[Mega Thread] - Safe Zones
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Wow you must be one of the lucky ones to be running into so many players at sea. The big streamers of the game couldn't find anyone out on sea (Shroud) and every time I played I kept running into the same one person or people until they left the server. One time I went all around the entire map without finding a single ship. It makes sense with only 16 players in that big map to have a difficult time finding someone. Man I wish I found a single outpost that was being camped; that would have been a nice battle. I love the PVP aspect of this game and tried to get into as many battles as possible before the beta ended. But if you find outposts being camped an issue than maybe this game isn't for you since this is something that should always be happening in this game.
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Well obviously each persons experience is going to be abit different, the game is in beta. Shroud is a big streamer? Hahaha, I bet he is really entertaining with that great personality of his. I said the island would alleviate congestion around outposts, as the current meta is for crews to sit there for hours on end. Coming up with solutions to alleviate camping and congestion at outposts by adding a social island is anti-pvp now? Haha, how strange. This game isn't for me because I suggested a way to ease the congestion at outposts for new and solo players? Lol.
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@rgbknights said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
I like the idea of a Social Zone but I am very against the idea of a Safe Zone (like the Ferry of the Damned) it is a PvP game after all.
How do we counterbalance this so we could have mini-game in the tavern without loading into a new "safe" area?
No, you're wrong. And i hope this "point of view" isn't endorsed by alot of people because conceptually it's wrong.
The game is ALSO PVP, but it's not PVP. Because by asserting that, you're telling everyone that the game is just another PVP thing, which it isn't the case.
Yes, there's some PVP mechanics, it's part of the game, but something needs to be done by RARE to keep the gameplay fair and engaging for PVE players.
Which means that there's alot of people who wants to enjoy some pirate life in their spare time (because of family, life, work shifts etc.) that cannot afford to be ganked by a group of idiots hidden in the bushes in the outposts, just to kill you and steal all your hard harvested chests/materials.
That's wrong. Oh boy if that's wrong. It's also unfair.
So we have two options to avoid this:- Outposts should be safe places were no engage rules/pvp damages could be done. Once your ship arrives in the outpost waters (in some range) automatically any damage actions will be disabled.
- The game should offer two game modes: PVE or PVP (like Fortnite as an example). People who paid for the game have the same right as you to speak about how they feel about the product.
Yes, you could say "if you don't like the product, don't buy it" and you're right: i will then personally ask for a refund and do all i can to warn every single founder, pioneer and new customer out there about this.
For once, we got a good pirate game, with everything working in order, graphically pretty and funny, let the people have fun and finally accomplish their dream to sail with a ship full of friends.
Remember: pirates spent their whole life in search of the best treasure, while they fail to understand that the real treasure is the friendship you build along the way.
I sincerely hope RARE has a solution to this, otherwise it's a no go for me, and it hurts to say so.
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@kingpinzer0 said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
@rgbknights said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
I like the idea of a Social Zone but I am very against the idea of a Safe Zone (like the Ferry of the Damned) it is a PvP game after all.
How do we counterbalance this so we could have mini-game in the tavern without loading into a new "safe" area?
No, you're wrong. And i hope this "point of view" isn't endorsed by alot of people because conceptually it's wrong.
The game is ALSO PVP, but it's not PVP. Because by asserting that, you're telling everyone that the game is just another PVP thing, which it isn't the case.
Completely agree. Some people are under the strange impression that is this is some kind of arcade arena shooter, strictly pvp. I highly doubt Rare has the same "no pve it's a pirate game" mentality, that a small portion of the community seem to uphold. A lot of ages from children to adults, will no doubt be playing this game. Along with different skill gaps. Rare is making this game suitable for everyone, not just the avid pvp players.
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@kinggzanga Think of it this way. In which scenario will there be more exciting action? One where people are sitting in a safe zone or one where people are constantly fighting each other? I personally would like there to be constant action if you're going to chose to play this game (A full on PVP game). Camping is fun, and so is killing campers. Congestion at outposts is a good thing.
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@sloshed-smurf You have once again, missed my point. Each player is different, you might like PvP whereas someone will enjoy PvE. That's why getting the balance correct, is essential. Rare isn't designing this game with just PvP only players in mind.
