has any real attachment too. Everybody should have their own Sloop that is relatively easy/free to bring back once sunk. Run a few simple errands for the shipwright at any Outpost and they'll bring your ship right back. I'm not suggesting anything crazier than that.

Ok, now we're getting somewhere. I think at heart you're striking at an idea that I think should be introduced, and that is flexible crew rosters. Now if you pick your own ship rather than popping into the world with one, naturally you must be able to populate it with the crew of your choosing(or random if you like). I think doing chores to get your ship back would be dull, but perhaps you could bring up another ship owned by a crew mate. Or perhaps you could be presented with a beat-up shamey ship to let everyone know you got your ship sank. I don't think the ships need to progress statistically at all. I don't think this is that type of game. I think, in this game, the progression is in your skill of playing. However, to realize the vision that Rare set forth: to encourage socialization, adventure, and exploration, things might need to change. I myself am fine with the way the game is. It is fun to me, but I think it could be better. I do understand that it's not quite what others hoped for. The ultimate question is: how can they change it to satisfy more people without turning it into a different game entirely? Because, honestly, I just don't see that happening, and that's where a lot of the suggestions from the disgruntled lead.

I've sugested somthing similar to this kind of idea. A better in-game looby system/crew management system i think this will be in-line with Rare's vision for the game. As an answer to your qestion just look at what said in my previous post in this thread.

@labarge28 said in More punishment for losing ship?:

Perhaps we should flip this idea over a little bit. The goal here seems to be that there's an inherent value to keeping your ship afloat. Perhaps instead of punishing people for losing their ship further, we add some positive incentive for keeping your ship afloat? Some sort of buff that slowly builds over time, that resets upon your sinking. A bonus to gold received upon turn-in perhaps?

I think this guy is on to something. I sugest a reputation/notorius system in where when you/ your crew sinks a ship or does anything like completing voyage they would gain X amount of rep. and tie it to the ship. You can scale it with levels like a number system or icons. Once a level is reach it could unlock temporary ornatiments or visiual effects that would not affect gamplayb (like a glow to the ship or skull and crossbones etch into the side of the ship one for every kill) . These would only last in the session your playing and will be reset once the ship is lost. This would give hardcore players something to grind for, while making it easier for casuals to avoid as the hardcore player would gain the most rep from other rep players while risking it all going after the casuals.

@inflickked said in More punishment for losing ship?:

Ships in general should be more of a resource, and everyone should be able to have their own without being forced into solo matchmaking, instead of disposable vessels that nobody has any real attachment too. Everybody should have their own Sloop that is relatively easy/free to bring back once sunk. Run a few simple errands for the shipwright at any Outpost and they'll bring your ship right back. I'm not suggesting anything crazier than that.

Ok, now we're getting somewhere. I think at heart you're striking at an idea that I think should be introduced, and that is flexible crew rosters. Now if you pick your own ship rather than popping into the world with one, naturally you must be able to populate it with the crew of your choosing(or random if you like). I think doing chores to get your ship back would be dull, but perhaps you could bring up another ship owned by a crew mate. Or perhaps you could be presented with a beat-up shamey ship to let everyone know you got your ship sank. I don't think the ships need to progress statistically at all. I don't think this is that type of game. I think, in this game, the progression is in your skill of playing. However, to realize the vision that Rare set forth: to encourage socialization, adventure, and exploration, things might need to change. I myself am fine with the way the game is. It is fun to me, but I think it could be better. I do understand that it's not quite what others hoped for. The ultimate question is: how can they change it to satisfy more people without turning it into a different game entirely? Because, honestly, I just don't see that happening, and that's where a lot of the suggestions from the disgruntled lead.

I feel like it's punishment enough to lose all my chests, thank you very much. That's hours of work lost right there and sometimes it's just because someone has nothing better to do than kill me over and over again and not let me get back on my feet.

i have already said this in another discussion but good thought

@pho3nixcatfire what makes no sense? i was building off OP's post.
if you lose, you get hit much harder with losing all your stuff and a punishment. why not introduce some sort of notorious level for the attackers? if you win, you get the treasure or whatever but for attacking you get notorious level. maybe it's only for the person who attacks first.

@hc-king-luis what, that makes no sense. One of the major points of the game is to steal from people. It is called sea of thieves

@SNewbould I like the signal flare thing, but my idea was you have to pay extra for the ship to be repaired/outfitted with spare cannonballs and planks once sunk, also a home port option could be added if you can afford the ship it will spawn at your home port, if you are in a hurry and can afford it, it could be delivered to an outpost closest to you for an extra gold fine. If you don't have the gold you would spawn with your ship stuck in shallow water damaged on a random island where you have to find planks to repair it on the island then head off to get the sails mended at an outpost or try to get revenge with a slower ship.

@natsu-v2 Ok, so in those terms, I think of people who play CoD or other games where they literally memorize everything about the game to maximize their odds of winning.

To that degree, I understand that SoT might not be hardcore enough for these types of players. But I do think it is "hardcore" enough for those looking for a long term casual experience.

I have played FFXIV for years now due to its more casual activities. It keeps me coming back because its something I can do time and time again to relax with friends.

There is no punishment for failing to do something in FFXIV, aside from time lost, and it appears to me that Rare it taking the same approach with SoT.

This is why I do not believe there needs to be a punishment placed on losing a ship in SoT as it would appear to go against the casual vibe of the game.

@inflickked another point I agree with, instant match making is hurting the game, a simple addition could be solo matchmaking which would give you control over the ship's customization, then you could open your ship up to players that are instant matchmaking, this way if you have a crew of 3 you don't have to lock the 4th in the brig so they don't get in the way or something. Or if you are looking to challenge yourself try solo or duo captaining a Galleon lol.