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@kinggzanga can we at least agree for your "separate island" to be on a separate server?
If its on the same server, half the people are sitting on this safe zone island of yours and half the people are sailing about, I would then be half as likely to encounter someone on the sea correct?
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@sloshed-smurf said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
@kinggzanga can we at least agree for your "separate island" to be on a separate server?
If its on the same server, half the people are sitting on this safe zone island of yours and half the people are sailing about, I would then be half as likely to encounter someone on the sea correct?
Having it on a seperate server does nothing other than add another hollow social hub, just like Destiny and CoD:WWII. Do you not want something original, innovative and entirely unique? Having it in the World not only affects congestion at outposts, it gives griefed players a place to seek and find help. Along with so much more activities and benefits. I understand your concerns about player count being high at a social hub along with such a low server pop, but adding no progression here will drive people out onto the sea. Not being able to cash in rewards, chests or trade missions here would simply force people to play the game, rather sit in the social hub. There was also a rumour in which Rare, were raising the server population after launch to 20-25. I have no idea how concrete that is though.
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Why half of the players should have sit on the save zone island? To do their stuff, like finding treasures, bring goods to other outposts or killing skeletons they need to leave.
Why should there be no place for people to rest and tell their tales like pirates do. At one point it gets boring to kill the same ganking landlubbers over and over again.
This is not a PVP game, it is an adventure game with PVP...
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@sloshed-smurf Have you actually read up on / watched videos of what this game is meant to be about? PvP is meant to be one of many possibilities upon encountering another crew, not a guarantee and certainly not all the time.
By no means has anything Rare stated until now remotely indicated that it's a full on PvP experience, the only classification they gave it was a shared world adventure game. You're not really meant to be sailing around solely looking for other ships to attack and sink, you should be going about your own adventure / voyage, and seeing what happens when you do come across another crew.
As for the subject at hand, I really hope they don't go the route of a full on safe zone / island within the regular world. To support larger numbers of players making it a more social experience it would have to be a separate option to join into. But I really do hope they add some form of consequences to attacking within the boundary of an Outpost, not preventing it, but at least discouraging it.
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Since this thread has grown so large...
I'll redirect to my post in regards to a "Social Zone" mentioned above... Clicky Clicky
I think it addresses most people's desires while minimizing some concerns of others.
Aiming for a win/win! :)
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@falk-van-cleef said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
Why half of the players should have sit on the save zone island? To do their stuff, like finding treasures, bring goods to other outposts or killing skeletons they need to leave.
Why should there be no place for people to rest and tell their tales like pirates do. At one point it gets boring to kill the same ganking landlubbers over and over again.
This is not a PVP game, it is an adventure game with PVP...
Well said.
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How to introduce safezones
I believe that the best way to introduce safe zones is the following:
Add a HUB to every outpost.
In this hub, you'll find the tavern, shops, traders, and possible future things.
Inside the hub, you are immune to damage, even when shot from outside the hub.You can make clear what is part of the hub and what not by adding an archway to every entrance into the hub.
You can also reduce the amount of entrances (not exits) by putting all the buildings in the hub close together, and maybe adding certain fences/walls/elevated areas here and there to connect the different buildings.
Why introduce safezones
I believe that right now, safezones are not that necessary.
Being able to steal treasures from eachother is a necessary mechanic. Without a safezone, you can still interact with other crews, with the risk of a fight breaking out ofcourse, but that fits in the pirate experience.
Right now, a safezone would only be interesting around clothing shops, traders, and in a tavern, but even then, you could do without, since getting killed while doing any of those things doesn't cost you anything but time.
Only if not-having-a-safezone would cost you anything else than time (e.g. gold), a safezone would be interesting. Since if there isn't a safezone then, the gameplay would be punishing, rather than challenging.
For instance, if you die you lose gold, or if you die you respawn without any resources (and resources would not be free), only then it would be interesting to have a safezone around the hub.
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@knightx13 there should most definitely be a safe zone, because the safe zone is the only way to play for someone who would like to play alone because the game is balanced in the way that smaller ships are faster and nimbler while bigger ships have more firepower and more people, but from a personal experience this doesn't function because. That experience was me and a friend being chased for literally 3 hours or more, we had 4 chests in our ship and we just came across a bigger ship that started chasing us and they didn't stop for 3 hours plus both ships are pretty much the same speed while sailing so we couldn't get away, and it was just annoying and tedious and it completely ruined the experience for me. The best way for me to play is in the same room with a friend, him on my xbox, and me on my pc because it feels like couch co-op but its impossible to play without a safe zone.
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@kinggzanga This. I don't know if this has been said, but maybe an NPC on said safe island that takes you to instance that is your private home that you can customize, adding more progression to the game. Maybe even crafting, making some cosmetics, furniture, etc, that you can't just buy with gold, could add a new layer to the game.
(just look at Puzzle Pirates, that game was perfect... but with puzzles...)
EDIT: Replying to kinggzangas orginal post on this thread.
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@maxochristo and this is the problem with safe zones. People like you will just run to them anytime a ship chases you.
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I think there should be one or two safe outposts and more normal, unsafe outposts. Now the tricky parts is that unsafe outposts should give you more gold per chest. That would make a self-balanced system. More players would prefer the safe area because at the current state it seems like camping is a big deal. But as more people prefer the safe outposts and there is no ships to hunt at unsafe outposts, the campers would stop camping, at least most of them. When there are less campers it will be more considerable to go to the unsafe outposts for more gold. But when more players start to go for the unsafe outposts the campers will be back and the cycle will be reset.
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I haven't had any trouble with this. Just gota be slick rick. I mean I have had my ship sank a few times (solo rider here) but I hide my treasure in bushes unless I'm sailing. If you see a ship at an outpost.. just don't go there haha. If you do have a friend or two in your crew its even easier. Have them protect you or jump off the ship with the chests when you go around the island. I love this part of the game. If people really wana be bored waiting for someone to arrive with treasure I can't imagine they will have that much fun with that to play for months haha.
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@kinggzanga said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
@sloshed-smurf said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
@kinggzanga can we at least agree for your "separate island" to be on a separate server?
If its on the same server, half the people are sitting on this safe zone island of yours and half the people are sailing about, I would then be half as likely to encounter someone on the sea correct?
Having it on a seperate server does nothing other than add another hollow social hub, just like Destiny and CoD:WWII. Do you not want something original, innovative and entirely unique? Having it in the World not only affects congestion at outposts, it gives griefed players a place to seek and find help. Along with so much more activities and benefits. I understand your concerns about player count being high at a social hub along with such a low server pop, but adding no progression here will drive people out onto the sea. Not being able to cash in rewards, chests or trade missions here would simply force people to play the game, rather sit in the social hub. There was also a rumour in which Rare, were raising the server population after launch to 20-25. I have no idea how concrete that is though.
It would make sense to increase the server population since the map will be 5 times bigger but I think it will be empty still if you steer more of these other players to your social hub. No place should be a safe place in the world of pirates.
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@falk-van-cleef said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
Why half of the players should have sit on the save zone island? To do their stuff, like finding treasures, bring goods to other outposts or killing skeletons they need to leave.
Why should there be no place for people to rest and tell their tales like pirates do. At one point it gets boring to kill the same ganking landlubbers over and over again.
This is not a PVP game, it is an adventure game with PVP...
It is PVE with the excitement of PVP. You are trying to take away from the PVP aspect of the game I get it. But that is your opinion and I respect that.
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@oldmansutii said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
@sloshed-smurf Have you actually read up on / watched videos of what this game is meant to be about? PvP is meant to be one of many possibilities upon encountering another crew, not a guarantee and certainly not all the time.
By no means has anything Rare stated until now remotely indicated that it's a full on PvP experience, the only classification they gave it was a shared world adventure game. You're not really meant to be sailing around solely looking for other ships to attack and sink, you should be going about your own adventure / voyage, and seeing what happens when you do come across another crew.
As for the subject at hand, I really hope they don't go the route of a full on safe zone / island within the regular world. To support larger numbers of players making it a more social experience it would have to be a separate option to join into. But I really do hope they add some form of consequences to attacking within the boundary of an Outpost, not preventing it, but at least discouraging it.