@inflickked I like the signal flare thing, but my idea was you have to pay extra for the ship to be repaired/outfitted with spare cannonballs and planks once sunk. If you don't have the gold you would spawn with your ship stuck in shallow water damaged where you have to find planks to repair it on the island then head off to get the sails mended at an outpost or try to get revenge with a slower ship with damaged.

@natsu-v2 said in More punishment for losing ship?:

@avirex-idyll We live in a world where games like Dark Souls and Hollow Knight are extremely popular. A game will be perfectly fine to err on the hardcore side, or at the very least try to compromise. Currently, SoT is far and away too baby-like of a game in terms of difficulty and gripping mechanics to add replayability for the hardcore crowd. Hopefully that changes as we learn more about the game.

We also live in a world where Splatoon is very popular and a lot of other games that most of us deem not "hardcore" enough.

I am a "hardcore" player myself. I love pushing the limits and understanding the mechanics ('cept for the math, I hate math). That being said, I think it's a bit overshooting than to think that, at this level of development, Rare will make changes to cater our needs before the more casual mass.

As I see it, there is but a small percentage of player (I'd put my hand in fire) that wants this game to be more punishing and demanding. This game was always meant to be a game that you can pickup anytime and join your friends on any type of Voyages or Quests. With that in mind, I don't think they can risk jeopardizing that key element by making the game more hardcore.

As you've mentioned before @Natsu-v2, we'll see what the future holds for us and if there's a (real) demand for Hardcore Content, I'm sure that Rare will oblige. As long as there's a player base willing to pay for MTX and participate in the content, the Devs will provide us with content, hopefully.

@avirex-idyll I mostly mean people who don't get a lot of games, but hone in on one or two games and play them for several years on end.

In terms of not attracting those players, and the game being too baby-like, it's due to replayability and a lack of value for gold. I have no idea what Athena's Fortune will bring to the table, but the core loop of the game does not feature replayability for the type of player I mention. Those players will have amassed a fortune and bought every cosmetic just for completion, and then there's nothing left to do I guess.

@natsu-v2 You are right - Dark Souls and Hollow Knight are very popular. PUBG also has that very unforgiving multiplayer. All hugely popular games.

That niche is getting lots of attention, why is it wrong for SoT to try and fill a different niche. If you want to play a punishing, hardcore game go play those. People who want to play something refreshing and different can play Sea of Thieves.

Stop trying to "punish" innovation!

@labarge28 I like that idea. Some other small things that we could add are if a ship sinks there could be random things that float up, like a spare barrel for cannonballs or planks that you can place top or bottom deck, a "Rare" drop could be a cannon or a spare ammo box you can put in the the crows nest or something, it would give a slight edge to a crew that has won a couple battles, but there could be limits to how much could be added. So that way if a ship is sunk they could loose the gold buff gained from completing quests and loose that rare cannon they had.

@natsu-v2 In all seriousness, could you explain what this hardcore crowd consist of? Does hardcore consist of playing a set amount of time over a given period, or perhaps those that are achievement junkies? Or do you mean pvp heavy players?

I am asking because you state that the game is to "baby-like". Why? Because there is not enough emphases on punishing people for losing a ship?

Again, I am asking as a general inquire.

@avirex-idyll We live in a world where games like Dark Souls and Hollow Knight are extremely popular. A game will be perfectly fine to err on the hardcore side, or at the very least try to compromise. Currently, SoT is far and away too baby-like of a game in terms of difficulty and gripping mechanics to add replayability for the hardcore crowd. Hopefully that changes as we learn more about the game.

@lucid-stew So stop guessing? I haven't suggested anything specific; not sure why you're targeting my response. I just came to agree with OP that there is a severe lack of meaning around ships right now. I do agree with you that any considerable change on this front would dramatically alter the meta, which is extremely unlikely to change in any meaningful way at this point, but I strongly disagree that sort of change would be for the worse.

Ships in general should be more of a resource, and everyone should be able to have their own without being forced into solo matchmaking, instead of disposable vessels that nobody has any real attachment too. Everybody should have their own Sloop that is relatively easy/free to bring back once sunk. Run a few simple errands for the shipwright at any Outpost and they'll bring your ship right back. I'm not suggesting anything crazier than that.

Being able to instantly hop in to a fully decked-out Galleon at the press of a button, and only being able to do so from a matchmaking menu, doesn't bode well for the game's longevity though imo. Really don't want to spend a hour coming up with a system that will go largely ignored, but I've repeatedly told Rare in my surveys the game needs a stronger progression system based around ships. If the game stays on course to be as casual as we've seen it will be a flash in the pan at best.

Ok, i'll bite, again....when you place a cost on fundamental parts of a game, you hurt your casual player base. I, and my crew, are looking for a casual game where do not have to worry about losing something every time we go out on the water.

Any punishment comes in the way of treasure chest. This is how Rare tackles risk/reward and pve/pvp.

And because this very topic has come up again and again in repeating threads......

@colten822 Let them come, those m***y pirates will just add to my collection!

@natsu-v2 There should be a system in place where certain parts of the ship need to be repaired but cant be scavenges, such as going to an out post and having your sails repaired by NPCs it would be a timed thing and you would have to wait and guard the ship while the sails are repaired.

But I would also make it to where these parts don't NEED to be repaired, like if the sails had holes it would only slightly slow the boat down, rudder damage causes the boat to turn slower, etc. I would also make the costs scale with a players amount of gold, so a crew that only cares about PvP would have to steal more gold/do side quests/take a break to make repairs at a port and keep the ship top rate.

@mrdestiny17 I'm sure with those shiney cosmetics will make people wanna sink you out of spite. ;P