I like that idea.
Do you know the game All Points Bulletin? This game has died twice in the past because there was a "safe zone" where more than half of the community were in their comfort zones and stood around just to talk about random stuff and were showing off their cosmetics. I don't want this for this game. I would rather this "socializing" happen out on the sea.
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Before I post, I have to say, I havent had any playtime in SoT. Alpha or Beta... all of my info comes from live streams during beta, every YT video I can get my eye on, and reading and reading and reading these forums. Like a lot of people, I was and am still a little, concerned about the overly PvP tendency I've seen. However, safe zones may not be the best way to go. It's not easy to implement a system to keep the zones from being camped, and it's also not super easy to deal with the congestion of players they would accrue. World wide safe zones doesn't seem to fit. But I do have a suggestion about them.... Allow each player to have their own little zone (Not part of the open world) a basic and plain little island that saves locally. Something they can park their ship at and even customise slightly. Add little mini games and things that they can play with the other players on the server... The area should offer no progression opportunity, so no equipment shops or anything of that sort. Maybe just a tavern. Allow players to customise their ships and pirates there. Give them a little bit of sailing room around their island.
To prevent abuse of this island, only allow access when a player first logs on, and then put a 45 min or longer timer before they're allowed to go back. Along with that, once a player decides to go to their island, add a 10 min timer before they're sent out of the world. So people don't just use it to run away from PvP. Since the island doesn't offer any kind of progression, these timers could conceivably be as long as needed. The only people with access are the player themselves and their current crew, if they allow. That way you don't have the noise pollution cause by too many people in one spot. Then they could practice sailing their ship in the sailing area, play mini games with others, and argue with eachother about ship customization.
This is just an idea of course, anything added to it, or pointed out about it is always welcome from everyone. Lemme know!
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People comment on pirating and safe zones should learn about history of pirates before commenting and learn the Pirate Code, if this game turns into another Pubg style game most gamers will not play this game, this isn't just a pvp game it is a action adventure game with PvE and PvP elements. For the games sake and to true to the pirate legends game must have safe zones where you log in and out, chat, find crew members and plan a voyage also social games like pub games is a great idea. As Tortuga is mentioned safe heavens existed and every pirate knew them either to escape from navy or to trade and find crew and every pirate obeyed pirate code dictated by pirate kings. Pirates did not attack each other on our around those islands. Parley and other codes followed by every pirate. Thus Only open seas and mission islands must be PvP areas and outposts must be safe heavens there could be a larger island like Tortuga where pirate meetings could be held for future events in the game. Also navy could be added to the game later.
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@lumpaywk Which articles say there will be safe zones? So far, from what I've read, there's only the Pirate Legend outpost that won't be a safe zone, if that's what you're referring to.
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@sloshed-smurf Yes I know APB, I was in the beta for that waaay back before the first release, one of the original members of WASP, and the leader of STING.
But this game is not meant to be anything like that, certainly not APB on the seas. Again, it's intended to be a game where PvP is one possible outcome of an encounter with another crew, it's not a full on PvP game like APB was originally. Hence why there needs to be some form of consequence to give people reason not to, at least in certain areas.
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@WhenKoalasattak
from https://m.windowscentral.com/becoming-pirate-legend-sea-thieves-personal-hideout-captaincy-and-moreAs you ascend up the ranks of faction rep with the game's various voyage traders, eventually you will be able to find a special hideout, available only to you and crew members you choose to bring there
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@lumpaywk nevermind! :D I read your link :) in the other article it was not sure if it is a private zone for only your crew :D
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@avecrux said in [Mega Thread] - Safe Zones:
@lumpaywk and for any other legendary pirate
available only to you and crew members you choose to bring there
not really saying that! tgis says its just for me and friends in plane text
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@avecrux I am confused now tbh :D his link say about only his crew and others say for ALL legendary pirates -.-
I just edited my post above about it dangit :D
it could not be private since they say it WAS in the beta but noone found it or it was not accessible. I do not think it's a instance so the privacy is busted :/